And on Saturday it was Dixon, Bumphis, and Marcus Green handing it to them all day. Yea we had Relf from Bama and Broomfield from Florida making big plays but you see my point. Ignoring in state talent is just stupid.
I love how Ole Miss thinks they don't need in state players....
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And on Saturday it was Dixon, Bumphis, and Marcus Green handing it to them all day. Yea we had Relf from Bama and Broomfield from Florida making big plays but you see my point. Ignoring in state talent is just stupid.
And on Saturday it was Dixon, Bumphis, and Marcus Green handing it to them all day. Yea we had Relf from Bama and Broomfield from Florida making big plays but you see my point. Ignoring in state talent is just stupid.
is because they are getting outworked for almost all of them. I might be completely wrong on this, but when you get a team full of Mississippi kids on it, the Egg Bowl becomes more important to them than a team with a bunch of kids from south Florida. Obviously, more games than just the Egg Bowl matter, but you get what I'm saying.
Derek Sherrod- Caledonia (Columbus)
Quentin Saulsberry- Independence
Brignone- Pass Christian
Jenkins- Pearl
Lawrence- Mag Heights
All MS boys.
Quentin Saulsberry- Independence
Brignone- Pass Christian
Jenkins- Pearl
Lawrence- Mag Heights
All MS boys.
and those guys dominated Sat and played well for the vast majority of the season. I think most fans would agree that they were the most improved unit on our team.
LSU is our biggest rival.
The Junction is the mini-Grove.
Dan Mullet.
Bullfrauds.
Jackie Cheated.
Dey took r recroots!!!
muttsuckkks
And one really just for you...Tony Homo sucks.
Did I cover it well enough?
The Junction is the mini-Grove.
Dan Mullet.
Bullfrauds.
Jackie Cheated.
Dey took r recroots!!!
muttsuckkks
And one really just for you...Tony Homo sucks.
Did I cover it well enough?
I don't think you can win championships focusing mainly on Mississippi players. I don't think there is enough talent in the state to satisfy both teams. Most seasons there are only 10-15 in-state players who can play in the SEC. Only about 8-10 of those guys are going to come in and give you a big boost. Every year there are going to be some guys who are going to end up at State no matter what and every year there are going to be guys that end up at Ole Miss no matter what. Lets say one season there is 13 guys who can play. Three of those guys are die hard state fans and two are die hard OM guys. That leaves eight guys to battle for. Let's say you guys really outworked us in state and got five and we got two. One guy went out of state. You guys now have eight quality guys and we have four. You won the instate recruiting battle, good for you.
Now lets say we went into Texas and got out five replacement guys who have good offers and are very similar players. How again are you better?
You guys have kicked our *** this decade with the instate players. We have six winning seasons, you have two. I realize that there are other factors affecting that, but I just won't buy into the needing in-state players to win idea. Especially not when you have to put up will all the ******** that goes into Mississippi recruiting while fighting over 10-15 guys. Sign the kid from Texas who is just as good and doesn't feel the in-state pressure as long as he doesn't have a UT offer.
Now lets say we went into Texas and got out five replacement guys who have good offers and are very similar players. How again are you better?
You guys have kicked our *** this decade with the instate players. We have six winning seasons, you have two. I realize that there are other factors affecting that, but I just won't buy into the needing in-state players to win idea. Especially not when you have to put up will all the ******** that goes into Mississippi recruiting while fighting over 10-15 guys. Sign the kid from Texas who is just as good and doesn't feel the in-state pressure as long as he doesn't have a UT offer.
Jackie's last 3 years coaching in the decade were abysmal because of loss of control of the program and impending NCAA probation (2001-2003). Croom was our extended probation from 2004-2008. Eventhough we won the instate recruiting battles, we had no one to coach them and put them into position to be successful. We no longer have a coach who will give a scholarship to a long snapper or a 5'8 quarterback that showed a lot of heart and earned a scholarship when he threw a pick and chased the guy down from behind to save a pick 6. If you guys haven't noticed, Mullen is not recruiting ONLY Mississippi players. He is getting the best Mississippi players and is also going outside the state borders. To hear some of the Rebels talk, it's like Mullen won't cross the Mississippi river in Vicksburg because he'll be out of Mississippi looking for a recruit.
