I offer this: Out of UK's possible starting D front 7 of Miggins, Meant, Elam, Ware, Jones, Love and say, Allen...who starts on any other SEC team? Maybe Ware on 2-3 teams, possibly Elam on 1 or 2 but other than that the likely answer is zero. Progress is being made but still a long way to go.
Wow, UK only favored by 7 1/2 over Southern Miss (posted on KSR).
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It is difficult to say because I don't believe any other SEC team runs a 3-4. Example: Ware may be a good DE in our system, but he would never crack the 2-deep at LSU because their DEs usually go 270-290 lbs. This isn't a knock on Ware, but at LSU he would be completely out of place, he would not be the DE that they look for, and would pretty much have no business playing there. On talent alone, Ware could start for Vandy, UK, Mizzou, South Carolina. Question is will those other teams be able to plug a player like him into their scheme?
Sorry if anyone is offended by me using Ware as an example. Not knocking the kid, just pointing out how this is a hard argument to make.
If the Southern Miss game was scheduled at the end of September, I would feel better about it. Because of successful recruiting, our overall roster gets better every year. The problem with playing Southern Miss in our opener is a case of bad timing. We have a new quarterback, a new offensive coordinator, a new punter, and a new defensive front 7 almost completely rebuilt out of reserves and transfers. Southern Miss has a great quarterback, a couple of experienced receivers, a veteran offensive line, and enough returning talent on defense to be ready for this game. I see this as an even game, with our main advantages being our home field advantage, MacGinnis, and our secondary. But Coach Eliot must find a pass rush to get pressure on Nick Mullens, or else we may lose this game. On the bright side, Denzil Ware and Kobie Walker really impressed me in our spring game. I tend to be an optimist when I have some facts to support that, but I don't see any way we beat either Florida or Louisville on the road this year. If you attended the Louisville game in Commonwealth Stadium on November 28, I am not sure how you are coming up with a win prediction over Lamar Jackson in their house. I know they lost some defensive players, but so did we. Josh Forrest kept us in that game.
Kentucky doesn't exclusively run a 3-4, although we use it in most matchups. Alabama also uses a 3-4 much of the time.
This is a misconception. Mullens is a very effective, very experienced quarterback, considered 1 of the best returning quarterbacks in the country. We have a nice secondary. But no secondary is ever expected to cover for more than 4-5 seconds. So if we can't put pressure on Mullens, he will pick us apart. And some of the things getting said here about Shannon Dawson are naive. Dawson had a tough time last year because he was a poor fit on our staff. I'm not defending him. But he isn't a moron. We could lose this game.
Southern Miss has been a pretty good football program over the years. They won 12 games in 2011, and then Larry Fedora left for UNC. The next year, under Ellis Johnson, they lost 12 games. They've clawed their way back to respectability since then. Imagine going from 12 wins to 12 losses in one year. Wow. Should be a good opening test for the Cats.
Yes, I was at that game. Regardless, you have a comprehension problem. Just where did I predict a win over UL this year?
miggins was recruited hard by ms st and they expected him to come in and start.... sooo.
Heard that too but his first year he didn't show that kind of ability. Maybe this time around he will, let's hope so. Actually think Kengera Daniel will eventually take that spot.
I understand English. You said next win would be Florida, then Louisville. But you still insist I have a comprehension problem. Can you comprehend this? 17,372 posts, but only 388 likes. Man, that's really ugly. But you keep slamming everyone else. So maybe you have the comprehension problem.
I agree. Miggins was a backup plan for that scholarship, after 2 of our previous verbal commitments de-committed. I have walked past him, and he doesn't look as big as his listed height and weight. He didn't show much last year, but I hope it was because of the system adjustment. Anyway, Kengera Daniel is for real. Daniel's offer sheet included Alabama, Tennessee, Michigan, Miami. If Daniel has his weight up to 260 pounds like the official roster says, then he will play a lot.
