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Bowie vs. Turpin

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Audobaby

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Just watched an SEC Story documentary on Sam Bowie. I know he is a great person who was plagued with untimely injuries throughout his collegiate and professional career.

That said, my father has a collection of games from the 1983-1984 season that I have watched (I was a child at that time). In the games I watched, Turpin certainly seemed like a more polished and skilled big man offensively.

Do you guys think Turpin was the better player by the tims they were both seniors?
 
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RonEJones

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Bowie was a 7 foot 1 inch Anthony Davis before there was AD. He was extremely skilled and light on his feet. Great hands, timing, could jump to the moon, block anything and had a face up game with range. Of course, injuries decimated that potential but even with all the injuries, he went #2 in the NBA draft and had a decent career. Just imagine had he stayed healthy.

Dinner Bell Mel (RIP Big Guy) was more of your back to the basket true center. Strong as an ox and could get off the ground for such a big guy (and get up quick). Had a few good post moves and was unstoppable when he wanted to get to the hoop.

Injuries were what stopped Bowie and work ethic is what slowed down Melvin (loved to eat).

Two totally different players but Bowie definitely had more upside prior to injuries due the skillset in that 7'1" frame.

As far as who was better by their Senior year, tough call. Bowie had been out with injuries and wasn't the same guy. So I guess Mel was more effective. But it's hard to call because even with the injuries, Bowie was still a great player when healthy.
 
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BigBlueFanGA

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Audobaby said:
Just watched an SEC Story documentary on Sam Bowie. I know he is a great person who was plagued with untimely injuries throughout his collegiate and professional career.

That said, my father has a collection of games from the 1983-1984 season that I have watched (I was a child at that time). In the games I watched, Turpin certainly seemed like a more polished and skilled big man offensively.

Do you guys think Turpin was the better player by the tims they were both seniors?
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No. I was a student at UK then. Got to see lots of Turpin in particular. Big Mel was a very good college player but Sam was transcendent. Like a previous poster said, he was more like AD at a time when those skills didn't exist in big men.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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Two totally different styles of play with the two. Bowie could go inside or outside and hit shots; Turpin had a decent mi-range game but was really tough around the basket. Only problem with Turpin is that Hall had to stay on him constantly to keep him motivated. Had he been able to control his weight he would've been a very good pro. Used to see him in the Seaton Center when I was still in school and he was always wearing headsets and seemed to be in a world of his own. However, the progress he made after Bowie got hurt was very impressive. Bowie was a much better shot blocker and more athletic but when Turpin was motivated he was really good.
 
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kybassfan

Heisman
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Completely different players. Great comparison of Bowie to AD. Melvin had wonderful soft hands and was stronger than any two elephants. The team featuring Mel and Bowie and the '15 teams are likely some of the best teams in history that didn't win all the marbles. They may be some of the best teams period.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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kybassfan said:
Completely different players. Great comparison of Bowie to AD. Melvin had wonderful soft hands and was stronger than any two elephants. The team featuring Mel and Bowie and the '15 teams are likely some of the best teams in history that didn't win all the marbles. They may be some of the best teams period.
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Not knocking Coach Hall but our offensive just wasn't as productive as it should've been when they were in the game. Seemed as if almost everyone we played slowed it down and it really got old to watch every game transpire in that manner.
 
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jrm693

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I can still hear Cawood say "lob to Bowie stuffed it" he would have been great if his wheels stayed on then had to suffer through the enigma of being drafted ahead of Jordan and I would vote him ahead of Turpin.
 
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bigbluelou

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Healthy Bowie, no question. Turpin had a great all around game, though. Not as mobile as Big Sam but in the half court could be deadly. Had soft hands as someone else said, and a nice mid range jumper. Deceptively skilled if not super athletic. Still remember the great game he had against uavel in the first Dream Game 65-44 sweet revenge. Also had 41 or 42 on the road against I think Tenn...maybe Vandy. Forget which.
 
