during the Stansbury era. The only one I can think of that has actually looked improved was Walter Sharpe. Robert Jackson ended up on a better team, but I don't think he was improved by any measure. Gary Ervin was on a super talented Arkansas team and that team still underachieved big time. Reginald Delk would be starting for MSU and he can't get off of the end of the bench at Louisville. This talent argument regarding Stansbury is really overblown. I feel like the guy gets decent to okay players and actually coaches them up. The best player Stansbury has had was Lawrence Roberts and he couldn't even make it in the NBA. I think when Stansbury lands one of these top notch Mississippi players that can't pro, we will see that he can coach a little.
What Basketball transfer has done better at their new school...
- Thread starter squirldawg
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during the Stansbury era. The only one I can think of that has actually looked improved was Walter Sharpe. Robert Jackson ended up on a better team, but I don't think he was improved by any measure. Gary Ervin was on a super talented Arkansas team and that team still underachieved big time. Reginald Delk would be starting for MSU and he can't get off of the end of the bench at Louisville. This talent argument regarding Stansbury is really overblown. I feel like the guy gets decent to okay players and actually coaches them up. The best player Stansbury has had was Lawrence Roberts and he couldn't even make it in the NBA. I think when Stansbury lands one of these top notch Mississippi players that can't pro, we will see that he can coach a little.
Stan Heath and most Arkansas fans would beg to differ. Ervin may have "seemed" better because he was not on our team doing his usual dumb stuff but he still followed every good play with a bone headed one.
The only thing that improved after Gary left was my blood pressure.
The only thing that improved after Gary left was my blood pressure.
the talent argument is definitely overblown. he has done good coaching jobs. the biggest concern for me is players leaving. i don't think the ncaa tournament has been a serious indication of anything
Ervin did not improve, HE THRIVED!
As to your argument that RS coaches up talent, prepare for the onslaught of "no Sweet 16 = ****** coach" posts that are sure to follow.
As to your argument that RS coaches up talent, prepare for the onslaught of "no Sweet 16 = ****** coach" posts that are sure to follow.
is definately overused in my opiniong. i mean when's the last time we've had someone in the nba that contributed or even played? dampier...
"This talent argument regarding Stansbury is really overblown. I feel like the guy gets decent to okay players and actually coaches them up. The best player Stansbury has had was Lawrence Roberts and he couldn't even make it in the NBA."
Just because a college player doesnt make it big in the NBA, doesnt mean they werent great college players,
Signed
JJ Reddick, Darryl Wilson, and a thousand other players I dont have time to list
You telling me JJ Reddick, the all-time leading scorer in the best conference in college basketball the last 30 years didnt have talent? He was just coached up? He barely gets to play in the NBA.
Darryl Wilson didnt play for a second in the NBA, yet is one of the conferences best players the last 20 years.
Renalso Balkman of SC gets drafted, and he made very little impact. He wouldnt be considered one of the SEC's top 100 in the last 20 years.
Great college talent does not equal NBA talent.
Just because a college player doesnt make it big in the NBA, doesnt mean they werent great college players,
Signed
JJ Reddick, Darryl Wilson, and a thousand other players I dont have time to list
You telling me JJ Reddick, the all-time leading scorer in the best conference in college basketball the last 30 years didnt have talent? He was just coached up? He barely gets to play in the NBA.
Darryl Wilson didnt play for a second in the NBA, yet is one of the conferences best players the last 20 years.
Renalso Balkman of SC gets drafted, and he made very little impact. He wouldnt be considered one of the SEC's top 100 in the last 20 years.
Great college talent does not equal NBA talent.
the talent argument is such a red herring.
We play in the SEC WESTERN DIVISION. Its not exactly a hotbed of college basketball. In general, we are usually as talented or more talented than the other teams in our division. That's 10 games. In the Eastern Division, the same can be said about SC, Vandy, and Georgia. That's 13 games of a 16 game conference season where talent shouldn't be an excuse. Yet we found a way to lose to Georgia and SC in 07 when Gordon was a soph and Rhodes was a junior. Those 2 games likely cost us a bid.
