So who will decide what is and isn't allowed? And how is that going to sit with the notion that everyone is equal?
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Deandre Johnson dismissed from FSU
- Thread starter St. Anger
- Start date
So who will decide what is and isn't allowed? And how is that going to sit with the notion that everyone is equal?
"It don't matter if we like it, there is right and there is wrong"- Judas Kiss by the Del-Lords
BTW, what we are generally talking about here is battery, not assault. Battery is usually defined as something like an intentional unwanted or unlawful touching, so by that definition it certainly appears that the woman committed battery. However, I think it would take a strong-willed DA to charge the woman, given the uproar around this case as well at the national discussion about entitled college athletes.
Oh and there is also a possible defense available to Johnson based on her allegedly using the N-word multiple times, the fighting words defense. I have no idea what the law is in Florida and I'm not going to look it up, but given the "stand your ground" law and other defenses that were discussed in other prominent cases, I would guess the fighting words defense is broadly construed in Florida.
What are you talking about? I mentioned a short skirt, when you said how someone was dressed. Sorry I didn't get it verbatim.
The fact is you either were trolling Tom or incredibly stupid. I prefer to think you were trolling him.
If i saw one thing on that video the honestly looked like he instigated or escalated the situation i would be upset too. You don't hit another without provocation or in self protection. You hit another person without reasonable cause then don't cry when you get your comeuppance.
Fighting words defense is weak and probably won't fly. https://www.thefire.org/misconceptions-about-the-fighting-words-exception/
The difference may be small, but the meaning is significant. Shows what you think of women in short skirts.
He got charged with battery. That punch was worth a 2nd if not 1st degree assault if he was honestly in the wrong. The PC crowd needed to be kept at bay so battery it is. His lawyer is gonna have a field day with this charge.
I think there would only be an uproar if JD got off scot-free. If they were both convicted and charged then I don't think there'd be an uproar at all.
Doesn't matter if she swings and misses, swings and hits him, hell doesn't matter if she hit you with a bat. You just don't hit women. First off, it's NEVER going to end well for you. Especially if you are an athlete. If you think it's sexist it just doesn't matter. You don't hit women. Just walk away. If she said something racial, just say "sorry you feel that way" and walk away. Be smart.
THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER HIT A WOMAN!
THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NO REASON TO EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER HIT A WOMAN!
Again, my apologies. Nice backhanded swipe my way, by the way... since you seem to know what I think about women in short skirts, it is apparent you know more than me on just about every subject. Which is why I'm asking again, what was your intention in writing what you wrote to Tulsa Tom? It obviously was different than the way I took it.
Edit: also, since you know more than me, what IS the difference between short skirts that might lead someone to rape and the clothes a person wears that might lead to rape? You say there is a significant distinction... I'll wait for your answer.
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That site refers to what is permitted under the First Amendment. It doesn't deal with a possible defense to a charge of battery. But rereading my original post I realize that I gave the impression that the defense was a strong possibility. That's wrong and my post was really unclear. In some states it is not a defense at all, but can be the basis for a counter charge of assault. In other states it is an incomplete defense, in that it can reduce the level of the charge and/or punishment, but cannot be a complete defense to a battery or assault. In my original post I was just wondering aloud if Florida had a moved to a more expansive definition, as they had with other potential defenses to assault/battery type charges. Sorry about the confusion..
Under Florida law, battery is the more serious offense. Assault is threatening to harm another, battery is actual physical contact.
For you who think she is guilty: a jab is not a punch, and a jab is not illegal. Her actions were a protest for how she felt she was being treated. She aimed for his shoulder. His actions were a violent response intended to cause serious injury. He aimed for her face.
It boggles the mind that some of you cannot see the difference.
It boggles the mind that some of you cannot see the difference.
I don't think she aimed for his shoulder.
Where in the world are you getting your legal definitions from?
Clothes have nothing to do with rape. There was a significant difference between the question I asked TT and what you wrote. There are you answers take your trolling elsewhere.
You're full of crap and you know it. Look at what you wrote to Tulsa Tom and tell me you weren't trolling. That's the biggest load I've seen on here in quite some time.
