I need advice on where to buy a gun or three.

[BlueRaider22]

I looked at a S & W 9mm shield EZ for about an hour today but couldn’t make myself spend 460.00 for it. I went online and found a 9mm shield 2.0 for 419.00. It’s got a red laser on it. I don’t know if the laser will be useful or not. I guess I will find out. My wife and I are planning on getting some training from Bud’s before we begin shooting. I also have a bid in on a S & W sport 15. I’m sure I will be out bid. The only ones I can find for sale are about 1000 dollars. I’m a bit overwhelmed but I’m trying to figure it out. Thanks for all the insight.

Man oh man are they gouging.....but the way things are I understand you have to do what you gotta do. But if you get outbid on the AR, I’d drop it.......just focus on the pistols for the time being. In a yr or two, prices and options will get much better.....then you can get an AR or PCC, whatever. Besides like anything in life, as you get into a hobby or activity you start to develop personal preferences. You start going to the pistol range regularly and before you know it you’ll be renting all kinds of stuff.....who knows what you’ll start to favor.

Post a picture of the pistol when you can. I’d like to know more about the laser. Some are grip mounted......some attach to the pictinny rail section up front. Some people love lasers while some could take or leave them. It might be great for you.


Great to hear about the classes. Be sure to get some ear and eye protection before you go.



On a side note, I don’t know much about female concealed carry options. Certainly they can carry the same way we do, but they do have some really cool purse or bra options......but unfortunately I don’t have much experience with any of it. My wife is a little resistant to carry since I’m always with her.

 

[mashburned]

Oldblue, here’s a MP Sport for $700...

https://www.smga.com/smith-and-wesson/mp15-sport-ii-556nato-69

I just found this on gundeals.com

 

[Oldblueone]

Oldblue, here’s a MP Sport for $700...

https://www.smga.com/smith-and-wesson/mp15-sport-ii-556nato-69

I just found this on gundeals.com

Thanks Mashburned. I ordered it. No tax and no shipping charge.

 

[mashburned]

No problem. I’ve used them before, very easy to work with when I had a question about a gun.

I think 700 is a fair price during these times.

Now getting ammo for it is another story! Another place to keep an eye on is reddit/r/gundeals. Any available ammo that pops up will be posted there, and gone shortly after.

 

[BlueRaider22]

No problem. I’ve used them before, very easy to work with when I had a question about a gun.

I think 700 is a fair price during these times.

Now getting ammo for it is another story! Another place to keep an eye on is reddit/r/gundeals. Any available ammo that pops up will be posted there, and gone shortly after.

I’ve ordered from sgammo in the past. They seem to still have ammo, but orders are delayed in shipping.

https://www.sgammo.com/catalog/rifle-ammo-sale/223-556mm-ammo

 

[Bill Withers]

With the lack of choices, I'd probably lean toward a revolver. And you can still find that ammo. Especially for new shooters, less to go wrong. I was at the gun store last night, and they didn't have much left.

 

[magic8ball]

My ultra light carry gun is a SW 638 revolver in .38. I love that little thing. Taurus has come a long way. Their quality control used to be hit/miss, but they’ve gotten much better. They have the G2C (I might be off on the model) which a lot of people swear by.

But, yes, your revolver is a great “first” gun......hehe......

I have a SW 637.

They are great for conceal carry.

 

[BlueRaider22]

I have a SW 637.

They are great for conceal carry.

It’s easily the smallest, lightest one I own. I wish it was a .357, but it’s not like the .38 isn’t capable. My brother Has the Ruger LCR......that’s a nice one as well.

 

[Hank Camacho]

Anyone got a lead on online ammo sales that are even remotely reasonable in price for common calibers?

 

[mashburned]

You have to watch Basspro.com like a hawk. They have Herters pistol ammo in stock almost every day for about 30minutes or so. 20cpr for 9mm.

I caught a case yesterday by dumb luck by checking reddit/gundeals at the right time... https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/


Or try checking ammoseek.com

 

[mashburned]

Winchester 9mm - 25cpr

https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/winchester-usa-handgun-ammo-bulk-pack?irclickid=XujSh03KrxyOWZT05-R4sULoUkiWopxF3z7qT80&irgwc=1&hvarAID=impact&source=aff

Blazer 40 - 34cpr

https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/bla...opWx3z7qT80&irgwc=1&hvarAID=impact&source=aff

 

[Oldblueone]

I ended up buying a S&W 380 with the ez slide for my wife and a S&W 9mm shield for myself. I also picked up the S&W AR 15 Sport. We haven’t fired the guns yet and haven’t been able to set up any training. Hopefully we will get that scheduled soon. I search online every night for 9mm and 380 bulk ammunition but haven’t had any luck finding any. Any suggestions on where I can find any bulk ammo of 500 to 1000 rounds? We are going to need a lot of practice. When I search for 5.56 ammo, 223 always comes up. Are these interchangeable?

