Agreed - he would be much better in a free-wheeling, fast break oriented offense that values speed and athleticism more than our system does (there aren't many 6'11" players with his speed and hops - that's worth a look and a serious attempt at development). He doesn't have to hit outside shots to make the NBA, but he does have to develop much better post moves, which I'm not sure he's capable of as finishing requires some sort of shot-making in close, which requires decent hand-eye coordination, which I'm just not sure he has enough of. I hope he proves me wrong.
Is Cliff hurt?
- Thread starter RUSCFORMERLYRULOU
- Start date
Every time this topic comes up multiple people point to Cliff dunking as proof he's not hurt
If you were at the Nebraska game and watching cliff at all observantly we wouldn’t be having this convo
Definitely. He’d have a lot more spacing in pro ball and he’d get lots of lob opportunities off to of big men helping on drives by guards.
Last edited:
You’ll see the limp up close then! Though I hope he’s feeling better Saturday.
I agree with this. There’s things that Cliff can do that are awesome, and he’s fun to watch when he’s playing above the rim.
But he doesn’t have any post moves that get him to the basket. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a drop step or an up and under from him, the only thing he ever really does is a jump hook. Even a simple pump fake could open up some space for him or get him to the foul line.
I’ll tell you why…because today’s top college players expect to be featured in NBA-style isolation sets and have the opportunity to show their skills to scouts on film and in person. And if coaches want top recruits, that’s the pact with the devil they have no choice but to make. It’s why Caleb shoots too much as well. So the **** shots these guys take are tolerated to keep guys like this coming in. A catch-22. High major coaches are just higher paid AAU coaches in the way that winning is secondary, behind player pampering. Coaches can only hope the team wins anyway. Coach restricts that, top players leave. Simple as that.
Last edited:
Will be right behind bench Saturday at 11am here! Will look closely for this supposed limp.
Nothing we do as a program is NBA-like at all. We grind it out defensively, we have horrible range, and we don’t space the floor lol.
That’s the point, Cliff will succeed in an NBA game more than he does here.
Guys are coming in to be a part of RU, and the NIL money. They aren’t coming in because they get to take dumb shots lol. We just have very few offensive weapons.
Your post suggests that the basketball program at Rutgers University may not resemble the style of play typically seen in the National Basketball Association (NBA), due to a focus on defensive play, lack of long-range shooting ability, and a lack of offensive spacing. You go on to argue that this style of play may not be attractive to recruits and that they may be more interested in coming to Rutgers for other reasons, such as opportunities to earn money through name, image, and likeness (NIL) agreements.
While it is true that Rutgers' style of play may not resemble the high-scoring, fast-paced style of the NBA, it is important to recognize that there are many different approaches to the game of basketball that can be successful at various levels. A strong defensive strategy can be an effective way to control the pace of the game, limit the scoring ability of opponents, and create opportunities for scoring on the offensive end. Similarly, a lack of long-range shooting ability can be compensated for by focusing on other aspects of the game, such as rebounding, interior scoring, and ball movement.
Furthermore, it is important to note that there are many factors that influence a player's decision to commit to a particular university or program, and these factors may vary from one individual to the next. While some players may be drawn to programs that emphasize a particular style of play or offensive strategy, others may be more interested in factors such as the quality of the coaching staff, the level of competition, the academic offerings of the university, and the opportunities for personal and professional growth.
In conclusion, while it is true that the basketball program at Rutgers University may not resemble the style of play typically seen in the NBA, it is important to recognize that there are many different approaches to the game of basketball that can be successful at various levels. Additionally, while some players may be more drawn to programs that emphasize a particular style of play, there are many other factors that can influence a player's decision to commit to a particular university or program.
Didn’t say program is NBA-like. Said top recruits and players expect frequent opportunities to be featured and score in NBA-like action/sets, and that coaches must oblige else lose top recruits and players. That’s why Cliff gets entry passes so much even though it’s obvious he will rarely convert. The top players are in charge, just like in the NBA.