2009 Mullen Recruits:
Brandon Heavens (alabama)
Mardrecas Hood (alabama)
Ricco Sanders (south carolina)
Darius Slay (georgia)
2010 Mullen commitments:
Ferlando Bohanna (tennessee)
Antwon Chisholm (florida)
Rajion Neal (georgia)
Malcolm Johnson (alabama)
Blaine Clausell (alabama)
Mullen isn't recruiting ONLY Mississippi, but historically, if you can land the best in Mississippi and mix in some good jucos or out of state players, you will have success.
2009 Mullen Recruits:
Brandon Heavens (alabama)
Mardrecas Hood (alabama)
Ricco Sanders (south carolina)
Darius Slay (georgia)
2010 Mullen commitments:
Ferlando Bohanna (tennessee)
Antwon Chisholm (florida)
Rajion Neal (georgia)
Malcolm Johnson (alabama)
Blaine Clausell (alabama)
Mullen isn't recruiting ONLY Mississippi, but historically, if you can land the best in Mississippi and mix in some good jucos or out of state players, you will have success.
the players we've recruited, its been the coaching and the recruiting decisions made by those coaches --like not signing a QB in 06 or 08. Its insane to think our last decade of misery is attributable to MS players.
I don't think anyone is suggesting you sign 25 guys from MS every year, but I think its smart when you are State or OM to form your core from MS guys. They aren't any better or any worse than kids from other places...but they are going to be more willing to give our 2 schools the time of day year in and year out.
And now that kids are qualifying more, its an even better move.
I don't think anyone is suggesting you sign 25 guys from MS every year, but I think its smart when you are State or OM to form your core from MS guys. They aren't any better or any worse than kids from other places...but they are going to be more willing to give our 2 schools the time of day year in and year out.
And now that kids are qualifying more, its an even better move.
and I'll keep telling you that having the majority of your team being from your home state is more beneficial than having mostly out of state players. They get to represent their state every game they play and they get to play in front of family, friends and people they know as opposed to a totally alien social group like the fan base at Ole Miss.
You think there are only 8 players a year from the state of Mississippi that are worth battling over? Are you that big of an idiot? Are you that out of touch?
If you Ole Miss people want to sacrifice the instate recruiting battle be our guests. You people are so delusionally arrogant to think that top notch players from Florida and Texas are going to pass on going to Texas, Florida, Miami hell even Florida St to come to Ole Miss. You may stumble onto a Dexter McCluster every once in a while but you are mainly going to end up with busts like Jevan Snead.
In the meantime we will keep stacking up players like Anthony Dixon, Chad Bumphis, K.J. Wright, Cory Banks, Chris White, Fletcher Cox, Josh Boyd, Tyler Russell and our whole offensive line.
You think there are only 8 players a year from the state of Mississippi that are worth battling over? Are you that big of an idiot? Are you that out of touch?
If you Ole Miss people want to sacrifice the instate recruiting battle be our guests. You people are so delusionally arrogant to think that top notch players from Florida and Texas are going to pass on going to Texas, Florida, Miami hell even Florida St to come to Ole Miss. You may stumble onto a Dexter McCluster every once in a while but you are mainly going to end up with busts like Jevan Snead.
In the meantime we will keep stacking up players like Anthony Dixon, Chad Bumphis, K.J. Wright, Cory Banks, Chris White, Fletcher Cox, Josh Boyd, Tyler Russell and our whole offensive line.
All of these OM people point out how bad we've been this decade, but they never take into account we had tHE worst coach in college football HISTORY...
Nobody was suggesting that you could win with only in-state talent. Just that you should look in your own backyard before heading somewhere else. I've never recruited, but I can imagine it is easier to recruit from nearby rather than far away.
I agree with the fact that the Cellular South Gameplan, AKA Orgeron's "plan", has helped Mississippi recruiting. Mississippi does produce a good bit of talent. Problem is, it still only produces about half of what you see in Lousiana, about 1/3 of what you see in Georgia, and less than 1/4 of what you see in Florida. In terms of total quality prospects, the state of Mississippi really only ranks ahead of Arkansas, Tennessee, and Kentucky as far as SEC states are concerned.
The Gameplan will make it better, because more of the top talent will actually be eligible though, so we'll see how that changes things. The state still leaves gaps every year though, and you have to supplement a with out of state even if you do well in state. I like going 60-40 out of state, maybe 50-50, but you can win with 60-40 in state, maybe even 70-30 if you do really well with the top prospects in the state.
We went out of state a lot in this last class, and I think a good part of that was the fact that Croom had locked down so many of the in-state guys before he was fired and Mullen was able to hold them, so we went out of state out of necessity. Still, we managed to do well out of state last year with guys like DT Shackelford, Joel Kight, Rodney Scott, Jesse Grandy, Bobby Massie, and Tim Simon that all contributed this year. The plus with in-state talent is that you can sometimes use recruits to help you recruit others since they often have pre-existing relationships with each other, and you can build relationships with coaches and get pipelines going. I can't remember the recruit, but I believe one of this year's recruits is family friends with Shay Hodge's family, and we have that tie to help us out, as an example. Out of state recruiting sometimes takes a little bit of extra work to maintain a steady stream of talent, since you can't build pipelines as easily. The bottom line though is just get good players period. If we can land classes like our last one every year, I'll be happy regardless of where they come from. That's not going to be as easy to do consistently, but talent is talent.
The Gameplan will make it better, because more of the top talent will actually be eligible though, so we'll see how that changes things. The state still leaves gaps every year though, and you have to supplement a with out of state even if you do well in state. I like going 60-40 out of state, maybe 50-50, but you can win with 60-40 in state, maybe even 70-30 if you do really well with the top prospects in the state.
We went out of state a lot in this last class, and I think a good part of that was the fact that Croom had locked down so many of the in-state guys before he was fired and Mullen was able to hold them, so we went out of state out of necessity. Still, we managed to do well out of state last year with guys like DT Shackelford, Joel Kight, Rodney Scott, Jesse Grandy, Bobby Massie, and Tim Simon that all contributed this year. The plus with in-state talent is that you can sometimes use recruits to help you recruit others since they often have pre-existing relationships with each other, and you can build relationships with coaches and get pipelines going. I can't remember the recruit, but I believe one of this year's recruits is family friends with Shay Hodge's family, and we have that tie to help us out, as an example. Out of state recruiting sometimes takes a little bit of extra work to maintain a steady stream of talent, since you can't build pipelines as easily. The bottom line though is just get good players period. If we can land classes like our last one every year, I'll be happy regardless of where they come from. That's not going to be as easy to do consistently, but talent is talent.
Shay Hodge, John Jerry, Marcus Tillman, Allen Walker, Jerrell Powe, Johnny Brown, Markeith Summers, Pat Patterson Bradley Sowell and whoever the %*%! else we have from Mississippi. I am in no way saying that the 2009 Ole Miss football team represents my theory at all. We have plented of Mississippi kids and we have wasted a lot of time recruiting guys you signed too. Ole Miss is not doing what I would do at all.
In 2009, 144 kids from Florida signed to play with a BCS conference school. 31 of those signed with Florida, FSU, or Miami. That's 113 kids in Florida that signed to play with a BCS school that didn't go to one of the three big Florida schools. So your point about having to battle the big three for all those kids is stupid. I don't know the numbers for Texas because I haven't seen a Rivals article about it, but I bet the numbers are similar. Florida and Texas are not Louisiana and Alabama.
I think there are 10-15 prospects in state worth signing every year. Go back and do the research on the last ten seasons. It's been done before. 15 is about as many as you will see.
Despite the fact that you beat us, you still went 5-7 this season. You aren't going to a bowl and you aren't a championship team. So brag about your players and your team all you want, but the 2009 Mississippi State Bulldogs do nothing to disprove my theory.
In 2009, 144 kids from Florida signed to play with a BCS conference school. 31 of those signed with Florida, FSU, or Miami. That's 113 kids in Florida that signed to play with a BCS school that didn't go to one of the three big Florida schools. So your point about having to battle the big three for all those kids is stupid. I don't know the numbers for Texas because I haven't seen a Rivals article about it, but I bet the numbers are similar. Florida and Texas are not Louisiana and Alabama.
I think there are 10-15 prospects in state worth signing every year. Go back and do the research on the last ten seasons. It's been done before. 15 is about as many as you will see.
Despite the fact that you beat us, you still went 5-7 this season. You aren't going to a bowl and you aren't a championship team. So brag about your players and your team all you want, but the 2009 Mississippi State Bulldogs do nothing to disprove my theory.
bonedaddy401 said:
I think you are misunderstanding. We signed 8 or 9 players from Florida last year. I don't believe we beat out Miami, FSU, or Florida for any of them, but we still signed some pretty good players. In states like Texas, Georgia, and Florida, there are great players available that don't get offers from the biggest in state programs, and they aren't exactly diamonds in the rough. The guys we signed from Florida this past year pretty much all had multiple BCS offers. The big programs just didn't have enough room.
with a MS running back and 5 MS offensive linemen.
I know its a broken record by now, but we would be bowling if we had played Tulane/Memphis/UAB/La Tech instead of GT and Houston.
Im not taking a shot at OM's OOC schedule, Im just stating the facts b/c its not accurate to claim our 5-7 record shows that we weren't good or that MS kids are a bad thing.
I know its a broken record by now, but we would be bowling if we had played Tulane/Memphis/UAB/La Tech instead of GT and Houston.
Im not taking a shot at OM's OOC schedule, Im just stating the facts b/c its not accurate to claim our 5-7 record shows that we weren't good or that MS kids are a bad thing.
Riiiighht. Beep beep beep......
as long as you pass on Mississippi players in favor of table scraps from Florida, Texas and other larger states you will continue to regress as a program and under achieve.
Yea we went 5 - 7 but guess what? Yall were ranked #4 in the country and then proceeded to **** the bed. I feel a helluva lot better about our season than the vast majority of your fanbase feels about yours. We went 5-7 with the hardest schedule in the country and a 5'9 walk on QB and yall went 4-4 in the SEC with a QB who was supposed to be the overall No. 1 pick in the draft next year. You do the math.
Not to mention that our outlook for next season is a lot better than yalls is. Why is that? Because we successfully recruited the best talent this state had to offer while yall went out of state and didn't get YOUNG talent like T. Russell, Chad Bumpis, Fletcher Cox, ect ect.....
BTW keep bragging about Bradley Sowell he is a bad ***.
as long as you pass on Mississippi players in favor of table scraps from Florida, Texas and other larger states you will continue to regress as a program and under achieve.
Yea we went 5 - 7 but guess what? Yall were ranked #4 in the country and then proceeded to **** the bed. I feel a helluva lot better about our season than the vast majority of your fanbase feels about yours. We went 5-7 with the hardest schedule in the country and a 5'9 walk on QB and yall went 4-4 in the SEC with a QB who was supposed to be the overall No. 1 pick in the draft next year. You do the math.
Not to mention that our outlook for next season is a lot better than yalls is. Why is that? Because we successfully recruited the best talent this state had to offer while yall went out of state and didn't get YOUNG talent like T. Russell, Chad Bumpis, Fletcher Cox, ect ect.....
BTW keep bragging about Bradley Sowell he is a bad ***.
Yes, there may be 113 BCS players from Florida that don't sign with UF, FSU or Miami. But you're going to have to fight 40-50 other BCS schools (including us - just because you think we focus too much on Mississippi doesn't mean we won't go into Florida to sign a player like Pernell McFee) to sign those recruits. Good luck signing 5-6 of those players who will be good enough to make a difference on the field for you. I'll take our 5-6 Mississippi recruit advantage over you that you mentioned in your earlier post, and then we'll see if you can sign 5 more good players from Florida than we will.
...which includes Alabama, Louisiana, Tennessee, and Arkansas, as well as Mississippi. Of course, getting the best Mississippi players is a major part of that, but Mullen never said he was only going to recruit in Mississippi. And it's obvious by his signees and current prospects that his is going out of state for players.