An 0-1 start. If that comes to fruitin then the ship will have sank. And a good portion of our fanbase would be absolutely done with stoops. Only the most hardcore stoops apologists would remain hopeful. Honestly though if we somehow lose to USM that will be the most devestating loss in program history and one that we would never recover from with stoops at the helm
Critical staff turnovers on each side. FWIW, I don't think Dawson was "as bad" as some make him out to be. For whatever reasons it did not work for him at UK but he gets another chance at another school. USM returns 7 offensive starters including a very good QB and a 1000 yard rusher (they had 2) from a high octane offense in 2015 so this year might be a better indication of just "how good" of a coach/play caller he is.
Currently the Cats are sitting at -7 in most places. Historically (i.e., past 482 games at that spread) a 7 point favorite wins outright 70.1% of the time but covers only 46.2% of the time.
Peace
Currently the Cats are sitting at -7 in most places. Historically (i.e., past 482 games at that spread) a 7 point favorite wins outright 70.1% of the time but covers only 46.2% of the time.
Peace
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That's ridiculous. Every year, half the teams in the country lose their opening games. A couple of years ago, Ohio State lost their opening game and then won the NC. Southern Miss is a solid veteran team with 1 of the best returning quarterbacks in the country. Southern Miss is a stronger opponent than Louisiana Tech last year. It will take a great effort for Kentucky to win this game. If you want to give up on Stoops, go ahead. But don't be shocked when half of our fan base doesn't follow you. The usual complainers have already given up, just like they gave up on Brooks in 2005. But smart fans are going to give Stoops the 2017 season to develop his 2014 class.
First week lines can be widely inaccurate however since there is no historical data for the current season to rely on.
Dawson is a reasonably well qualified offensive coordinator, and a better recruiter than he gets credit. It was because of Dawson that Kentucky got a verbal commitment from Mac Jones. Dawson knows what he is doing. But he was a bad fit for our staff at the time. He was not Stoops' 1st choice. He came here just as spring practice was being planned and got plugged into a staff where he didn't choose any of his position coaches. Some of them didn't like him. He became a divisive fault line on our staff and in our locker room. He was really not a bad game planner, but he did not show any aptitude for making adjustments in the game plan to take advantage what of the other team was doing in the 1st half. Play calling gets the blame here when we don't have enough talent or a good enough line to move the football against better SEC defenses. But in Dawson's case, some of the play calling criticisms may have been deserved. But based on what is being said around here, Southern Miss' offense is going to be a lot better than our fans are expecting. Nick Mullens presents major problems for us. Coach Eliot will have to find a consistent pass rush and make good adjustments during the game in order to win it.
Well, for one I think a healthy Boom would beat out Harris. We have a DB that Auburn wanted badly, that everyone raves about, and another that our coaches seem to think is even more talented, they expect him to have a breakout year. Our TE is still young and hasn't had a lot of opportunities yet but a lot of fans think he is something else. We also have a FIVE STAR OT coming in, and yes, even Bama has had five star true freshmen OL in their starting lineup before. These are just some examples.
Bama doesn't have All Americans at every position, our players would probably look better with the players at Bama with their back, and you need to get updated about the talent on this team, it isn't like the old days when the best we ever got were rejects from Home State U.
Cobb was worth the price of admission alone some games, we have a lot of players worth paying to see play whether we win the game or not.
I hate to break it to you. But this team is pretty much all stoops players. Can't blame joker. Can't blame anyone else at all anymore. The 2016 season is our make or break year. Wanna know why? Because after going 5-7 in the 2014 season, before the 2015 season. Coach stoops promised major improvement from the season before where we went 5-7. He said there will be a much improved product on the field before the 2015 season and to fill up the stadium for an excited and groundbreaking season. What actually happened? We played a MUCH easier schedule. Finish with the same record? We REGRESSED in 2015. Now you're telling me. He gets a pass the 2016 season? When he practically promised a groundbreaking bowl season last season? The 2015 season. And then if we suck this year it doesn't count it counts the 2017 season. I feel like I hear this every season. This season doesn't count towards stoops. Next does. This is YEAR FOUR.