There's not even any chance to reason with you because on three different occasions you've told me to butt out, when all I'm really doing is revealing your own hypocrisy. I've apologized, not once, but twice, in this thread and you continue to talk down to me. It's time for you to take your garbage elsewhere too, or at the very least try to be civil.
Not cool...
It makes me proud to see so many men arguing for their right to beat the **** out of a woman half their size because she dissed him. Awesome job men, your mom's would be so proud of you!!!! Your mom's would probably like to invite all of you over for Sunday dinner and make your favorite meal and the admiration and respect she would have for all of you would be overflowing, and she would be beaming with pride the whole time!!!
Of course a "jab" is illegal. The general definition of battery is an unwanted and illegal touching. If a jab touches someone, it was unwanted and the jabber didn't have a legal basis for throwing the jab, then that is battery. The jab the woman threw meets the definition, end of discussion.
Stop with the hyperbole. It'd be like me saying, "It makes me proud to see so many men arguing for the right of women to instigate a fight, knee a guy in the crotch, call him nasty names then punch that man in the face. Yadda yadda yadda." Sick
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No hyperbole meant, you guys are awesome!!! Would love to have friends like you guys to hang out with when I go out on the town. Guy friends who you know will have your back should any 115lb girl try to start some ****!! Word would travel fast you guys are not to be messed with and should be taken seriously!!!
No doubt Rover. No doubt. So when some girl disses you, you just be ready to throw down. Totally acceptable behavior and I support your right to clock her because she didn't treat you the way you wanted. You have my full support!!
I've been converted, you guys did it. You've been right the whole time. Thank you!! In fact, I think, just to be on the safe side, you should probably carry brass knuckles. That way you can teach that b*%ch a lesson she'll never forget!!
I thought you were going to stay out of this thread. You said your part why keep going with the sarcastic hyperbole. You act like DJ went up and picked a fight with this woman which everyone else except you is able to see did not happen. You're an idealist. Thats fine. The world is not ideal and neither is this situation, so chill out abt it and others' views not meshing with yours.
You are right Sunahmi, I did say that, but when you wake up and realize you've been wrong the whole time, you gotta stand up and admit it. It's what real men do, when their done beating the **** out of women who disrespect them, that is. You win!! You little winner you.
That's very commendable. A little introspection is a good thing now and then.
Reading about this incident from primarily women-oriented facebook posts is quite revealing. Pretty much every woman I've seen talking about it says that she was the instigator and, while not exactly deserving, should not be surprised she got punched. Whereas on male-oriented sites it's like 60/40 in favor of never hit a girl no matter what. Which reminds me of this Daniel Tosh bit http://www.cc.com/video-clips/856no2/stand-up-daniel-tosh--sounds-like-a-challenge
"Let's say you come home and your wife has drowned two of your kids. She's about to dunk the third one. Is it ok to run over and sock her then? "Nope. There's no excuse. You're gonna have to let her drown that one too.""
From my opinion, it is really weird how she was being a huge jerk in the beginning and purposely sticking her leg out/moving her whole body to block him from getting to the bar and then turning around to say ???? to him before the incident turned physical. Don't really know what that's all about.
"Let's say you come home and your wife has drowned two of your kids. She's about to dunk the third one. Is it ok to run over and sock her then? "Nope. There's no excuse. You're gonna have to let her drown that one too.""
From my opinion, it is really weird how she was being a huge jerk in the beginning and purposely sticking her leg out/moving her whole body to block him from getting to the bar and then turning around to say ???? to him before the incident turned physical. Don't really know what that's all about.
I've watched it and re-watched it a few times and I'm a little upset by it. The following sequence of events is clear
1) the blonde woman is at the bar and to her left is a dark haired woman
2) De'andre approaches and briefly speaks to the dark haired woman, making incidental contact with the blonde girl 's back
3) Dark-haired girl leaves and the blonde girl turns around angrily since in her mind she has been pushed
4) De'andre tries to approach the open space to the left of the girl at the bar and she slides over to block him
5) More contact is made and she then raises a fist at him which he responds to by grabbing her arm
6) She punches him with her free hand and he then retaliates with a quick slap punch
If the girl was a guy, the same evidence would have been seen him charged with assault while De'andre would have been let off with no charges (self-defense). The law needs to be blind to gender if we are a fair and just society. She assaulted him from everything I see and while his retaliatory punch was wrong, her behavior led to everything that transpired. She should be charged with assault.
