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Who killed JonBenet Ramsey?

Who do you think killed JonBenet?

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UK_Dallas

UK_Dallas

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With all the documentaries and shows coming out on the 20th anniversary of her death let's get a consensus on who did it.

Personally, I think the brother accidentally killed her and the parents helped cover it up.
 
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UKserialkiller

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Had the means and the motivation
 
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wcc31

wcc31

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Weird and fascinating case for sure. I think it had to be an intruder- some sadistic child molester. I don't know how his DNA isn't in the system, though.
 
UK_Dallas

UK_Dallas

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The DNA is the only thing that saved the parents. I didn't realize they had been indicted but the DA refused to prosecute.

The parents also had a reward offered but dropped it shortly after moving away from Boulder. Seems like they knew that nobody would be caught.
 
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TransyCat09

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wcc31 said:
Weird and fascinating case for sure. I think it had to be an intruder- some sadistic child molester. I don't know how his DNA isn't in the system, though.
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Or why/how all of the stuff used to murder her was already in the house. Or why the killer wrote a nonsensical note (and a practice one). Or why she had her favorite blanket with her. Or why there were no more similar killings in the area
 
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wcc31

wcc31

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TransyCat09 said:
Or why/how all of the stuff used to murder her was already in the house.
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Yeah, but the stuff used to tie her up and other stuff used in the assault wasn't in the house. If it was the parents, then why wasn't it left there?
 
UK_Dallas

UK_Dallas

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Didn't they compare the note to the mothers writing and it was a match? Or am I misremembering?
 
wcc31

wcc31

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MdWIldcat55 said:
When you reflect on how badly the police and prosecutors screwed up what should have been a simple investigation and prosecution, it really is scary -- getting falsely locked up and getting away with murder are both more than plausible.

The idea that anyone other than one of the parents killed the girl, then took the time to hunt up a pen and a piece of paper inside the house and write up a three page 'ransom note,' asking for the precise amount that the father had been given as a Christmas bonus, strikes me as preposterous.

And what a moronic, panic-reflex to write that note. What was that going to accomplish once no call ever came and the body was found in the house? If the mother hadn't written that note the scenario of an intruder from outside with a sexual motive is just as plausible, and the strongest circumstantial evidence -- the note -- goes away.

Take away the note, and I'd be genuinely torn on who did it.

As for the DNA, the sloppy way the evidence in the case was handled, the passage of time, and the limited testing that was done, all make that less than conclusive to me.
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Lou Smit (sp?), considered at the time one of the best murder investigators in Colorado and hired by the Boulder DA to take another look, thought an intruder snuck in through a broken window downstairs while they were at a friends house, wrote the note, planned on taking the girl out of the same window in a suitcase but couldn't fit it through, and then just assaulted her there before fleeing.

The Ramseys were considered loving parents. Nothing in their past points in any devious direction. The thought they could come home on Christmas night and kill her and molest her then frame it as a failed abduction is just hard for me to buy. It doesn't make any sense.
 
wcc31

wcc31

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UK_Dallas said:
Didn't they compare the note to the mothers writing and it was a match? Or am I misremembering?
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They had like 5 experts look at it- I think 3 said no, 1 said could be and the other thought she definitely could've written it.
 
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TransyCat09

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wcc31 said:
Yeah, but the stuff used to tie her up and other stuff used in the assault wasn't in the house. If it was the parents, then why wasn't it left there?
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There is/was police speculation that the mom bought the ligatures weeks before. There is also the fact that the Ramseys were given plenty of time to themselves after the investigation had actually started. Could have fairly easily disposed of it, jmo.

Also, she was tied up entirely for show. The police said there was "staging within staging" of the body, i.e. she likely was not raped and/or tied up while she was alive, but just made to look that way. There's also the fact that killer used duct tape, but left behind no fiber or DNA evidence. The only cloth on the duct tape was strongly suspected to belong to the coat Patricia was wearing the night of the murder.
 
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wcc31

wcc31

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TransyCat09 said:
There is/was police speculation that the mom bought the ligatures weeks before. There is also the fact that the Ramseys were given plenty of time to themselves after the investigation had actually started. Could have fairly easily disposed of it, jmo.

Also, she was tied up entirely for show. The police said there was "staging within staging" of the body, i.e. she likely was not raped and/or tied up while she was alive, but just made to look that way. There's also the fact that killer used duct tape, but left behind no fiber or DNA evidence. The only cloth on the duct tape was strongly suspected to belong to the coat Patricia was wearing the night of the murder.
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I'm not going to argue with you. You obviously buy what the police said. I buy into what Smit thinks happened. I've watched plenty of shows on this through the years and I think it was an intruder.
 
