Buy/Sell: Texas A&M- THE SLEEPER HAS AWAKENED

[HammerOfTheDogs]

For years, Texas A&M has resided in the shadow of the University of Texas. Competing with them in first the Southwest Conference, and then the Big 12, the Aggies had both a hatred and an envy for the Longhorns that rivals what Auburn has for Alabama, Pitt has for Penn State, or the university of ole miss has for The Mississippi State University. Why, part of their fight song is about beating Texas.

However, by tying themselves to UT-Austin, they always assured they'd always be second-class in their State. No matter how many oilfields they have around campus, no matter how many billionaire tycoons they had supporting the university, they were always going to be the second choice to the best talent Texas had to offer...until now.

That's when the more forward-thinking Aggie leaders decided to snip the umbilical cord they had to Texas and cast their lot with the SEC. While the T-sips will be fighting it out with the Iowa States and the Kansas' of the football world for a bid to the Independence Bowl, the Texas A&M Aggies are now poised to become the national power they've always wanted to be. Why? By admittance into the best Conference in the nation, 5-* Texas recruits will now make them their first choice. Not only that, but they'll be able to cherry-pick kids from all over the nation.

Kevin Sumlin has proven to be a far better coach than I expected. "Johnny Football" Manziel is the 2013 Heisman frontrunner. Once Texas A&M recruits some big, badass Offensive and Defensive linemen, they'll make school like Alabama and LSU look like MSU when We play Alabama or Auburn, or the university of ole miss when they play us. With their money, their resources, and now a member of the best conference in the land, everybody else in the SEC will be playing for second-best in a couple of years.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

You answered your own question. It's more about Kevin Sumlin/Johnny Football...

than it is about Texas A&M becoming a power. They've always had the backing and resources. They are just better than Texas right now because they have a better coach. Texas will get rid of Mack and hire a good coach, then they'll build up. You have two entities with lots of money that aren't backing down.

It'd be the same if they'd stayed in the Big 12. A&M might even be undefeated in that league, and they'd most assuredly beat Texas.

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

I'd have A&M in there with Auburn and Arkansas pecking-orderwise... once those two recover, of course....

this, however, is crazy talk: "Once Texas A&M recruits some big, badass Offensive and Defensive linemen, they'll make school like Alabama and LSU look like MSU when We play Alabama or Auburn....."

 

[FISHDAWG]

I think it's more along the lines of getting pissed about the Longhorn Network and the Big-12 backing UT on that issue than just waking up and deciding to come to the SEC ..... they quit and took their marbles to our conference ... I'm to lazy to check, but I thought aTm had beaten UT something like the last 5 years

 

[karlchilders.sixpack]

Remove Johnny Football, they are pretty good, not outstanding.
Sort of like Cam Newton at Auburn. He won't be around forever. His speed and elusiveness have put them in the position that they are right now.

Sumlin is a good coach, but not on a pedistal to me.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Lots of money in Texas to build a program, but the money is spread out......

You have a bunch of schools out there (Texas, TAM, Tech, Houston, Rice, SMU, UTEP, etc. etc., so until they have the fanbase and alumni to build them a 100,000 seat facility, no, they won't match Alabama and LSU. I agree, Auburn status is about the best they can attain. Money is the biggest part of it, but getting talent there is another, and A&M, like Auburn, won't have that problem. Arkansas and Tennessee do have that problem, despite the money. Not all those oil tycoons are Texas A&M fans.

But, A&M actually has a relatively young fanbase. If they can keep the success level high, and get putting out alumni at the rate they are going (50K+ enrolled there), I'd say they could pass Bama in a decade, maybe more. Remember, Alabama is rolling with lots of sidewalk alumni that donate. Most people in Alabama give to the Red Elephant Club before they tithe - pretty hardcore determination right there. If Texas A&M ever decides to do that, look out.

 

[FlabLoser]

I'd have A&M in there with Auburn and Arkansas pecking-orderwise... once those two recover, of course....

this, however, is crazy talk: "Once Texas A&M recruits some big, badass Offensive and Defensive linemen, they'll make school like Alabama and LSU look like MSU when We play Alabama or Auburn....."

Who is to say Arkansas will ever "recover". What have they done? They had a couple good years with one of the best offensive coaches in football. So unless they go hire one of the best coaches in football, I see them returning to their traditional middle-to-lower tier spot in the SEC.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

I agree. They are not one of the SEC's privileged.....