This season. IS ALL ON STOOPS. If we crap the bed, he'll still be here because of the buyout money. Doesn't mean we shouldn't give up if we crap the bed again this season after last seasons despicable in game coaching, every single game. If you didn't see how terrible the coaching was last season. And how unprepared our team looked last season. And how we didn't make one IN GAME ADJUSTMENT ALL SEASON. Then I don't know what to tell you. It was bad. But if it REPEATS THIS SEASON. Then stoops needs to go. There's no more excuses. None. I've never seen such terrible in game coaching my entire life. Can't repeat that again this season. And if it does. As I said. Only the most hardcore stoops apologists will remain
UGA's base defense is a 3-4, sometimes one of the LB will put his hand down, at least the last couple years they have. But that one is gone now, so we may not have the 260lb OLB who can do that now. About the only time we went into a different front was short yardage and goalline.
It is your opinion that none of our starters would start for Alabama, but I am not sure how you know this. I will not give an opinion on which of our players would start for other SEC teams, because I have no way to know. Here is what I do know. Some of them would. Stoops hasn't gotten nearly enough credit for his recruiting. Matt Elam, Kendall Randolph, Kengera Daniel, Tate Leavitt, Landon Young, Drake Jackson, and Mac Jones got scholarship offers from Alabama. Boom Williams had offers from LSU, Auburn, and Clemson. Denzil Ware had offers from Notre Dame, Florida State, Florida, and Clemson. Jared Tucker had offers from Ohio State, Michigan State, Florida, and Tennessee. Marcus Walker had offers from Notre Dame, Michigan State, and Florida. Darius West had offers from Notre Dame and Michigan State. Chris Westry had offers from Florida and Auburn. Jordan Jones had offers from Oklahoma, Michigan State, and Nebraska. Jordan Bonner had offers from Tennessee, Nebraska, and Virginia Tech. Marcus McWilson had offers from Michigan State and Nebraska. Kobie Walker had offers from Oklahoma State, Wisconson, and Miami. Derrick Baity had offers from Oregon State and Wisconsin. Jordan Griffin had offers from Clemson, Stanford, Auburn. Drew Barker had offers from Tennessee, South Carolina, Miami. Mikel Horton got an offer from Florida State. Eli Brown got an offer from Ohio State. DaVonte Robinson had an offer from Notre Dame. George Asafo Adjei had an offer from Florida. Given sufficient development time, these guys are going to be good SEC football players, but most of the players mentioned here are still freshmen and sophomores. Several just graduated from high school in the last 2 weeks, and Jones just finished his junior year of high school. That's why our fans ought to be more patient with our coaching staff.
You are really dense. I wrote, "Seven would be 3 non-conference + V/SC/MO/MSU with MSU the most marginal. My next win would be FL, then UL." That means the 4 SEC games listed + the three non-conference that aren't UL since I listed FL as the next possible as the EIGHTH win , then UL as the NINTH win. Got it? But I'm only predicting SEVEN. Is that getting thru at all?
To top that, you apparently have a real insecurity issues since you worry about how many likes someone else has besides your own. Who the hell cares outside you? I wouldn't have known had YOU not been so concerned & now that I do know, so what? Do you live for being liked online? Have you no other life? Get a grip. Since you have such a need to be liked, I'll go back & mark several of yours, OK?
12`
According to WildCard's stats there is a 30% chance our season is over after the first game according to you. Lots of football teams lose games they shouldn't, I think USCw was a 31 point favorite over Stanford one time and lost. It's football. The real fans will still be here, even if they are complaining to high heaven.
BS. Quitters quit.
I followed every game after LSU destroyed us in 05, what was the score, 48 to 3 or something like that, UK rebounded with a very good record after that. AND they got revenge on the NC LSU team two years later. One game does not a season make.
Lots of ways UK could lose this game and have a very successful season, lot of fourteen point plays in football, one of the most glaring recently was the UK DB bobbling the ball in his breadbasket against Florida two years ago, which went straight into his hands and setup up a long gain for an easy TD when he had a wide open field for a TD.