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wcc31

wcc31

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I believe the DNA was discovered right away on the inside of her underwear. However, they have recently discovered the same unknown male's DNA on two other places on her pajama bottoms, as well.
 
wcc31

wcc31

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MdWIldcat55 said:
Not looking to argue. I respect opinions contrary to mine. But just so I understand Lou Smits' position:

He believes a killer broke in with the intention of a kidnapping for profit, awoke JonBenet, fed her pineapple, hunted up a piece of Patsy's paper and a pen from inside the house, wrote a three-page detailed note, in which he happened to guess the amount of John's bonus, then took the girl to the basement intending to smuggle her out in a suitcase (why not just walk her out and hustle her into a van) but when no suitcase could be found, sexually assaulted and killed her? That is one nervy intruder, who is both a profit-motivated kidnapper and a sexual predator. Seems unlikely, but that's why it is an enduring mystery, I suppose.

As for the idea that a parent murder doesn't make sense: I agree for the most part. I'm a parent of three, and in my most angry and frustrated moment have never come close to harming a child. But the sad fact is that thousands of parents snap every year and hurt their kids.
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More or less- although I don't think he ever considered it to be for ransom. I don't recall his explanation for that letter, although I imagine he had some thoughts on it. I think he believed it to be a pedophile who wanted to molest her. I think he believed the perp was in the house for hours while the family was away.

He was convinced the marks on JonBenet were caused by a stun gun- which was used to subdue the girl.

He thinks the suitcase was in play because of the way it was positioned beneath the broken window.

The garrote is the most interesting part to me. Who would use and/or know how to tie one of those things? Smit thought that specifically pointed to a sadistic molester who had specific fantasies about killing.

Also, keep in mind- her head injury wasn't just from a slap from a frustrated parent. Her skull was cracked.
 
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Wall2Boogie

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My vote goes to Chris Hansen. In all seriousness, who the hell writes a 3 page letter using paper from there house? It very well could of been the father but I could also see it being a family thing either way it's sick and when God finally cuts them down they will have an eternal place in hell.
 
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YourPublicEnemy

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Am I mistaken or did that written note also contain a $ figure that was exactly what the father's bonus was?

And wasn't there no foot prints leading away (it was snowing)?

Could be wrong since it has been 20 years
 
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mdlUK.1

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YourPublicEnemy said:
Am I mistaken or did that written note also contain a $ figure that was exactly what the father's bonus was?

And wasn't there no foot prints leading away (it was snowing)?

Could be wrong since it has been 20 years
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The dollar amount was indeed the same amount as his bonus. Don't know about footprints.
 
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KopiKat

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I dunno. Watching the old clips, being reminded of the image of Mr. Ramsey leaning away from his wife during an interview, hearing JonBenet's mother recite that phrase "I loved that child" and remembering many years ago thinking how she could have said "I loved her, I loved my daughter, I loved JonBenet" or any other combination of words that would not have been as disconnecting, any other combination of words that any other mother who had just lost a child would have spoken . . .

Phil is such a lightweight in this interview, going as far as to point to the conclusions in the book by the lead investigator who labels Burke as the "culprit" for this primary reason: because of a 10 year old boy's failure to ask enough questions on the very day his sister was murdered.

Not defending Burke Ramsey, but I will make this statement. In a world where now seems necessary to pursue conditions in order for grown, gender confused adults to avoid being traumatized by going to a bathroom other than the one of their whacked-out preference, it doesn't seem as if there is room to accept the possibility that 10-year old Burke Ramsey was immediately and permanently traumatized by the murder of his beautiful sister.
 
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JHB4UK

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bigger question....why the touch is this subject exploding right now, September 2016? my wife is searching through the Directv guide & finding shows on this on touching 5 or 6 channels.

no answer makes sense. the motivation and actions of an intruder, nor the sadistic manner in which she was displayed if it was the parents.
 
wcc31

wcc31

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JHB4UK said:
bigger question....why the touch is this subject exploding right now, September 2016? my wife is searching through the Directv guide & finding shows on this on touching 5 or 6 channels.
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a) 20th anniversary is coming up in December
b) the success of all these true crime docs/series the last few years- Serial, OJ Simpson, Making of a Murderer, etc.
 
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