After reading about Vick's interview on 60 Minutes, he seems really sincere and remorseful. He even acknowledged that he had always been a lazy player and never lived up to his potential. I, for one, hopes he makes the most out of this second chance. I am pissed however that the 49ers did not get him. Hell Tyson Lee would be an upgrade for the Niners.
Anyone kind of rooting for Michael Vick to turn it around?
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After reading about Vick's interview on 60 Minutes, he seems really sincere and remorseful. He even acknowledged that he had always been a lazy player and never lived up to his potential. I, for one, hopes he makes the most out of this second chance. I am pissed however that the 49ers did not get him. Hell Tyson Lee would be an upgrade for the Niners.
and i didn't watch the interview. Who doesn't want to see him make some of those runs he did in his first years in the pros. I'm looking at this from my entertainment perspective. If I can buy tickets to watch Vick go play the titans, saints, or falcons. I'm going. (once he's made a comeback)</p>
While I think he was an idiot for being involved, I also think its absolutely ridiculous the amount of outrage he's received for this. We seem to care more about animals than humans. Ray Lewis was involved in the murder of a person and didn't get half of the crap Vick's got.
To all the PETA folks, no I don't agree with dogfighting.
To all the PETA folks, no I don't agree with dogfighting.
He got busted, he served his time, and his debt to society has been paid. I'm sure the PETA folks will continue to beat him up for the rest of his life but they are retarded.Hanmudog said:
Hell, he served more jail time than Stallworth will. How 17-ed up is that?
play in college, especially in that 99/00 Sugar Bowl when his team was clearly overmatched (and he was still running circles around everyone), and not like to watch him play football. He is just fun to watch. Like J-Rock. Those kind of quicks don't come around too often. I hope he tears it up in a hybrid role for the Eagles.
I wish the Bolts would have gotten him. Sproles, LT and Vick in the Wildcat would have been sick.
I wish the Bolts would have gotten him. Sproles, LT and Vick in the Wildcat would have been sick.
No doubt that what Vick was involved with was a terrible thing. And yes, I have a family dog, but in no way do I equate what he was involved with to the mistreatment of humans. In that respect, I think things have gone a little overboard. He's now served his time. Funny thing is, I wonder how many people would have even cared if he had instead gotten involved with say cock fighting. Still illegal but nobody cares much about roosters.
if he is able to turn it around along with keeping this humble "i 17'ed up and am happy about my second chance" attitude then it could be a damn good thing when it comes to those who idolize pro sports athletes (i.e., kids). now granted, i idolized my dad but not all of Vick's fans have that opportunity.
and was starting to think that he turned it around. He was very frank and seemed to really come to terms with a lot of his faults. And then they discussed the fact that he has dozens of lawyers, agents and image consultants telling him exactly what to say. You didn't see an interview with Vick, you saw a interview <span style="font-weight: bold;">ABOUT</span> Vick but he just happened to be reading the script. It was all ******** down to the very last drop meant to secure him another chance at playing football.
I don't think he should be denied the chance to play if a team wants to take a chance on him but that team deserves all the bad press and protests they get. I don't give a rats *** about PETA, got no problem with hunting, but I am a dog lover. Anyone who can hold a dogs head underwater until it drowns is a ****** human being. I think he deserves another chance and I hope he fails miserably.
I don't think he should be denied the chance to play if a team wants to take a chance on him but that team deserves all the bad press and protests they get. I don't give a rats *** about PETA, got no problem with hunting, but I am a dog lover. Anyone who can hold a dogs head underwater until it drowns is a ****** human being. I think he deserves another chance and I hope he fails miserably.
First of all, Ray Lewis was tried and determined to be not guilty. Vick confessed.Bob Sacamano said:
But that's not the main point. The bolded portion is oversimplifying the situation. Yes, killing a person is worse than killing a dog. However, people get so sickened by what Vick did because it was so calculated and disturbing in its violence. I think most people can feel at least an iota of empathy for someone who committed a crime of passion. Vick did what he did repeatedly and in some cases as inhumanely as possible. I think that's why people have so much of a problem with what he did.
