From Chat: Would you support a merger of MSU/OM if it would mean
- Thread starter drt7891
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Yes. I feel like most out of state people at ole miss would look else where and it would be more like Msu is now.
Just so I have this straight, these people that we constantly refer to as criminals, sleazebags, pimps, slimeballs, these people we accuse of doing everything immoral under the sun, you all are just willing to say "All right, war's over, let's be friends now!"
I would support this only if it involved totally shutting down Ole Miss, keeping the names Mississippi State University and Bulldogs, kept our colors maroon and white, kept all of traditions and added none of theirs, and did not merge our football histories one iota. Only then.
I would support this only if it involved totally shutting down Ole Miss, keeping the names Mississippi State University and Bulldogs, kept our colors maroon and white, kept all of traditions and added none of theirs, and did not merge our football histories one iota. Only then.
At the core of most of Mississippi(the state)'s problems are delusions of grandeur - appointing far more government, administration, school districts, and universities than our population needs. Hell yes I'd be in support of a merger.
My grand plan...
1) Close Mississippi Southern.
2) Merge all the HBU's into what is now known as Mississippi Southern
3) Merge MSU and UM into a new school called MU, Mississippi University. Y'all know good and well we couldn't be the Rebels (UM needs to drop Rebels regardless) or Bulldogs, so I vote for going back to UM's original name - The Flood.
My grand plan...
1) Close Mississippi Southern.
2) Merge all the HBU's into what is now known as Mississippi Southern
3) Merge MSU and UM into a new school called MU, Mississippi University. Y'all know good and well we couldn't be the Rebels (UM needs to drop Rebels regardless) or Bulldogs, so I vote for going back to UM's original name - The Flood.
My point exactly. If it were announced tomorrow by the state legislature that Mississippi State University and University of Mississippi were officially closing their doors (along with other colleges... but that's not the point) into a centrally located, single state-wide university in no way associated with either university, but if you could somehow promise national championship contending athletics, people would say "sure, why not? What's the big deal?" All the buildings, campuses, traditions, everything associated with MSU or Ole Miss would suddenly just become a memory.
For a microcosm of what I'm talking about, look at Choctaw County. People there are going apeshit because the Weir Lions and Ackerman Indians are no more. However, they have a football team that very likely could win 3A North this year with what they have. Still, people are pissed off to no end. I think most people saying they wouldn't have a problem with it are lying... or at least not thinking it all the way through. And no, this isn't "apples to oranges," it's the same concept.
For a microcosm of what I'm talking about, look at Choctaw County. People there are going apeshit because the Weir Lions and Ackerman Indians are no more. However, they have a football team that very likely could win 3A North this year with what they have. Still, people are pissed off to no end. I think most people saying they wouldn't have a problem with it are lying... or at least not thinking it all the way through. And no, this isn't "apples to oranges," it's the same concept.
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You are right and eventually they will get over that.
The fact is our resources are spread too thin. Has Arkansas EVER been on probation? Has LSU EVER been on probation? Tennessee? South Carolina? (SC has barely). The common thread...no in state competition except for SC and thus the footnote.
Bama - yes, and it killed them for more than a decade. Auburn - yes. Common thread - in state competition.
A merger has obvious huge advantages to football. Academically and otherwise, there are efficiency advantages. Eliminate duplication and our state's alread disadvantaged resources could focus more on our strengths. UMCC cured AIDS in at least one case. MSU beat a long list of brand name engineering schools in the eco car whatever-it-was-called challenge. We have real potential already. How much better could we be if we were all on the same page?
Yes. Yes. Yes. Every day and twice on Sunday.
I could see both sides of the argument. I'm a somewhat nostalgic person and enjoy going back to campus and seeing the places I lived and had class... and had the absolute time of my life. I love going to games and seeing the maroon and white play. I love hearing Hail State. I love stopping by my favorite *******.
However, I do know that neither us or OM will nationally contend in anything (besides baseball) unless something changed. A single state university could compete nationally, not just in athletics, but academics, too. You are absolutely right, The competition and the talent pool will not be near as spread thin and over time, the state would have an institution that is forward moving, progressive, and nationally competitive in every area... from football to engineering to medicine.
The biggest problem undoubtedly is that there would be so many people that would try to stop something like that from being a great thing (i.e. the people who want Col. Reb back or thought we should have hired Tommy Raffo because Polk wanted him)... hence, why we can't ever have nice things...
However, I do know that neither us or OM will nationally contend in anything (besides baseball) unless something changed. A single state university could compete nationally, not just in athletics, but academics, too. You are absolutely right, The competition and the talent pool will not be near as spread thin and over time, the state would have an institution that is forward moving, progressive, and nationally competitive in every area... from football to engineering to medicine.
The biggest problem undoubtedly is that there would be so many people that would try to stop something like that from being a great thing (i.e. the people who want Col. Reb back or thought we should have hired Tommy Raffo because Polk wanted him)... hence, why we can't ever have nice things...
That's the only way it would work
State fans are going to want to keep our traditions. Ole Miss fans are going to feel the same. The only solution is to do away with both. And for the record, as a State fan I don't like that solution. The new university would probably have to be in the Jackson Metro area too. It would kill Starkville and Oxford as towns.
Merging athletic programs would be crazy because you would have to cut roughly half the players on both teams. How is that going to work?
On paper it makes sense though.
State fans are going to want to keep our traditions. Ole Miss fans are going to feel the same. The only solution is to do away with both. And for the record, as a State fan I don't like that solution. The new university would probably have to be in the Jackson Metro area too. It would kill Starkville and Oxford as towns.
Merging athletic programs would be crazy because you would have to cut roughly half the players on both teams. How is that going to work?
On paper it makes sense though.
And this thing extends beyond sports.
MSU has a good engineering program with skins no the wall. No reason that effort is being duplicated at Ole Miss and also at Jackson State. That duplication would be eliminated and the funds could be used to further things that aren't duplicated.
Plus we could jettison HD6 to LSU.
MSU has a good engineering program with skins no the wall. No reason that effort is being duplicated at Ole Miss and also at Jackson State. That duplication would be eliminated and the funds could be used to further things that aren't duplicated.
Plus we could jettison HD6 to LSU.
What if they decided to keep the games on a campus? I doubt anyone at either University would support playing all the games in Jackson. What if OM kept the football games in Oxford, since they have a better overall record in football, and we kept baseball and basketball, since our record is better in those sports. Would that be a deal killer?
If you came up with a practical plan...sure. The reality is that no one would allow it to happen in a mutually beneficial way.
However, a more realistic approach would be to shut Delta State, JSU, Alcorn, MVSU, and force Southern to go private (too large to just close). Seriously, Delta State and MVSU are like 30 minutes away from each other, at the very least, why do they both still exist?
No
I see the obvious advantages. But I'm not going to drive back in from out of State to support a school that I didn't go to. I'm an MSU fan, and not particularly a fan of the fictitious d-1 school in the same state as where I went to college. I could see MSU graduates still living in MS supporting the sports programs, but not the out of state folks. And I'd probably send my kids to LSU if that happened for in-state tuition.
I see the obvious advantages. But I'm not going to drive back in from out of State to support a school that I didn't go to. I'm an MSU fan, and not particularly a fan of the fictitious d-1 school in the same state as where I went to college. I could see MSU graduates still living in MS supporting the sports programs, but not the out of state folks. And I'd probably send my kids to LSU if that happened for in-state tuition.
I think I would lose interest in college sports all together....
I could not even become an LSU fan.
I'm not going to support a school that I did not attend, with time and financial resources, the way I support Mississippi State.
I would play more golf in the fall, and probably go to more Saints games.
I could not even become an LSU fan.
I'm not going to support a school that I did not attend, with time and financial resources, the way I support Mississippi State.
I would play more golf in the fall, and probably go to more Saints games.
If Mississippi wants to compete on the national state for anything, athletically or academically, it has to merge universities. There just aren't enough resources to do it separately. Look at the endowments of the big-time schools and how they compare to ours. To think otherwise is spitting in the wind and downright delusional. I wouldn't count on a new campus. Too much capital is invested in the existing campuses.
Not that it would ever happen anyway, but we've pretty much ensured it can never happen by our idiotic locations of state schools. None of our major campuses are in an area that makes sense. If there were two universities or two main campuses, they could be in Hattiesburg and maybe somewhere around Winona. It doesn't make sense to have Oxford and Starkville located near the edge of the state within an hour and a half from each other. So either you'd end up abandoning the Starkville or Oxford campuse, or keeping both (which probably doesn't make sense financially) or starting a new campus from scratch that is centrally located, with the Oxford, Hattiesburg, and Starkville campuses slowly abandoned.
Probably the best alternative would be to establish a university system to cut out the duplicative programs, try to move UM (minus the med school) to a model that does not rely on state money and primarily caters to out of state students (which it's basically doing anyway), and use Hattiesburg and Starkville as the main campuses. The other campuses around the state could focus on instruction, and mainly take on the same role as community colleges, being a cheap way to get lower level classes out of the way. DSU and MVSU could basically be gradually merged, with MVSU campus eventually being used as part of Mississippi Delta Community College. Even with this plan, Starkville is being used because it's already an established campus with enough land to allow growth. You'd never choose that location now.
For athletics success? No. For better academics? Why not?
I support MSU athletics because it's fun for me to get back to campus and re-live some of my fondest memories. Of course, it's more fun to support a winning team, but that's secondary to the experience of going to Starkville for a day - if I'm being truly honest with myself. If you take that away from me, what's the point? I could just anoint myself an Alabama fan and support them. At least I know what I'm going to get with their program...
If someone wants to make an argument for consolidation of admins and resources of our major institutions for betterment of the education system in the State, I'm all for it. You would always have an MSU/OM/USM since the infrastructure is there. It would never make sense to bulldoze those sites/communities/economies to make some kind of centralized/consolidated campus.
I support MSU athletics because it's fun for me to get back to campus and re-live some of my fondest memories. Of course, it's more fun to support a winning team, but that's secondary to the experience of going to Starkville for a day - if I'm being truly honest with myself. If you take that away from me, what's the point? I could just anoint myself an Alabama fan and support them. At least I know what I'm going to get with their program...
If someone wants to make an argument for consolidation of admins and resources of our major institutions for betterment of the education system in the State, I'm all for it. You would always have an MSU/OM/USM since the infrastructure is there. It would never make sense to bulldoze those sites/communities/economies to make some kind of centralized/consolidated campus.
2013 Baseball team is confused by this statement.
1996 Basketball team is also confused.
That is too complicated and far-fetched to fathom properly but I'll try......
First of all the logistics of such a merger is mind-blowing. Keeping multiple campuses intact would still result in fierce competition. Combining into one would cost billions and result in the loss of millions and millions of current assets.
Secondly, the combination into one super sports program would not immediately result in a world class program. It would alienate thousands of alumni whose alma mater suddenly did not exist any longer. Top recruits would have no allegiance for a while and I think would be drained by other regional powers. And as far as I know such a mergered team would almost certainly not automatically remain in the SEC.
Thirdly, much of the non-sports related financial benefits for combining universities can be largely addressed right now through the state legislature whom we are ALL currently subject to.
Finally, remember that UM and MSU were at one time part of the same college. MSU was broken off from UM exists as a separate school for some very good reasons that still are true today.
First of all the logistics of such a merger is mind-blowing. Keeping multiple campuses intact would still result in fierce competition. Combining into one would cost billions and result in the loss of millions and millions of current assets.
Secondly, the combination into one super sports program would not immediately result in a world class program. It would alienate thousands of alumni whose alma mater suddenly did not exist any longer. Top recruits would have no allegiance for a while and I think would be drained by other regional powers. And as far as I know such a mergered team would almost certainly not automatically remain in the SEC.
Thirdly, much of the non-sports related financial benefits for combining universities can be largely addressed right now through the state legislature whom we are ALL currently subject to.
Finally, remember that UM and MSU were at one time part of the same college. MSU was broken off from UM exists as a separate school for some very good reasons that still are true today.
Sure. Change school name, mascot and colors....
play 5 homes games in Starkville and 2 in Oxford. Sort of like Arkansas plays two games in Little Rock every year. Plus you don't completely lose the use of facilities that each school has invested millions in.
/Starkville is more centrally located than Oxford.
//never gonna happen.
play 5 homes games in Starkville and 2 in Oxford. Sort of like Arkansas plays two games in Little Rock every year. Plus you don't completely lose the use of facilities that each school has invested millions in.
/Starkville is more centrally located than Oxford.
//never gonna happen.
Most of American is confused by your thinking that baseball is more than a blip on the screen of sports.
Its awesome that we made it to Omaha. But college baseball = college hockey.
And if the '96 basketball team is confused, then they should simply realize that next year, kids will be going to college who WERENT EVEN BORN when we played in the Final Four.
Thats how long ago its been.
Where do you people come from? I have seen this crap come up from time to time usually from some hanger on who never gave a darn either way. To actually read some of the posts that include "realistic" strategies for bringing about such a merger causes one to question the collective sanity of those who post on this board. To even spend the time thinking that the respective physical plants of Mississippi's two most major universities could somehow be dismantled or otherwise combined and that such alteration of multi-billion dollar campuses would be efficient and save money calls into question the degrees that you allegedly got from MSU or elsewhere. I can assure you that your Ole MIss buddies will ignore you at the door. At least they have enough pride, although often misplaced, to recognize the idiocy of such a proposal.
History even mitigates against this discussion. The "children of the industrial class" refused to attend U of M when they were designated as the "land grant" for one year. To assume that either school would gladly give up a century and a half of traditions to have a better football team is naive beyond the point of help.
History even mitigates against this discussion. The "children of the industrial class" refused to attend U of M when they were designated as the "land grant" for one year. To assume that either school would gladly give up a century and a half of traditions to have a better football team is naive beyond the point of help.
The guy said this:
I think your beef is with him, because he was wrong. You're just spouting off irrelevant statements.
I think your beef is with him, because he was wrong. You're just spouting off irrelevant statements.
