Is Russia considered our......

bornaneer

Senior
Jan 23, 2014
30,143
800
113
enemy? I understand that we had/have different political world views over the years but we were allies during WWII and I don't remember any direct combat actions against them. I thought with the fall of the communist regime that we have had a non adversarial relationship with them and yet I see several of our fellow board Patriots referring to them as our enemy.
 
Sep 6, 2013
27,594
120
0
 

op2

Senior
Mar 16, 2014
11,167
528
103
enemy? I understand that we had/have different political world views over the years but we were allies during WWII and I don't remember any direct combat actions against them. I thought with the fall of the communist regime that we have had a non adversarial relationship with them and yet I see several of our fellow board Patriots referring to them as our enemy.

Rip Van Bomaneer is in the house.

Russia has awful in WW II but we allied against them because we needed to beat the Nazis.

Then Russia was even more awful from 1945 to about 1992 when the USSR broke up.

Now Russia is less awful than before but still awful. They don't push worldwide Communism anymore but they are a repressive regime bent on expansion but quite as repressive as they used to be and not quite as bent on expansion as they used to be. So I guess that's an improvement of sorts.
 

D. Denzil Finney

Redshirt
May 29, 2001
9,391
14
0
enemy? I understand that we had/have different political world views over the years but we were allies during WWII and I don't remember any direct combat actions against them. I thought with the fall of the communist regime that we have had a non adversarial relationship with them and yet I see several of our fellow board Patriots referring to them as our enemy.

Georgie Patton had a pretty good handle on the Ruskies; The division of Berlin, the cold war, the Cuban Missle Crisis were all good reasons for not trusting them. What do you mean by fall of the Communist Regime? It is still there, alive and kicking. Ask Georgia and the Ukraine. Probably many do not feel the same but as for me I don't trust them.
 

bornaneer

Senior
Jan 23, 2014
30,143
800
113
Rip Van Bomaneer is in the house.

Russia has awful in WW II but we allied against them because we needed to beat the Nazis.

Then Russia was even more awful from 1945 to about 1992 when the USSR broke up.

Now Russia is less awful than before but still awful. They don't push worldwide Communism anymore but they are a repressive regime bent on expansion but quite as repressive as they used to be and not quite as bent on expansion as they used to be. So I guess that's an improvement of sorts.
Don't read something into the question that was not there. I NEVER made the suggestion that the USA and Russia were aligned in world view and political philosophy. Also, we allied with the USSR in WWII and not against them. And I also probably forgot more about USSR history,especially concerning WWII, than you ever knew.
 

bornaneer

Senior
Jan 23, 2014
30,143
800
113
Georgie Patton had a pretty good handle on the Ruskies; The division of Berlin, the cold war, the Cuban Missle Crisis were all good reasons for not trusting them. What do you mean by fall of the Communist Regime? It is still there, alive and kicking. Ask Georgia and the Ukraine. Probably many do not feel the same but as for me I don't trust them.
See my above reply to Op2. Nowhere did I say that we should trust them or not keep a leery eye on them. I simply asked if they are considered the enemy.
 

D. Denzil Finney

Redshirt
May 29, 2001
9,391
14
0
See my above reply to Op2. Nowhere did I say that we should trust them or not keep a leery eye on them. I simply asked if they are considered the enemy.

If I don't trust them, I don't consider them as a friend therefore they sre my enemy. That clear it up?
 

torontoeers

Freshman
Nov 20, 2010
13,452
71
0
They are dirtbags IMO bornaneer HERE ANYWAY ...always have been. Invade sovereign Ukraine to placate some transplanted Ruskies? Hey why not! Plenty of them around these parts...**** don't stink etc. And then there is their sense of fashion lol...man do they stick out like a pathetic thumb....F em!
 

dave

Senior
May 29, 2001
60,572
755
113
They are dirtbags IMO bornaneer HERE ANYWAY ...always have been. Invade sovereign Ukraine to placate some transplanted Ruskies? Hey why not! Plenty of them around these parts...**** don't stink etc. And then there is their sense of fashion lol...man do they stick out like a pathetic thumb....F em!
Crimea was more than just placating transplanted Ruskies. When it happened the left in America was ok with it since it was only Crimea. Apparently since trump agreed with them the flip flopped.
 