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kybassfan

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Catscratch81 said:
Not knocking Coach Hall but our offensive just wasn't as productive as it should've been when they were in the game. Seemed as if almost everyone we played slowed it down and it really got old to watch every game transpire in that manner.
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You have a point. I don't think Hall necessarily slowed it down, but he always emphasized a brutal physical defense. I think to some degree, the SEC physical play owes its roots to coach Hall. On offense, it was all about percentages. And a few bodies hitting the floor.

I had and have the greatest respect for coach Hall. I believe him to be one of the most under rated coaches in history, maybe one of the greatest.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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kybassfan said:
You have a point. I don't think Hall necessarily slowed it down, but he always emphasized a brutal physical defense. I think to some degree, the SEC physical play owes its roots to coach Hall. On offense, it was all about percentages. And a few bodies hitting the floor.

I had and have the greatest respect for coach Hall. I believe him to be one of the most under rated coaches in history, maybe one of the greatest.
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I too have the greatest respect for Coach Hall. I can't recall when the shot clock came into initiation but I think both were still in school. Regardless, I remember a number of games, especially on the road, that were in the '50's and '60's score wise. It was just the same thing over and over; teams knew they didn't have the talent to complete so they played a slow down, deliberate style of ball. It was hard to watch at times.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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bigbluelou said:
Healthy Bowie, no question. Turpin had a great all around game, though. Not as mobile as Big Sam but in the half court could be deadly. Had soft hands as someone else said, and a nice mid range jumper. Deceptively skilled if not super athletic. Still remember the great game he had against uavel in the first Dream Game 65-44 sweet revenge. Also had 41 or 42 on the road against I think Tenn...maybe Vandy. Forget which.
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It was against UT. I remember that game well but I thought it was in Rupp, though after 30+ years I could be wrong.
 
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Blueaz

Blueaz

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RonEJones said:
Bowie was a 7 foot 1 inch Anthony Davis before there was AD. He was extremely skilled and light on his feet. Great hands, timing, could jump to the moon, block anything and had a face up game with range. Of course, injuries decimated that potential but even with all the injuries, he went #2 in the NBA draft and had a decent career. Just imagine had he stayed healthy.

Dinner Bell Mel (RIP Big Guy) was more of your back to the basket true center. Strong as an ox and could get off the ground for such a big guy (and get up quick). Had a few good post moves and was unstoppable when he wanted to get to the hoop.

Injuries were what stopped Bowie and work ethic is what slowed down Melvin (loved to eat).

Two totally different players but Bowie definitely had more upside prior to injuries due the skillset in that 7'1" frame.

As far as who was better by their Senior year, tough call. Bowie had been out with injuries and wasn't the same guy. So I guess Mel was more effective. But it's hard to call because even with the injuries, Bowie was still a great player when healthy.
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You hit that nail right on it's effin' head!
 
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bigbluelou

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Catscratch81 said:
I too have the greatest respect for Coach Hall. I can't recall when the shot clock came into initiation but I think both were still in school. Regardless, I remember a number of games, especially on the road, that were in the '50's and '60's score wise. It was just the same thing over and over; teams knew they didn't have the talent to complete so they played a slow down, deliberate style of ball. It was hard to watch at times.
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Like the Cincinnati game of like 81 or 82? 83? We won like 26-12 or something terrible like that. Halftime was like 12-6 or close to it. Ughhhhh.
 
K

kybassfan

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Catscratch81 said:
I too have the greatest respect for Coach Hall. I can't recall when the shot clock came into initiation but I think both were still in school. Regardless, I remember a number of games, especially on the road, that were in the '50's and '60's score wise. It was just the same thing over and over; teams knew they didn't have the talent to complete so they played a slow down, deliberate style of ball. It was hard to watch at times.
Click to expand...

Oh they were indeed. I really believe that was our fault. Against Kentucky you found a means to control tempo or risk sleeping in the parking lot.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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bigbluelou said:
Like the Cincinnati game of like 81 or 82? 83? We won like 26-12 or something terrible like that. Halftime was like 12-6 or close to it. Ughhhhh.
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One of the dumbest moves ever in college basketball. That one game cost UC about $400K over the long run as UK cancelled the series after that.
 