Petrino tends to mess with fans' expectations a little too much. Yes, they a have some money from a few sources, but nowhere near the power of some of the other SEC schools. Plus they don't have the talent in that state, and the school isn't attractive enough to lure elite talent out of state. Much like Ole Miss, they only get players that the home states overlook.

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

I didn't check the numbers but thought that this year was abnormally "bad" for them... I'd put them in the same SECW tier with AU (and A&M) just below LSU & Bama...

 

[Dawgzilla]

The Aggies have merely revealed how OVERRATED the SEC is this year...

A mid level Big 12 team has come into the SEC and pushed around the big boys. Its absurd. I'll grant you Johnny Football playing well, but how did the Aggies suddenly find a good defense?? The Aggies could not stay on the same field with K-State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, or even Texas. The SEC gives them little problem.

Think about this: The Aggies just finished a 3 game road trip in the SEC. Granted, Auburn and MSU put up little to no fight, so it was an atypical roadtrip, but I really thought that playing 3 games on the road in the SEC would be tougher than anything the Aggies had ever tried to accomplish. Instead, they finished off the roadtrip by beating Alabama to go 3-0.

The SEC is over rated. No one has played any decent teams out of conference, so we really have no reason to just assume the SEC teams are all good. Alabama's schedule was almost as weak as MSU's, but based just on the "eyeball" test, people were wondering whether Alabama could match up with an NFL team. We now know that perception was way off base. Nevertheless, rather than punish Alabama for revealing themselves to be a fraud, the PTB instead elevate the Aggies to a totally undeserved ranking....and since LSU and UF both beat the Aggies, they get an undeserved boost as well. And since UGA beat UF, they are now sitting at #5 even though they aren't good enough to even be ranked in the Top 10!! And USC? Well, since their only losses are to LSU and UF - and since the totally crushed the "#5 team in the nation" they get to hang around at #12 even though they are playing awful right now.

The only thing the SEC has going for it is the total lack of upsets so far this season. Out of the top 6 teams, none of the have lost to any of the lower 8 teams. This is due, in part, to the fact that UT, Auburn, UK and Mizzou are all having some of their worst seasons in decades, and the fact that Arkansas has fallen off of a cliff as well. UMiss, MSU and Vandy are all having respectable seasons, but not good enough to beat any of the top 6.

This speaks more to the lack of any depth in the SEC this year than the strength of the top 6. I fear for the bowl season, because I think the conference will then be totally exposed.

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

Arkie is a top "lil 6" team....

along with SC... I think A&M will fit in just above that, but below the bottom of the "big six"'s AU and UT.... moving forward...

SEC wins

	2011	2010	2009	2008	2007	2006	2005	2004	2003	2002	TOTAL	10yr avg.	5 yr avg.
LSU	8	6	5	3	6	6	7	6	7	5	59	5.9	5.6
Florida	3	4	8	7	5	7	5	4	6	6	55	5.5	5.4
Georgia	7	3	4	6	6	4	6	6	6	7	55	5.5	5.2
Auburn	4	8	3	2	5	6	7	8	5	5	53	5.3	4.4
Alabama	7	5	8	8	4	2	6	3	2	6	51	5.1	6.4
Tennessee	1	3	4	3	6	5	3	7	6	5	43	4.3	3.4
Arkansas	6	6	3	2	4	7	2	3	4	5	42	4.2	4.2
USC	6	5	3	4	3	3	5	4	2	3	38	3.8	4.2
Ole Miss	0	1	4	5	0	2	1	3	7	3	26	2.6	2
Kentucky	2	2	3	2	3	4	2	1	1	3	23	2.3	2.4
MSU	2	4	3	2	4	1	1	2	1	0	20	2	3
Vanderbilt	2	1	0	4	2	1	3	1	1	0	15	1.5	1.8

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[Railin Jemmye]

That's a good table......

Of course, I favor the 5 year average that puts MSU #9 in the league instead of #11.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Get the **** outta here.....

How many SEC teams are in the Top Ten? Six. SIX. In my best Houston Nutt voice. Yes, one is A&M. But that's not an indicator of how bad the SEC is, it's an indicator of how good A&M is. And good grief, Alabama still beats A&M 9 out of 10 times they play. This is college football, and it's how the game works. A&M didn't push Florida or LSU around did they?

OOC wins
Alabama beat Michigan
LSU beat Washington
Missouri beat Arizona State
Tennessee beat N.C. State

OOC losses
Clemson beat Auburn
Texas beat Ole Miss
Rutgers beat Arkansas
Louisville beat Kentucky
Northwestern beat Vanderbilt

Upcoming
Florida and Florida State
Georgia vs. Georgia Tech
South Carolina vs. Clemson
Vanderbilt vs. Wake Forest

Take that information and do with it what you will. The conference is NOT down.

 

[Dawgzilla]

Like I said, the conference is OVER RATED. Don't tell me the conference is strong because it has 6 teams in the top 9 of the BCS. You have it backwards. Those 6 teams are in the top 9 because they are in the SEC and everyone just presumes the SEC teams are strong --with no proof.

As you posted, the conference's record against opponents from other BCS conferences is an abysmal 4-5. Granted, two of the wins are aginst Michigan and Washington, and both of those teams have managed to crawl back into the BCS rankings, but wins over those teams proves nothing. When Florida and USC lose their in-state rivalry games, the real status of the SEC will start to be revealed.

It is kind of shocking that there have not been any major upsets in the conference this year (by "major upset", I mean none of those 6 teams in the top 10 have lost to any of the 8 unranked teams. Oddly enough, that makes the conference appear stronger, when it actually reveals what a weak year this is.

 

[missouridawg]

A mid level Big 12 team has come into the SEC and pushed around the big boys. Its absurd. I'll grant you Johnny Football playing well, but how did the Aggies suddenly find a good defense?? The Aggies could not stay on the same field with K-State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, or even Texas. The SEC gives them little problem.

Think about this: The Aggies just finished a 3 game road trip in the SEC. Granted, Auburn and MSU put up little to no fight, so it was an atypical roadtrip, but I really thought that playing 3 games on the road in the SEC would be tougher than anything the Aggies had ever tried to accomplish. Instead, they finished off the roadtrip by beating Alabama to go 3-0.

The SEC is over rated. No one has played any decent teams out of conference, so we really have no reason to just assume the SEC teams are all good. Alabama's schedule was almost as weak as MSU's, but based just on the "eyeball" test, people were wondering whether Alabama could match up with an NFL team. We now know that perception was way off base. Nevertheless, rather than punish Alabama for revealing themselves to be a fraud, the PTB instead elevate the Aggies to a totally undeserved ranking....and since LSU and UF both beat the Aggies, they get an undeserved boost as well. And since UGA beat UF, they are now sitting at #5 even though they aren't good enough to even be ranked in the Top 10!! And USC? Well, since their only losses are to LSU and UF - and since the totally crushed the "#5 team in the nation" they get to hang around at #12 even though they are playing awful right now.

The only thing the SEC has going for it is the total lack of upsets so far this season. Out of the top 6 teams, none of the have lost to any of the lower 8 teams. This is due, in part, to the fact that UT, Auburn, UK and Mizzou are all having some of their worst seasons in decades, and the fact that Arkansas has fallen off of a cliff as well. UMiss, MSU and Vandy are all having respectable seasons, but not good enough to beat any of the top 6.

This speaks more to the lack of any depth in the SEC this year than the strength of the top 6. I fear for the bowl season, because I think the conference will then be totally exposed.

This is the most laughable piece of drivel posted on this board in a while...

Last years' aTm team was coached by Sherman and QB'ed by Tannehill.

This years' aTm is coached by Sumlin and QB'ed by Manziel. Two completely different teams. Not even close to compare the two. This years' aTm would be neck-and-neck with K-State for the Big 12 title this year.

 

[hsvdog]

just got back from Houston - from the guy who checked me in at the rental car company on i heard about how fired up they are
they've got everything it takes to be successful - coaching, fertile recruiting, solid fan base.
i'm buying

 

[GloryDawg]

Kevin Sumlin has proven to be a far better coach than I expected. "Johnny Football" Manziel is the 2013 Heisman frontrunner. Once Texas A&M recruits some big, badass Offensive and Defensive linemen, they'll make school like Alabama and LSU look like MSU when We play Alabama or Auburn, or the university of ole miss when they play us. With their money, their resources, and now a member of the best conference in the land, everybody else in the SEC will be playing for second-best in a couple of years.

