Abraham should’ve kept it in his tunic
I hate to compliment Ole Miss, but...
- Thread starter preacher_dawg
- Start date
I know a missionary to Muslims who talks about how Israel has mistreated those who live in Gaza. With that being said, he would obviously agree that October 7th was awful, and something needed to be done against Hamas. The other thing is that like a lot of Muslim countries, it seems obvious to me that the protesters use protesting for Palestinians as an excuse for bad behavior.
And I am referring to his actions with Hagar, not Sarah
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I know a missionary to Muslims who spends a lot of time in parts of the Middle East. I spoke with him a few months back and he agreed Oct. was evil and Hamas needed to be dealt with. He told me he has Muslim contacts throughout the Middle East who think the same about Hamas. His biggest issue though is the impact Israel has on him sharing the gospel. Israel does a lot of bad/evil and Christians' unconditional support does not help the cause of reaching Muslims.
Actually you both do have that right, subject to limits.
The never left part involved slaughtering their opponents. Somehow that never seems to get mentioned much.
Of course, especially in the US. Same as 2020.
Yep, this really frustrates me. I have people in my church who have blind allegiance to Israel. I wish they were half as enthusiastic about Christians being persecuted and telling others (especially the Muslim world) about Jesus.
Today I learned Gomer is in the Bible and he is a she. And she is either simply promiscuous or a full fledged prostitute.
It's really not that complicated. Hamas operates out of Gaza. Certainly not all people in Gaza support Hamas, but enough of them support them and enough of them are ok with them that they not only get to have Gaza act as a terrorist state but they siphon off a ton of aid that could help improve the quality of life in Gaza. Sucks for the people that don't support Hamas but it's not unique to them. I'm sure there were anti-nazi's in Dresden that lost their homes and possessions. Tragic but not the fault of Israel or the allies. Just more victims of Hamas and the Nazis.
A few notes that resonate with me:
- It's a complex situation, therefore there is a lot of nuance, in general Americans don't like to think so aren't good with nuance
- Palestine includes Christians and Muslims but is run by Hamas, a terror group, so wanting to see a good outcome for both Palestine and Israel is not inherently bad; however, supporting Hamas lumps you in with that evil
- There are some correlations between people (mostly young crowd) who get their news on TikTok (Chinese government overseen) and them having a pro-Hamas/anti-Israel opinion; not surprising as China/Iran/Russia/etc. are all anti-American. the enemy of my enemy
- Recent generations only know Israel as a nuclear world power, it's all they've ever known, so they don't see them as an historically oppressed people
- Claims to that land go back thousands of years and it has always been occupied by whoever won the most recent war over it
- There are credible reports of Israeli military mistreating Palestinians at check points during peace time, even to the extent of being sexually inappropriate with the women. (this involves even more nuance when you consider the way that Hamas uses people as bombs, so I'm not making a right/wrong statement, just observing; If you are Palestinian and your sister was aggressively but appropriately frisked at a checkpoint, you might not like it; what about the case where the frisker took liberties as a bad human and did more?)
- America has traditionally been pro-Isarael largely due to Christian influence in this country
- Israel is not some Christian good luck charm as many Christians like to believe that it is
- America is not some new Israel/God's chosen people as some Christians like to believe that it is
- If Hamas wasn't using Palestinian citizens as human shields, like the cowards they are, there wouldn't be as many casualties (nuance again here; how do you deal with a terrorist organization that hides behind women and children?)
- If Hamas laid down arms today, the war would be over
- If Israel laid down arms today, Israel would be over
I could go on, but the above should be enough to recognize that even people in this thread using Palestine interchangeably for Hamas are not recognizing the complexity of the situation.
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That’s exactly how it would be. And I’m not saying Israel hasn’t done things that were wrong but there’s clearly a different end game by both sides in this.
It was actually Hagar, not Gomer. I got my OT women mixed up.
These are the two points that the majority of people in the US need to understand, but don't.
- If Hamas would just free the remaining hostages (they are still holding 100 or so Israelis), the war would be over. In general, Israel would rather just leave them alone, as it was pre-October 7.
- That is not the same as the Hamas/militant Muslim belief system... which involves eliminating all non-Muslims in order to get to heaven and the 72 virgins. They WANT the fight - until Israel and the west (that's us) are all eliminated.
I haven’t read any of the posts, but I am assuming that the six pack has solved the Israel / Palestine issues?