But he's not backing up. In his initial post, he said there were 10-15 prospects each year, but several would go to this school or that school no matter what (the "grew up a state fan" thing, I guess) leaving 8-10 to fight for.
the same way no rational MSU fan thinks it can sign 25 MS players and be competitive in the SEC year in and year out. I have been saying for years that MSU has an advantage in-state for a few reasons, but one of the bigger reasons is that they have more alumni coaching high school football, and Juco football and those relationships pay huge dividends. So far this year MSU and Ole Miss are going heads up for more players than usual. You've got Wells, Thompson, Sanders, Johnson, Eulls, Martin, Bennett, Coleman, Robinson, all in-state players that have more than in-state offers and all have interest in both MSU and Ole Miss. Now if MSU swept all of those guys, that would be a great class for MSU, not a top 10 class, but certainly a top 20 class, which is a great class for OM or MSU. I just don't see either school sweeping this list. I would expect at least one of these guys to go out of state, and at least 2 of these guys to sign with OM. At the end of the day, Mullen proved that recruiting is overrated. Coaching is underrated. MSU's OL has one highly recruited player in Sherrod and it played well this season.
"Most seasons there are only 10-15 in-state players who can play in the SEC. Only about 8-10 of those guys are going to come in and give you a big boost." From my first post. Shay Hodge falls into the 8-10, Markeith Summers in the 10-15. Both are worth signing, but they are not the same type of player.
You feel better about going 5-7 and sitting at home than you would about going 8-4 and going to a New Years Day Bowl? Niiiice.
Your outlook isn't any better than ours. You are losing your best player, you have a difficult schedule, and you still have no QB. Sure you may sign Cam Newton, but he isn't proven. Russell hasn't played a down.
By the way, where is your evidence to show me that Tyler Russell is better than Raymond Cotton? Is Bumphis better than Pat Patterson? He got more playing time this season, but you guys didn't have Hodge and McCluster on your team either. You act like we didn't sign a recruiting class that was ranked higher than you on both services last season. In fact, the last time either service thought you had a better class than us was 2003. You act like Bruiser and DiamondReb are stepping up to take the place of some of our departing seniors. We didn't meet our expectations this seasons, but we are still going to a New Years Day bowl.
As for Sowell, he played well down the stretch. He sucked it up early on, but by the end of the season, he was a solid O-lineman.
You feel better about going 5-7 and sitting at home than you would about going 8-4 and going to a New Years Day Bowl? Niiiice.
Your outlook isn't any better than ours. You are losing your best player, you have a difficult schedule, and you still have no QB. Sure you may sign Cam Newton, but he isn't proven. Russell hasn't played a down.
By the way, where is your evidence to show me that Tyler Russell is better than Raymond Cotton? Is Bumphis better than Pat Patterson? He got more playing time this season, but you guys didn't have Hodge and McCluster on your team either. You act like we didn't sign a recruiting class that was ranked higher than you on both services last season. In fact, the last time either service thought you had a better class than us was 2003. You act like Bruiser and DiamondReb are stepping up to take the place of some of our departing seniors. We didn't meet our expectations this seasons, but we are still going to a New Years Day bowl.
As for Sowell, he played well down the stretch. He sucked it up early on, but by the end of the season, he was a solid O-lineman.
I would identify the kids early on that wanted to be at my school, get them in the fold, and then move my interest out of state. I'm not saying you take no Mississippi kids approach, I just don't think that you get out what you put into recruiting in Mississippi. Go look at the Mississippi top 10 prospects. Three out of the top 10 are committed (and Shun Coleman isn't solid). All of these guys are going to waver and stretch both of our staffs for the next two months. Almost all of these kids know where they are going to go. Maybe one or two don't, but most do. They are just having fun with the process. Both of our staffs are going to bust *** to try and sign these kids and we are going to get three to five guys out of it. It happens every year.
In Alabama, nine of the top ten are committed. The schools identify who wants to be there early, recruit those kids, and move out of state. LSU does it too, although for them, it is much easier. If both schools would take this attitude, maybe we could eliminate the yearly craziness that comes from in-state recruiting.
