I pay no attention to rumors, because 90% of rumors I see here turn out untrue. Let's consider yesterday's win for what it really is. Both Kentucky and South Carolina are 2-2. South Carolina beat Vandy in Nashville. Tennesee is the best team in the SEC-E, followed by Florida, Missouri, Georgia, Kentucky, South Carolina, Vandy. Things could change due to injuries, development of young players, and luck of the game. In June, I explained on many threads why Kentucky will win 4-5 games in 2016, followed by 7-8 wins in 2017 when about 19 incumbent starters will return. Other posters slammed my reasoning, but they were just "tired" of this and "tired" of that. It was obvious in August, especially after Meant left, that our 2016 defensive line does not have numbers or experience needed for a bowl level defense. Yet, this morning, there is still a path to a bowl. We would have to beat Vandy and Austin Peay, plus 2 out of Mississippi State, Missouri, Georgia. I still think this team will NOT win 6. So, what is the difference between winning 6 and winning 5? There are 2 real football differences. You get 4 extra weeks of practice in December, and it's a little easier to recruit in some cases. Those 2 things are important, but not decisive this year. The biggest thing that happened this week is that Stoops rolled up his sleeves and coached our defense. Guess what, there was a big positive difference in our defensive effectiveness. That means Stoops KNOWS Eliot isn't getting the job done. And that gives us some hope that Eliot might be gone after this year. I have said all along that Eliot is the weakest link on our staff. Stoops won't like firing Eliot, but his future as an SEC head coach might depend on it. So that's 1 implication of this week. The other implication is that Stoops' recruiting class won't fall apart at this point. Jedrick Wills isn't coming to Kentucky, but there is still a viable chance to sign another strong class. What this team needs is more SEC type defensive linemen, and it's time for Stoops to find some. If he can. He also needs another quarterback to cultivate for the future.
What last night's win means. And what it doesn't mean.
- Thread starter Blue Decade
- Start date
Good post. I can deal with 5 as long as we are improving.
If we do not and remain in the bottom 10 of multiple defensive categories then it will be difficult to remain positive.
Your post is consistent with your initial points. I agree with much of what you say. The first two games should have been a win and a much closer game at Florida - period. I think your statement about Elliot is 100% spot on. If Stoops had pulled the trigger on Elliot, UK would have been a lot better now. He quickly pulled the trigger on Dawson - and I think that was still a good decision in the long run, but he should have pulled the trigger on Elliott as well. It is hard to fire one of your best friends. Stoops may be able to save his job - but if he is to do it he has to keep his throat on the defense and let his other coaches support him. This season is still salvageable, but we must win 5 and look good in doing it IMO. I'm probably wrong, because Barnhart will not fire anyone unless. Gillespie doesn't count - and I really don't think he even made that decision anyway.
Go Big Blue!
Not me. There's zero excuse not to make the bowl game with this crappy schedule. Apparently next year schedule was a lot harder so we're not making a bowl next year. So you're basically saying you're okay with Stoops not getting us to a bowl for 5 straight years as long as were quote-unquote improving LOL
Stoops' handling of Eliot and Dawson is instructive for all 1st time P5 head coaches. People can say whatever they want about Dawson, but Dawson beat us in our own house. I don't think Dawson ever should have been hired by Kentucky in the 1st place, but the same thing is also true for Eliot. I would not have had a problem with hiring Eliot as our linebacker coach. But Stoops hired Eliot as our coordinator because Stoops wasn't ready to let someone else have a free hand running our defense. By hiring Eliot as his coordinator, Stoops kept a hand in his comfort zone at the time. If Stoops wants to survive as Kentucky's head coach, it's time for him to bring in a real defensive coordinator who can teach, recruit, and make effective halftime adjustments at the SEC level. Otherwise we will never build a real SEC front 7. With regard to our 1st 2 games, I disagree with you but those games are in the past. All through the summer, I tried to explain why Kentucky would have a difficult time with Southern Miss, and would be badly outgunned in the Swamp. No 1 here would listen. But those games are in the books now, so continuing to have heartburn over them is a distraction. Everyone has to let go of the 1st 2 games and take a much more rational view of the future. 2017 has always been Stoops best chance for a breakout. It still is.
Honestly no.
But since we have Mitch I have to come to the realization that this is what will happen and trying to maintain some sort of objectivity.
I have been a bowl or bust guy for this year. But MB doesnt care about the fans or results, and his idiotic extension keeps us in the position of settling for mediocrity.
My preference:
Win 6 or get a new coach and give him these returning players next year so he doesnt have to start with a completely bare cupboard. This simply won't happen though.
Re Eliot, I think you're probably right. What I expect from Stoops is for him to promote Matt House to DC then hire an asst to fill House's current job, OLB coach I think. Maybe you've noticed that House has been very active on the sidelines the last couple of games. House will be UK's DC in '17.
