We had 463 yds Saturday in regulation and scored 17 pts. I understand kicking is part of it but we can't score a TD either.
Why do we struggle so much with our redzone offense?...
- Thread starter dawgstudent
- Start date
Because we like to do **** like line up in 5-wide for 2nd down inside the 10.
When you put 5 receivers in the endzone, it makes that piece of property really crowded. And our surest-handed (new word?) receiver being our shortest further complicates things.
When you put 5 receivers in the endzone, it makes that piece of property really crowded. And our surest-handed (new word?) receiver being our shortest further complicates things.
Announcers said Saturday that our TD % in the red zone is right at the national average. Which isn't good, but not terrible either. I find it hard to believe though. Our playcalling in the red zone usually makes no sense at all to me. We run sweeps to the short side of the field, fades to our short WR and don't execute fades to our tall WRs well at all.
Mullen needs a red zone offensive coordinator. He can move it all day long
between the 20's, but once we get in the red zone, Mullen over thinks his play-calling. He also needs a goal line package where our QB gets under center. Spread teams tend to struggle at the goal line due to having the QB in the shotgun.
between the 20's, but once we get in the red zone, Mullen over thinks his play-calling. He also needs a goal line package where our QB gets under center. Spread teams tend to struggle at the goal line due to having the QB in the shotgun.
Can't blame the playcalling too much. We've scored 27 TDs on 44 attempts. Bama has scored 31 on 44 attempts.
4 TDs in 11 games. Milton fumbling and Wilson pushing off are two we gave away. I'm sure there are others. 4 TDs are the difference between us and the best in the SEC. Players got to make plays.
But we also need rip any page out of the playbook that calls for Perkins up the middle.
4 TDs in 11 games. Milton fumbling and Wilson pushing off are two we gave away. I'm sure there are others. 4 TDs are the difference between us and the best in the SEC. Players got to make plays.
But we also need rip any page out of the playbook that calls for Perkins up the middle.
Easy... it's because use we don't run enough fake jump passes.
In all seriousness, I think simply running J Rob will solve a lot of our woes. Getting stuffed on 1st and goal is killer. We get ourselves in situations where we have to pass, the defense know it, so our WRs are well covered. The result is a fade. We simply do not have the personnel to consistently rely on the fade.
I think Dan is still learning this part of the game.
I've wondered about coaches coming from the coordinator position - how many years does it take to develop a feel for specific situations like red-zone offense, when you are the one actually having the final say on what gets run? If you think about it, there just aren't that many opportunities to learn from in a season - you have 11 or 12 games, and probably average 2 or three key decisions per game in the red zone - that isn't a large N to develop a real sense of what is going to work and what isn't. I actually think Dan has regressed a bit in his red-zone calling because he's trying to be creative. I think he'll get better if given the chance, but I would imagine managing red-zone effectively is one of those things that takes some level of experience before there is consistency, and I don't think he has that experience yet.
I've wondered about coaches coming from the coordinator position - how many years does it take to develop a feel for specific situations like red-zone offense, when you are the one actually having the final say on what gets run? If you think about it, there just aren't that many opportunities to learn from in a season - you have 11 or 12 games, and probably average 2 or three key decisions per game in the red zone - that isn't a large N to develop a real sense of what is going to work and what isn't. I actually think Dan has regressed a bit in his red-zone calling because he's trying to be creative. I think he'll get better if given the chance, but I would imagine managing red-zone effectively is one of those things that takes some level of experience before there is consistency, and I don't think he has that experience yet.
Well, we fumbled at the 1 yesterday and had a chip shot field goal blocked. Against Bama we had a chip shot field goal missed...there's 13points from the last two games we left on the field in the RZ alone right there. The more you score, the more confident you become. When you're hoping to make the chip shot FG and combine that with turning the ball over in costly situations, or just can't quite get the TD near the goal line, that hurts confidence and I think that has a lot to do with it. Coaches start over thinking the play calling, not trusting players like someone in this thread just said, and probably causes our players to think too much trying to avoid a mistake.
I think having horrible special teams puts too much pressure on the O to get a TD and that in turn affects our confidence from coaches to the players alike.
Boom goes the dynamite. Perfect answer for you.
I think having horrible special teams puts too much pressure on the O to get a TD and that in turn affects our confidence from coaches to the players alike.
Boom goes the dynamite. Perfect answer for you.
Just once I would like to see us line up in a tight formation and put Chris Jones in at FB and let him lead block for Robinson.
Partially because Perkins is a back that works best in space, not limited space. Partially because we only have one or two receivers that might scare anyone on the fade or slant routes. We also don't have a true fullback to run lead inside the tackles so we could set up in the I formation.
just need to point out it is 4 TDs from the best overall team but not the best offense. Saban is a defensive guru and his team's reflect that.
We still aren't terrible but just not good. I think a better # to look at is what DS identifies: points scored as compared to total offense.
I just used Bama because they have the same number of attempts as us. Percentage wise Bama, South Carolina, Tx A&M, Vandy, and Missouri all convert 70% of their redzone attempts into TDs. That's as good as it gets in the SEC - ranks around 15-20th nationally.
We're around 60% which puts us about 65-70 nationally.
We're around 60% which puts us about 65-70 nationally.
It may be a problem for spread offenses....
