Lineup is shaping up.

[tdawg22]

If it were me, I would not have DH'ed Tyler Fullerton for Brandon Woodruff today. I don't want this club to give up on Woodruff at the plate. However, we are having a couple guys step up and it looks like our line up is starting to shape up. Once everyone is healthy this lineup could be really good:
1.) A. Frazier
2.) C.T. Bradford
3.) H. Renfroe
4.) W. Rea
5.) T. Porter (Nick Flair)
6.) M. Slaughter
7.) A. Detz (M. Britton)
8.) D. Norris
9.) D. Armstrong

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Guys are getting their shot in this 5th inning. With 2 outs and bases jammed, Britton and Armstrong both K'ed. Frost walked. Now Robson is up with a shot to be a hero. The starting LF position is there to be had for guys who can hit in this situation.

 

[CadaverDawg]

If it were me, I would not have DH'ed Tyler Fullerton for Brandon Woodruff today. I don't want this club to give up on Woodruff at the plate. However, we are having a couple guys step up and it looks like our line up is starting to shape up. Once everyone is healthy this lineup could be really good:
1.) A. Frazier
2.) C.T. Bradford
3.) H. Renfroe
4.) W. Rea
5.) T. Porter (Nick Flair)
6.) M. Slaughter
7.) A. Detz (M. Britton)
8.) D. Norris
9.) D. Armstrong

I love this ^^ lineup. I think there is still a battle in Left Field, but as of right this second I would be fine with Armstrong in left. I also like Detz at 2B with Britton as his back up. I have seen nothing out of Pirtle, Hann or Frost that makes me think they should get significant innings this year.

 

[GOOD_DAWG2.0]

Not that it makes much of a difference, but I'd take Henderson over Armstrong. Nothing but personal preference.

 

[CadaverDawg]

Not that it makes much of a difference, but I'd take Henderson over Armstrong. Nothing but personal preference.

As of right now, none of the 3 LF's are exactly "winning" the job. Until someone rises in a big spot, I would guess Cohen sticks with Henderson. Armstrong had a key hit early in this game, but then looked awful in a big spot just now. Robson hasn't hit it much either. I would hate Robson's attitude if I were an opposing team. He seems a little prick-ish.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Henderson has gotten it done in previous years and hits well in practice and scrimmages. Unless someone takes the position from him, it's his. These guys are getting plenty opportunities, and Henderson is leaving the door open a tad. But come SEC time, Henderson will be the left fielder unless someone just explodes.

 

[studentdawg87]

What, exactly, has Henderson done in recent years to warrant him having earned the starting position? He hasn't exactly set the world on fire since he arrived here. As of right now, I like Armstrong and Robson better than him. The coaches are giving him every opportunity to nail down the LF position, and he can't do it. LF will be a revolving door all year.

 

[CadaverDawg]

What, exactly, has Henderson done in recent years to warrant him having earned the starting position? He hasn't exactly set the world on fire since he arrived here. As of right now, I like Armstrong and Robson better than him. The coaches are giving him every opportunity to nail down the LF position, and he can't do it. LF will be a revolving door all year.

I agree that Henderson has gotten a few timely hits in his career, but he hasn't done nearly enough to lock up a position on the field. We are deeper than we've been in quite some time, so Cohen will find somebody to put in there that can hit. I still say that when in doubt, you go with the guy with the most upside. That being said, I think if Henderson doesn't begin separating himself, we should start Robson out there.

 

[Todd4State]

The thing I like is even though no one is separating themselves from the pack, they are all hitting at least .300. I'll take that revolving door any day.

The only thing I would like to see is maybe play Flair more. Norris leads the team in errors at the moment- let's get Flair a start and see what he can do. We can still use Norris at DH or even first base and then move Detz to second base.

Someone said they see nothing from Pirtle- I think he is our best defensive second baseman. However, that doesn't mean that he is our best all-around second baseman. In my opinion, that is probably Detz.

 

[GOOD_DAWG2.0]

I agree that Henderson has gotten a few timely hits in his career, but he hasn't done nearly enough to lock up a position on the field. We are deeper than we've been in quite some time, so Cohen will find somebody to put in there that can hit. I still say that when in doubt, you go with the guy with the most upside. That being said, I think if Henderson doesn't begin separating himself, we should start Robson out there.

Um what the heck have Robson and Armstrong done to lock up a position on the field? Granted, they haven't played much with Henderson getting a lot of the PT so far this year. And even with their bats, neither Robson or Armstrong have separated theirselves from Henderson. It's his to lose. And what has Henderson done for us? He's an EXCELLENT glove in the field plus he has improved his hitting from what we've seen so far this year. Not to mention last year he gave us a solid position player and a what seemed like a decent bat at the time. Henderson is the SEC veteran of the group and should therefore receive more playing time until he or Robson or Armstrong demonstratively shows otherwise.

 

[CadaverDawg]

I agree about LF. It's good for 1 of our 2 "problem spots", being between 3 guys batting at least .300. Robson seems like an ideal 9 hole hitter that can help set the table for the top of the lineup. Henderson isn't bad, but Robson gives you that drag **** option, even better speed, and the obvious upside.

When it comes to Norris...I really wish we could keep his bat but lose his glove. I'm not a huge Porter fan, so I could live with Norris as the DH, but Porter has looked pretty good lately. If Flair is really good defensively, we could start him at 3B and let Norris and Porter battle it out for the DH or rotate them lefty/righty. Either way, 3B is definitely a position of a little concern due to Norris being terrible defensively.

And it was me that said Pirtle has shown me nothing. I agree that he has been solid in the field, so I was wrong to say "nothing", but he has been awful at the plate. Nothing worse than a little guy trying to hit for power and popping it up....if you are small and quick, at least try to keep the ball down to give yourself a chance on the base paths. He rarely gets on base, and pops up too much in my opinion.

If Detz can play 2B, I would say that position is a no brainer when Rea gets healthy. If no Rea, then let's still move Detz over and put Flair at 1B so we can get Frost/Pirtle/Hann's bats out of the lineup. Ole Frost is a scrapper though, and had some good AB's tonight.

 

[CadaverDawg]

Um what the heck have Robson and Armstrong done to lock up a position on the field? Granted, they haven't played much with Henderson getting a lot of the PT so far this year. And even with their bats, neither Robson or Armstrong have separated theirselves from Henderson. It's his to lose. And what has Henderson done for us? He's an EXCELLENT glove in the field plus he has improved his hitting from what we've seen so far this year. Not to mention last year he gave us a solid position player and a what seemed like a decent bat at the time. Henderson is the SEC veteran of the group and should therefore receive more playing time until he or Robson or Armstrong demonstratively shows otherwise.

What are you talking about? I didn't say Robson or Armstrong had done anything, so I'm not sure where you got that.

I'm saying that everyone wants to act like if there's no separation then Henderson should start by default...I disagree. If you have 3 guys batting .300, and all are very good in the field...I'm going with the guy with the best upside. In my opinion that guy is Robson. Henderson has been in the SEC for a few years now, but still can't separate himself from the Freshman. Robson is the type of talent that should get better and better with more experience, so I would prefer getting him those reps now rather than later. I have nothing against Henderson at all...I just think Robson has a higher ceiling, and he is basically the same as Henderson already, so let him play and begin his development as the stud everyone thinks he can be.

ETA: You said Henderson has improved his hitting? Maybe a little, but he hasn't improved it enough to separate himself from a Freshman that was one of the best in his country last year.

You also said he has an EXCELLENT glove. Well, so do the other two it appears, so I don't see that as being an issue.

Obviously, I think Cohen will play the veteran if nobody has separated themselves by SEC play, so it's more of my opinion on the position than what I actually think will happen.

 

[Will James]

Porter was our second leading hitter during SEC play last year, and third place was 38 points behind him. This not liking Porter meme is funny; he hit for average last year and is one of our few sources of power. DH is his to lose just as much as LF is Hendersons to lose. If we want to platoon DH for righty lefty matchups with Porter/Flair and Flair produces I say go for it. But Porter has a spot in the lineup as does Norris at this point.

Wish we would go ahead and put Porter or Flair at 1B and allow Detz to get his reps at 2nd because he is by far the best option there.

 

[CadaverDawg]

Porter was our second leading hitter during SEC play last year, and third place was 38 points behind him. This not liking Porter meme is funny; he hit for average last year and is one of our few sources of power. DH is his to lose just as much as LF is Hendersons to lose. If we want to platoon DH for righty lefty matchups with Porter/Flair and Flair produces I say go for it. But Porter has a spot in the lineup as does Norris at this point.

Wish we would go ahead and put Porter or Flair at 1B and allow Detz to get his reps at 2nd because he is by far the best option there.

The "not liking Porter" is my opinion, so it's perfectly fine. And being one of the best hitters on last year's team, is like being one of the biggest turds in the toilet...not saying much. I didn't say Porter shouldn't play...I just said I'm not a huge fan.

