Let me get this straight - Strasburg is sitting...

[DAWG61]

Strasburg is good but "once in a generation" come on man! That's Mike Trout. I'm a Giants fan and they haven't shut down Cain, Lincecum or Bumgardner and they are pretty young too. They also won a World Series recently. The Nationals are complete idiots for shutting Strasburg down and they probably won't make the playoffs for another 15 years because thats how fate/karma works. Ask the Pirates if they'd shut down their best pitcher this year? They haven't made the playoffs in like 20 years. I could see this argument if they were the Yankees and make the playoffs routinely and have tons of WS trophies but the Nationals/Expos have NEVER made the playoffs before and they are acting like it's just a foregone conclusion that they will be making the playoffs every year from here on. The Nats are taking their position for granted and will get 17ed for it. Either Strasburg will tear his arm up the year he signs a 120+million contract with them or they will just start sucking next year. I sense a curse coming the Nats way real soon.

 

[patdog]

So what if he loses a few innings in April next year? Basically, he'd miss a couple of weeks of the season at most and then he'd have another couple of weeks ramping his innings per start up. That's a small price to pay for giving yourself your best chance at a World Series title. What crystal ball do you think they would have needed? If you don't make the playoffs, then you have him available for the start of spring training, but at least you give yourself the option to have him for the playoffs if you do make it. Like I said, just plain stupid.

 

[dawgs.sixpack]

a very very good read on the strsaburg shutdown.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...-mike-rizzo/index.html?eref=sihp&sct=hp_wr_a2

Here are some of the other case studies involving Tommy John patients that the Nationals considered:
• Jamie Garcia. The Cardinals shut down Garcia, then 23 years old, on Sept. 13, 2010 -- his first full season after Tommy John surgery -- with 163 1/3 innings. Nobody noticed because St. Louis stood 7 ½ games out of a wild card spot. The next season the Cardinals won the World Series while pushing Garcia to 220 1/3 innings, a huge jump in innings that I predicted put him at risk this year. Garcia broke down with shoulder trouble, has a 4.52 ERA and doesn't look like the same pitcher.
• Josh Johnson. The Marlins allowed the 25-year-old Johnson to throw 209 innings in 2009, his first full season after Tommy John surgery. (He had made 14 starts after coming back the previous season.) Johnson pitched well the next season before breaking down late with back trouble, then broke down with shoulder trouble last year, and this year has a 3.86 ERA and a declining strikeout rate. He doesn't look like the same guy.
• Francisco Liriano. The Twins let Liriano make 34 starts (minors included) and throw 199 1/3 innings in 2008, his first full season after Tommy John surgery. He was 24 years old. Since then Liriano is 33-44 with a 4.78 ERA. He doesn't look like the same pitcher who dominated in 2006.
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[patdog]

Once again, nobody's saying the Nationals should push Strasburg past the recommended number of innings for this season or the extended break between seasons. I've explained twice how they could have easily done both. Just skip a few starts during the season and save those for the playoffs if needed. If not, you can have him not skip as many starts late in the season. And if you do make the playoffs, just start his spring training late and let him miss the first couple of weeks of the 2013 season. I've never seen anyone yet show me how I'm wrong about that. You say the Nats are good enough to win the World Series without him, and that's possible. However, with him they're the favorites to win the World Series and without him they're not. You can't argure he doesn't give them a better chance to win it.

 

[dawgs.sixpack]

did you not read the part about the tigers doing exactly that with porcello a few years back and he still has never been the same pitcher? he wasn't coming off surgery, but he was a 20 year old in his first full MLB season. also, do you not think that pitchers don't throw between starts? even if they are being skipped? those pitches are factored into "innings" because while not 100%, they are still putting stress on the arm. and shutting down a guy for a month and then ramping him back up is a recipe for an injury. just read in the article the mention of all the young guys that were attempted to be stretched out from RPs to SPs and are now injured.

as for starting late next year, maybe if the nats had a crystal ball back in february and march this past year and could see that they'd be one of the favorites to win the world series it might have been an option, but once they saw where they stood in relation to the rest of the MLB, it was a little alte to just decide to start skipping starts and/or shut him down for a month or whatever magical formula everyone thinks they have figured out that mike rizzo somehow failed to consider. the article talks about how that strategy hasn't worked with other guys anyway, like porcello. furthermore, if he started the 2013 season late, he might cost them next year due to a ****** first month without strasburg. or maybe he doesn't receive the proper MLB level coaching by beginning his season late in extended spring training while all the MLB coaches are actually coaching games in april.

basically there is no right or wrong definitive answer that anyone can point to, and therefore you can't really criticize someone's decision. if you don't think the nats front office hasn't run through every single solution posted by a message board GM, then you are off your rocker. you don't build a franchise from the ground up this way by not being thorough.

 

[patdog]

When did Porcello start spring training the next year? The article doesn't say. The Nats could have had Strasburg skip the between-starts throws for the starts he was skipping and he wouldn't have any more total pitches (in game and out of game) at the end of the playoffs than he does now. They could even afford to sit him out the rest of the season and then let him pitch again in the playoffs. If they don't make the playoffs then just let him pitch through the end of the season. Take the full off-season break recommended and pick up from there. Bottom line is there was a way to both fully protect Strasburg and give the team its best chance of winning the World Series and they blew it.

 

[dawgs.sixpack]

what?!?! you would take a freshly surgically repaired elbow and throw him in games, then have him not throw at all for a week or 2 then pitch him in games again?!?! do you know how stupid that is? you can't do that to an arm and expect it to survive. that post alone proves that you don't have the slightest bit of understanding regarding pitcher's arms.

as for starting late next year, you still haven't addressed the issues of preseason coaching/training while the best the nats have to offer would all be off actually playing baseball. what happens if the guy making $50K/year as an extended spring training coach doesn't catch a problem with his mechanics resulting in arm damage, whereas a seasoned MLB manager or pitching coach would have? what happens if the nats got off to a 15-25 start while strasburg is down in florida and it cost them the playoffs next year?

the nats didn't blow anything. they had to do what they had to do. they didn't have the benefit of hindsight to know how good they'd be and once they were into the season, there is not a sane coach, manager, GM, or doctor who would recommend cylcing strasburg through periods of use and complete shutdown throughout the season. it would be awesome to win it this year, but i'd rather be the braves and be in the playoffs year after year and only walk away with 1 ring than to be the marlins and pretty much suck and sell off any talent we have year after year, but have 2 seasons where the stars aligned for a ring. the nats are building for long term sustained success, not a 1 and done shot at a ring. and you don't tempt fate with the career of one of your centerpieces for 1 shot at glory if you are thinking big picture.