PriddyBoy

Junior
May 29, 2001
17,174
282
0
Invade sovereign Ukraine to placate some transplanted Ruskies? Hey why not!
Wasn't that initiated after "Reset?"
...**** don't stink etc.
People get used to the stink after standing in line for Butt Ribbon. We'll find out when Government is in charge of everything.

Excepting an occasional politician, the U.S. won't/can't officially say Russia is our enemy, but they are. They are an unspoken enemy we have to deal with for now.
 

torontoeers

Freshman
Nov 20, 2010
13,452
71
0
Crimea was more than just placating transplanted Ruskies. When it happened the left in America was ok with it since it was only Crimea. Apparently since trump agreed with them the flip flopped.
Oh I agree Dave...the WORLD did NOTHING including Obama...
 

torontoeers

Freshman
Nov 20, 2010
13,452
71
0
Wasn't that initiated after "Reset?"

People get used to the stink after standing in line for Butt Ribbon. We'll find out when Government is in charge of everything.

Excepting an occasional politician, the U.S. won't/can't officially say Russia is our enemy, but they are. They are an unspoken enemy we have to deal with for now.
They are dirtballs...agree? Disagree?
 

WVMade

Redshirt
Aug 23, 2016
1,221
0
0
From where I stand, Donnie's only (admitted) "enemies" are Americans who didn't vote for him. Same goes with his cult fans.
 

torontoeers

Freshman
Nov 20, 2010
13,452
71
0
No man. The 1980's called, they want their foreign policy back.

Who said that again?
Oh I know...and don't disagree...however NOW STILL...careful Donnie, we all know where this guy came from...and we all know how his masses will fall right in line lock step....Russian Nationalism is like Lucifer on steroids.
 

CAJUNEER_rivals

Redshirt
May 29, 2001
72,872
44
0
enemy? I understand that we had/have different political world views over the years but we were allies during WWII and I don't remember any direct combat actions against them. I thought with the fall of the communist regime that we have had a non adversarial relationship with them and yet I see several of our fellow board Patriots referring to them as our enemy.
Putin took the opportunity afforded by poor economic conditions to first quiesce the democratic movement of Russia and now control the process. His regime is brutal--jailing and killing opposition. He is a bully tactician--land-grabbing from neighboring countries. In order to give Russia a strong Middle East presence and his military real-world experience he drops bombs on civilian Syrian populations. We may not be at war with Russia but Putin is definitely our enemy.
 

MikeRafone

Freshman
Oct 5, 2011
4,238
53
0
Only since Putin openly said in 2006 that Russia's nuclear arsenal was the only way for the world to stop "US aggression", Born.

Bush's war in Iraq and the supposed pretexts that created it was a wake up call for Putin. He was sure we were heading after his buddy Assad, the head of the other Baathist regime next door, that had a operating chemical weapons program built for them by the Soviets decades before, next. That imperiled the then small Russian Naval facility on the Mediterranean Coast of Syria. It was and is their only true warm water refueling port in the Med with access to the Atlantic year round could go with Assad, which was intolerable to the Russians. Murmansk, the only other outlet to the Atlantic that is semi-open year round is above the Arctic Circle and often has to be kept open by nuclear power icebreakers, is woefully inadequate and was major hindrance during the even the glory days of Soviet Union. They've got Vladivostok, but that's next to North Korea.

What has been the centerpiece of Russia's foreign policy since the time of Peter The Great? Access to warm water ports. Control of the Bosporus, entrance to the Black Sea is key to that.. What's stopped them from trying that for nearly the past 70 years? Turkey's membership in NATO as Turkey sits on both sides of the straits. Throw in Greece, another longstanding NATO member with the Turks, and NATO owns the Aegean Sea and access to the Med from those straits What was the key to post WWII Soviet, and now Putin's foreign policy? Breaking NATO to accomplish that primary goal. The main powers in the West will absolutely go to war over a Russian push towards the Bosporus, NATO or no NATO.