 

[mashburned]

You can shoot .223 in your rifle because it has a 5.56 chamber. You can verify that by the stamp on the barrel between the hand guard and muzzle. It should say 5.56 on it. Your manual should also explain this.

You shouldn’t shoot 5.56 in a .223 chamber. They’re slightly different, 5.56 has higher pressure, and more velocity.

In terms of finding ammo, just check those links I posted for Hank. It’s brutal. If you happen to stumble upon 9mm for .20-30 cents a round, get all you can since you have little to none, and prices won’t go down anytime soon. Rifle ammo looks to be .40cpr at the low end.

Happy hunting. Don’t shoot your dick off.

 

[magic8ball]

Happy hunting. Don’t shoot your dick off.

Well, mine is so small that if I hit it I'd be a deadeye sniper...

 

[BlueRaider22]

You can shoot .223 in your rifle because it has a 5.56 chamber. You can verify that by the stamp on the barrel between the hand guard and muzzle. It should say 5.56 on it. Your manual should also explain this.

You shouldn’t shoot 5.56 in a .223 chamber. They’re slightly different, 5.56 has higher pressure, and more velocity.

In terms of finding ammo, just check those links I posted for Hank. It’s brutal. If you happen to stumble upon 9mm for .20-30 cents a round, get all you can since you have little to none, and prices won’t go down anytime soon. Rifle ammo looks to be .40cpr at the low end.

Happy hunting. Don’t shoot your dick off.

Mashburned nailed it. 5.56 chamber can shoot .223........but it’s not advised the other way around.

Also, 9mm and .380 shoot the same projectile.......except .380 is shorter with less power. Be cautious not to mix up these on your pistols. Your 9mm pistol might be able magazine a .380......might chamber it.....and might fire it......but I don’t think it would cycle the slide. I doubt there would be catastrophic failure this way. However, if you “could” get a 9mm round in your wife’s .380......it “could” be bad.....like blow up in your hands bad. Maybe her pistol could take the pressures......but maybe not. Just keep the ammo separate.

You might have different magazines as well. I’m not sure. Might want to check on that. If so, you might want to label them with a marker or something.

Ammo and reliability...... Guns often have a bit of a break in period.......usually a few hundred rounds before the springs and trigger loosen up a little. Also, some firearms are picky with ammo. Accuracy and/or reliability may suffer as a result. Try different ammo......stick with what works. Technique with pistols can lead to reliability problems as well....especially for beginners.

I like SGAmmo out of Oklahoma for bulk.

 

[Hank Camacho]

https://www.luckygunner.com/rifle/223-remington-ammo

Lucky Gunner currently has 1000 rounds of steel case Tula 223 going for $420. Under normal circumstances, that's a crappy deal.

But if I just bought an AR and needed training ammo, I'd buy two cases and thank my lucky stars.

I can't find 9mm in bulk anywhere.

 

[mashburned]

Buy a bunch of these two, Oldblue.

https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/Federal-American-Eagle-Centerfire-Rifle-Ammo

Federal .223 boxes available for .45cpr + tax. Not good, not awful.

Same for 5.56.

https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/federal-lake-city-556mm-centerfire-rifle-ammo

 

[mashburned]

Also, get some magazines. These prices haven’t increased, but they will.

https://gunmagwarehouse.com/pmag-ge...r-15-223-5-56-30-round-mag571-all-colors.html

 

[Oldblueone]

Mashburned nailed it. 5.56 chamber can shoot .223........but it’s not advised the other way around.

Also, 9mm and .380 shoot the same projectile.......except .380 is shorter with less power. Be cautious not to mix up these on your pistols. Your 9mm pistol might be able magazine a .380......might chamber it.....and might fire it......but I don’t think it would cycle the slide. I doubt there would be catastrophic failure this way. However, if you “could” get a 9mm round in your wife’s .380......it “could” be bad.....like blow up in your hands bad. Maybe her pistol could take the pressures......but maybe not. Just keep the ammo separate.

