247 puts out 2025 Team Talent Composite

Perd Hapley

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They downgrade highly recruited players who don't see the field and then transfer to a less talented team. Many four-star high school prospects transfer as three-star transfer prospects.

Even without a lot of film, you can evaluate talent based on their inability to get on the field and by how in-demand they are in the transfer market. I have no idea how that factors into 247's metric, but it at least makes sense. Film isn't the only information recruiting services use.

I think you are giving them way too much credit. They are no different than these sites have ever been….just trying to sell subscriptions and get clicks. Zero actual research. You do that by catering to the biggest fanbases. And you cater to the biggest fanbases by making it appear that the players they are losing to school XYZ with a smaller fanbase isn’t really as good as originally thought, while also making it appear that the player they are gaining from school XYZ with a smaller fanbase is actually way better than previously thought.

Here are prime examples of how stupid the system is. First off, there are allegedly 6 tiers of player - Not Rated, then 1* through 5*. But if you land on a P4 roster, its evidently impossible for you to be any less than a 3*. This is crap…..it means there’s really just 3 tiers. This is dumbing down something already very complex to sell subscriptions. 1* and 2* players used to actually be a thing, and in real life they still are. They don’t account for them.

Secondly, I will give you the entire formula that they use with very few exceptions, which is pretty obvious from looking at anyone’s haul of players:

Scenario 1 - Player with average or maybe decent stats transfers up from G5 to P4. If he was unrated in HS, he enters as a 3*. If he was a 3* in HS, he bumps to a 4*. Probably very rare to find a 4* in HS that goes G5, but if you find one and he transfers up he becomes a 5*. No matter what, the player somehow gets better just by changing schools, which has NOTHING to do with how he actually performed. Do any players who don’t ever enter the portal ever get re-ranked? Hell no. So the overall rankings are going to be skewed from that.

Scenario 2 - Player transfers from lower tier P4 to higher tier / elite P4 school. Same as above. If he’s a 3* he’s getting bumped to a 4*. Low-mid 4* out of high school, he’s going to high 4* or possibly 5* at the new place. High 4* or 5* out of high school is a 5* automatically at new school. Even more stupid than scenario 1 above because it ignores the NIL effect. Big school may have lost a lot of players at a given position, and thus just need to pay up in NIL to replenish, even if it means picking up some guys that are more average than superstar.

Scenario 3 - The inverse of Scenario 1, player leaves P4 to go G5. Player gets a bump down in their rating from high school pretty much automatically. No research.

Scenario 4 - The inverse of Scenario 2, player leaves crowded depth chart at Big School for bigger role at Mid-Sized State. Again, automatic bump down. Again, makes no sense because it ignores NIL component. If OU liked Brenen Thompson in his role last year, wants him to get a small increase in snaps at least, wants to pay him $500k…..is he suddenly a worse player just because MSU wants to pay him $600k? Of course not.

Scenario 5 - You transfer within the same tier. Elite P4 to Elite P4, small/mid P4 to small/mid P4, G5 to G5. You keep your
rating.

Then, they’ll throw in the occasional oddball….just to give the illusion of some type of mysterious insight and try to give hope to the hopeless. My favorite example of that in this years transfer class is Dwight Lewis III, a 22-year old redshirt Sr from a no-name NAIA school who is allegedly a 4* talent now at MSU (LOL). Other past hilarious examples of this on the other networks were when Josh Riddell and Tyson Lee were both rated as 4* QB’s….and let’s not forget the Arizona Western DL class of 2001.

These sites all compete just to see who can find the most creative way to say that Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, and Texas are the 4 best teams in the country (in some order), and that 25 or so of the 35 “most talented” teams are SEC / Big 10 schools, when nobody actually needs a subscription or a detailed ranking to know either one of those things. Tell me I’m wrong.
 
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o_Hot Rock

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ASU returns 17 starters from a playoff team and we're more talented than they are? Garbage rankings.
Not garbage.. that is silly but it is just one factor.

Teams with better rosters do win at a higher rate but things like returning production matters, individual players and coaching will affect actual team performance.

put it this way:
The top recruiting gurus are still picking ASU to beat us. Why? Because it’s just one part of being a team.
 
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anon1758050382

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Oct 6, 2022
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I think you are giving them way too much credit. They are no different than these sites have ever been….just trying to sell subscriptions and get clicks. Zero actual research. You do that by catering to the biggest fanbases. And you cater to the biggest fanbases by making it appear that the players they are losing to school XYZ with a smaller fanbase isn’t really as good as originally thought, while also making it appear that the player they are gaining from school XYZ with a smaller fanbase is actually way better than previously thought.

Here are prime examples of how stupid the system is. First off, there are allegedly 6 tiers of player - Not Rated, then 1* through 5*. But if you land on a P4 roster, its evidently impossible for you to be any less than a 3*. This is crap…..it means there’s really just 3 tiers. This is dumbing down something already very complex to sell subscriptions. 1* and 2* players used to actually be a thing, and in real life they still are. They don’t account for them.

Secondly, I will give you the entire formula that they use with very few exceptions, which is pretty obvious from looking at anyone’s haul of players:

Scenario 1 - Player with average or maybe decent stats transfers up from G5 to P4. If he was unrated in HS, he enters as a 3*. If he was a 3* in HS, he bumps to a 4*. Probably very rare to find a 4* in HS that goes G5, but if you find one and he transfers up he becomes a 5*. No matter what, the player somehow gets better just by changing schools, which has NOTHING to do with how he actually performed. Do any players who don’t ever enter the portal ever get re-ranked? Hell no. So the overall rankings are going to be skewed from that.

Scenario 2 - Player transfers from lower tier P4 to higher tier / elite P4 school. Same as above. If he’s a 3* he’s getting bumped to a 4*. Low-mid 4* out of high school, he’s going to high 4* or possibly 5* at the new place. High 4* or 5* out of high school is a 5* automatically at new school. Even more stupid than scenario 1 above because it ignores the NIL effect. Big school may have lost a lot of players at a given position, and thus just need to pay up in NIL to replenish, even if it means picking up some guys that are more average than superstar.

Scenario 3 - The inverse of Scenario 1, player leaves P4 to go G5. Player gets a bump down in their rating from high school pretty much automatically. No research.

Scenario 4 - The inverse of Scenario 2, player leaves crowded depth chart at Big School for bigger role at Mid-Sized State. Again, automatic bump down. Again, makes no sense because it ignores NIL component. If OU liked Brenen Thompson in his role last year, wants him to get a small increase in snaps at least, wants to pay him $500k…..is he suddenly a worse player just because MSU wants to pay him $600k? Of course not.

Scenario 5 - You transfer within the same tier. Elite P4 to Elite P4, small/mid P4 to small/mid P4, G5 to G5. You keep your
rating.

Then, they’ll throw in the occasional oddball….just to give the illusion of some type of mysterious insight and try to give hope to the hopeless. My favorite example of that in this years transfer class is Dwight Lewis III, a 22-year old redshirt Sr from a no-name NAIA school who is allegedly a 4* talent now at MSU (LOL). Other past hilarious examples of this on the other networks were when Josh Riddell and Tyson Lee were both rated as 4* QB’s….and let’s not forget the Arizona Western DL class of 2001.

These sites all compete just to see who can find the most creative way to say that Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State, and Texas are the 4 best teams in the country (in some order), and that 25 or so of the 35 “most talented” teams are SEC / Big 10 schools, when nobody actually needs a subscription or a detailed ranking to know either one of those things. Tell me I’m wrong.
I don't know how much credit you think I am giving the rankings. I just think they are an interesting metric, not the be-all and end-all.

You seem to think they are absolutely worthless: "Pure nonsense"..."Zero actual research"..."stupid"..."crap"

I think you have the extreme position.

But I will ask you one thing: If it is completely fabricated, why did 247 move Mississippi State up 10 spots from 2024 to 2025?

My answer is that it is not completely fabricated; we had a tremendous amount of turnover, and 247 evaluates the overall talent on our roster as being better (not difficult after last season).
 
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o_Hot Rock

Senior
Jan 2, 2010
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ASU is going to miss Skattebo. That guy was their offense. He made it all work. They might replace him.
I predict we beat USM by 6 in a somewhat high-scoring game. The defense will look poor, but the offense will overshadow it. State fans and media will tell you the defense will need to gel, and we will be fine. They'll also mention how good an offensive coach Huff is and downplay how soft we look on the DL. Then Az State will double donkey punch us again while rushing for 200 yards...again. Hope I'm wrong.
I think you are wrong. State will dominate Southern Miss start to finish. Let's see who is right next week.
 

Perd Hapley

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Sep 30, 2022
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I think you have the extreme position.
Its not an extreme position to state that an organization that has people evaluating football talent who have never played, coached, or scouted talent at the collegiate NFL level might have quite a few errors in their metrics, because they are using very superficial criteria.

But I will ask you one thing: If it is completely fabricated, why did 247 move Mississippi State up 10 spots from 2024 to 2025?

No idea, but it’s pretty obvious last year’s ranking was way off. For one thing, ZERO draft picks in the NFL…for the first time since 2009. For the record, 37 different schools had at least 3 players taken. 54 schools had at least 2 players taken. So I find it pretty hard to believe we were 34th in talent with….zero NFL hopefuls on all the upperclassmen on the roster. I have my doubts that last year’s team was even Top 50. And therefore, how much they moved up or down in the metric that said they were 34th is not particularly relevant to me.

My answer is that it is not completely fabricated; we had a tremendous amount of turnover, and 247 evaluates the overall talent on our roster as being better (not difficult after last season).
That doesn’t mean they are right. But like you said, it was a pretty low bar regardless. Wouldn’t be hard to be better, but still doesn’t mean we are Top 25 there. But I’d bet we’re Top 25 - Top 30 in 247 website subscriptions and clicks, so there’s that…
 
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