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bigbluelou

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Catscratch81 said:
It was against UT. I remember that game well but I thought it was in Rupp, though after 30+ years I could be wrong.
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If it was UT would've been in Stokely of course. Hated those orange checkerboards. No three point shot then, not that he would've shot it. Joe B would've yanked him immediately! Lol

Big Mel was on fire that night.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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kybassfan said:
Oh they were indeed. I really believe that was our fault. Against Kentucky you found a means to control tempo or risk sleeping in the parking lot.
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Problem was that we had some great athletes that were more than capable of playing up tempo. Dirk Minnifield, Charles Hurt Derrick Hord, Kenny Walker etc., to go along with Bowie and Turpin. I always wondered how a Tyler Ulis or Brandon Knight would've fit in with those teams.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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bigbluelou said:
If it was UT would've been in Stokely of course. Hated those orange checkerboards. No three point shot then, not that he would've shot it. Joe B would've yanked him immediately! Lol

Big Mel was on fire that night.
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I remember watching him have a great game against UT at Rupp but I don't know how many he scored. I just remember that he couldn't miss that night and UT had no answer for him.
 
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childe

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Check out THE Dirk Minniefiled dunk video. Notice who steals the ball and passes it to Minniefield. Not a bad for a big center known more for his offensive ability.
 
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bigbluelou

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Catscratch81 said:
I remember watching him have a great game against UT at Rupp but I don't know how many he scored. I just remember that he couldn't miss that night and UT had no answer for him.
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You may be right...it could've been at Rupp. Either way it was his highest scoring game as a Cat. RIP big fella.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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bigbluelou said:
You may be right...it could've been at Rupp. Either way it was his highest scoring game as a Cat. RIP big fella.
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Yes, really sad about his death. He had some great games against UT during his career.
 
K

kybassfan

Heisman
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Catscratch81 said:
Problem was that we had some great athletes that were more than capable of playing up tempo. Dirk Minnifield, Charles Hurt Derrick Hord, Kenny Walker etc., to go along with Bowie and Turpin. I always wondered how a Tyler Ulis or Brandon Knight would've fit in with those teams.
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I'm not sure about Knight, but I think Ulis was born to play that game. Tyler is not the fastest (as opposed to quickest) or greatest jumper. He is among the best passers and skilled in execution. He is one of our smartest guards ever. All these are essential skills for a ball control percentage offense.

I gotta stop talking about this. Getting Georgetown flashbacks.
 
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KWilt43atbuzz

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Still cant believe the 84 2nd half meltdown v G Town in FF.
That was my 2nd favorite UK team ever next to the Unforgettables.
Cried like a baby after both losses.
 
U

UKNumberOne

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Also saw the Bowie show... I remember watching him back in the day... but had forgotten how good he really was. He was crazy good as a freshman... and there were a bunch of other good big men back then... Sampson, Olajuwan, Ewing... He made someone like Skal look just mediocre by comparison.. Too bad his injuries limited his career..
 
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bnewt

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Bowie wasn't close to the same player after sitting out 2 years, especially offensively. He lost his shot & touch during those off years.
 
Stenchymouse

Stenchymouse

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bnewt said:
Bowie wasn't close to the same player after sitting out 2 years, especially offensively. He lost his shot & touch during those off years.
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Yeah, the first part of his career at UK, he was a totally different player than he was by "84"...

I remember his first college game against Duke and he was amazing!!

Turpin DEVELOPED into a solid college center but Bowie came into college as a superstar!!

You really have to admire the courage he had to continue to come back from those leg breaks.

Very few would have that kind of courage!

I know that I wouldn't.
 
