When Stoops has been here five years I would think it would be time to evaluate him and his staff. I just think there have been crazy things going on that look like we are disorganized and I don't understand it. But I do understand that it takes that many years to change the mess he inherited. The one reason I didn't want Coach Brooks hired was because of his age, and I didn't think he would stay long enough to finish the job. He did a remarkable job. Why he quit was rumored to be the administration didn't keep their promises to him. Whatever the reason I would hope we don't make the same mistake this time. We are just too thin to absorb injuries to any of our starters. Stoops should have red-shirted his whole freshman class every year he has been here. I hope he stays and gets the job done. I think he handles the criticism well and think he is the man for the job. And I hope "time" will tell if I am right or not. Just hope he gets that time! Just my two cents worth.
When Stoops has been here five year........................
- Thread starter Tapemaster8
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There are things that you should evaluate after five years (roster for example). There are things you can evaluate after a week (organization for example).
At this point in Stoops' tenure, there are areas that, IMO, can't be fairly evaluated. For example, IMO, he hasn't been at UK long enough to build a SEC roster or compete with the big boys each and every week. So when UK goes into Starkville and loses, I don't get bothered by it.
When UK has to call timeouts before field goals or punts, I get bothered by it. That kind of thing shouldn't happen even ONCE, much less THREE times in a month and TWICE in one game (UK actually took a penalty once in lieu of burning a timeout).
I don't expect Stoops to win big. I do expect him to run a fundamentally sound program though, and that includes doing the little things like getting lined up on time.
Even putrid football teams can be fundamentally sound. So in a nutshell, I don't expect Stoops to turn a 4.8 guy into a 4.4 guy. But he had better do a better job of acing the things that are in his control. Right now, he's striking out across the board.
GBB!!!
At this point in Stoops' tenure, there are areas that, IMO, can't be fairly evaluated. For example, IMO, he hasn't been at UK long enough to build a SEC roster or compete with the big boys each and every week. So when UK goes into Starkville and loses, I don't get bothered by it.
When UK has to call timeouts before field goals or punts, I get bothered by it. That kind of thing shouldn't happen even ONCE, much less THREE times in a month and TWICE in one game (UK actually took a penalty once in lieu of burning a timeout).
I don't expect Stoops to win big. I do expect him to run a fundamentally sound program though, and that includes doing the little things like getting lined up on time.
Even putrid football teams can be fundamentally sound. So in a nutshell, I don't expect Stoops to turn a 4.8 guy into a 4.4 guy. But he had better do a better job of acing the things that are in his control. Right now, he's striking out across the board.
GBB!!!
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He handles criticism well? What???? Didn't he say it's not as easy as it looks so why don't you give it a try? That sounds like the epitome of a man who lives off excuses and a man with a losers mentality.
If he'll endorse his paycheck over to me I'll happily give it a try. We may not win any games with gojvc as coach but we won't take the field for a punt return with 8 guys, I promise you that.
Did you just see where merriman tried to say USC was good when we beat them earlier this year now all of a sudden they're not good but at the time we beat them they were good? That guy is crazy man.
Erik..we were at the MSU game in Starkville...We got the ball first and the very first play of the game was what...an illegal formation penalty...really!!!!...WAY to much disorganization in the third year
This is the way I feel. Improve each year to where we don't get blown out and "run a fundamentally sound program". I don't look necessarily at wins and losses. I look at HOW we win or lose. That means more to me.
He handles criticism well because none of it matters yet. With his extension and relationship with Mitch he is safe as in his mother's arms, and he knows it. The fans cannot touch him yet, so he can casually blow off all of the criticism with a chuckle.
Two years from now will tell the story.
You sure have gotten your panties in a wad since you joined Sunday. Is this a repeat performance because you got banned or do you just dislike Stoops?
Why?...either way he has 18 million coming, walks away rich and becomes a DC somewhere...there is no pressure or if there is , give me some of it where at his age he is set for life
Hmmm...we calling MSU a big boy now? [winking]
I always thought of MSU as one of UK's "peer opponents". Up until Mullen took over I think the Cats and MSU were pretty even head to head. I know the Cats recently held an edge in this series. MSU had a 10 win season last year but more often than not have been a 7-8 win team.
