best thing I heard about Payton Manning this morning...
- Thread starter Coach34
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I have no idea what Marino's post season record is. I know he didn't win any Super Bowls. But I would say he was a helluva QB. Same for Peyton. Manning is probably one of the best but certainly not the best ever.
Best ever would have to be Montana. He was a decent athlete as well. Manning wears concrete cleats.
Best ever would have to be Montana. He was a decent athlete as well. Manning wears concrete cleats.
We get it, you think Montana is the greatest QB of all time. You're not going out on a limb here, and a lot of people agree with you. Starting to sound like fishwater with the repetitiveness.
Please tell me no.
Do you think Brett Favre isn't good?
If your telling me yes on both of these, I will immediately change my stance on Stansbury.
Do you think Brett Favre isn't good?
If your telling me yes on both of these, I will immediately change my stance on Stansbury.
And I realize that QBs are the most influential position on the field, but using playoff record as your main talking point when it comes to football is very short-sighted.
It takes a lot more than a QB to win a Super Bowl, or else Jeff Hostetler and Trent Dilfer wouldn't have as many rings as Peyton Manning and Drew Brees.
Was Elway average before he won two titles late in his career? The answer is no. He was always a great QB. He just finally had the right supporting cast around him to give him a chance at a title.
Montana is a great QB, but you can't just use playoff record to measure him against others, and the debate on who is the greatest of all-time is about as clear of an answer as the Jack vs. Tiger debate. In other words, it can't be answered.
By the way, if you go purely on winning percentage as a starter, Tom Brady is better than Joe Montana (97-30 is greater than 117-47). Tom Brady also has a better playoff record than Montana (14-4). So, if that's your measure, then Brady is the greatest ever.
It takes a lot more than a QB to win a Super Bowl, or else Jeff Hostetler and Trent Dilfer wouldn't have as many rings as Peyton Manning and Drew Brees.
Was Elway average before he won two titles late in his career? The answer is no. He was always a great QB. He just finally had the right supporting cast around him to give him a chance at a title.
Montana is a great QB, but you can't just use playoff record to measure him against others, and the debate on who is the greatest of all-time is about as clear of an answer as the Jack vs. Tiger debate. In other words, it can't be answered.
By the way, if you go purely on winning percentage as a starter, Tom Brady is better than Joe Montana (97-30 is greater than 117-47). Tom Brady also has a better playoff record than Montana (14-4). So, if that's your measure, then Brady is the greatest ever.
There are 22 starters on a football team each game.. How can everything be placed on the QB? I can see how you can say that about pitchers in the WS, but it just doesn't hold true in football..
Marino is the best pure passer I have ever seen play football. I saw an NFL films on Marino where Bill Walsh, Don Shula, Elway, and several others all said the same..
Marino is the best pure passer I have ever seen play football. I saw an NFL films on Marino where Bill Walsh, Don Shula, Elway, and several others all said the same..
I noticed how Jim Nantz kept referring to his partner as the man who led two teams to the Championship. When was the second? Don't recall him playing much the year of Bills Choke Number One.
but it does play an important part...
The point was is that they are both great QB's, but when you come down to differences and having to differentiate, Montana's flawless performances in Super Bowl's puts him above pretty much everyone. In my opinion, Brady is the only one with a chance to unseed him.
And I agree that Otto Graham should be considered the best old school QB.
The point was is that they are both great QB's, but when you come down to differences and having to differentiate, Montana's flawless performances in Super Bowl's puts him above pretty much everyone. In my opinion, Brady is the only one with a chance to unseed him.
And I agree that Otto Graham should be considered the best old school QB.
Coach34 said:
Bastard didn't lose, did he? Comes to the NFL from a "nothing" conference, promptly beats the NFL Champion the opening weekend, smacks around the rest of the league for six years, wins a division title every year in the league. Did lose three title games - two closes one and one freakin beat down from their main 50s rivals the Lions. But that guy could play QB. And he won. True measure of a great QB? Wins.
I still think Unitas was the best though. Its fun to compare old to new, but I don't know how you could realistically make a decision between old and new.
Kinda partial to Staubach too...if Landry had handed him the reins earlier...who knows? Hemight be closer to Montana. Of course, if he had got traded to Atlanta, he'd probably be a lot closer to Bartkowski.
slightly. People forget Danny White was a very good QB. He could actually be on the list. Marino was better, but by the mid 80s, the Cowboys problems ran much deeper than the QB position.
See? No violence.
See? No violence.
I think he would have still won, that's all I'm saying. Marino is my favorite QB of all time, it's just a shame he never had a running back or a defense worth a ****.
He was able to win without unreal talent around him. Like I said, in his first Super Bowl, he was throwing to Dwight Clark and Freddie Soloman, I think their TE was Charlie Young, and then they had Earl Cooper, Paul Hofer, and Wendell Tyler at RB. Their o-line had people like Randy Cross, Fred Quillan, Jim Fahnhorst. Some of those players were very solid players, but not HOF talent.
Later in his career, he helped make some players better- like Roger Craig, Brent Jones, John Taylor, and Tom Rathman.
The 49ers did add better players later in the 80's, and they were just loaded- namely Jerry Rice. Joe only won two Super Bowl's with Rice, though.
And I would be remiss to not mention that the 49ers also had a very good defense- Ronnie Lott, Fred Dean, Jack Hacksaw Reynolds, Keena Turner, and and later Charles Haley. The 49ers were just great, but they were built around Joe Montana and Ronnie Lott.
Later in his career, he helped make some players better- like Roger Craig, Brent Jones, John Taylor, and Tom Rathman.
The 49ers did add better players later in the 80's, and they were just loaded- namely Jerry Rice. Joe only won two Super Bowl's with Rice, though.
And I would be remiss to not mention that the 49ers also had a very good defense- Ronnie Lott, Fred Dean, Jack Hacksaw Reynolds, Keena Turner, and and later Charles Haley. The 49ers were just great, but they were built around Joe Montana and Ronnie Lott.
But Marino's biggest enemy was his ego. Just ask Jimmy Johnson.
His refusal to allow for a running game is why he never had a decent RB on his team. Personal opinion. Emmitt Smith would have had about half as many yards as he does had Marino been his QB. and fewer Super Bowls too.
His refusal to allow for a running game is why he never had a decent RB on his team. Personal opinion. Emmitt Smith would have had about half as many yards as he does had Marino been his QB. and fewer Super Bowls too.
That you for mentioning the great Danny White. #11 is the only number I have worn on any sports team.Predestined said:
Peyton is the best QB I have seen at audibles and basically serving as both a QB and an O Coordinator on the field. Maybe the best at reading a defense and one of the best passers I have ever seen.
However, that isn't everything it takes to be a great QB. As long as he dumps the ball off to avoid being hit I say he is a big, pale, ugly white P***Y of a football player.
I understand protecting his million dollar ***. It's the playoffs and the Fn SUPER BOWL Peyton - grow a pair. Flag football doesn't win every NFL game.
However, that isn't everything it takes to be a great QB. As long as he dumps the ball off to avoid being hit I say he is a big, pale, ugly white P***Y of a football player.
I understand protecting his million dollar ***. It's the playoffs and the Fn SUPER BOWL Peyton - grow a pair. Flag football doesn't win every NFL game.
Rebels7 said:
But Dan may have been more willing to hand the ball off if he even had a decent RB, or a great one like Emmitt Smith as opposed to say, Sammie Smith. Perhaps his RB's would have been better had he been willing to give them a chance though.
You could make the same arguement about Elway had it not been for a guy named Terrell Davis.
