What kind of offense and defense would you like to see run at UK?
- Thread starter Robcatt24
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IMO UK will probably never get the big uglies and talent we need to continue running the pro style offense in the SEC year in and year out. Like it or not we are a bottom feeding SEC wanna be with no real in state talent pool to draw from and no tradition to pull talent from out of state. Our best chance to compete is to run a true air raid with a duel threat QB. As long as we have second rate linemen and 190 pound China dolls running the ball with a pro style offense, we are toast in the SEC. We must create an exciting offense that is fearless and capable on any given day of outscoring other SEC teams. Stoops is trying to build a real football team the likes of Georgia and Tenn. but with half the talent. Recognizing who and what you are is part of the solution to the problem. Embrace the underdog role and play a style that is exciting even in a loss. Run a hurry up offense that leaves the other team gasping for air. Find a stinkin quarterback that can pass the ball and run like a deer!!
Offense: Multiple. See what Jeff Brohm does at WKU. Can beat you for throwing for 400 yards, or by rushing for 250. It's a pro style scheme based out of the shotgun and pistol. We are actually suited really well for this. Andre Woodson ran a very similar scheme back then but it was based under center.
Defense: 4-3 / 4-2-5. I'm a big believer of 4 down lineman. I think it frees up your linebackers more. Plus, with a 3-4, you have to have a really good NT. That's hard position to find. I would rather have 4 good defensive lineman on the field than 4 backers. I would also rather have a 5th DB than a 4th LB. Way better in pass coverage and frees up the other LBs to focus on stopping the run. TCU has mastered this.
Defense: 4-3 / 4-2-5. I'm a big believer of 4 down lineman. I think it frees up your linebackers more. Plus, with a 3-4, you have to have a really good NT. That's hard position to find. I would rather have 4 good defensive lineman on the field than 4 backers. I would also rather have a 5th DB than a 4th LB. Way better in pass coverage and frees up the other LBs to focus on stopping the run. TCU has mastered this.
Having a dual threat quarterback doesn't guarantee a thing unless you have a good one, and guys like Prescott don't grow on trees. In fact, we had one just recently in Whitlow and it didn't exactly work out. What success we've had in the past two decades has come when we've had Couch, Lorenzen, Woodson, and, to a lesser extent, Hartline. All pro style QBs.
Offensively, I would like to see Kentucky run the spread-option (much like you see out of Oregon). UK would have to get a dual-threat QB with the ability to make pre-snap reads, but it opens up the offense in a number of ways. Fun little playbook, a lot of answers against opposing defenses (which is why Oregon's offense works). Inside zone-reads, outside zone-reads, straddled triple-option, etc.
You don't need a Prescott. You don't need a guy that can make insane throws and break 3 tackles on half of his runs. You need a quick QB with an honest arm, and the ability to read defenses before the snap, and make the right call in the read-option post-snap.
Defensively, I want Kentucky to go to a 5-3. I'm confident in the back end of our defense against the pass with Westry, Baity, and Mike Edwards. I think Marcus McWilson/Darius West would be better suited as an outside linebacker in this formation. They have that kind of physicality, and with Mike Edwards, you're not giving up any physicality on the back end against the run or short pass. He's also competent at defending in man-defense, so that's a huge bonus.
It would give Kentucky a way to generate a much stronger pass rush (with Elam taking up multiple blockers at the nose tackle spot, 2 defensive tackles next to him (Miggins and Meant), and 2 defensive ends (Jason Hatcher and Kengera Daniel perhaps [unless we get a JUCO speed rusher]) at the defensive end spots.
You could generate a solid pass rush, and have Denzil Ware, Courtney Love, and Jordan Jones (maybe Josh Allen) if you're against a run oriented team (and as I mentioned, McWilson and West against pass oriented teams) behind them for the occasional blitz, and the ability to contain the run much better than we can in a 3-4.
A couple of years ago, or even in the 2014 season, this wouldn't have been possible, because Tiller and Quinn just weren't capable man coverage cornerbacks. Westry and Baity both have the speed, quickness, and length to be terrific CB's. Both are good already (Westry could potentially be All-Freshman SEC this season, will likely be All-SEC in the next couple of years). When you have a young defensive backfield like we have, that performs as well as ours has, it opens up new options. The only thing missing to make our pass defense that much better is a pass rush, and the way to have a good pass rush without opening up a ton of holes on the ground like we did this season, the way I see it, is in a 5-3 defense.