I've heard that comment from a number of television announcers, although they just spout conventional wisdom, which is wrong as often as its right.
I've heard that comment from a number of television announcers, although they just spout conventional wisdom, which is wrong as often as its right.
To
me it's the playcalling in the RZ. It's horrendous. To go with that, we have poor execution from the players.
me it's the playcalling in the RZ. It's horrendous. To go with that, we have poor execution from the players.
I think points scored as a percent of total offense is a good indicator. I'm not 100% saying it is a significantly better indicator than red zone offense, but it may give a bigger picture because it covers the team's ability to score points both in the red zone and with big plays. I think DS and many people pick on the ability to score in the red zone because we appear to be able to move the ball well except there. We wouldn't notice a lack of red zone production if the offense struggled from anywhere on the field.
The game to date for Bama (since you used them) and OM (since we play them next) are below. I only used TDs Passing and Rushing and Field goals and did not include points scored on defense. I also did not include extra points since they "should" be automatic.
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Now, if you take out our pitiful field goal production you get a different picture. Below is just with points scored on TDs and no extra points again. Notice we are more productive than Ole Miss but the picture is the same with Bama.
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The game to date for Bama (since you used them) and OM (since we play them next) are below. I only used TDs Passing and Rushing and Field goals and did not include points scored on defense. I also did not include extra points since they "should" be automatic.
| Total Offense | Points Scored | Pts Scored as a % of Total Offense | |
| MSU | 4818 | 258 | 5.35% |
| BAMA | 4892 | 336 | 6.87% |
| OM | 5358 | 300 | 5.60% |
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Now, if you take out our pitiful field goal production you get a different picture. Below is just with points scored on TDs and no extra points again. Notice we are more productive than Ole Miss but the picture is the same with Bama.
| Total Offense | Points Scored - No field goal | Pts Scored as a % of Total Offense | |
| MSU | 4818 | 234 | 4.86% |
| BAMA | 4892 | 300 | 6.13% |
| OM | 5358 | 258 | 4.82% |
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Any breakdown on our RZ offense success with DP/DW versus TR? I think a strong zone read QB makes the spread more effective near the goal.. Without one, spreading out near the goal line gives the defense an edge through the boundary effect of a shorter field. I'm sure there are spreads that are very successful in RZ/goal lines situations. But given a choice I'd much rather have a power run game with an OL and RBs that will force the defense to stack the box just to try and stop the run, opening up much more options for getting on the corner with a wide run or fade pass than a spread offers.
You know going back earlier this year a phrase that Mullen kept bring up was finishing. I know it's coach speak but coach speak is not always a complete misdirection. Young teams or teams trying to find field leaders struggle with finishing. Whether its finishing drives or games. A lack of focus compounded by getting tight, especially when you know you cant depend on the kicking game. Its like standing over a 5 foot putt. With nothing on the line pros never miss. With a championship on the line that putt just got exponentially harder. I see play calling issues at times but there is a lot of lack of execution or mental breakdowns i.e. penalties. You don't execute because of lack of focus. Even bad play calls can work when executed properly.
because I have way too much time on my hands this week...
Season
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SEC Only
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SEC only touchdowns:
1- Russell to Siddoway fumble
1- Russell to Wilson
1- Dak to Wilson
1- Dak to Perkins
1- Perkins rush
1- Lewis to Dak
1- Dak to Lewis
2- Russell to Lewis
2- Lewis rush
4- Dak rush
SEC only touches, non-QB (accurate to the best of my knowledge):
10- Perkins
9- Lewis
6- Robinson
2- Wilson
1- Morrow
1- Milton (yep, one & only in an SEC game)
Interesting notes: Johnson & Johnson have not caught a pass thrown from within the redzone this year as best I can tell. Morrow has one reception.
In SEC play we've completed 11 of 25 passes and ran the ball 36 times.
This is all me looking through play-by-plays so I probably have some errors here.
Season
| Russell | 4-8 | 50% |
| Dak | 19-27 | 70% |
| Williams | 2-5 | 40% |
| Cowart | 1-1 | 100% |
| Mixture, Russell & Williams | 1-3 | 33% |
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SEC Only
| Russell | 3-6 | 50% |
| Dak | 11-15 | 73% |
| Williams | 0-1 | 0% |
| Mixture, Russell & Williams | 1-3 | 33% |
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SEC only touchdowns:
1- Russell to Siddoway fumble
1- Russell to Wilson
1- Dak to Wilson
1- Dak to Perkins
1- Perkins rush
1- Lewis to Dak
1- Dak to Lewis
2- Russell to Lewis
2- Lewis rush
4- Dak rush
SEC only touches, non-QB (accurate to the best of my knowledge):
10- Perkins
9- Lewis
6- Robinson
2- Wilson
1- Morrow
1- Milton (yep, one & only in an SEC game)
Interesting notes: Johnson & Johnson have not caught a pass thrown from within the redzone this year as best I can tell. Morrow has one reception.
In SEC play we've completed 11 of 25 passes and ran the ball 36 times.
This is all me looking through play-by-plays so I probably have some errors here.
This has the answer in it. On a shrunken field, LB's and DB's don't have to cover as much space so they can be more aggressive against the run. Russell commands no respect on the read option, which we stubbornly continue to run, thus 50% of the time, we don't score.