Peace
Do any of you remember the press conference after Brooks got killed at LSU when he was asked if he felt like his job was in jeopardy? I am obviously paraphrasing but he said something like "I wasn't the first one they offered this job to. If they think they can replace me, let them." Point is, this is not a good job. Everyone that keeps begging for coaches to be fired needs to be careful what they ask for. Our staff is recruiting well. They have made mistakes. No more than other staffs we have had here. And before you build a statue of Brooks, he scheduled his way into some bowls, but was only .500 in the SEC once. I'm not sure how old you all are, but UK football has always sucked. I've been a fan since the late '50s and we've sucked other than when we cheated. I ***** and moan and get more frustrated than most. I'm commonly called a troll and a UL fan because I'm contrary. But we can't change coaches ever 3-5 years and expect to ever be worth a ****. At least Stoops owns it. If he is learning on the job, let's let him learn. While I am genuinely frustrated with some kids on the team, we are getting more talented. Let's give him a chance. Two more years of sucking isn't going to kill me. The gin and cigars might.
WildCard, no kidding dude. Mississippi State hasn't lost to Kentucky this decade. MSU hired Mullen (which resulted in their program improving significantly). Kentucky hired Joker (which wrecked the program significantly).
And as far as UK is concerned, yeah, MSU might as well be the Patriots (LOL).
GBB!!!
And as far as UK is concerned, yeah, MSU might as well be the Patriots (LOL).
GBB!!!
Yeah, I understand.
But I would guess he would just as soon keep cashing those big head coach checks from Mitch, as move back to DC somewhere. So, there could be slightly more pressure a few years from that incompetence and fan revolt could result in a pay cut.
But you are right that Mitch handed him a winning lottery ticket wrapped up with a big, blue bow on it. Obviously worth it to take a few calls from the fans.
under Stoops UK will always be a 5-7 or once in a while 6-6 team. We have regressed as the season goes along all three years. Doesn't appear that any players have drastically improved but like someone else mentions first play of the game illegal formation we come out of the half and always have dumb penalties or plays - just not enough experience in the key coaching positions. one example of Vandy is there Defense -points allowed was cut in half from the previous season that is improvement.
I
This is all well and good but so far stoops has not shown he has learned anything from his mistakes. He keeps making them week after week and this year they have gotten progressively worse. The vandy game may very well be the worst coached game I have ever seen. You could have done a random ticket drawing and had the lucky fan coach better in that game and this is his 3rd year. I get you cant keep changing coaches but the problem is we never land a proven coach with experience instead opting for someone looking to make a name for themselves in the coaching ranks. That is not going to happen in the SEC and specifically KY.
The only name they will make for themselves is fired for lack of production. Guy Morris is the only coach I can remember leaving for greener pastures and that was after one season. All the other coaches have been fired and rightfully so (except brooks who retired).
This is all well and good but so far stoops has not shown he has learned anything from his mistakes. He keeps making them week after week and this year they have gotten progressively worse. The vandy game may very well be the worst coached game I have ever seen. You could have done a random ticket drawing and had the lucky fan coach better in that game and this is his 3rd year. I get you cant keep changing coaches but the problem is we never land a proven coach with experience instead opting for someone looking to make a name for themselves in the coaching ranks. That is not going to happen in the SEC and specifically KY.
The only name they will make for themselves is fired for lack of production. Guy Morris is the only coach I can remember leaving for greener pastures and that was after one season. All the other coaches have been fired and rightfully so (except brooks who retired).
Never said anything about brooks. And he NEVER had a .500 sec team so you're wrong on that point. And I've never seen a staff not even jokers make as many mistake as this staff does every game. They make multiple decisions every game that have you yelling at the tv. Like the vandy game how we ran out of the shotgun 3 plays in a row from the one? That's one of the worst decisions I've ever seen. Then on 4th and 1 near the end of the half. He calls a run up the middle out of the SHOTGUN again. Never seen a coach waste a TO on a punt before. Then to not use a TO to save us 5 yards on the FG that caused us to miss it? Yup the 5 yards on the punt was sure a hell of a lot more important than the 5 on the field goal attempt. Then they went with the qb that's 5-17 with zero tds and an int for 22 yards over the qb that was 5-8 for 60 yards with 1 td and 1 int? The announcers that aren't even UK fans were giving him hel over all these decisions. It was almost as if the announcers were pissed at stoops for the way he was 'managing' the game for us. That vandy game. Was one of the weakest coaching jobs I've ever seen in any sport. Watching this staff coach. Couldn't be more obvious that all of them have zero experience in their roles. None of them look like they know what they're doing. None of them. To say they don't make any more mistakes than the previous staffs. Is just a total insult to football. I'm not that young. And we are not privelegded to have this staff coaching here. Whether you believe so or not. They have not proven to be good at anything besides recruiting.