He hasn't proved to me yet. When he was at Houston he had three winning seasons and one losing season. Those three winning seaon he had Keenum as QB and the losing which was in the middle of the four season Kennon was hurt and he did not play. Now he has another good QB. If it wasn't for him A&M would be a average football team. Johnny Football is that team and with out him they are average. I suspect just like at Houston if Johnny Football was not on the field they lose a few more games.

Also Franklin and Freeze have proven more to me then Sumlin.

 

[RocketDawg]

Sumlin got beat by Southern Miss last year ... got what's-his-name the head coaching job at North Carolina.

 

[GloryDawg]

USM coach might have been their best options regardless if he won that game or not. The NCAA was putting some serious heat on them. They were not going to land a high profile coach.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

Texas A&M already has the best OL in the country. They couldn't possibly recruit a better one.

 

[Guy From Gulfport]

Buy. They will continue to climb, as long as the administration & Big Money Ags (BMA's) pull in the same direction. Easier said than done, though...

 

[DAWG61]

Sell until they drop all the freak show traditions.

 

[patdog]

Don't tell me the conference is strong because it has 6 teams in the top 9 of the BCS. /QUOTE]


This is one of the dumbest things I've ever seen posted. What other conference has even 3 teams that could play with those 6 SEC teams? You know as well as I do the answer is none.

 

[Aggie96]

Buy... (go figure) I only see us getting better in the next few years. Perfect storm going on right now in Aggieland... New Conference that everyone in the nation knows is the toughest, New Coach with Swagger and a strong *** pimp hand (kids love him!!!), awesome new QB that is turning heads all over the nation, recruiting class that is already top 10 and soon to be top 5... yeah things are looking up

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

I think the Texas-Texas A&M rivalry might be like Ohio State-Ohio rivalry in a few years, or the Mississippi State-university of ole miss rivalry....totally one-sided, if they even play each other as well. Texas A&M has an Ivy League-level endowment to go with Texas-sized sports fanaticism. I wished I had got my Petroleum Engineering degree from A&M...I'd be a millionaire.

 

[The Peeper]

We think its bad around here when we improve and the Bears start sending the investigators around and pulling out all of the stops to slow our progress. I will guarantee you that U TX has already put the wheels in motion at all costs to stop aTm from getting anywhere. Lots of old TX alums with lots of $$$ sitting around that won't stand for it

 

[FISHDAWG]

well it appears that the conference will fall short of it's bowl game quota this year by two teams

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

There's certainly a lot of money there, but it's not with A&M (for now)... Texas A&M makes and spends exponentially less money than Bammer RE: athletics/football... they should not even be in the same conversation, in that regard.

I will agree that they have potential, however.

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

What's the SEC's "bowl quota" up to, now... 35?

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

Petro Engineer??? I thought you had a Structural Engineering degree with an emphasis on "Tree House Design"...

 

[BiscuitEater]

Not to get personal, but ...

You have a bunch of schools out there (Texas, TAM, Tech, Houston, Rice, SMU, UTEP, etc. etc., so until they have the fanbase and alumni to build them a 100,000 seat facility, no, they won't match Alabama and LSU. I agree, Auburn status is about the best they can attain. Money is the biggest part of it, but getting talent there is another, and A&M, like Auburn, won't have that problem. Arkansas and Tennessee do have that problem, despite the money. Not all those oil tycoons are Texas A&M fans.

Have you been living under a rock? Tx A&M passed Bama a long, long time ago. A&M main campus is the largest in the country and includes the Bush Presidential Library. They have plenty of room to build and expand while Bama has no where to build unless they tear something else down. They have 55K undergrads compared to 33K for Bama. Bama has a nice endowment of roughly $700M while A&M has right around $7 BILLION.

In Sep, they announced that they are working on a 3 year, ~$450M rennovation of historic Kyle field which could increase their capacity to 103,500. And, rumor is they already have the $$ committed.

Apparently, they are already doing okay in the talent dept; they just traveled to and beat Bama.

I will agree with your statement that, "Not all those oil tycoons are Texas A&M fans." But, I will also add that there are a bunch of oil tycoons that are Texas A&M fans AND they are kicking in some serious $$.

 

[boatsandhoes]

Sell....give it 3 years

It is a perfect storm for them this year. A great o-line and a once in a lifetime qb. The rest is all the same. It's AU with and w/o newton. They struggled mightily the last 15 years in the big 12 with average to poor teams. Sumlin is no different than he was at Houston. Just better athletes...same system. People will figure out the offense and when Johnny doesn't have a cohesive o-line like he does this year it is a different story.

