Who thinks we should start Relf against ARK?

[jfs131]

I say start him. I'm tired of Lee constantly throwing bad INTs. The INT against Bama on the first drive....Peyton Manning couldn't have made that throw. The first play of the game..throw it 3 more yards and it's a TD. Too bad that's as far as Lee can throw the ball, 40-45 yards.

I say play Relf. Run the triple option all game, our counter draw, zone read, quick pass to Berry/Bumphis/Heavens, and throw the occasional deep ball because we all know Relf isn't a bad deep ball passer.

I would rather lose with Relf in there instead of watching Lee throw terrible INT after terrible INT wondering the whole time if Relf could do any better. We should be able to run the ball on ARK anyway, so let's let Relf run it on them too and throw the occasional pass. Seems like a better recipe for a win than taking our chances with a QB who can't see over his line.

Thoughts?

 

[jfs131]

I say start him. I'm tired of Lee constantly throwing bad INTs. The INT against Bama on the first drive....Peyton Manning couldn't have made that throw. The first play of the game..throw it 3 more yards and it's a TD. Too bad that's as far as Lee can throw the ball, 40-45 yards.

I say play Relf. Run the triple option all game, our counter draw, zone read, quick pass to Berry/Bumphis/Heavens, and throw the occasional deep ball because we all know Relf isn't a bad deep ball passer.

I would rather lose with Relf in there instead of watching Lee throw terrible INT after terrible INT wondering the whole time if Relf could do any better. We should be able to run the ball on ARK anyway, so let's let Relf run it on them too and throw the occasional pass. Seems like a better recipe for a win than taking our chances with a QB who can't see over his line.

Thoughts?

 

[jfs131]

I say start him. I'm tired of Lee constantly throwing bad INTs. The INT against Bama on the first drive....Peyton Manning couldn't have made that throw. The first play of the game..throw it 3 more yards and it's a TD. Too bad that's as far as Lee can throw the ball, 40-45 yards.

I say play Relf. Run the triple option all game, our counter draw, zone read, quick pass to Berry/Bumphis/Heavens, and throw the occasional deep ball because we all know Relf isn't a bad deep ball passer.

I would rather lose with Relf in there instead of watching Lee throw terrible INT after terrible INT wondering the whole time if Relf could do any better. We should be able to run the ball on ARK anyway, so let's let Relf run it on them too and throw the occasional pass. Seems like a better recipe for a win than taking our chances with a QB who can't see over his line.

Thoughts?

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

That was a hell of a deep ball to Wilder. He has been virtually unstoppable running the ball. I still think the TD throws to Bumphis and Green in the J-state game were two of the best throws I have seen from us all year. It really can't be any worse at QB. Lee obviously cannot throw a better deep ball than Relf.

I don't hate Lee, he is just in over his head. He has clearly regressed from last season though and I don't know the reason for that.

Do I feel comfortable about Relf attempting a pass on 3rd and 8 or longer? No, but I think Relf's impact on the ground game > the 4 or 5 intermediary throws per game that Lee might make.

In my mind it breaks down like this:

Best runner: Relf
Best deep ball thrower: Relf
Most accurate short to intermediary: Lee
Best game management: should be Lee, but you just can't hide all the interceptions anymore. If you play a serious ground attack with Relf and Dixon, I think Relf can do all you need him to do. 3rd and longs should be fewer and farther between.

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

Coach talks about "big plays" all the time. Lee has made, what 2 big plays all year? The busted coverage play to Green against LSU and Wilder v. Kentucky is all I can think of off hand. Relf has made a bunch of big runs and can throw the bomb. Put him in.

 

[Seinfeld]

I think that Lee has played more due to his speed/ability to avoid the pass rush as well as his game management. However, what Relf gives up in speed, he makes up in size. Also, after the past few weeks, I no longer have any confidence in Lee's ability to manage the game. He makes two bad throws for every decent one that he tosses.

 

[jcdawgman18]

I think that Lee has played more due to his speed/ability to avoid the pass rush as well as his game management. However, what Relf gives up in speed, he makes up in size.

Let me get this straight. You are saying that Tyson is faster than Chris Relf? Quicker, debatable. Faster? Absolutely not.

 

[Agentdog]

Well, Lee has had a couple of TD runs around 20-30 yards. Not sure of the exact yardage off the top of my head.

None the less, I agree with your assessment of Relf. The only logical explanation of why he isn't the starter has to be a grasp of the playbook/signals and making the right reads. I think his passing touch would come with some reps. Obviously, he is physically talented enough and I think has just as much speed as Lee.