But now there's money invested in it. I want change. If brooks had the money and the resources to recruit the same way stoops does. Then I guarantee you brooks would have stayed longer. And there's a good chance we could have eventually won 9 games in a year. The man could COACH. No denying that. He just didn't get the talent because he had zero resources to recruit with. Stoops has the resources and recruiting ability. But it's year 3 and it's as if he's making more mistake this year than he did the previous years. He never learns from his mistake it seems like. He repeats them over and over again. Doesn't matter how good the recruits are if you can't COACH. Which so far stoops has proven he can't. He can maybe change it. But his coaching abilities just don't look very promising.
I'd guess that you can find that disorganization in EVERY area of UK football, from the receptionist to the football field. Usually works that way.
I'm not sure if you were only around since Sunday like it says or not, but you must not have been around in 06 when Brooks went 4-4 in the SEC. But then that was the same year we beat ULM 42-40 also, so close games against teams you overlookd can happen also.
Then again you can lose a game 47-0 sometimes and come back to win five of six, counting the bowl game.
Weird how some of our fans are, our coaches have never had the experienced talent to compete at a decent level in the SEC, , mostly because of dismal support from the University, I still laugh at all the fans that were so upset when we lost to MSU by one TD in 09 that everyone assumed we should own when they had over 20 four star commits the previous four years (ALL from in their state) and we had two JC four stars playing. We still don't have the experienced talent to comptete with most teams on our schedule, but we do have an unusually talented group of young talented players that will be much better with experience. If we can hold our young in state talent and the rest of our class together we will filll some of our biggest holes, the OL could go from a big weakness to a great strength------if we don't run them off.
It isn't basketball. Tough to watch all the mistakes by our players AND our staff lately, but it is still a process, and not only do I not wish to start completely over again (some changes will be made after the season whether they should be or not) but anyone trying to get everyone fired now is just hurting the program, IMO, because it isn't about to happen, for several reasons. Recruiting being the big one to me.
If Stoops does get let go after next year (I doubt that he will be) we will lose a tremendous recruiter that will leave us a roster filled with talented players that a decent established coach will want to take over, instead of none of them wanting the job.
It isn't basketball. Tough to watch all the mistakes by our players AND our staff lately, but it is still a process, and not only do I not wish to start completely over again (some changes will be made after the season whether they should be or not) but anyone trying to get everyone fired now is just hurting the program, IMO, because it isn't about to happen, for several reasons. Recruiting being the big one to me.
If Stoops does get let go after next year (I doubt that he will be) we will lose a tremendous recruiter that will leave us a roster filled with talented players that a decent established coach will want to take over, instead of none of them wanting the job.
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You're right I thought the best he had done was 3-5 in the sec. At least I can admit when I'm wrong unlike some here.
Give up the cigars and switch to Kentucky Bourbon. This team will look better, especially if you start when the game starts
OLD STOLL FIELD GUY!
I like Stoops. But, I just see too many disorganization errors. 8 players on field for punt return, punt returner who doesn't know when to return or make a fair catch, run the ball EVERY 2nd and long, senior tackle that doesn't know he is supposed to be on the field for a FG attempt, etc... etc... etc...
This year is not lost yet folks. You are going to pound Charlotte, and the Louisville game will be very competitive, and even if you lose, you may still get a bowl at 5-7. That, while disappointing, is improvement over last year. If you can hold on to the recruiting class, next year should show further improvement. The fans need to settle down and support the team until the need for change is more clearly demonstrated. The team and the staff need to get better, but give them a chance to do that before you start running them off. Peace.
There's a lot of Billy Clyde happening on the football front at this point. The players aren't the only one coming apart at the seams when the pressure is on.
As for the notion that nobody better wanted the job, pure fairy tale BS used in order to deflect criticism.
As for the notion that nobody better wanted the job, pure fairy tale BS used in order to deflect criticism.
I'm afraid year 5 will be too late for Stoops if he doesn't start some internal evaluations of staff and overall strategy for the program...
I would agree Stoops needs a few more years, but the same staff and philosophy, scheme, etc will probably yield the same results...