You might have different magazines as well. I’m not sure. Might want to check on that. If so, you might want to label them with a marker or something.

Ammo and reliability...... Guns often have a bit of a break in period.......usually a few hundred rounds before the springs and trigger loosen up a little. Also, some firearms are picky with ammo. Accuracy and/or reliability may suffer as a result. Try different ammo......stick with what works. Technique with pistols can lead to reliability problems as well....especially for beginners.

I like SGAmmo out of Oklahoma for bulk.

Thanks for the tips on the ammo. I already wish I had gotten my wife a 9 mm also. Wouldn’t have to worry about getting the ammo mixed up.

 

[Oldblueone]

Also, get some magazines. These prices haven’t increased, but they will.

https://gunmagwarehouse.com/pmag-ge...r-15-223-5-56-30-round-mag571-all-colors.html

I found it. Ordered 10. Thanks

 

[BlueRaider22]

I found it. Ordered 10. Thanks

That's a good price.....and a good buy......Magpul Pmags are one of the gold standards for AR's.

You might also want to look into magazines for the pistols as well. They might have some cool options for the pistols. For example, higher capacity magazines. Understand that not all magazines are supremely reliable.




Also, about buying ammo in bulk.

If we weren't going through a crazy year, I would tell you to first go buy a small box or two of a particular ammo......try it......then choose whether or not you want to buy bulk.


For instance, Handshaker above mentioned TulaAmmo. Tula is normally a dirt cheap range-type ammo. Some AR's will have trouble running it reliably. Usually the higher end ARs or brands, will run darn near anything. Some of the cheaper AR's or brands are finicky. So, under a normal year I would purchase a couple of small boxes of it to test it before I bought bulk. NOTE that this does not mean that the ammo is bad and you should avoid it. I have ran Tula (at the range) on many occasion because I know my AR's run it well. But like Handshaker said, if you know you can run it and it's all you can find in the middle of this crazy social mess......buy it and be thankful. The genius of brands like Tula is that if you're gear can run it reliably, you might be able to practice with 1,000 rounds.......for the price of 500-700 rds of other brands. In essence more practice.

For further discussion, Mashburned mentioned Federal ammo. In general, Federal is a really good brand for ammo. The American Eagle line is more of their cheaper stuff, but the company in general has some higher standards than some other brands. Soooo, without knowing for certain I would wager a very small amount of money that most AR's would be more reliable running Federal Am/Eag than Tula.





These same principles of ammo apply to your pistols as well.

 

[BlueRaider22]

Since, you're wife is allowing you to spend money......

......what kind of sights do you have for the AR? You might want to look into getting a nice red dot.

 

[KopiKat]

You can shoot .223 in your rifle because it has a 5.56 chamber. You can verify that by the stamp on the barrel between the hand guard and muzzle. It should say 5.56 on it. Your manual should also explain this.

You shouldn’t shoot 5.56 in a .223 chamber. They’re slightly different, 5.56 has higher pressure, and more velocity.

All of the above is generally true. Probably near 100% of the time. But there are caveats to almost everything, even among the most rigorously standardized industries. Anyway, there are in existence some imports, intentionally machined to 5.56 chambering configurations, will therefore allow for the safe chambering and firing of either 5.56 or .223, but are only stamped .223. No explanation may be available in any documents / user manual associated with the firearm. Knowledge of such things may come from what we all ubiquitously know as "reliable sources". But the reason for this is simple. I only know the condensed, layman version. 5.56 is not considered a "sporting" cartridge and this disallows 5.56 marked firearms from being imported to the US. So they mark them only for .223, which is a "sporting" cartridge. Some high quality items out there fitting this category.

Then there are examples like CZ (my favorite firearm producer), who offers their beautiful model 527 in commercial .223 chambering (stamped .223) but have publicly stated that because their configuration is to CIP specification and not SAAMI that the pressures are just fine for shooting ANY type of 5.56 (lake city brass, cheap *** wolf - avoid the corrosive primers). I have a 527 in 7.62x39. Let me just close by saying everyone needs one of these sweet little bolt actions. I want another for .204 ruger. There's some more caveats out there to the whole .223 / 5.56 thing. That's enough though.

 

[BlueRaider22]

.

Complete side question. Do you have much experience or own a CZ457.......the .22lr?

I'm looking to get my daughter her first gun. I started on .22 just like most people. I was wanting to start her on something that is a nice starter......but also a bit of a showpiece that she can look back on 30+ years later and talk about how beautiful it is.

