Why Can’t Penn State get to the National Championship Game?

CDLionFL

Well-known member
Oct 25, 2021
998
1,446
93
I'm gonna throw weight toward the offensive line. Washington's won the national award for best o-line. Michigan has had pros on their line the last 2 seasons. Bama and Georgia we know what they've had on the lines in their championship years. To me, it all starts with the line. If you can't open holes and protect your QB, the offense bogs down and the defense ends up being on the field longer than they should be. Eventually, that all-star defense cracks. We've had a couple of guys like Olu and McGovern get to the NFL but largely, the line has been a very inconsistent unit. Remember how Barkley would get swarmed over on a number of handoffs per game? Yes, part of that was the scheme but the o-line has been too inconsistent over the years to help get us where we want to be.
 

Nitt1300

Well-known member
Oct 12, 2021
4,013
7,495
113
Alabama is using their loss to generate more NIL contributions so they can buy rent better players so they can win more games.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LaJollaCreek

Bwifan

Well-known member
Oct 12, 2021
1,135
2,148
113
Agreed.

And when you did deeper: How do you get effective QB play?

Look at every Top Ten team, what do you find?
Either a HC who has a track record of developing QBs, or an OC/QB coach with that track record.

Rarely will you find a Top Ten team without a proven QB developer on staff.
PSU doesn't even have a QB Coach - let alone one with a quality track record of developing QBs.

1 other thing I would also put in why Michigan has been successful is the portal. Harbaugh has been very active in the portal from day one and used it to fill gaping holes on his team. PSU and Franklin have been active in the portal but took them longer to embrace it. PSU has also not done as well as Michigan in evaluating talent in the portal and fits for the program needs. One only has to start with Cephas at WR. Look at Lane Kiffin at Ole Miss the crew he has coming next fall at Ole Miss. Like it or not JF the portal is here to stay, its where you can fix holes on your team quickly if you can evaluate talent. Based on the PSU WR room this is an area where PSU struggles.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Midnighter

psu0408

Active member
Oct 26, 2021
148
367
53
I'm gonna throw weight toward the offensive line. Washington's won the national award for best o-line. Michigan has had pros on their line the last 2 seasons. Bama and Georgia we know what they've had on the lines in their championship years. To me, it all starts with the line. If you can't open holes and protect your QB, the offense bogs down and the defense ends up being on the field longer than they should be. Eventually, that all-star defense cracks. We've had a couple of guys like Olu and McGovern get to the NFL but largely, the line has been a very inconsistent unit. Remember how Barkley would get swarmed over on a number of handoffs per game? Yes, part of that was the scheme but the o-line has been too inconsistent over the years to help get us where we want to be.
OL and DT are the biggest glaring weaknesses. Our OL draft picks since 2015 - Scruggs (R2), McGovern (R3) Walker (R7), Fries (R7), and Menet (R7). Our DT draft picks since 2015 - Austin Johnson (R2 in 2016) and Robert Windsor (R6).
 

Midnighter

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,733
12,490
113
Interesting chart - Allar’s name isn’t listed but the PSU logo is under Alan Bowman and Fernando Mendoza.

 

PSUJam

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,982
13,161
113
1 other thing I would also put in why Michigan has been successful is the portal. Harbaugh has been very active in the portal from day one and used it to fill gaping holes on his team. PSU and Franklin have been active in the portal but took them longer to embrace it. PSU has also not done as well as Michigan in evaluating talent in the portal and fits for the program needs. One only has to start with Cephas at WR. Look at Lane Kiffin at Ole Miss the crew he has coming next fall at Ole Miss. Like it or not JF the portal is here to stay, its where you can fix holes on your team quickly if you can evaluate talent. Based on the PSU WR room this is an area where PSU struggles.
The answer is because PSU doesn't have the kind if money to spend in the portal that Michigan does. It's as easy and sad as that.
 
Last edited:

PSUJam

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,982
13,161
113
OL and DT are the biggest glaring weaknesses. Our OL draft picks since 2015 - Scruggs (R2), McGovern (R3) Walker (R7), Fries (R7), and Menet (R7). Our DT draft picks since 2015 - Austin Johnson (R2 in 2016) and Robert Windsor (R6).
THE thing is, all but Menet and Windsor are now every day starters in the NFL.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ChandlerPearce

Midnighter

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,733
12,490
113
The answer is because PSU doesn't have the kind if money to spend in the portal that Michigan does. It's as and sad as that.

You don’t need NFL first rounders at WR to have success - see Hamilton, Butler, Norwood, etc. More astounding than missing on portal WRs is missing on almost all of the 4* guys we recruited. That is historic bad luck or our staff is asleep at wheel.
 

TheBigUglies

Well-known member
Oct 26, 2021
861
1,287
93
I'm gonna throw weight toward the offensive line. Washington's won the national award for best o-line. Michigan has had pros on their line the last 2 seasons. Bama and Georgia we know what they've had on the lines in their championship years. To me, it all starts with the line. If you can't open holes and protect your QB, the offense bogs down and the defense ends up being on the field longer than they should be. Eventually, that all-star defense cracks. We've had a couple of guys like Olu and McGovern get to the NFL but largely, the line has been a very inconsistent unit. Remember how Barkley would get swarmed over on a number of handoffs per game? Yes, part of that was the scheme but the o-line has been too inconsistent over the years to help get us where we want to be.
Several OL made it to the NFL from when Franklin has been coaching. McGovern, Donovan Smith, etc and they are on Superbowl contending teams. This leads me to believe that the talent is there and the offensive schemes and blocking assignments are the problem. How can we have this talent and not open up holes? Its the schemes!!
 

Midnighter

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,733
12,490
113
Michigan has two five star players on its roster and is below Penn State in bluechip ratio. Bama has 18 5* players and the best bluechip roster ratio ever this year. In fact, the average of all Bama players is 75 in a given recruiting year. So, at every position on their roster they average a Top 100 player. That is the entire roster.
 
Last edited:

PSUJam

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,982
13,161
113
You don’t need NFL first rounders at WR to have success - see Hamilton, Butler, Norwood, etc. More astounding than missing on portal WRs is missing on almost all of the 4* guys we recruited. That is historic bad luck or our staff is asleep at wheel.
Hence the revolving door at WR coach. Is it a chicken egg thing?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Midnighter

PSUJam

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,982
13,161
113
Several OL made it to the NFL from when Franklin has been coaching. McGovern, Donovan Smith, etc and they are on Superbowl contending teams. This leads me to believe that the talent is there and the offensive schemes and blocking assignments are the problem. How can we have this talent and not open up holes? Its the schemes!!
Maybe we should hire a new OC to work on that. 😉
 

Karl_Havok

Well-known member
Oct 6, 2021
1,726
3,143
113
Because winning is very hard. Very very hard and the amount our program wins is unattainable consistently for most programs. It's why there are only a handful of programs who win as much or more than we do consistently.
 

Midnighter

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2021
7,733
12,490
113
Hence the revolving door at WR coach. Is it a chicken egg thing?

do not know schitts creek GIF by CBC
 
  • Like
Reactions: PSUJam

BostonNit

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2021
637
1,261
93
What you say makes a ton of sense. Thanks!

is Frank Reich still looking for a job?

QB is definitely key position as we have seen time and time again how offenses click or not under diff QBs. No QB has improved under Franklin and explains why Hack' was better under O'Brien and then seemed to regress under Franklin.
How about BigBen as a QB consultant? At least try SOMETHING, and you've got a guy with the 5th most passing yards in NFL history in state.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheBigUglies

mr.michigan

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2022
1,803
2,359
113
The answer is because PSU doesn't have the kind if money to spend in the portal that Michigan does. It's as easy and sad as that.
Michigan's NIL is a disaster and we have ridiculous restrictions on transfers with regards to credit. You aren't even close
 

Alphalion75

Well-known member
Oct 21, 2021
2,362
2,519
113
This is a serious question…..Why can’t Penn State get to the National Championship Game, similar to Michigan and Washington? Similar to Pennsylvania, the states of Michigan and Washington are not fertile recruiting grounds. In addition, both Michigan and Washington are not bringing in Top 5 or Top 10 recruiting classes year in and year out. Both schools don’t have fantastic facilities, they have average to good facilities like Penn State. Both schools are not doling out multi-millions in NIL, similar to Penn State. Michigan and Washington are not warm weather environments, similar to Penn State. Michigan and Washington have proved that you don’t have to be an SEC team to get to the National Championship Game.

So again, why can’t Penn State get to the National Championship Game? Is Penn State struggling or failing in Coaching, Culture, Player Development, or what, as compared to Michigan and Washington?
When you figure it out, let Franklin know.
 

Catch1lion

Well-known member
Oct 12, 2021
1,675
2,600
113
Franklins Big10 championship year we got hosed by the committee mentality . Maybe things break differently if that happened .
 

JoeBot409

Well-known member
Oct 26, 2021
668
515
93
The blue chip ratio supports Penn State’s ability to make the playoff and win a Natty. Washington and Michigan have been in the playoff multiple times. MSU and TCU have made it. On paper, none of them are better situated than PSU. There is sufficient talent at Penn State. They’ve been close.
Franklin is the number 1 problem. He is a terrible coach, no leader of men. Not much else needs to said.