What is Putin's stated personal goal for Russian foreign policy in his lifetime? To restore Russia as closely to it's Soviet borders and military status. That means goodbye to the Baltic States, all NATO members, the Ukraine, Belarus, Moldova, a chunk of Romania, all of the states in the Caucus region north of the Turkish border, and the Central Asian "Stans" except for Afghanistan, where they, the British before them and finally ourselves have awakened to the fact it's better to let the Afghans keep it.

The initial grab of Crimea? The port of Odessa which only sees mild icing in the winter. The current war in the Ukraine? To restore Russia's breadbasket and "Holy Kiev" home of the first Rus state and birthplace of the Russian Orthodox Church. These are issues with very deep roots.

Iran along with it's proxy Hezbollah have been working shoulder to shoulder with the Russians to prop up Bashar Assad, the Gas Man of Syria, in a civil war that has raged since late 2011. Without their interference that war would have likely been done in 2013, and Bashar on trial in the Hague. Instead Putin raised the specter of his nuclear arsenal when it looked as if the we were going to intervene, thus the war wages on. (I've never forgiven Obama for not calling his bluff on that one.) Bashar Assad, Putin's friend since since his days as a young KGB officer in Lebanon assisting Syria and allied forces there in the Lebanese Civil Wars, is sitting pretty in Damascus today with all the eggs in his basket.

Finally the Russians assisted the Iranians in starting up their nuke program in the 90's, destabilizing not only the Middle East but adding the possibility of another nuclear power cheek to jowl with both Pakistan and India in South Asia, a traditional tinder box. When did Russian assistance in that begin in earnest? When Putin took power. You see, the Straits of Hormuz have been a goal of the Russians since the time of the Czars, too. A permanent Russian naval base there would be disaster of epic proportions, giving the Russians control of not only their own oil and gas reserves, but that of the Gulf States and Iran, and a base of operations in the Indian Ocean. Who would control the tap on oil then?

This is a huge geopolitical moment and the current POTUS is woefully inept, lacking the mental toughness needed to do the job at hand, and very possibly too compromised by the role the Russians played in the election to have the sack to do anything about it.

Any other questions about "When did the Russians become the enemy?"

Don't underestimate Putin, he's a brilliant and totally ruthless autocrat. He had nearly thirty years of training before he reached the top of pile in an environment where the slightest mistake could cost you and your family their lives. He's not some Wall Street/corporate exec or real estate mogul that's had a cushy life, with the only great risk since adulthood being losing other people's money and missing out on dinner reservations.
 

MikeRafone

Freshman
Oct 5, 2011
4,238
53
0
As for combat expeditions against them, we fought the Red Army around the Murmansk region as part of an expeditionary force with our other WWI allies from roughly 1918 to 1920 in support of the White Army. The Soviets and now the Russians still remember it like it was yesterday.

That's thing about Russia it's always been prone to invasion, mainly from horsemen such as the Mongols who overran and controlled much of the country under various Khanates from the12th to the 16th century. (The Mongols kept the Crimea for another two centuries after that.) Since then they've been invaded by the Turks, both the Ottomans and alliances of Turkic speaking horsemen of the steppe, the Poles, the Swedes, the French under Napoleon, the Japanese in the early 20th century, and the Germans at least twice. They also lost wars to Finland most recently in the early 40's, and fought a protracted little noted border along the Yensei and Amur Rivers with the Chinese in the 1960's that cost both sides tens, if not hundreds of thousands of lives. (I'm sure I'm missing a few invasions) Russian paranoia of the outside world runs deep and for good reasons.
 
Last edited:
Dec 17, 2007
14,537
359
83
Don't read something into the question that was not there. I NEVER made the suggestion that the USA and Russia were aligned in world view and political philosophy. Also, we allied with the USSR in WWII and not against them. And I also probably forgot more about USSR history,especially concerning WWII, than you ever knew.
We allied with the then USSR because the Nazis invaded them and we held a common enemy, the Nazis. Not so much because we liked Stalin.
 

bornaneer

Senior
Jan 23, 2014
30,143
800
113
We allied with the then USSR because the Nazis invaded them and we held a common enemy, the Nazis. Not so much because we liked Stalin.
Agreed....we never liked them....and I have NEVER liked or trusted them. We did not formally recognize them until 1933. I just was trying to get a read on what the board considered them to be.
 
Last edited: