I almost feel like Lebby is being stubborn…

The Cooterpoot

Heisman
Sep 29, 2022
6,852
11,956
113
If this were the case there would never be upsets. Inferior talent wins games all the time. Coaching matters.
You don't realize how bad our talent really is and how thin our depth really is. We've got guys on that OL that can't play at USM, only have two WRs, TEs can't block or do much of anything well. We've got a deep RB room and that's about it, and it's thinner now too. QB isn't great either. Unless Lebby moves to a completely different scheme, we don't have the players to consistently run his offense.
 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,705
26,043
113
If this were the case there would never be upsets. Inferior talent wins games all the time. Coaching matters.
Theres a lot of other reasons upsets happen. It’s not usually because of some brilliant coaching strategy or play calls. If it were they wouldn’t be upsets because the underdog would win a lot more games.

I really think for the most part Lebby has done what he could to try to compensate for our weaknesses with his play calling. But there’s only so much you can do.
 

Drebin

Heisman
Aug 22, 2012
21,490
25,035
113
You don't realize how bad our talent really is and how thin our depth really is. We've got guys on that OL that can't play at USM, only have two WRs, TEs can't block or do much of anything well. We've got a deep RB room and that's about it, and it's thinner now too. QB isn't great either. Unless Lebby moves to a completely different scheme, we don't have the players to consistently run his offense.
No, I realize the problem exactly.

That's why you have to scheme in a way to mitigate it. You don't beat two TD favorites by trying to lineup and big boy them to death. You have to coach to your talent level.
 
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TilloDwg

Senior
Aug 25, 2012
396
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Well, if we're gonna continue to run Shapen, he won't be long for the lineup anyway. He's a liability in the running game, and a sack waiting to happen. Taylor is already disgruntled he's not getting to play at all. If that continues, he will playing somewhere else next year.
 
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The Cooterpoot

Heisman
Sep 29, 2022
6,852
11,956
113
No, I realize the problem exactly.

That's why you have to scheme in a way to mitigate it. You don't beat two TD favorites by trying to lineup and big boy them to death. You have to coach to your talent level.
He's not going to just drop his scheme in what's effectively year one for him so you can forget that. Even Mullen, as great as he was at adjusting an offense, never truly got away from his scheme either. Lebby will live or die building the talent. His offense was fine last week before the injuries.
 
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Villagedawg

All-Conference
Nov 16, 2005
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Lebby is still a work in progress. He's still learning how to call sitiational plays. He's still learning how to evaluate coaching hires. He's still learning how to conduct practice. He's still learning how to build a roster. He is in a phase in his career where every week he's taking in new information and analyzing it.
He out thinks himself like a lot of coaches do all over the country. He'll get better as he gets more experience.

Unfortunately our roster isn't built to win with this schedule while he evolves as a program leader.
Right. It’s going to take a while for Lebby to build up his knowledge and experience base to catch up with mine. It’s hard for me to watch him struggle without just calling him up and telling him what to do. But after all, he has to learn.*
seriously, we still simply don’t have the players, especially on the lines, to be a real threat in this conference. Add in the injuries to a thin roster and, well, here we are. It’s going to be tough to get one, much less two, more wins this year. I’m encouraged by the improvement. And I’m ok with the direction we’re headed.
 
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Dawgzilla2

All-Conference
Oct 9, 2022
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Well, we should've had at least 21 points but the damn turf got Booth and Work did Work **** on the goal line. 21 against that defense ain't bad either. I'd say the OL and bad luck got us.
Those two things happened on the same drive. How are you turning that one drive into 14 points?
 
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OopsICroomedmypants

All-Conference
Sep 29, 2022
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That game is mostly on play calling. Nine points is unacceptable even on the road against #6. The backs needed more carries while Lebby was out there trying to take shots with two tackles that couldn’t block. That was stupid no matter how you slice it. At this point we are better off running it on third and fifteen rather than give up another sack or hurried throw and potential turnover.
In Lebby's defense, he put a TE in there to help the LT and the dang LT kept blocking in the direction of the TE, leaving a gaping hole to get beat inside. It seems like because we had late transfers, we didn't get any other o-linemen reps at all. It's not an ability issue at LT, it's a between the ears issue. As far as RT, Luke Work is a guard and tried his damnest. He's just not quick enough at tackle, but he's a pretty good guard.
 
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Drebin

Heisman
Aug 22, 2012
21,490
25,035
113
He's not going to just drop his scheme in what's effectively year one for him so you can forget that. Even Mullen, as great as he was at adjusting an offense, never truly got away from his scheme either. Lebby will live or die building the talent. His offense was fine last week before the injuries.
There's a noun version of the word scheme and a verb version of the word scheme. I wasn't referring to the noun. I was referring to the verb. Maybe if I had said "gameplan" that would've helped.
 

bulldoghair

All-Conference
Jul 9, 2013
2,463
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I think most everyone is saying play Shapen but to use Taylor a bit more.
Exactly. Especially when the guy is getting paid over a half million dollars for this year, yes utilize him more. Especially in games like last night. Quicker hitting read option stuff with play action off it. Help our out marched o-line out. Make the defense have to defend something else. Why pay the guy that much not to help out? At least have him planned into the scheme to change the pace and play call ability. Keep the defense on their heels
 
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TXDawg.sixpack

All-Conference
Apr 10, 2009
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With Taylor.

Q: Was there any thought on giving KaMario Taylor a series to try to change things up?
Lebby
: No. I felt with the run game piece of it and what we wanted was to do the run game through the backs. To me, that is what was going to give us the best opportunity to go run the football successfully. We didn’t do that consistently at all and that is something we will go back and look at. That wasn’t something in the middle of it that felt like the right thing.
He tried to give KT a possession at the goal line (and it probably would’ve worked), but our dubmass OL couldn’t stay still and got a false start.
 

TXDawg.sixpack

All-Conference
Apr 10, 2009
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This is a thing that is true.
I thought the run game was there in the first quarter, but then we backed away and continued to let Shapen drop back and get clobbered over and over. Announcers talked all night about A&Ms young QB and him getting his passes out quicker so he can gain confidence. Our Senior QB sure didn’t get that. And yeah I know our O line sucks.
I posted it in a different thread; with sacks removed, we ran the ball 24 times and threw it 15. We didn’t “move away” from the run, TAMU’s defense shut it down. Combine that with our craptastic pass blocking allowing our QB to get hit in 1.5 seconds and that’s the result we get.

KT isn’t the answer right now. Building a better OL is.
 

TXDawg.sixpack

All-Conference
Apr 10, 2009
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Lebby is still a work in progress. He's still learning how to call sitiational plays. He's still learning how to evaluate coaching hires. He's still learning how to conduct practice. He's still learning how to build a roster. He is in a phase in his career where every week he's taking in new information and analyzing it.
He out thinks himself like a lot of coaches do all over the country. He'll get better as he gets more experience.

Unfortunately our roster isn't built to win with this schedule while he evolves as a program leader.
The fake punt against TN was an amazing situational call. Unfortunately, our OL ruined that one too.
 
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greenbean.sixpack

All-American
Oct 6, 2012
8,781
8,067
113
With Taylor.

Q: Was there any thought on giving KaMario Taylor a series to try to change things up?
Lebby
: No. I felt with the run game piece of it and what we wanted was to do the run game through the backs. To me, that is what was going to give us the best opportunity to go run the football successfully. We didn’t do that consistently at all and that is something we will go back and look at. That wasn’t something in the middle of it that felt like the right thing.
100% if we want that 5th and 6th win, we need a QB who can put pressure on the D with legs. A QB who has a small about of escapability.
 

Trojanbulldog19

All-American
Aug 25, 2014
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Gotta shorten the passing game some. The deep routes just don’t have time to develop consistently
That was the fear after first 4. I didn't feel like our line was good enough to block long enough to get those deep throws. We got maybe two last night. One we caught the other just too long. The others were tipped or sacks.
 

Trojanbulldog19

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Aug 25, 2014
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That game is mostly on play calling. Nine points is unacceptable even on the road against #6. The backs needed more carries while Lebby was out there trying to take shots with two tackles that couldn’t block. That was stupid no matter how you slice it. At this point we are better off running it on third and fifteen rather than give up another sack or hurried throw and potential turnover.
That's it. We were running fine and stopped to throw bombs when we couldn't block to do it.
 

Crazy Cotton

All-Conference
Aug 26, 2012
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Our successful drive happened because they had to respect Shapen's ability to hit mid and long range throws, so that opened up the run for Fluff. I'm imagining what A&M would do on defense if we put a running QB in the backfield, and it isn't pretty - safety run blitz every play.
 

Trojanbulldog19

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Aug 25, 2014
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Our successful drive happened because they had to respect Shapen's ability to hit mid and long range throws, so that opened up the run for Fluff. I'm imagining what A&M would do on defense if we put a running QB in the backfield, and it isn't pretty - safety run blitz every play.
Yes there must be balance. However, Taylor can chunk it too. I haven't seen enough to know how accurate he is. But Shapen is still the best answer for now. We play fine as long as we actually have d1 tackles playing. Right now we don't. It also helps if Lebby doesn't call three straight pass plays. I also disagree with bringing in Taylor at the goal line. We don't do that we don't get.m the penalty and I believe we score if we give fluff or booth a shot. Or even a shovel pass or something. Bringing in another qb at goal is predictable and comes with penalties a lot
 

TXDawg.sixpack

All-Conference
Apr 10, 2009
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What's not factual about what I said about the game last night after the first quarter?
We didn’t ”stop running to throw bombs”. Final stats (excluding sacks): 24 runs, 15 passes. We kept trying to run the ball, but TAMU adjusted and stopped it. Our OL was as effective as a screen door on a submarine in pass blocking.

Play calling was fine; our OL played like ąss.
 

The Peeper

Heisman
Feb 26, 2008
15,412
10,559
113
With Taylor.

Q: Was there any thought on giving KaMario Taylor a series to try to change things up?
Lebby
: No. I felt with the run game piece of it and what we wanted was to do the run game through the backs. To me, that is what was going to give us the best opportunity to go run the football
hole round GIF

Trying to force the square peg in the round hole
 

Trojanbulldog19

All-American
Aug 25, 2014
9,979
5,753
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We didn’t ”stop running to throw bombs”. Final stats (excluding sacks): 24 runs, 15 passes. We kept trying to run the ball, but TAMU adjusted and stopped it. Our OL was as effective as a screen door on a submarine in pass blocking.

Play calling was fine; our OL played like ąss.
Okay break down 2nd and 3rd quarter for me
 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,705
26,043
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Okay break down 2nd and 3rd quarter for me
1d - 1 yard run
2d - 2 yard run
3D - incomplete


1d - 3 yard run
2d - 1 yard run
3D - 10-yard run
1d - interception when dl hit qb hand

1d under 2:00 - sack
2d - 3 yard run
3D - 9 yard completion.

that’s 2nc quarter. You can do 3rd yourself. But we didn’t abandon the run game when it was working. A&M made adjustments and forced us to pass some.
 

Deltaduckhunter

Freshman
Feb 25, 2017
54
55
18
Our OL is our biggest liability right now. We are also going to see some DLs as good at A&M's the rest of the year (Florida, Georgia, and Texas).
 

msualohadog

Senior
Oct 25, 2014
478
657
93
Absolutely no reason at all for Taylor not playing the final 2 possessions. Hand the ball off to Gayten and throw a pass or two. It's not that complicated. A&M just wanted to keep us in bounds to run clock.
 

Dawgg

Heisman
Sep 9, 2012
10,535
10,793
113
I think once the game was 28-3 (and damn sure when it was 31-9), there was no value in keeping Shapen (or most other skill players) in. If you’re concerned about KT getting “thrown to the wolves” and destroying his confidence, then Kromenhoek should have been out there.

There’s no shame in getting reps for the backup when the math is that far against you.
 
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Dawgg

Heisman
Sep 9, 2012
10,535
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You don't realize how bad our talent really is and how thin our depth really is. We've got guys on that OL that can't play at USM, only have two WRs, TEs can't block or do much of anything well. We've got a deep RB room and that's about it, and it's thinner now too. QB isn't great either. Unless Lebby moves to a completely different scheme, we don't have the players to consistently run his offense.
Whose fault is that though?
 

johnson86-1

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
14,301
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Whose fault is that though?
It's Lebby's, but it seems clear to me he made improvements from last year. We just couldn't afford injuries and we had them. I'm not sure the line should be this bad; definitely some lack of talent but also seems like they just are bad at execution also. But it's hard to execute when your are badly out talented.

Hopefully after he's shown some ability to be competitive this year, it will be easier and cheaper to get transfers next year and we can get a more complete Oline. You have to be able to withstand an injury on the Oline, so it's on him, and us looking so completely lost last year I'm sure contributed to making it hard to get players for this year, so that's on him, but if he's showing progress, I think that's good enough at this point.

I don't undersatnd the justification for keeping skill players in so late. The OL probably needs the reps. You have a QB that's historically been injury prone and you have two highly rated backups. I completely believe that KT isn't ready and that he will be worse than Shapen if he goes in for anything other than a short yardage situation, but when is that not true of the backup QB? We need to get some backup reps both to limit hits to Shapen when the game is out of hand and to start developing a backup in case he does get hurt. The only argument I can think of is that you don't want to create a QB controversy by having KT light up benchwarmers for A&M, but that seems like something you deal with if it happens, not something you let drive decisions. I can't believe that has anything to do with him not putting in a backup, but I can't come up with another reason either.
 
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The Cooterpoot

Heisman
Sep 29, 2022
6,852
11,956
113
Whose fault is that though?
Well, he's had one recruiting class to try to fix the worst roster in P5. I'd say it's everyone's fault but his. Leach died, so I won't drag 85 out, Keenum 17'd the hire, Cohen refused to touch football NIL, so lots of problems. We're two years behind in NIL fund raising and this year is basically year 1 for Lebby.
 

Dawgg

Heisman
Sep 9, 2012
10,535
10,793
113
Well, he's had one recruiting class to try to fix the worst roster in P5. I'd say it's everyone's fault but his. Leach died, so I won't drag 85 out, Keenum 17'd the hire, Cohen refused to touch football NIL, so lots of problems. We're two years behind in NIL fund raising and this year is basically year 1 for Lebby.
Year 1, my аss. He was hired like 2 days after the Egg Bowl in 2023. That’s two recruiting classes, plus the practically unlimited transfer portal era.

He’s a 17ing offensive coach. After QB, OL should have been his next priority.
 

The Cooterpoot

Heisman
Sep 29, 2022
6,852
11,956
113
Year 1, my аss. He was hired like 2 days after the Egg Bowl in 2023. That’s two recruiting classes, plus the practically unlimited transfer portal era.

He’s a 17ing offensive coach. After QB, OL should have been his next priority.
He didn't get to recruit that class outside of the portal guys really and if you don't believe this is year one, you're going to keep being disappointed because that's exactly what it is on the field for Lebby.
 

ETK99

Heisman
Jul 30, 2019
9,321
13,093
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1d - 1 yard run
2d - 2 yard run
3D - incomplete


1d - 3 yard run
2d - 1 yard run
3D - 10-yard run
1d - interception when dl hit qb hand

1d under 2:00 - sack
2d - 3 yard run
3D - 9 yard completion.

that’s 2nc quarter. You can do 3rd yourself. But we didn’t abandon the run game when it was working. A&M made adjustments and forced us to pass some.
Someone on the other side did this, so credit to them but here you go. Lots of missed opportunities:


2nd drive: He got us down to the goal line & we get a false start that stalls our drive — on the players.

4th drive: took a shot play to Evans that 100% should’ve been PI call to keep that drive going

5th drive: gets us into their territory & we have a shot play that likely hits BT wide open & Work gets demolished that allows a dead duck ball for an INT — on the players.

8th drive: we get to 2nd and 3 and Shapen fumbles an RPO that puts us in 3rd and 11 and kills the drive — on the players.

10th drive: Shapen hits Ant for a 1st down & he fumbles the ball away on the first play of the drive — on the players.

11th drive: finally a TD

12th & final drive: Get a first down & then throw the ball out in the flats to Fluff when he got hurt, loss of 6 and puts us in 2nd and 16 and kills the drive — on the players (Shapen for dumping it off, injury on Lebby for having them out there tho)
 
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