Furthermore, talent is no excuse to lose to Miami OH, South Alabama, or Miami FL (I'll even give him a pass on the Clemson and Southern Illinois losses) and its sure no excuse to not force tempo against Georgia when they are playing their second game of the day...win 2 of those and we don't play Memphis last year.
The talent=NBA thing is no excuse for the underacheivement of the last 2 years.
We play in the SEC WESTERN DIVISION. Its not exactly a hotbed of college basketball. In general, we are usually as talented or more talented than the other teams in our division. That's 10 games. In the Eastern Division, the same can be said about SC, Vandy, and Georgia. That's 13 games of a 16 game conference season where talent shouldn't be an excuse. Yet we found a way to lose to Georgia and SC in 07 when Gordon was a soph and Rhodes was a junior. Those 2 games likely cost us a bid.
Furthermore, talent is no excuse to lose to Miami OH, South Alabama, or Miami FL (I'll even give him a pass on the Clemson and Southern Illinois losses) and its sure no excuse to not force tempo against Georgia when they are playing their second game of the day...win 2 of those and we don't play Memphis last year.
The talent=NBA thing is no excuse for the underacheivement of the last 2 years.
teams that go to the sweet sixteen with teams that have NBA players on their roster. I already did the research on this once. Of all of the Sweet Sixteen teams since Stansbury's 2001-2002 team, I want to say well over 80 percent had at least one guy who is still currently on a NBA roster. Guess I'll do it aGAIN, hold on for a bit.
--Gary Ervin improved. F yeah he did. he was more efficient...thats improving.
--Vernon Goodridge improved. his minutes are up, his scoring is up, his rebounding is up. he had a hell of a game agaisnt UCONN and Thabeet.
--Richard Delk has done much much better. he is a go to scorer now...a damn go to scorer!!...Richard Delk!! his FG% is great for a guard, and his rebounding is up too.
--Bernard Rimmer has done better, albeit not much.
--Robert Jackson improved. his play was good at Marquette and he helped lead them to a final 4.
--Walter Sharpe's did a lot better. of course, id say that also had to do with starting over and having time to mature a bit.
--Jerrell Houston has really really done better. he is a scorer, rebounds at a high rate, shoots a solid %, and is very very solid from the FT line.
--Vernon Goodridge improved. his minutes are up, his scoring is up, his rebounding is up. he had a hell of a game agaisnt UCONN and Thabeet.
--Richard Delk has done much much better. he is a go to scorer now...a damn go to scorer!!...Richard Delk!! his FG% is great for a guard, and his rebounding is up too.
--Bernard Rimmer has done better, albeit not much.
--Robert Jackson improved. his play was good at Marquette and he helped lead them to a final 4.
--Walter Sharpe's did a lot better. of course, id say that also had to do with starting over and having time to mature a bit.
--Jerrell Houston has really really done better. he is a scorer, rebounds at a high rate, shoots a solid %, and is very very solid from the FT line.
my point to hd. i'm not saying that a player has to be badass in college to play in the nba or even the opposite. my point was just that we keep bashing stans for not making the sweet 16 and then we use the fact that he's had all this talent to do it. however, as you stated, if you look at the majority of these teams that do make the sweet 16 they have at least one nba player on their team and we haven't had any. that's all i'm saying. not sticking up for stans or bashing, just stating the facts.
Gary Parrish did this very thing a couple months ago. its somewhere on his page at cbssportsline. it was staggering to see how many NBA draftees have been on great teams(final 4 quality) in the last decade.HD6 said:
and our last Sweet 16 team, we had Dampier- an NBA player, and Dontae Jones, who was a first round draft pick that didn't stick because of injuries was also on our Final Four team.
We've had some good players through the years like Roberts, Austin, Bowers, Zimmerman, and even Tang Hamilton got a shot, but we haven't had someone stick in the league like Dampier in a while.
We've had some good players through the years like Roberts, Austin, Bowers, Zimmerman, and even Tang Hamilton got a shot, but we haven't had someone stick in the league like Dampier in a while.
HD's saying, just look at last year's sweet 16 and the 08 draft:
Memphis: dorsey, douglas roberts, rose
Mich State: None
Stanford: B. Lopez, R. Lopez
Texas: Augustin
UCLA: Westbrook, Love, Moute
WKentucky: Lee
Xavier: None
WVirginia: Alexander
WashingtonState: Weaver
UNC: None(not that there aren't any nba players on the team, just none drafted last year)
Louisville: None
Tenn: None
Kansas: Kaun, Jackson, Chalmers, Arthur, Rush
Villanova: None
Wisconsin: None
Davidson: None
so half the teams in the sweet 16 didn't have a player taken in the first2 rounds of the draft last year. however, of those 8, at least half of them probably have guys that will be taken in the year's draft. so overall i'd say 75% of the teams in last years sweet 16 have nba players on their team.
Memphis: dorsey, douglas roberts, rose
Mich State: None
Stanford: B. Lopez, R. Lopez
Texas: Augustin
UCLA: Westbrook, Love, Moute
WKentucky: Lee
Xavier: None
WVirginia: Alexander
WashingtonState: Weaver
UNC: None(not that there aren't any nba players on the team, just none drafted last year)
Louisville: None
Tenn: None
Kansas: Kaun, Jackson, Chalmers, Arthur, Rush
Villanova: None
Wisconsin: None
Davidson: None
so half the teams in the sweet 16 didn't have a player taken in the first2 rounds of the draft last year. however, of those 8, at least half of them probably have guys that will be taken in the year's draft. so overall i'd say 75% of the teams in last years sweet 16 have nba players on their team.
if West Virginia, ans Western Kentucky and Washington State can have NBA players, why not State? Or us for that matter. Plenty of schools with no inherent advantages over either of us seem to do better.
Or maybe that was the point. C34's threads get me all confused.
Or maybe that was the point. C34's threads get me all confused.
unless i missed something???
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*edited to add: i saw jarvis for the '10 projection. however, a) that's 2 years away on a "projection" and b) i'll believe it when i see it...that he's the 9th guy taken
</p>
*edited to add: i saw jarvis for the '10 projection. however, a) that's 2 years away on a "projection" and b) i'll believe it when i see it...that he's the 9th guy taken
the SEC defensive player of the year is projected as a lottery pick in 2010 but that's too far away to matter.
Can someone answer me as to how many legit pros played on Butler's 2003 team and Xavier's 2004 team?
I can't imagine how many coaches would love to have jamont, charles and varnado on their team instead of one nba prospect.
Can someone answer me as to how many legit pros played on Butler's 2003 team and Xavier's 2004 team?
I can't imagine how many coaches would love to have jamont, charles and varnado on their team instead of one nba prospect.
i've got nothing on butler, that was just pure ****. chalmers was drafted and sato was drafted too (although he didn't make it). look i'm not on the stansbury is god wagon, just pointing out that most sweet 16 teams have nba talent on their team and the only nba talent we've had recently was lrob and he didn't last too long.</p>
are always exceptions to the rule. however, i think the point was/is that more than not, these teams have nba talent on their roster.</p>
Didn't you try to argue the exact opposite to show that Jamont's Cousy nomination was ********? He couldn't be the top college point guard without being an NBA prospect.Coach34 said:
"Didn't you try to argue the exact opposite to show that Jamont's Cousy nomination was ********? He couldn't be the top college point guard without being an NBA prospect."
You must be talking about JR. I have never said what the NBA says affects what kind of college player you are. And I always use Darryl Wilson to illustrate that point.
You must be talking about JR. I have never said what the NBA says affects what kind of college player you are. And I always use Darryl Wilson to illustrate that point.