And no, the coaches didn't cause that, I would have caught that ball in the 2nd grade. But oh, I wouldn't have returned it for a TD like he would have, pretty slow then.
BIG game though, very important to our bowl placement.
According to WildCard's stats there is a 30% chance our season is over after the first game according to you. Lots of football teams lose games they shouldn't, I think USCw was a 31 point favorite over Stanford one time and lost. It's football. The real fans will still be here, even if they are complaining to high heaven.
BS. Quitters quit.
I followed every game after LSU destroyed us in 05, what was the score, 48 to 3 or something like that, UK rebounded with a very good record after that. AND they got revenge on the NC LSU team two years later. One game does not a season make.
Lots of ways UK could lose this game and have a very successful season, lot of fourteen point plays in football, one of the most glaring recently was the UK DB bobbling the ball in his breadbasket against Florida two years ago, which went straight into his hands and setup up a long gain for an easy TD when he had a wide open field for a TD.
And no, the coaches didn't cause that, I would have caught that ball in the 2nd grade. But oh, I wouldn't have returned it for a TD like he would have, pretty slow then.
BIG game though, very important to our bowl placement.
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Right. Got it. Everyone else here is dense but you. Nobody besides you can comprehend. You are the only really smart guy. That's the theme of so many of your posts. But then, there are these inconvenient numbers. You have made 17,373 posts. You have received 390 likes. You probably have the lowest ratio of likes on the entire board. Oops. Now, that's really ugly. So maybe you are actually the dense party, maybe even too dense to see it.
Your comment is nothing but wishful thinking. As good as Boom may be he is not what Bama looks for in a RB. They could use him as a change of pace RB but he will never wear down defenses like Derrick Henry or Mark Ingram. Sorry, Boom would not start at Bama.
Very impressive list, thanks, and I know you shortened it, I wonder how short that list would have been before Stoops? Plus a lot of the offers were shortened because of the great job of spotting talent before other schools by our staff, a lot of them were signed early and were solid. I also know that Boom was not only offered by Georgia, but committed to them, backed out when they added Chubb AND another five star, when they already had Gurley on the team.
Half the players you mentioned have not played a college game.
The other half, what have they done so far?
Apples and oranges comparison. Elam may have developed different under Saban. As it stands he would not have started for Bama in 2015. Their DTs were miles ahead of him.
I am surprised to hear that they are still there, nice pick and choose.
Boom averaged over seven yards a carry with UK's OL blocking for him, Harris averaged about two yards a carry with Bama's OL blocking for him.
Do you think Harris is going to win the Heisman trophy? Scarborough maybe, a beast, he could start anywhere in the nation from the looks of him, what ever happened to him, haven't heard him mentioned a lot lately. I think Harris was the starter in their spring game.
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Like I said, he is not what Bama looks for in a RB. Henry wasn't the highest drafted RB, but he is perfect for Bama's offense. Bama just wants to hand it to him 30 times a game and have him wear down the D. That is not the system for Boom. Boom already has injury issues, imagine if he is given 30 touches a game.
Again this isn't a knock on Boom. Boom and Henry may play the same position, but they are completely different players for completely different systems.
Stoops needs to "breakthrough" this season or next. Most coaches who are going to upgrade the program do so in the third season, while some breakthrough in the fourth season. Sometimes it takes to the fifth season (somewhat rare), but given the context of UK's position, I could see it taking till next season.
But what is a breakthrough by UK standards? 7-8 wins I guess. Even if it happens next season, Stoops will need to prove he can sustain that, upgrade the program to consistent 6-8 win seasons.
Frankly I'm skeptical he can upgrade the program to 7 win average seasons from what I've seen so far, but am still hopeful. I'd like to see him take a page out of Dantonio's book (from Mich State), who probably does more with less (in terms of recruiting) than any coach in America.
From SB Nation:
If something big is going to happen, the odds are good that it will have happened by the end of a head coach's third year on the job.
Since 2006, 46 teams have improved by at least 14 adjusted points per game (per S&P+) from one year to the next. That's about four to five big leaps per season for the entire country. From this group of 46, 36 were led by coaches that were either in their first (10), second (13), or third (13) years.