 

[jfs131]

Lee has some quick acceleration but no top end speed. The run Relf had against UK showed some speed. Lee would not have made it that far. I agree Lee can avoid the pass rush better but that's because 6"5' guys are trying to tackle someone whos is 5"9'...they actually have to bend down and when Lee shrinks down to about 4" even, there's no shot at them getting him the first time. Relf definately has more speed and can also stiff arm and drag a guy. Against MTSU Lee got broken in half and fumbled. Relf might have bounced off that guy.

 

[Agentdog]

I think it was our 1st offensive play vs GaTech. Lee broke into a hole off the end and had 10 yards on everybody. A player with speed scores on that play.

 

[jfs131]

I think it was our 1st offensive play vs GaTech. Lee broke into a hole off the end and had 10 yards on everybody. A player with speed scores on that play.

Your correct on that. Relf might not have scored, but he would have gotten into the red zone. Relf runs about a 4.6 I would say, Lee about a 4.7.

 

[leftydog]

It isn't like Lee is going to throw the ball all over the place on Arkansas all of a sudden. Maybe it is just cuz I'm sick of Lee, but I'd like to see him not start against U Pig.

 

[graddawg]

I went back and watched the first few drives of Saturday's game on DVR and didn't to realize until then just poorly Tyson threw the pass on the first play of the game; I guess I was too amped up by the game atmosphere and the fact we "gained"15 yards on the play to realize it at the time. I'm convinced, based on the way Relf threw the deep ball later, if Relf had been in for that play we would have been up 6, 30 seconds into the game and we would all forget about the reactions to AJ and Banks' pick-sixes. That throw was just awful and it pisses me off thinking about it.

 

[HD6]

*

 

[thunderclap]

and Relf gives us another option in the running game that Lee doesn't, and Lee can't throw it for **** anymore anyway, so start him.

 

[xxxWalkTheDawg]

Run it at em with everything we can including relf. It would be nice to get the ground game going and opening up a few easy throwing opportunities.

 

[gravedigger]

the reason Lee has been playing is that he has a better ( didnt say acceptable) feel than Relf for how to recognize what the defense is showing and check off or change the play. This is what the crux of this offense requires. Relf, far faster, stronger and taller just doesnt have a feel for how to do this yet. Go back and watch the plays he is in there. He just doesnt look like he has any idea but to run the play that is called. I think Mullens offense requires more.

In the end, I still say it is worth a shot to allow Relf to start and play as long as he is successful at moving the team down the field. We'd certainly have a better shot at completing the short passes across the middle that Tyson isnt tall enough to see the receiver on.

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

If the coaches are looking at the D and calling in plays anyway, that takes half the burden off the QB. All he has to do is know where to go with the ball.

 

[Sutterkane]

4 star-future leader who brought recruits for us-Tyler Russell hasn't even played a down, and apparently he's the worst thing for our offense.

Yet headcase-team virus-plays soft D-Kodi Augustus is a godsend and we should play him 40 minutes a game.

 

[Seinfeld]

If Tyson Lee is slower than that, well... I don't see it

 

[Seinfeld]

Relf was clocked with a 4.9. I may be wrong, but I don't think Lee is slower than that

 

[Coach34]

from the team- it's the "General Consensus" that Relf couldnt pronounce the number on his jersey. Thats why he is not going to play a significant number of snaps and will be moving to TE this Spring...you can only run the same 4 plays so many times</p>

Relf didnt keep throwing deep to Featherstone because they thought he would outrun the guy, but because its one of the few plays he knows</p>

 

[jfs131]

Relf was clocked with a 4.9. I may be wrong, but I don't think Lee is slower than that

I bet it's faster now. He's stronger and more physically mature. It's gotta be faster than a 4.9.

Also, some of you are saying he can't read a defense. Against Florida and Alabama any QB will have trouble against them. Mallet got man handled by Bama's 35-7, so that's not a very valid argument. Against a mediocre at best D in ARK, I think Relf can make as many plays as Lee in the passing game if not more. I promise you Relf knows more than we think, Mullen may not be comfortable running those plays, but he does know more than just a deep ball.

Besides, against ARK all we need is the counter draw to Dixon, zone read, triple option, deep ball, quick out to WR, and a slant here and there. Relf can execute that better than Lee I beleive.

 

[Mjoelner]

Relf's rushing threat > Lee's passing threat. With Lee in the game, teams can load the box on Dixon. With Relf in the game, he at least has to be accounted for as a rusher. As far as the short passing game goes, I think everyone is just parroting what was said coming out of spring practice. I seem to remember a pick-6 thrown by Lee on a pass behind Ducre during the LSU game. Speaking of passes behind players, for the last 3 games every crossing route we have run, the pass has been behind the receiver. That is why Heavens dropped one in the Bama game. It hit his back shoulder.