I am really looking at the CZ457 Lux......such a beautiful rifle.


https://cz-usa.com/product/cz-457-lux/

 

[KopiKat]

Complete side question. Do you have much experience or own a CZ457.......the .22lr?

I'm looking to get my daughter her first gun. I started on .22 just like most people. I was wanting to start her on something that is a nice starter......but also a bit of a showpiece that she can look back on 30+ years later and talk about how beautiful it is.

I am really looking at the CZ457 Lux......such a beautiful rifle.


https://cz-usa.com/product/cz-457-lux/

Complete side question. Do you have much experience or own a CZ457.......the .22lr?

I'm looking to get my daughter her first gun. I started on .22 just like most people. I was wanting to start her on something that is a nice starter......but also a bit of a showpiece that she can look back on 30+ years later and talk about how beautiful it is.

I am really looking at the CZ457 Lux......such a beautiful rifle.


https://cz-usa.com/product/cz-457-lux/

First off, the lux designs from CZ are indeed gorgeous. Lines on them are as easy to look at as any commercial firearm I know of. Their Turkish walnut is really nice. I saw one on a 457 at Whittaker's a few weeks ago that was so beautiful I almost bought it for the wood alone. But no, I do not have personal experience with the 457. I do, however, have models 452 in. .22 and a .17 hmr with bull barrel. The only thing I know for certain changed from the 452 to the 457 is the trigger system. My 452 trigger is outstanding, but not the incredible "set trigger" system of the 527. Otherwise, the 452 is outstanding. The 457 can't possibly be any less.

The only thing I caution people about with CZ bolt actions is clearance. The could be some interference or narrow spacing between your scope and bolt handle knob. The spacing on my 452s is small but I'm used to it. Older 527s would require some of the bolt handle knob to be machined off. So you might shop for a used 527 and see a bolt handle knob that looks like it has had a small bite taken out of it. If it's in .223 it may have been mine and I wish I had never traded it. Newer 527s are not supposed to have this issue. Not as frequently at least, depending on optic / mounting.

 

[Punkin Puss]

My pap's Winchester Model 60 will take any of you on plinking.

 

[BlueRaider22]

First off, the lux designs from CZ are indeed gorgeous. Lines on them are as easy to look at as any commercial firearm I know of. Their Turkish walnut is really nice. I saw one on a 457 at Whittaker's a few weeks ago that was so beautiful I almost bought it for the wood alone. But no, I do not have personal experience with the 457. I do, however, have models 452 in. .22 and a .17 hmr with bull barrel. The only thing I know for certain changed from the 452 to the 457 is the trigger system. My 452 trigger is outstanding, but not the incredible "set trigger" system of the 527. Otherwise, the 452 is outstanding. The 457 can't possibly be any less.

The only thing I caution people about with CZ bolt actions is clearance. The could be some interference or narrow spacing between your scope and bolt handle knob. The spacing on my 452s is small but I'm used to it. Older 527s would require some of the bolt handle knob to be machined off. So you might shop for a used 527 and see a bolt handle knob that looks like it has had a small bite taken out of it. If it's in .223 it may have been mine and I wish I had never traded it. Newer 527s are not supposed to have this issue. Not as frequently at least, depending on optic / mounting.

Outstanding, thx.

I want to start her on bolt action with iron sights so the clearance shouldn’t be an issue. Once she develops the basics, I’ll transition her to something quicker and more fun......semi-auto, red dots, scopes, etc.

 

[BlueRaider22]

My pap's Winchester Model 60 will take any of you on plinking.

Lol. It just might.

My first gun was a Western-Field .22.......which was basically a Marlin Model 60 clone. Still shoots very well though I don’t shoot it as often. The ones i shoot mainly are my Ruger 10/22’s.

One is a takedown model with a cheap red dot and large capacity magazines......and a Maglite......you know......so, I can, ummmmmmmm see in the dark.....yeah that’s it.....*wink, wink*. If I believed in a Zombie gun, this would be it.

The second is a 10/22T with a decent 3-9x scope. I love this thing....but it’s fairly heavy. It can put every round through a quarter at 100 yds with bulk factory Winchester ammo. There certainly are custom builds (Volquartsen, etc) that are more accurate, but this one outshoots me just fine. Plus, I’m getting to the age when my skills are declining.....lol.

 

[KopiKat]

Lol. It just might.