All things considered though, despite the fact that Chris Westry, Derrick Baity, and Mike Edwards were all true freshmen and started (some longer than others, obviously), despite the fact that Kentucky didn't have a pass rush, and despite the fact that our style of defense left Kentucky prone to lapses in gap integrity, thus, opening big gaps to run through, so our guys in the defensive backfield had that to worry about as well. I feel like a 5-3 defense could shore up those issues. Maybe I'm wrong somewhere along the line, but I think it's a solid idea.
You don't need a Prescott. You don't need a guy that can make insane throws and break 3 tackles on half of his runs. You need a quick QB with an honest arm, and the ability to read defenses before the snap, and make the right call in the read-option post-snap.
Defensively, I want Kentucky to go to a 5-3. I'm confident in the back end of our defense against the pass with Westry, Baity, and Mike Edwards. I think Marcus McWilson/Darius West would be better suited as an outside linebacker in this formation. They have that kind of physicality, and with Mike Edwards, you're not giving up any physicality on the back end against the run or short pass. He's also competent at defending in man-defense, so that's a huge bonus.
It would give Kentucky a way to generate a much stronger pass rush (with Elam taking up multiple blockers at the nose tackle spot, 2 defensive tackles next to him (Miggins and Meant), and 2 defensive ends (Jason Hatcher and Kengera Daniel perhaps [unless we get a JUCO speed rusher]) at the defensive end spots.
You could generate a solid pass rush, and have Denzil Ware, Courtney Love, and Jordan Jones (maybe Josh Allen) if you're against a run oriented team (and as I mentioned, McWilson and West against pass oriented teams) behind them for the occasional blitz, and the ability to contain the run much better than we can in a 3-4.
A couple of years ago, or even in the 2014 season, this wouldn't have been possible, because Tiller and Quinn just weren't capable man coverage cornerbacks. Westry and Baity both have the speed, quickness, and length to be terrific CB's. Both are good already (Westry could potentially be All-Freshman SEC this season, will likely be All-SEC in the next couple of years). When you have a young defensive backfield like we have, that performs as well as ours has, it opens up new options. The only thing missing to make our pass defense that much better is a pass rush, and the way to have a good pass rush without opening up a ton of holes on the ground like we did this season, the way I see it, is in a 5-3 defense.
All things considered though, despite the fact that Chris Westry, Derrick Baity, and Mike Edwards were all true freshmen and started (some longer than others, obviously), despite the fact that Kentucky didn't have a pass rush, and despite the fact that our style of defense left Kentucky prone to lapses in gap integrity, thus, opening big gaps to run through, so our guys in the defensive backfield had that to worry about as well. I feel like a 5-3 defense could shore up those issues. Maybe I'm wrong somewhere along the line, but I think it's a solid idea.
Wishbone offense.
5-2 Defense.
Party like it's 1983.
Seriously though, I would prefer a pro style multiple offense with a 4-3 or maybe 4-2-5 defense.
I could get with an Air Raid offense if the staff would actually commit to it but they don't seem to want to go all in for one.
5-2 Defense.
Party like it's 1983.
Seriously though, I would prefer a pro style multiple offense with a 4-3 or maybe 4-2-5 defense.
I could get with an Air Raid offense if the staff would actually commit to it but they don't seem to want to go all in for one.
I'm with the above - anything that spreads our opponents D out and gets our playmakers in space is what I want.
I would love to see us go after "dual threat" QB's but that is:
A) not what we have on our current roster
B) not what we have committed thru co 2017
I hate the man, but Petrino's O at UofL w/Jackson is a blueprint of my dream scheme.
Our Defense is fine how it is - we just need better players in the front 7. We would lose a lot of our flexibility going to a 4 man down front IMO.
I would love to see us go after "dual threat" QB's but that is:
A) not what we have on our current roster
B) not what we have committed thru co 2017
I hate the man, but Petrino's O at UofL w/Jackson is a blueprint of my dream scheme.
Our Defense is fine how it is - we just need better players in the front 7. We would lose a lot of our flexibility going to a 4 man down front IMO.
Offense: competent and well coached
Defense: competent and well coached
Based on the results I've seen for the last 40 years, apparently that is asking too much.
Defense: competent and well coached
Based on the results I've seen for the last 40 years, apparently that is asking too much.