There have been some stragglers -- Gary Andersen (Utah State), Dana Holgorsen (West Virginia), Kevin Sumlin (Houston), and Rich Brooks (Kentucky) all saw significant improvement in their fourth years, and Joey Jones broke through in his fifth at startup South Alabama. The rest are made up of late-career bounceback efforts: Air Force under Troy Calhoun in 2014, TCU under Gary Patterson in 2014, etc.
I agree that he isn't the type of RB that Saban wants. I wonder if he told him that before or after he signed his LOI? I wonder why Harris didn't notice that Scarborough was going to end up in his class.
In their two biggest games last year I think Henry had thirty or forty carries to a couple for the rest of the backs.
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Or Elam may have quit and left Tuscaloosa to go home. We will never know. All these things are hypotheticals. I did not attempt to comment on what these players have accomplished so far at Kentucky. I was only providing evidence that Stoops is an underrated recruiter who brings in lots of players coveted by other SEC programs including Alabama. But I have an answer for your latest question. In 2015, which was their most recent chance to play, all the high school players signed in 2014 by Stoops were still true sophomores and redshirt freshmen. All the players signed by Stoops in 2015 were still true freshmen. Players signed last February haven't had any opportunity yet. Since the overwhelming majority of college football players make their greatest contributions on the field in their junior and senior seasons, you may be showing a lack of understanding of college football by asking what Stoops' freshman and sophomore players have accomplished so far, as an indicator of what they might have accomplished at other SEC programs. But I am reasonably confident that Westry and Boom would start almost anywhere, and a lot of Stoops' younger players would be very competitive with a little more development and experience. But 1 way or the other, we will never know. Which is why your question may suggest a lack of confidence in Stoops that he might not actually deserve, given his strong recruiting record.
If you're making the case for Stoops being an underrated recruiter, then you must make the case for him being an overrated coach. Again, you can't give any coach a pass because they recruit well. You are what your record says you are, not what rivals.com says your recruiting ranking is.
Have to agree with this. It's either one or the other.
I personally think he has some guys on his staff that pull him down and he has made some bone headed calls. I know the DB's look good though.
The front 7 has never looked good. I've been told many times it's because of the talent then in the same breath are told of how awesome of talent we are bringing in now.
Okay, I will try for the 3rd time to explain this again. Like I said before, I am making a case for people to judge Stoops in 2017, when his 2014 recruits will be juniors and seniors. Last season, they were true sophomores and redshirt freshmen. In basketball, lots of players stand out as freshmen. But in SEC football, most players don't make their most important contributions until they are juniors and seniors. You cannot judge SEC football players as freshmen and sophomores. To make that mistake means you will underestimate the eventual contributions of those players. You should not judge a Kentucky football coach who is recruiting better than any of his predecessors until he has had enough time to develop some of his own players into juniors and seniors. Many Kentucky football fans wanted to run off Rich Brooks in 2005. But Barnhart was smart enough to support Brooks. Then from 2006-10, Kentucky went to 5 straight bowls. More people should have learned something from that, but impatience is not a rational emotion.
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Their is no doubt we have recruited better under Stoops than any other coach we have had since the 70's. I'm just thinking aloud here on what would the team looked like if Brooks was coaching them instead? Wonder what changes on the staff he would have made.
We are going to have to play lights out to win this game. Southern Miss has too much experienced talent for even Dawson to screw this game up.
If we start out slowly at all on offense, then there is a serious chance we lose this one.
This is a terrible bit of scheduling on our part. Making a team this talented our opening game puts our coaches in a tough spot.
If we start out slowly at all on offense, then there is a serious chance we lose this one.
This is a terrible bit of scheduling on our part. Making a team this talented our opening game puts our coaches in a tough spot.
Well, I don't know for sure about now, a lot more info in a couple of years, but I have always maintained that UK football's main problem this century has been lack of raw talent compared to other SEC schools. And I think Stoops has taken some giant steps to improve some of our coaching problems.