Again I agree with your post. I also agree 2017 was to be the year - I think what I am upset about the most, as of now, is I truly believed next year was going to be a chance for a 10 win season - now, if things remain the same, I don't feel confident about winning even 7 games. But it's a long way to 2017 and we will have a different head coach next year than what we started this year with. It will either be a better Mark Stoops who will have a new DC or it will be a new Head Coach not named Mark Stoops. I think either of them will win and go to a bowl. Unfortunately I think we wasted last year and this year at this point - but maybe I will be proven wrong again. Maybe my initial optimism about this year will still show itself this year.
Go Big Blue!
Prior to this season, I explained why Kentucky will not win 6 games this year. Many posters disagreed with me at the time, but I didn't see real team awareness in their reasoning. Basically, everyone was "tired" of this, "tired" of that. There will always be fans who "want" more than the team is constructed to deliver. That would be true no matter how our schedule looks, no matter how our team performs. I have seen it from all sides. All due respect, it doesn't matter whether you think there are excuses. Stoops is not much for excuses either, but there are good, observable reasons why this is the 5th best team in the SEC-E. Those begin on our defensive line, which is just not very good. We played alright yesterday at home, but South Carolina is not as good as Southern Miss. It's time to awaken and look at this team for what it really is. And isn't.
My only complaint about firing stoops after this season is we will have talent arguement for next year. Next is the year we need to make big strides. It's hard to want a coaching change, and all the things that go along with it.
New staffs take some time to adjust and get to know personnel on what works. We could honestly start 2-2'ext year just adjusting to a new staff and working out kinks. After next year we are not in a bowl, ill pitch in and help with the buyout. But I want to see the team with a complete roster of coaches players. Yes he been here four recruiting classes. But that first class was mostly filled before he arrived. Everyone complained about the talent joker was bringing in, and it is pretty relevant with players playing now are all under classman. We do not have any senior leaders, because that first class was pretty much a waste. After the attention of losing hatcher, only Timmons is a stoops actual recruit in that class
New staffs take some time to adjust and get to know personnel on what works. We could honestly start 2-2'ext year just adjusting to a new staff and working out kinks. After next year we are not in a bowl, ill pitch in and help with the buyout. But I want to see the team with a complete roster of coaches players. Yes he been here four recruiting classes. But that first class was mostly filled before he arrived. Everyone complained about the talent joker was bringing in, and it is pretty relevant with players playing now are all under classman. We do not have any senior leaders, because that first class was pretty much a waste. After the attention of losing hatcher, only Timmons is a stoops actual recruit in that class
I agree with much of what you say. But the biggest challenge facing Kentucky fans is to just be more realistic. That's always hard for everyone, especially if not familiar with developmental issues on the team. Most people don't possess the gift of patience, but our fans just need to open their eyes and stop trying to destroy everything. As a fan base, we carry so much destructive baggage. So many people still have a boulder on their shoulder toward Barnhart, which is a waste of their energy. Barnhart has made a lot of changes over the last 14 years, and some changes have angered boosters for reasons having little to do with sports and much more to do with access. Stoops is a Barnhart hire, so for all the Barnhart haters it's open season on Stoops. That's destructive, so these people should be called out. 2017 has never added up as a 10 win season. Not in the cards. We don't have the kind of defense that generates 10 wins. But every part of our football team should be stronger next year. We will lose Toth, Kemp, Timmons, Miggins, Harmon, McWilson, McClain. All are contributors, but Toth, Miggins, McClain are the only starters. All of the 19 returning incumbent starters will be more experienced, and ought to be better players on that basis. Both kickers will be back, which is important. In our principal area of weakness, the defensive front 7, only 1 starter (Miggins) will be lost. Younger players like Adrian Middleton, Tymere Dubose, Kengera Daniel, TJ Carter, Calvin Taylor, Kordell Looney, Ja'Quize Cross, Josh Allen, Kash Daniel, Eli Brown, Roland Walder should be significantly better. Phil Hoskins should help, especially if he enrolls in January. The running backs and receivers will be as good as any SEC team. On the offensive side, the big question is whether Coach Gran will get solid play from his quarterbacks over 12 games. If that happens, this could be an 8 win team, not counting the bowl.
Not worth discussing. No matter what yarn his detractors on this board would like to spin, Barnhart is a successful athletics director. Successful athletics directors don't fire football coaches with 19 incumbent starters returning and a $12 million buyout. If Stoops doesn't get to a bowl in 2017, THEN he would get fired. But 2017 will be Stoops' breakout season. My immediate concern is whether Stoops can maintain his recruiting momentum, which will be essential and crucial farther down the road. I also think this is the time for Stoops to get an upgrade at defensive coordinator. Very important.
In what world is Barney successful. Of the two Money producing programs one has been a total loss. How do you define success?
It means we beat a horrible team. The thing I liked was passion of the D, the play of Ware,Allen,and Jones. I was impressed with O-line in 2nd half. Still Stoops made some calls and decisions that had me scratching my head yet again
Sorry, but nearly losing at home to a mediocre FCS program in EKU and getting beat by Vandy in a must-win game last year, then getting manhandled by Southern Miss and NMSU's offenses can't be whitewashed away by shutting down an inept South Carolina offense and the false promise of more returning talent. Their Qb was bouncing and sailing passes and still converted three straight 2nd and tens on the final drive. I'd like to see Mark Stoops succeed, but he's grossly underachieved to this point.