1) the blonde woman is at the bar and to her left is a dark haired woman
2) De'andre approaches and briefly speaks to the dark haired woman, making incidental contact with the blonde girl 's back
3) Dark-haired girl leaves and the blonde girl turns around angrily since in her mind she has been pushed
4) De'andre tries to approach the open space to the left of the girl at the bar and she slides over to block him
5) More contact is made and she then raises a fist at him which he responds to by grabbing her arm
6) She punches him with her free hand and he then retaliates with a quick slap punch
If the girl was a guy, the same evidence would have been seen him charged with assault while De'andre would have been let off with no charges (self-defense). The law needs to be blind to gender if we are a fair and just society. She assaulted him from everything I see and while his retaliatory punch was wrong, her behavior led to everything that transpired. She should be charged with assault.
You're not being truthful about the video. Not only did she try to block him from getting to the bar, when he makes it she throws her hip into him.
Shoving to me is an extension of a person's arms and pushing another person away, what is it to you?
Up until the point she turns around it doesn't look like he does anything more than would be considered incidental contact in a crowded place.[/QUOTE]
I have to agree. While men are by nature stronger (in most cases), the idea that women are incapable of doing wrong should have died with the Salem Witch Trials. They are equals in the workplace and in society and are fully capable of instigating a fight. That is what I saw in the video. Grabbing someone's arm who is about to punch you is self-defense. When that person then proceeds to punch you, it is very hard to not make some retaliatory response.
I will always teach my sons to not strike a woman, but we must also accept that women are no longer the little waifs that they were a century ago. They participate in sports, lift weights in gyms, and run marathons. A woman striking a man can result in injury, and there has to be a limit to what we as a society expect of men when we are assaulted.
If the girl was male, I don't think for a minute that DeAndre would be charged. The other guy would have been charged with assault. That's a sexist justice system.
Shoving to me is an extension of a person's arms and pushing another person away, what is it to you?
Up until the point she turns around it doesn't look like he does anything more than would be considered incidental contact in a crowded place.[/QUOTE]
I have to agree. While men are by nature stronger (in most cases), the idea that women are incapable of doing wrong should have died with the Salem Witch Trials. They are equals in the workplace and in society and are fully capable of instigating a fight. That is what I saw in the video. Grabbing someone's arm who is about to punch you is self-defense. When that person then proceeds to punch you, it is very hard to not make some retaliatory response.
I will always teach my sons to not strike a woman, but we must also accept that women are no longer the little waifs that they were a century ago. They participate in sports, lift weights in gyms, and run marathons. A woman striking a man can result in injury, and there has to be a limit to what we as a society expect of men when we are assaulted.
If the girl was male, I don't think for a minute that DeAndre would be charged. The other guy would have been charged with assault. That's a sexist justice system.
The bolded part that you put is assault. You even mention he grabbed her arm. He assaulted her. If he didn't do that, your argument holds up.
It's battery, not assault that you are describing. And in any event, you are wrong. A person has a legal right to respond to a reasonably perceived threat with a equivalent, measured response. Her clenched fist and aggressive stance allowed Johnson to respond, and his simply grabbing her arm would almost certainly be considered an equivalent, measured response. That it was a reasonable response to a perceived threat would be further supported by the fact she took a swing at him and kneed him after that. So until he struck her there was no battery on his part.
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There are self-defense laws on the books in every state, including Florida, that allow a person the right to use some level of force to protect themselves. What harm was done by him grabbing her arm if he believed she was going to punch her? Instead of hitting and kneeing him why didn't she yell 'let go of me!'. If she had done that I would be more inclined to take her side, but then no arrests would have been made and the whole thing would have been forgotten.
And yes, even a female can inflict injury with a well placed punch to the eye or mouth? If this was two males, I don't for the life of me believe Johnson would be charged and the other party would be facing battery charges.