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Bank Cat

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Catscratch81 said:
It was against UT. I remember that game well but I thought it was in Rupp, though after 30+ years I could be wrong.
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Turpin scored 42 on two occasions. Against UT on the road and in the SEC tournament in 1984 against UGA.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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Bank Cat said:
Turpin scored 42 on two occasions. Against UT on the road and in the SEC tournament in 1984 against UGA.
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He had some of the best games of his career against UT. I believe it was Don Devoe who was coaching UT at the time. Used to really drive him nuts that they could not contain Turpin.
 
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mjj_2K

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Catscratch81 said:
He had some of the best games of his career against UT. I believe it was Don Devoe who was coaching UT at the time. Used to really drive him nuts that they could not contain Turpin.
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Maybe. But the game that Turpin put up 42 at UT was one that UK lost, 65-63. Turpin had 42, the rest of the team had 21. He shot 18-22 from the floor, everyone else shot 10/27.

Which kind of sums up Joe B from 80-85. The man deserves a lot of respect, but UK basketball in the early to mid 80's was incredibly stodgy. It was all about getting bigger guys than everyone else, then relentlessly pounding the ball inside. Sometimes it worked, but it also led to a lot of SEC losses where smaller, qucker, more agile players went over and around UK's big bodies.
 
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anon_q409idbs5m40a

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mj2k10 said:
Maybe. But the game that Turpin put up 42 at UT was one that UK lost, 65-63. Turpin had 42, the rest of the team had 21. He shot 18-22 from the floor, everyone else shot 10/27.

Which kind of sums up Joe B from 80-85. The man deserves a lot of respect, but UK basketball in the early to mid 80's was incredibly stodgy. It was all about getting bigger guys than everyone else, then relentlessly pounding the ball inside. Sometimes it worked, but it also led to a lot of SEC losses where smaller, qucker, more agile players went over and around UK's big bodies.
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"Stodgy" is probably a good term to describe the offense under Hall's latter years. I was thinking more of "stagnant" but means pretty much the same. His offensive style was geared more to the '70's and did not change with the game. I had heard on several occasions that Hall seriously began to contemplate retirement after the Georgetown loss.
 
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CastleRubric

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RonEJones said:
Bowie was a 7 foot 1 inch Anthony Davis before there was AD. He was extremely skilled and light on his feet. Great hands, timing, could jump to the moon, block anything and had a face up game with range. Of course, injuries decimated that potential but even with all the injuries, he went #2 in the NBA draft and had a decent career. Just imagine had he stayed healthy.

Dinner Bell Mel (RIP Big Guy) was more of your back to the basket true center. Strong as an ox and could get off the ground for such a big guy (and get up quick). Had a few good post moves and was unstoppable when he wanted to get to the hoop.

Injuries were what stopped Bowie and work ethic is what slowed down Melvin (loved to eat).

Two totally different players but Bowie definitely had more upside prior to injuries due the skillset in that 7'1" frame.

As far as who was better by their Senior year, tough call. Bowie had been out with injuries and wasn't the same guy. So I guess Mel was more effective. But it's hard to call because even with the injuries, Bowie was still a great player when healthy.
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two of my favorite all time UK players

I was going to chime in about my memories on them but your post is pretty much perfect

both could hit a baseline jumper -

Mel seemed to take plays off or lose focus from time to time though --- he'd be unstoppable now minute / series and then disappear on occasion ….. hard to avoid I suppose

my aunt tutored some of those UK players from the 80's when she taught in the UK system
Turpin was one of her projects…………I don't know that he would even be eligible by today's standards…..I could be wrong, and mean no disrespect, but I think he would be hard to get eligible today

still love the #54 because of him --- because of the injuries to Sam and Turpin's overall development the previous 32 seasons -- I think Mel was a better player during their Sr seasons specifically

Still hate how they both let themselves get tossed around by Georegetown in the 2nd half of that 1984 final four game…...
 
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Teachable Moe

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Back in the day, there was a newspaper pic of Bowie (7'1") seated next to Leroy Byrd (5'2"). Bowie's legs spread out in front of him like a river. Byrd's toes (IIRC) just touched the ground. And their head and torsos were the same size.
 
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