My first gun was a Western-Field .22.......which was basically a Marlin Model 60 clone. Still shoots very well though I don’t shoot it as often. The ones i shoot mainly are my Ruger 10/22’s.

One is a takedown model with a cheap red dot and large capacity magazines......and a Maglite......you know......so, I can, ummmmmmmm see in the dark.....yeah that’s it.....*wink, wink*. If I believed in a Zombie gun, this would be it.

The second is a 10/22T with a decent 3-9x scope. I love this thing....but it’s fairly heavy. It can put every round through a quarter at 100 yds with bulk factory Winchester ammo. There certainly are custom builds (Volquartsen, etc) that are more accurate, but this one outshoots me just fine. Plus, I’m getting to the age when my skills are declining.....lol.

A man cannot have too many .22 rifles. It really is not possible.

 

[H. Lecter]

Lol. It just might.

My first gun was a Western-Field .22.......which was basically a Marlin Model 60 clone. Still shoots very well though I don’t shoot it as often. The ones i shoot mainly are my Ruger 10/22’s.

One is a takedown model with a cheap red dot and large capacity magazines......and a Maglite......you know......so, I can, ummmmmmmm see in the dark.....yeah that’s it.....*wink, wink*. If I believed in a Zombie gun, this would be it.

The second is a 10/22T with a decent 3-9x scope. I love this thing....but it’s fairly heavy. It can put every round through a quarter at 100 yds with bulk factory Winchester ammo. There certainly are custom builds (Volquartsen, etc) that are more accurate, but this one outshoots me just fine. Plus, I’m getting to the age when my skills are declining.....lol.

I’ve had my marlin .22 bolt action for about 40 years. Was bustin eggs at 50 yards with iron sights about 5 years ago but my eyes made me put a scope on it. By far my favorite gun, maybe because it was my first. Not a gun guru by any means but I got what I consider everything covered. While these might not be the best they all do their job. I kill groundhogs and squirrel with my .22. Deer and elk with savage .30-06. Turkey with an old Sears and Roebuck semi auto 12 gauge. Mossberg 12 gauge pump for home defense. Mossberg youth 20 gauge pump for wife’s home defense and kids turkey hunt. Glock .40 for personnel protection. And for ***** and giggles an old school dpms ar-15 with an m203 bayonet

 

[Punkin Puss]

Lol. It just might.

My first gun was a Western-Field .22.......which was basically a Marlin Model 60 clone. Still shoots very well though I don’t shoot it as often. The ones i shoot mainly are my Ruger 10/22’s.

One is a takedown model with a cheap red dot and large capacity magazines......and a Maglite......you know......so, I can, ummmmmmmm see in the dark.....yeah that’s it.....*wink, wink*. If I believed in a Zombie gun, this would be it.

The second is a 10/22T with a decent 3-9x scope. I love this thing....but it’s fairly heavy. It can put every round through a quarter at 100 yds with bulk factory Winchester ammo. There certainly are custom builds (Volquartsen, etc) that are more accurate, but this one outshoots me just fine. Plus, I’m getting to the age when my skills are declining.....lol.

I still plink with a Winchester 190, semiauto with the tube feed. Nice varmint gun.
Wish I bought up every pump action gallery gun I ever came across for a few hundred bucks.

I didn't know Henry had one out.

 

[BlueVelvetFog]

Because it needs to be said:

1. If you simply double-lock your doors with an effective deadbolt the chances that anyone ever breaks into your home are very small. Add an alarm system and if it ever happens, almost 100 percent of intruders will haul ***. Almost all azzholes breaking into houses like yours are teenagers or drug addicts who are easily discouraged. Professional crooks don’t want your junk.

2. Things more likely than you successfully shooting an intruder who aims to harm you: A. Your 14-year-old slips out of the house wearing a hoodie to drink some beer with friends. You hear someone breaking in and challenge him. In the confusion and inebriation he doesn’t respond quickly and you put two rounds in him. B. You can’t sleep so you slip down stairs and have a couple drinks. As you come back into the room, your wife wakes up in a fog, panics and shoots you. C. Your neighbor’s kid decides it would prove his courage to walk around someone’s house at night and comes in through an unlocked door. He freezes when you get the drop on him and to you he’s an armed desperado.