Didn’t say program is NBA-like. Said top recruits and players expect frequent opportunities to be favored / featured and score in NBA-like action/sets. Coaches must oblige else the players they covet will go elsewhere. These are pro prospect showcases within games. Fact. Oskar gets yanked for going 0-2 while Cliff isn’t restricted from taking shots that seem to be aimed at the practice hoops behind the student section half the time. That is the high major college game. It’s not just about winnning. It’s both.
I think you’re agreeing with me.
Shelby was saying we’re getting guys that want to be featured in NBA like sets. I’m saying that doesn’t make sense because we aren’t running nba sets
I think that’s more of an issue of lack of options tbh.
Oskar gets yanked and Cliff has a long leash because the drop off after Cliff is that much.
Cliff has struggled from a FG perspective, but I think it’s a combination of us not using him well, in addition to us not having options.
Think about it. Let’s say Cliff is having an awful game. Who do you go to?
Cam is ice cold.
Paul is a facilitator.
Hyatt is inconsistent and not a pure scorer.
Caleb is a below average offensive player.
Seriously, who do you go to?
This team was great when the ball stayed hot and we found a high percentage shot. Or when we could press (with mag) and create easy buckets.
I’m very very worried about how this team is going to finish.
Not entirely, but enough to keep Cliff happy. There is nothing in his skill set to justify the pro action he gets. Pike is showcasing him, keeping him happy and hoping the team wins anyway. And this isn’t unique to Pike or Rutgers. It’s college basketball.
Not accurate. Is true we have no backup for Cliff but that doesn’t explain the garbage he tries. I used to ***** about Myles being utterly useless on offense. 4 on 5. But with the way Cliff is showcased, his value on offense isn’t much better. Dunks, yes. The total of everything else is not.
Cliff was limping noticeably at one point when coming onto the court after a timeout. So something was hurting in his lower body or back. But only the team have any idea what the limp was due to or how impactful it is to Cliff's performance.
That's not making excuses for anything. It's a simple observation.
If Cliff actually has an injury, then it's entirely possible that it's affecting his game. That's not an excuse. It's an objective reality. Maybe it is affecting him. Maybe it's not. No amount of fan theorizing can change it. It's weird what fans will argue so vociferously about when they have no possible way of knowing.
That's not making excuses for anything. It's a simple observation.
If Cliff actually has an injury, then it's entirely possible that it's affecting his game. That's not an excuse. It's an objective reality. Maybe it is affecting him. Maybe it's not. No amount of fan theorizing can change it. It's weird what fans will argue so vociferously about when they have no possible way of knowing.
No one in college basketball is doing anything pro, that's my point.
Watch that, specifically the end where JJ says college sets haven't changed since he was in school.
It's not even about backup at his position.
We don't have an offensive threat on the court right now.
It wasnt an issue earlier because it was all about D, now with no Mag we've dropped off in defense and buckets are harder to come by.
This has always been a 60-65 point team. It is still a 60-65 point team, but now we aren't holding teams to 50-60. We're giving up 70-80.
meh. Illinois was 69, so right there.
Indiana we gave up 66 so still above that magic number of 65
Players who perform with injuries get deserved accolades from coaches and players alike.
All teammates, trainers and coaches admire guys who go out and lay it on the line with an injury.
Things like that slip out on any team I’ve ever been on, unless we’re the only team in the country where a player can’t say, Cliff ain’t feeling his best but that man is a warrior… !
Correct. They can't run a break to save their lives . Just inexplicable
Is there a metric somewhere for fast break efficiency? We seem to convert at a low rate this year, especially since the calendar flipped to 2023.
I expect we'll eventually hear about it. Unless it's a really minor, fleeting thing.
I’ve noticed a lot of them are contested and altered from behind and no fouls are ever called
Someone on the staff needs to inform the team that it's ok for the player with the ball to pass it to the open man trailing the play