The excerpts made it sound like he was completely remorseful and almost ashamed of what he had done. Then I, too, heard about the image consultants. So 17 him. I hope he is eaten by a pack of wolves.
and I don't mean sheep in the genespage sense. I mean sheep in that you walk around thinking everything in life is rosey and noone will ever attempt to harm you just b/c they felt like it at the time. If I were a lifetime thug that could make millions based on how well I could convince people that I had changed, I imagine that I could do it. On the other hand, he did his time, let him play until he <17>s up again. He can be used to tell kids it isn't cool to fight dogs and they will refrain from fighting dogs because they are sheep too (the end result is positive). If he had come out and gone on a crusade against dogfighting without ever being caught, I would say he changed. But, it took him getting caught and losing all of his money for him to CHANGE. I for one won't be allowing him to dogsit my dog.
in terms of being a talented football player, only because I hate to see talent like his totally wasted.
He would love to go to a dog fight today... He just wants to get paid and that interview was just part of it..
I do hope he has a good year, only b/c I took a flyer on him in my fantasy draft...
I do hope he has a good year, only b/c I took a flyer on him in my fantasy draft...
"Anyone who can hold a dogs head underwater until it drowns is a ****** human being. I think he deserves another chance and I hope he fails miserably."
Some of the things Vick did were simply evil. While I believe in redemption, I will never root for or like the guy.
And for the record, PETA can blow me.
Some of the things Vick did were simply evil. While I believe in redemption, I will never root for or like the guy.
And for the record, PETA can blow me.
I do care more about animals than humans. At least in this regard. Aside from innocent bystanders and the victims of crazy people most folks who get shot in this country put themselves in a situation where it was likely to occur. Dogs are innocent though. They only want to please their master and they are doing what they were trained to do.Bob Sacamano said:
Plus, if Ray Lewis had raised the guy who died from birth, taught him to be the person he was, and then killed him by holding his head underwater until he stopped breathing because he lost a sporting competition I really think the outcome would have been different for him.
PETA can go to hell for all I care. I love my dogs, I have three of them. Killing a dog like Vick did is evil. Here is where it gets muddy. Millions of cows(which billions of people on this planet worship as gods), chickens, pigs(which are smarter then dogs), fowl, and other animals die everyday so we can all eat. This wholesale reaping of delicious flesh is only acceptable because our culture has allowed it for so long. Don't think for one second though that all these animals that we eat everyday are any more or less happy about being killed then a dog is. Vick grew up in a culture that condoned dog fighting, so that's what he did. He got caught and went to jail. In our carnivorous society he deserves this second chance. He payed his debt to society. Millions of humans are murdered every year in doctor's offices, but because our culture has agreed that it's acceptable then these doctors are not dragged off and put on trial for crimes against humanity. We are also a society that has decided that to defend our lives we are willing to bomb stone age civilizations and accept that there will be unavoidable collateral damage to civilians. So, here we are, a culture that eats animal flesh, that kills babies, and drops bombs that kill people are vilifying a guy who killed dogs. It would be hypocritical as a society not to give him a second chance unless we never killed an animal again, never performed another abortion and never dropped another bomb.
but mine is certainly not. My dog (and the dog I had previously) is regularly doing things he knows he shouldn't be doing or things that he knows I don't want him to do. He normally wants to please me when he's in the mood to please me and that's about it. And granted, dogs certainly don't ask to be put into a dog fighting ring, but often people who end up getting into dangerous situations don't intend for it to end up that way any more than the dog that got run over chasing a car intended for that to turn into life or death either.
I could see Vick never being forgiven for what he did if we were all Vegans, but we are not. We kill animals and we eat them in mass. The guy went to prison for almost two years. If you are not a vegan then you really have no right to hold him over the fire for the rest of his life. I certainly will not. I love me some bacon and a smart *** pig had to die for me to get my bacon on.
Dogs always want to please the Alpha dog. If you dog isn't try to please you it's because he/she doesn't see you as the alpha dog. Which means you aren't doing things right. Maybe a little "Dog Whisperer" will help.maroonmania said:
each dog has its own personality and they are not looking to please anyone ALL the time anymore than children are. I'll grant you the better trained they are the less problems you will normally have with them but the same could be said for parenting children as well. My dog is certainly not out of control but he's not "innocent" either.