Definitely want to have a 4-3 defense. Got to have 4 down lineman when you're UK. I wouldn't even mind some schemes playing 3 safeties to help guard the over/under throw.
Offense I believe needs to be a spread. It's quick but has more versatility to the offense. The air raid only works if you are quicker than the defense which we aren't.
Offense I believe needs to be a spread. It's quick but has more versatility to the offense. The air raid only works if you are quicker than the defense which we aren't.
So you are in the 4-2-5 camp - might not be a bad way to go, but IMO we have enough problems stopping the run as it is. By taking one more front 7 player out of the box, it would just exacerbate the problem.
Offense - Flexible spread. UK can't recruit well enough to have an inflexible offense. The spread will help minimize OL issues and allow for more flexibility. If you have a great RB, then you can run it well and feature him. If you have a great QB, then you can adapt and let him sling it around. If you have a mobile QB, you can flex the offense to utilize his skillset.
Defense - I honestly think UK would be fine with a 4-3, 4-2, or 3-4. The problem is the time it takes to turn over the roster. Making the transition from 4-3 to a 3-4 takes 3-4 yrs to accomplish. Changing from a 4-3 to a 4-2 can be done within the same yr.
This are my thoughts for UK......not neccesarily what I prefer.
Defense - I honestly think UK would be fine with a 4-3, 4-2, or 3-4. The problem is the time it takes to turn over the roster. Making the transition from 4-3 to a 3-4 takes 3-4 yrs to accomplish. Changing from a 4-3 to a 4-2 can be done within the same yr.
This are my thoughts for UK......not neccesarily what I prefer.
A
anon_013cn8yrfncx2
Guest
I agree. I would actually love seeing a hybrid lb/s player helping out with that. We'll see though.
4-2-5 typically lines up with 2 ILBs and almost always presents a 6 in the box look to just about any set.. While the 4-3 offers a 7 man front usually at least 1 and sometimes 2 of the LBs are playing outside the box. 4-3 OLBs frequently have an "outside responsibility" (or may be subbed out for a DB) against spread sets.
Peace
Honestly doesn't matter to me so long as the scheme is successful. I never understood the specific desire for air raid at all costs when discussing OC candidates.
what ever the offense...play calling needs to be aggressive...
would like to see us start being more aggressive with the intermediate and deep passing game...would also like to see the TE involved more...especially in the redzone and on third downs...
staff needs to find an athlete who can run some wildcat and play multiple positions...a Randall Cobb type...a dynamic and versatile play maker...
would agree that going forward staff needs to really recruit athletic QBs that can extend plays and move the chains on the ground if needed...
I like that this staff has gone after big WRs...Bone, Baker are big long athletes...got a couple big tall guys coming in this year as well...really need for Bone and Baker to step up...
would like for the staff to really develop the new guys to be ready to play next year...if the young guys to come along well...we could have 4 guys in the regular rotation that go 6'3, 6'5, 6'5, and 6'7...would have size and length mismatch every down...the redzone possibilities are endless with that size...
potential for deadly combos with the big guys running deep and the smaller guys running short and medium precision routes...
need to really get aggressive with the passing game next year...some potential for big things to happen...cant afford to squander it with passive play calling...
would like to see us start being more aggressive with the intermediate and deep passing game...would also like to see the TE involved more...especially in the redzone and on third downs...
staff needs to find an athlete who can run some wildcat and play multiple positions...a Randall Cobb type...a dynamic and versatile play maker...
would agree that going forward staff needs to really recruit athletic QBs that can extend plays and move the chains on the ground if needed...
I like that this staff has gone after big WRs...Bone, Baker are big long athletes...got a couple big tall guys coming in this year as well...really need for Bone and Baker to step up...
would like for the staff to really develop the new guys to be ready to play next year...if the young guys to come along well...we could have 4 guys in the regular rotation that go 6'3, 6'5, 6'5, and 6'7...would have size and length mismatch every down...the redzone possibilities are endless with that size...
potential for deadly combos with the big guys running deep and the smaller guys running short and medium precision routes...
need to really get aggressive with the passing game next year...some potential for big things to happen...cant afford to squander it with passive play calling...
But coach his best game was against us. That's not a reason to want a duel threat. Against other teams he lost his starting job, it makes no sense to me to want this type offense since we were the only SEC team who couldn't stop it.
Pro style shotgun offense
4-3 defense
We don't have the horses to get off playing only three down lineman
4-3 defense
We don't have the horses to get off playing only three down lineman