Imagine if manziel goes down week one out for the year. how many games do they win this year? I say 7-5 to 6-6.

Have to give them their props this year tho they have a great team. I am not too worried about them...middle of the road SEC team. Dawgzilla's stuff up there is nonsense....we just don't have one real stand out this year but 8 pretty good to very good teams. No knockout punch this year.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Not personal for me, maybe for TUSK.....

Thanks for the info. Yes, it sure seems that TAM has the ability to out-class most anybody. But these things have always been that way. Why would they suddenly change now?

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

Big difference

We think its bad around here when we improve and the Bears start sending the investigators around and pulling out all of the stops to slow our progress. I will guarantee you that U TX has already put the wheels in motion at all costs to stop aTm from getting anywhere. Lots of old TX alums with lots of $$$ sitting around that won't stand for it

Texas and A&M aren't rivals in the same conference anymore. Not as much incentive for the Tea Sips to rat out the Niedermeyers.

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

Why? Because now they're now in the best conference in the country. A conference that takes its sports VERY seriously, especially football. They're going to expand their stadium to over 100,000, with room to grow. If you think T. Boone Pickens has helped OK State and Phil Knight helped Oregon, just wait until some of those Aggie Billionaires get together to help their team.

 

[Aggie96]

you do realize that JFF wasn't the starter in the Spring and that we have other really good QB's as back ups that have put up points against 1st team defenses... Of course they aren't as good as JFF, but they aren't slouches either. This team isn't all Johnny... we have an outstanding O-Line, an awesome stable of RB's 2- 5 stars and 1- 4 star, Great size, depth and speed at receiver too. Yeah Johnny makes some amazing plays, but he isn't the entire team

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

Mutt, what's your prediction for the future? say, in ten years... what would be your best guess at SEC rankings in football?

 

[patdog]

I think a lot of people in this thread are still underestimating A&M. As you point out, this team has a lot more talent than at QB. I do think you're making way too much out of the fact he hadn't won the job in the spring as a redshirt freshman though. But I think the big thing is that long-term, the move to the SEC is going to give you a significant recruiting advantage over Texas and it's going to give you better access to recruit states to the East of you.

 

[boatsandhoes]

yep I realize. It is nothing to be embarrassed about. attached are the records since 2000. This is pretty far and away the best team since 2000. Recruiting talent has never been the problem in aggieland. I am saying I don't think your near the threat without the one player. Hell, I wish we could hang our hat on one guy that good. I wish we had a Johnny or cam newton. I think in time with sumlin it will norm out. My theory this is. Far left overall record, second column in conference. My question is how you would have faired in the SEC without Johnny this year or in past years before johnny. Like I said, props to you for an awesome first year. You have blown my expectations out of the water much like most aggie's too I suppose. I think johnny accounts for at least 3 wins by himself. It is a fantastic weapon to have. His talent would be minimized some with an o-line that couldn't protect him.

2011	7	6	--	3	5	--	7th	Meineke vs. Northwestern	W, 33-22		Mike Sherman*	Results	Roster
2010	9	4	--	6	2	--	T-1st (South)	Cotton vs. LSU	L, 24-41	18th	Mike Sherman	Results	Roster
2009	6	7	--	3	5	--	5th (South)	Independence vs. Georgia	L, 20-44		Mike Sherman	Results	Roster
2008	4	8	--	2	6	--	6th (South)				Mike Sherman	Results	Roster
2007	7	6	--	4	4	--	3rd (South)	Alamo vs. Penn St.	L, 17-24		Dennis Franchione*	Results	Roster
2006	9	4	--	5	3	--	3rd (South)	Holiday vs. Cal	L, 10-45		Dennis Franchione	Results
2005	5	6	--	3	5	--	4th (South)				Dennis Franchione	Results
2004	7	5	--	5	3	--	T-3rd (South)	Cotton vs. Tennessee	L, 7-38		Dennis Franchione	Results
2003	4	8	--	2	6	--	5th (South)				Dennis Franchione	Results
2002	6	6	--	3	5	--	5th (South)				R.C. Slocum	Results
2001	8	4	--	4	4	--	T-3rd (South)	galleryfurniture.com vs. TCU	W, 28-9		R.C. Slocum	Results
2000	7	5	--	5	3	--	3rd (South)	Independence vs. Miss St.	L, 41-43		R.C. Slocum	Results

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