In Alabama, nine of the top ten are committed. The schools identify who wants to be there early, recruit those kids, and move out of state. LSU does it too, although for them, it is much easier. If both schools would take this attitude, maybe we could eliminate the yearly craziness that comes from in-state recruiting.
I'm surprised he hasn't spent more time in Florida. I'm sure he has some connections in Florida after working with Meyer, and I'd bet Meyer would even help put in a good word with coaches for prospects that Florida doesn't have room to take.
Florida is loaded with talent, and it would make sense for him to go there and try to scrap out a good bit of his out of state talent there. He may do that in the future. I've just been surprised with how little time he's spent in Florida so far.
Florida is loaded with talent, and it would make sense for him to go there and try to scrap out a good bit of his out of state talent there. He may do that in the future. I've just been surprised with how little time he's spent in Florida so far.
it will be fun watching your fan base implode again.
Don't act like you are happy with the way this season has gone. I though yall were going to Atlanta this year? I thought Snead was going to New York for the Heisman?
Yea yall are going to a New Years bowl. Enjoy it. It will be the last one "O" the coach's recruits can get yall to. I will give yall credit for one thing, great schedule, a group of opponents like that and Charlie Weis would still have a job.
Don't act like you are happy with the way this season has gone. I though yall were going to Atlanta this year? I thought Snead was going to New York for the Heisman?
Yea yall are going to a New Years bowl. Enjoy it. It will be the last one "O" the coach's recruits can get yall to. I will give yall credit for one thing, great schedule, a group of opponents like that and Charlie Weis would still have a job.
Every team in the SEC could have gone at least 7-5 with your schedule except for Vandy. Ole Miss did nothing special this year. And to answer your question....yes I feel better about my team than most Ole Miss fans feel about theirs right now based off of what the expectations were at the start.
Now I don't follow recruiting and generally just don't care too much about it, but I find it VERY hard to believe that the return on investment for recruiting out of state is higher than it would be by recruiting in state based solely on the fact that in-state schools have a built in advantage that the out-of-state ones don't. So I'm calling ******** on that one.
Also, I'm not getting into the whole 8-4 vs. 5-7 debate, but it basically boils down to this: 5-7 is about right at or maybe a little better than most State fans expected going into this year whereas 8-4 is a good bit worse than most Ole Miss fans expected going into the year. If you can't understand that that is the reason State fans are excited then you're dumb, and if you can honestly tell me that, while Ole Miss had a successful season, it wasn't a clear let down and disappointment then you are equally as dumb.
Most MSU fans aren't excited about a 5-7 season, we're excited to see the visible improvement in our team and for the first time in 9 years we have legitimate reason to be optimistic about the coming season. I can guarantee you that virtually all MSU fans would be bitterly disappointed (and very surprised) if we go 5-7 next year.
bonedaddy401 said:
The highlighted statement is the type that gets to me because of how completely uninformed it is. I don't know where the mantra started, but for whatever reason, people seem to have taken on the mantra that Nutt can't win with his own players.
Starting with Year 4 at Arkansas, looking at his final 7 years at Arkansas, Nutt took his team to 5 bowl bids (3 of them NYD bowls), 2 SEC West titles, and 4 seasons of 8 wins or more. I start with Year 4, because that's when I consider a team's results to be primarily the responsibility of the current coach's recruiting. The "once O's players are gone" line is garbage. And if you're a recruiting rankings junkie, Nutt has recruited just as well as Orgeron did in his first two years, if not better when you factor in attrition.
And yes, whether it's in state of out of state players, I'll take our most recent recruiting class every year. We addressed needs and landed what I feel like are some very quality players based on early returns.
Was I happy with the result of the season? No. But when I look back at it and realize what we actually had in comparison to what I hoped we had, it's not so disappointing. We were preseason No. 8 and No. 10 in the two polls based on the assumption that our OL would be able to back fill for 3 lost starters, the assumption that we'd have a receiver that could take up Mike Wallace's slack, and the assumption that Snead really was a first round talent at QB. All of those assumptions were incorrect. We were a flawed team this year, and our losses from last year's team were more important many expected. I fully expect if we stay on this path with our recruiting that we'll have a better team 3 years from now than we had this year.
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