 

[Todd4State]

I want to see Relf for no other reason than he at least looks like an SEC QB.

I also think based on Lee's INT's, it's a moot point as far as game management.

One thing about Relf throwing it deep is the threat of that should open some space for AD. Essentially putting Relf in takes out the short passing game, but at the same time, that may not be that bad of a thing for us. Plus, aside from AD, Relf looks to me like our second best runner. There is no doubt that he is a running threat that the defense has to account for, and again, that should help AD.

Plus, Relf has done a much better job on the option than he did earlier in the season.

So, what do we have to lose at this point? Give Relf a start and see what happens. He may know only 10 plays, but that's not that many more than Houston ran on us. At the very least, we need to be using Relf in the red zone.

 

[wchsdawg]

I can't believe this. Lee was the message board best chance two weeks ago now the vast majority wants Relf. Some of us, oops, a small and I mean a small number of us were saying this long ago. Put Relf in and keep it simple much like croom did with Carroll. KISS, which means keep it simple stupid and let the other team @@$% up first.

 

[Frances Drebin]

...we should start whoever gives us the best chance to win. I'm sure Mullen has a handle on who that should be.

 

[bierto]

I think relf not playing more results from the fact that he can't make the runnning reads and tends to take it himself much more than he hands it off thus making our one true playmaker on offense a non factor. I think despite tiger lees plethora of faults he is the quarter back that gives ad the best chance to be successful and in turn our team has a better chance to win.

 

[Beretta.sixpack]

....he threw some good ones in the JSU game to Bumphis, and the ones against Bama were dead on strike, just the defender mad a great play.....Lee's passing skills seem to get worse as the season goes on, at least I think....I say start Relf

 

[wchsdawg]

Did you?

 

[pDigital32Dawg]

Lee sucks. I no longer support the little guy.</p>

 

[jfs131]

I think relf not playing more results from the fact that he can't make the runnning reads and tends to take it himself much more than he hands it off thus making our one true playmaker on offense a non factor. I think despite tiger lees plethora of faults he is the quarter back that gives ad the best chance to be successful and in turn our team has a better chance to win.

He keeps it about half the time. But wouldn't you keep it at least that much if you only got a max of 10 plays a game. Bottom line is, when he comes in, he's very productive.

 

[Coach34]

that is a moron and will be a back-up TE come Spring?

 

[Spotdawg]

but I agree with you coach. I have heard from several on the inside...." NFL arm...just don't know where it's going." Not to mention that....uhhhh....the IQ is that of room temp water.

 

[Dawg in a pile]

but I agree with you coach. I have heard from several on the inside...." NFL arm...just don't know where it's going." Not to mention that....uhhhh....the IQ is that of room temp water.

If it wasn't for the NFL arm part, I wouldn't know if you were talking about Lee or Relf.

 

[jfs131]

they are probably thinking "how is this guy a starting QB in D1 football." It's not that Lee isn't a SEC QB, he's not even a D1 QB. He wouldn't be a top QB in D2. Point is, we're probably all thinking loss at ARK anyway, just play Relf. We really have nothing else to lose. We're going to have to run the ball all over them and control the clock to have any chance anyway. Lee is a guarantee to throw at least one or two bonehead INTs. Relf is smart enough to run the 8-10 plays we need to beat ARK. Against UK, we ran about the same play over and over and over again. Let's find about 10-15 plays Relf is good at, shuffle through them at practice and use the ones Relf is extremely good at. I promise you ARK is not preparing for Relf, probably not Lee either. Lee=no threat passing at all/balls batted down/bonehead INTs. Relf=Limited but capable/NFL arm strength. 'Nuff said.

 

[Todd4State]

whereas Lee has progressively gotten worse.

 

[pDigital32Dawg]

Why not start Relf? He will be back in the spring which actually helps my point and Lee will not. Whether he moves position or not we need someone with size back there that will make the opponent respect us a little more. Relf is big and can see. Lee is short and doesn't belong on the field for any SEC team.</p>

 

[VinceVega70]

Because he can run. Because he won't get balls batted down routinely at the line of scrimmage. Because we can run a triple option with him and our distinguished cadre of RBs. Because we won't be tempted to put him in positions to throw INTs (like we do with the incapable Lee). And because its our only faint chance at a win.

 

[Todd4State]

to whip out the wishbone with Relf and just go with it for two games.

Have AD and Ducre (if healthy) or Elliott (puke) at HB and then Hanrahan at FB, and we might have something. Maybe we could stick Bumphis at HB for a couple of games.

Hey, it worked for Jackie back in 1991 against LSU in Baton Rouge- Curley Hallman era, but still not an easy place to play. And it was a night game.