I like your premise but there are a couple of things about this season that bother me. First, the way we lost to Southern Miss. Had we not blown away huge lead I think most of us could understand that we lost to a solid team and we gave them a lot of fight. However, instead we looked like a tale of two teams in two halves.
Then I have a problem with the Elliott logic. Last week against New Mexico State is when Stoops took over the defense. We were gashed by their offense, especially on the ground. While this week was much better, how do you write off last weekday pitiful effort? Stoops called both the past two games and one was excellent and one was crap. So, how do we know which was really our defense?
Then I have a problem with the Elliott logic. Last week against New Mexico State is when Stoops took over the defense. We were gashed by their offense, especially on the ground. While this week was much better, how do you write off last weekday pitiful effort? Stoops called both the past two games and one was excellent and one was crap. So, how do we know which was really our defense?
Next year's schedule was/is set up to be our best chance at a 10 win season, including a bowl in the last 40 years. Our home schedule is very favorable and the question games are against teams that should not be as good as this year, Tennessee, Ole Miss and Louisville all will lose their quarterbacks and some very good offensive backs in the case of Tennessee and we get all of them at home. Georgia has not set the world on fire yet and we should be competitive with them on the road. Vanderbilt should be beatable on the road as well. We don't have any of the power SEC west teams on our schedule next year either. Injuries and departures always play a big roll in the future of all teams of course. Florida will be very good of course and probably the highest ranked team on our schedule. If we ever going to win 10 games or more in the next 10 years, next year is the year.
Go Big Blue!
My biggest issue with Stoops is that it took him this long to get involved with the defense and he supposedly did last week too and NMSU piled up 42 points with relative ease. Reluctancy to not take over or fire a friend over part of the team he responsible for is not part of a first time head coaches struggles, that is doing nothing but making excuses for someone. He is in his 4th year, not his first or 2nd, if he is reluctant to step in then he is just not head coach material. There is no since sugar coating it.
Perhaps he gets next year after all and he probably will but next years schedule is even harder than this years so no idea where you see 7 wins coming from unless this team receives a major overhaul in adjustments. Last night they looked immensely better, regardless of competition but I will temper any and all enthusiasm until such time they do something like this against a team with a pulse.
Perhaps he gets next year after all and he probably will but next years schedule is even harder than this years so no idea where you see 7 wins coming from unless this team receives a major overhaul in adjustments. Last night they looked immensely better, regardless of competition but I will temper any and all enthusiasm until such time they do something like this against a team with a pulse.
Next year's schedule is easier than this year's schedule - by a lot! Have you looked at it. The teams that are really good this year lose a lot of their firepower. Plus we have the best teams ALL at home next year. Next year WAS the year everyone was pointing to because of the fact we will have lots of experience back, should have some depth and don't play a power West team next year. Yes we play Ole Miss, but Ole Miss starts to come back to normal with talent level next year. Miss. State will be good, but we should be able to compete next year. 2017 was/is to be a big year for UK!
Go Big Blue!
I would not define success as 3340 posts and 62 likes. I doubt you have any idea what they athletics director does.
As of now Boom is ranked as the 23rd best rb prospect. He is small and injury prone. he is going nowhere
If you don't think Boom Williams is a top SEC running back, you know nothing about college football. Boom has great vision and cutback ability, great acceleration, and he blocks too. Running backs take more hard hits than anyone else except safeties. The thing that will cut into Boom's playing time, and I predicted this prior to the season, is that Benny Snell is the best running back at Kentucky at least since Rafael Little, maybe longer than that.
Lamar is just a true sophomore. He has to stay another year before he goes anywhere. UL will still be really good next year.
Being as Louisville QB is only a sophomore, why will he not be back.
And how many years has UK won 10 games?
And how many years has UK won 10 games?
At best I thought this year would be a 6 win season. We would win the home games. So now, I'm not sure they can beat Missouri away.
Um, can you show me where I said that Boom isn't a top running back in the SEC? That does not always translate to the league? Ask Tim Tebow... He is a great college running back that will play 4 years of college football. If you think he is going in the first round, you know nothing about football. see how that works
Kentucky was favored to win at home, and our D shut down a 120th ranked Offense. They did what they were suppose to do. So no contract extension this week.
It means UK won one in which they were a slight favorite, now have a 2-2 record (dramatically better than 1-3) and still have a legitimate shot at a 6 win season this year.
Defensively it means UK held a team averaging 283 YPG to 268 yards.
IMO, unless UK wins 6 this year (i.e., capture some bowl game "momentum" for 2017), it means little for next year. JMO
Peace
Defensively it means UK held a team averaging 283 YPG to 268 yards.
IMO, unless UK wins 6 this year (i.e., capture some bowl game "momentum" for 2017), it means little for next year. JMO
Peace
If this happens, we'll win. Big if, I know. I absolutely want to sign triple-option QBs instead of more pro-set QBs who may have bazooka arms but cement legs.