And no, I’m no liberal pansy. I’ve been hunting since I was ten. I’ve carried firearms in combat zones. I own hunting rifles and shotguns today. I just think this notion of winning some shootout with Ted Bundy in your living room is a fantasy. You are more likely to shoot a loved one, neighbor who wanders onto your property or yourself. In the very unlikely event someone does break into your house, lock your bedroom door and call 911. Then ratchet back the slide on a 12 gauge pump and shout, “I’m armed and the cops are coming.” Just make sure the 12 gauge isn’t loaded. You might shoot your daughters’ boyfriend.

By the way, not against owning guns. I have mostly shotguns these days along with a couple .22 rifles: an L.C. Smith double barrel, a Remington semi-automatic and an Ithaca Model 37 pump. All 12 gauge.

I have a friend who is (no joke) an international arms dealer. He’s a gun enthusiast and officianado. He told me literally the same thing you just wrote regarding owning a weapon for home defense.

It’s amazing how many people who buy firearms for the purpose of home defense overestimate their abilities to carry out this purpose successfully.

Now for hobby, carry, hunting, investment or collection? Absolutely.

 

[H. Lecter]

I love it when people like to tell others that they will probably never need a weapon for home defense so therefor why own one for that purpose. I hope I never need to use it but I’ve pulled my shotgun on someone on my property. That was enough so it served its purpose. I live in the woods. I’m not waiting on the cops and hope no one underestimated my ability to shoot them.

 

[MdWIldcat55]

I love it when people like to tell others that they will probably never need a weapon for home defense so therefor why own one for that purpose. I hope I never need to use it but I’ve pulled my shotgun on someone on my property. That was enough so it served its purpose. I live in the woods. I’m not waiting on the cops and hope no one underestimated my ability to shoot them.

just giving the other side of the debate, especially for someone with no deep knowledge of firearms. As I thought I’d made clear, not trying to take anyone’s guns away, and not giving up mine.

 

[Hank Camacho]

You're both right. That's the great thing about America -- individuals can weight their risks and rewards and decide accordingly.

If you do choose to have a firearm to defend yourself or your home -- YOU NEED GOOD TRAINING. Having a gun and not knowing what to do is, in a lot of cases, far more dangerous than not having one. But sometimes the mere presence of a gun is enough to solve a problem, too.

 

[BlueVelvetFog]

I love it when people like to tell others that they will probably never need a weapon for home defense so therefor why own one for that purpose. I hope I never need to use it but I’ve pulled my shotgun on someone on my property. That was enough so it served its purpose. I live in the woods. I’m not waiting on the cops and hope no one underestimated my ability to shoot them.

Yes..and you were likely fully awake and not stirring out of a deep slumber when you took action.

You don’t know how alert and cognizant you will be when you are startled out of sleep with seconds to act. If you are awakened and shoot an alleged intruder, the smart money is on it being a spouse, or a kid each time. Hell, there are mornings I wake up not knowing what day it is.

No one wants your guns, but let’s be real here. Solely for home defense is a terrible reason.

 

[H. Lecter]

Yes..and you were likely fully awake and not stirring out of a deep slumber when you took action.

You don’t know how alert and cognizant you will be when you are startled out of sleep with seconds to act. If you are awakened and shoot an alleged intruder, the smart money is on it being a spouse, or a kid each time. Hell, there are mornings I wake up not knowing what day it is.

No one wants your guns, but let’s be real here. Solely for home defense is a terrible reason.

I didn’t say you wanted my guns. As for a “terrible reason” that’s your opinion and I’m glad you’re allowed to have it. Thank a veteran.

 

[mashburned]

If you own a gun, I don’t believe you’re more likely to use it on your drunk daughter than you are a bad guy. That’s just my gut feeling. YMMV.

Frankly, I’m not sure what the argument is. Some people shouldn’t own guns because sh** could happen? Alright.

 

[BlueVelvetFog]

If you own a gun, I don’t believe you’re more likely to use it on your drunk daughter than you are a bad guy. That’s just my gut feeling. YMMV.

Frankly, I’m not sure what the argument is. Some people shouldn’t own guns because sh** could happen? Alright.

You definitely DON’T want it used on your kids....but if you’re startled and fire..chances are it will.

the last thing an intruder wants to see or hear—is another person. MdWildcats’s suggestion is awesome. If you’re awake and can do it, The sound of that double pump is hell on any intruder.

 

[berniecarbo]

Some people should not own a weapon because they are careless or stupid. I don't know how to enforce that without trampling on people's rights though. Where I live, I'm not prepared to wait till a policeman gets here and it might not be long before policemen don't want to respond. I suspect it's already that way in some places.