So you support the terrorism perpetuated...seems so. the Palestinian's do terrorism on a routine basis...just damn
I think you are the one you seems ignorant on the Middle East situation.
Probably before your parents made a terrible mistake but remember the 72 terror attack on the Olympics?
I agree with your basic point that both sides have some fault.
But when one side is willing to use civilians as human shields, steals humanitarian aid before it reaches women and children, stores their ammunition under hospitals, and has their military operations based in church offices, etc. - it is fairly obvious that one side is trying to lessen civilian casualties and one side is perfectly willing to sacrifice as many civilian lives as necessary.
You're correct but when bullets start flying, whether in Gaza or in an American university protest cesspool, you have to pick a side. Your last two sentences say it all.
They can protest, but myself and others can also call them out for the Communist, American hating pieces of shat that they are. You know, freedom of speech and all.
In my view as a Christian, the Jews reject the Messiah just like the Muslims. I don't know how any one can read the New Testament and still think the Jews are God's "chosen people". They were chosen to be the people the Messiah came through, which He did, and they rejected Him. Christians are God's chosen people. I think Israel is just as much at fault as the Palestinians in all of this(not talking about Hamas they are a terrorist organization) over the years since Israel was created in 1948. Many don't want to look at it from Palestine's(not Hamas') point of view. They'd been on that land for a couple thousand years, and then America and Britain says," Y'all got to go and give up your land to these Jews who are moving in here because God gave it to the thousands of years ago". What if they did that with us here in Mississippi with the Native Americans? Making us give up our lands and homes to the Indians because they were here first? We'd want to go to war also.
All that said these protest are idiot Communist, left wingers who know nothing about Palestine and the like. They are just being the dumbass, brain washed, America hating idiots that they are.
I really haven't seen any republicans supporting Russia. Not wanting to send money to Ukraine is not the same thing as supporting Russia, which the media and warhawks love to conflate.
I'm sure there are idiots out there who love Russia. There always have been. But it's not some movement on the right.
Considering that Hamas has an 85% approval rating among Palestinians and they keep electing Hamas to leadership positions, I'd say that "pro-Palestinian" and "pro-Hamas" are two sides of the same coin.
Some decent points here. But ultimately, if you support the individuals who are currently being paid to disrupt college campuses, block interstates, and vandalize property in the name of “pro-Palestine beliefs” you’re in the wrong here. That’s not debatable and was my original point.
Of course, the conflict overseas has a long history and is nuanced. That’s not debatable, either.
I trust six pack more than the government.
This is also true. Some folks fight like hell to distinguish between Hamas and Palestine - which there is a difference, absolutely. But to act like there isn’t an overlap and all Palestinians are angels is very ignorant. This is the stance of most left leaning individuals in this country. It’s pretty disgusting.
If these protestors want me to believe that they are serious about cancelling trade with Israel, they will absolve themselves of every single piece of technology that they own. Israel is huge in integrated circuit design with chips, or Israeli embedded IP, in every single electronic device in production. One positive outcome of this possibility is that there would be no device left to record their ignorance induced absurdity.
I am aware that young people do tend to have somewhat of a rage against the machine mentality by default and it doesn't take much to provide them a target for their grandiose world betterment ideas.
There hasn't been a real election in Gaza in years. But I don't disagree that that they are effectively the same thing as far as Gaza goes.
Let me tell you about this weight loss coffee...***
Very different women and very different stories. But God loved them both and requires us to do the same.
And God promised Hagar a Great Nation.
I agree. I have zero good things to say about Hamas. If I could choose to wipe Hamas off the earth without the collateral damage of killing innocents, they'd been gone yesterday. I can find things to pick on the Israeli government for, but I hope they are around tomorrow and Hamas is gone.
If you are a Christian, you share a common Biblical genealogy with the Jewish people, and you share (I assume) many of the same values that were given to us directly from God through Moses (a Jew). This country was founded on Judeo-Christian values. Our two religions diverged eventually when it came to Jesus being the Christ, and I hope eventually all Jews have an awakening and realize the truth at some point. But I don't want them to die because they aren't there in that belief yet. And they don't want me to die because I believe in Jesus. And there is no denying common ancestry and shared Godly core beliefs.
I hate to say it, but eventually every country (maybe every person) will have to choose a side in this war. So I look at the beliefs and actions of each side, and it's really REALLY easy to decide which side I need to be on. One side generally wants peace and to be left alone, the other generally wants perpetual war and for Jews, Christians, me, my family and my country to all die by sudden head loss.
It's a pretty easy choice if you ask me.
Any minute now. I love how these college kids. and now the folks on here are debating the nuances of a conflict that is thousands of miles away and really has no measurable impact on our daily lives other than giving people a reason to be even more divided. There are so many more things we could be spending our time, energy, intelligence, and money on that would actually better the lives of people right here in our own country. The following list is things that are happening somewhere in America right now:
-A child is going hungry.
-Someone is dying because they can not afford the bills to continue treatment.
-Someone is about to kill themselves for a reason that could be changed.
-Someone is about to try hard drugs for the first time, or for the millionth time.
-Someone is losing a job and house.
-A family is raising their children in poverty without access to even the most basic of services, see Jackson's water crisis.
-The list could go on.
And all of these things I would rather be concentrating on than a battle between peoples that have fought for hundreds if not thousands of years. Am I saying we should be isolationist? No, of course not. I am saying we are wasting our time and energy on problems we really can not solve.
I see a lot of wisdom in all of these posts. Maybe we should have a Sixpack political party and nominate someone to be president. Probably a better choice than either of the two choices we currently have.
No need to debate, but we have to address all that you mentioned above and keep a watchful eye on that conflict "thousands of miles away". Because if you haven't been seeing it, somewhere around 10 million new unidentified people have entered our country in the past 3 years. No one knows how many of those are possible terrorists bent on destroying us, but there is no doubt the number is above 0.
The enemies are inside our gates, unfortunately. I'm afraid we won't have the luxury of ignoring it sometime soon.
I'm not saying I'm against Israel. I'm saying most here in America support them because of "God's chosen people". I'm not the judge, but according to my beliefs they are going to bust hell wide open just like the Muslims. I'm against terrorism, however I understand why Palestinians hate Israel.
One thing I've found interesting is the lack of empathy and compassion shown the Palestinians by other Arab countries. There is a long deep history behind this going back to the PLO in the 60's and beyond . I've done some reading on the subject and like most things in middle east it very complicated and somewhat hard for a westerner to grasp. But it is very interesting and some commenting in this thread would benefit by reading up on the subject a bit.
The Quran treats Jesus as a prophet and messiah that will return before the day of judgment and defeat the antichrist. It also acknowledges virgin birth, miracles, ministry, and being turned away by the Jewish establishment. Where they differ is they don't believe in crucifixion, resurrection, divinity, trinity (obviously, as that part puts them in the Christian bucket). I was a bit surprised learning about the reverence that Muslims do place on Jesus, but it's there.
These universities are reaping what they have sown. However, it’s not okay to just be satisfied with these indoctrination factories getting their comeuppance. Universities should be a place of free thought and discourse. Once that occurs, if these misguided students come to the same conclusion, so be it.
Like many others have said, this conflict is very, very complicated. It breaks my heart to see children suffer. I’ll admit that a week or so ago, when the video was published through the media of dead Palestinian children killed by an Israeli air strike, I got somewhat emotional. I’m also aware that was the intent. I pray for the innocents in both Israel and Gaza, and I hope my fellow Christians do the same.
The only reasonable resolution to this conflict is a two-state solution, but that is incredibly complicated as well. It would require that Christians, Muslims, and Jews all have access to Jerusalem. It would also likely require that Egypt and Jordan kick in some land, and that Syria waive their claim to the Golan Heights. It would also include mass resettlements of both Arabs and Jews. You see why this is complicated.
Lastly, Palestinians and Jews both have legitimate claims to this small patch of land. The Palestinians could’ve had a country in 1948. They chose war.
Like many others have said, this conflict is very, very complicated. It breaks my heart to see children suffer. I’ll admit that a week or so ago, when the video was published through the media of dead Palestinian children killed by an Israeli air strike, I got somewhat emotional. I’m also aware that was the intent. I pray for the innocents in both Israel and Gaza, and I hope my fellow Christians do the same.
The only reasonable resolution to this conflict is a two-state solution, but that is incredibly complicated as well. It would require that Christians, Muslims, and Jews all have access to Jerusalem. It would also likely require that Egypt and Jordan kick in some land, and that Syria waive their claim to the Golan Heights. It would also include mass resettlements of both Arabs and Jews. You see why this is complicated.
Lastly, Palestinians and Jews both have legitimate claims to this small patch of land. The Palestinians could’ve had a country in 1948. They chose war.
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