Sorry but this argument is stupid as ****. I have no problems with Koreans eating dogs, that is their culture and those animals are raised as food. I have no problem with you eating pigs and chickens. These are SOCIETAL NORMS. Meaning, you aren't doing anything that our society considers wrong. But, in our society dogs are considered companion animals. I don't see many stores built for pet chickens, but we have PetCo and PetSmart for Dogs and Cats (among other things). Hell, we have daycare centers for dogs these days. So it's just silly to compare dogs and chickens in our society.Stansfield said:
Also, the silly assumption that Vick's society allowed dog fighting is also ********. Vick comes from the same society I come from. Now, he no doubt came from a area that had less respect for the law than I came from. There is no doubt he saw some things happen that I didn't see in my youth. But he knew this was wrong which is why he tried to hide it. He knew it was wrong which is why he lied about it when it was discovered. And he knew it could cost him his career if people found out. He knew with 100% certainty that it was wrong and he did it anyway.
Again, if you can raise a dog from a puppy and then hold it's head underwater until it dies because it lost a sporting event you are a damn monster. When you start raising your chicken from chicks, putting them into a competition, then drowning and hanging the ones that lose I'll start worrying about you as well.
the Dog Whisperer but maybe you do need to watch. It's not bunk, dogs are pack animals and when they act out it is because the pack, or more to the point the pack leader, is weak. There are some breed tendencies (some dogs love water, so them jumping in water when you didn't want them too wouldn't be considered being a bad dog) but otherwise pretty consistent on the psychology. Now, this only pertains to dogs raised as pups, if you have a rescue dog or adopted a older dog then the history makes a huge difference. If you dog is doing things you don't like it's probably because he/she doesn't respect you.
If I was a owner of a football team I would hire his *** in a second. I think what he did was wrong and I wouldn't want any part of it, but the media and some on here act like he was fighting humans. He did the time and is ready to play, I say good luck Vick, I hope you do well.
OK, interesting 3 points. I dont really agree with all thats in em, but they are interesting.Stansfield said:
1- I see what you are saying, and agree to an extent. The difference between what he did and what an Iowa Beef Producers(IBP is now Tyson) plant does is HUGE. Vick and Co friggin held the dogs head under water and drowned it, or electrocuted it to death in an inefficient way, or hung it from a tree and let it flail and swing around while choking to death. IBP uses electrocution in a way that is near immediate and also uses gas in a way that is near immediate.
The difference is that one is done as humanely as possible(IBP) while the other is done inefficiently and maximizes torture to the animal during the process of dying(Vick and Co way).
Neither way is pleasant for sure. Ive been in an IBP and it was tough to even come close to meat for the next couple of weeks. But since we are omnivores, meat is a staple of our diet. We have consumed if for thousands upon thousands of years.
And that brings me to the next difference between what Vick did and people eating meat. VICK WASTED THE ANIMAL!! People eating the meat of a slaughtered cattle is putting the animal's death to a use. Vick just wasted the dog's life and buried it. Do you really not see the difference? One is killing an animal so you can survive(i hear omnivores eat meat to survive). The other is killing an animal because it serves no further use for your selfish agenda. If the difference between those two isnt clear, i cant help ya any more.
2- Im gonna try and keep the abortion thing short since this is still a sports MB, even though in the summer it turns into a slightly less crocish version of NAFOOM with all the nonsports talk.
The doctor is not murdering a human. A fetus, at various stages of growth, is being terminated. I personally wouldnt ever consider such an option, but i do want everyone to be able to at least have an actual honest discussion on the matter when desired, and misinformation like that benefits nobody. It is not murder because a fetus has not been born and therefore is not afforded the rights of the living. If we were to call that murder, then we would have to classify fetuses as living Americans. They would have to get SS#s, be taxable dependants while in the womb, when a miscarriage happens the police would have to investigate the death, and women who smoke or drink would most likely be forced into incarceration since they are as parents making their child drink and smoke as an infant. Once born, the child would be immediately removed from the household as a result of those actions.
Since all that is absurd(though logical if fetuses are granted the rights of the living), lets try and not say doctors are killing humans, deal?
3- Absurd. Too absurd to actually comment on. Just refer back to points 1 and 2.