He needs to go out and get the very best coordinators and assistants....and there will be plenty of viable candidates this off season with all the upheaval throughout the college landscape...there are already half a dozen programs who's staffs are going to be up in the air and I would a imagine that a few more changes will occur after the season...and then there are the shake ups that happen at the pro level that leave coordinators and assistants up for grabs...
he seriously needs to look at just about every position and ask himself if there is a better option to be had...
I would say OC is safe because he hasn't been here a year yet...but I do think CMS needs to bring in a QB coach that can focus solely on DB and PT and not worry about the offense as a whole or the other skill positions meshing...just a QB guy who can focus solely on developing DB and PT...
just about every other coach on down the list from OL to CBs needs to be evaluated and told to get it in gear or replaced...
I would agree Stoops needs a few more years, but the same staff and philosophy, scheme, etc will probably yield the same results...
He needs to go out and get the very best coordinators and assistants....and there will be plenty of viable candidates this off season with all the upheaval throughout the college landscape...there are already half a dozen programs who's staffs are going to be up in the air and I would a imagine that a few more changes will occur after the season...and then there are the shake ups that happen at the pro level that leave coordinators and assistants up for grabs...
he seriously needs to look at just about every position and ask himself if there is a better option to be had...
I would say OC is safe because he hasn't been here a year yet...but I do think CMS needs to bring in a QB coach that can focus solely on DB and PT and not worry about the offense as a whole or the other skill positions meshing...just a QB guy who can focus solely on developing DB and PT...
just about every other coach on down the list from OL to CBs needs to be evaluated and told to get it in gear or replaced...
Getting the correct guys vs getting the incorrect guys....
Spurrier's 1st year was 9-2, 6-1 SEC
(prior probation prevents being SEC-C or getting a bowl)
Spurrier's 2nd year, 7-0 SEC Champs, 10-2 overall.
Meyer's 1st year, 9-3, 5-3 SEC, but he beat Iowa in Outback Bowl.
Meyer's 2nd year, 8-1 SEC-C & 13-1 BCS-NC.
McElwain's 1st year, 9-1, 7-1 SECe-C, with SEC-C and a NC Playoff spot still possible. (however unlikely,,, has still greatly exceeded expectations)
McElwain's 2nd year,,,,, Oh-My-Gawd! (expectations)
(the zooker (3 yrs) and the musclecramp (4 yrs), not so much...)
Honestly guys I really just do not think MS is cut out for this...Listening to him talk game after game it sounds like a recording. I don't think he can do the job . This is year three and even though I think he deserves until his first recruiting(maybe second) class is gone can you possibly evaluate him fairly, but there is just so much disorganization and the sideline always looks like it is in a panic mode and there doesn't seem to be a chief to keep things under control. Next season is going to be a BEAR with road games at Otis, Ala., Fla., Mizzou, Tenn...All those but Mizzou look unwinnable at this point so that means you almost have to go unblemished at home which will be a tall task...This off season needs to be ENTIRELY concentrated on what kind of offense MS wants to run, get a coordinator than runs it and go from there because there is no doubt in my mind that neither NB or SD run what he wants...My biggest fear is that what he wants will never happen unless our recruiting is going to rival the big guys in the league for linemen...You ARE NOT going to win games in the sec averaging 16 ppg...I don't think even Ala could do that on a consistent basis...
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I have ZERO fear of losing MS IF they will go to Washington State and bring Mike Leach in here!!
I agree with Erik. With my job, I get an official evaluation 1x/yr.......but in reality my boss keeps a running evaluation of me......as he does with all his employees. It's the same with Stoops......there are things that it's hard to evaluate right now, but there is a lot that you can.
I don't mind a few coaching mistakes.....he's only been a HC for a short period of time now, but unfortunately there is too much currently. And the play performance and talent is not such to cover up those issues right now.
I don't mind a few coaching mistakes.....he's only been a HC for a short period of time now, but unfortunately there is too much currently. And the play performance and talent is not such to cover up those issues right now.
You can evaluate all you want, but he'll still have 3 years and 8 figures left on his contract. He's not going anywhere after year 5, even if he's terrible. Hopefully it works out. It didn't with Bill Curry, who got 7 years, I believe. Of course, he didn't recruit like Stoops does and was probably the worst coach I've seen on any level.
I just looked this up. This year's win gives MSU a 22-21 series edge. Since going into divisions in 1992 MSU owns a 16-8 advantage most of which is due to their current 7 game win streak.
Peace