And you may be right that LF is Henderson's to lose in Cohen's eyes...but Henderson is also capable of losing it. Once again, we're discussing who we think, in our opinions, are the best option at each position. It's obvious that Cohen will go with Henderson if nobody else steps up.

 

[GOOD_DAWG2.0]

If you have 3 guys batting .300, and all are very good in the field...I'm going with the guy with the best upside. In my opinion that guy is Robson. Henderson has been in the SEC for a few years now, but still can't separate himself from the Freshman. Robson is the type of talent that should get better and better with more experience, so I would prefer getting him those reps now rather than later.

I understand your point (it's well made and I agree). But I'm not sure RIGHT NOW that Robson has the most upside FOR THIS SEASON. Yes, Robson probably has the most upside for a career, but as of now Henderson has a better chance of helping us this season in my opinion. Robson will get his chance next year when Renfroe goes pro, so it is important that he gets some PT this season. But Henderson has played through an SEC season and will be more valuable to us because of it.

 

[Will James]

The "not liking Porter" is my opinion, so it's perfectly fine. And being one of the best hitters on last year's team, is like being one of the biggest turds in the toilet...not saying much. I didn't say Porter shouldn't play...I just said I'm not a huge fan.

And you may be right that LF is Henderson's to lose in Cohen's eyes...but Henderson is also capable of losing it. Once again, we're discussing who we think, in our opinions, are the best option at each position. It's obvious that Cohen will go with Henderson if nobody else steps up.

What exactly is your basis for not liking Porter? Other than Todd saying he doesn't.

 

[CadaverDawg]

I understand your point (it's well made and I agree). But I'm not sure RIGHT NOW that Robson has the most upside FOR THIS SEASON. Yes, Robson probably has the most upside for a career, but as of now Henderson has a better chance of helping us this season in my opinion. Robson will get his chance next year when Renfroe goes pro, so it is important that he gets some PT this season. But Henderson has played through an SEC season and will be more valuable to us because of it.

I see what you're saying now...but I still don't agree. If they are both hitting at about the same exact average in non conference play right now, what makes you say Henderson has a higher upside THIS SEASON? You just said Robson has higher ceiling over his career, so if he's at the same place that Henderson is right now, wouldn't that also make his ceiling higher for this season? In other words, if Henderson isn't out hitting him in pre conference play, what makes anyone think he will suddenly hit SEC pitching? I guess that's my point.

If you have option A and option B....Everyone agrees option B has a higher upside...and A and B are even right now...Doesn't it make more sense to go with the better upside guy?

 

[Todd4State]

What exactly is your basis for not liking Porter? Other than Todd saying he doesn't.

When did I say that I don't like Porter? The main thing I've said about Porter is that I expected him to have a possible decline because he is coming off of surgery in the offseason and because his at bats would be reduced since we have right handed options for us that we didn't have last year. I like Porter against right handed pitching, but not so much against left handed pitching. Especially since we have Flair and Norris who seem to be good options as a right handed DH among others. However, he seems to be healthy and he is hitting well- so I certainly don't have a problem with that.

 

[GOOD_DAWG2.0]

I see what you're saying now...but I still don't agree. If they are both hitting at about the same exact average in non conference play right now, what makes you say Henderson has a higher upside THIS SEASON? You just said Robson has higher ceiling over his career, so if he's at the same place that Henderson is right now, wouldn't that also make his ceiling higher for this season? In other words, if Henderson isn't out hitting him in pre conference play, what makes anyone think he will suddenly hit SEC pitching? I guess that's my point.

If you have option A and option B....Everyone agrees option B has a higher upside...and A and B are even right now...Doesn't it make more sense to go with the better upside guy?

It's simple really. Henderson has a year of SEC play under his belt. Watch. When SEC play comes some freshmen are gonna find it a lot harder to get on base or keep their ERA low. It happens every year. Sure, you have Johnathan Holders, but they are the exception not the rule. I think the 2006 team will suffice as an example of how SEC ball changes things.

 

[CadaverDawg]

What exactly is your basis for not liking Porter? Other than Todd saying he doesn't.

My opinion has zero to do with Todd or anyone else.

I said I was not a big fan of Porters. It's nothing personal...I just feel like he has a bad swing and a tendency to be a dead pull hitter. You will bring up the oppo hit he had earlier this year but we both know that is rare. I also think good SEC pitchers can take advantage of his wide stance and pitch him outside and down and get him to pull grounders to the right side all day. He is also a double play threat, and is pretty slow overall. And considering he doesn't add a ton of power, I think we have other younger players that can hit as well or better, as well as giving us more speed on the bases.

Once again, I'm not saying he's a bad player, just not somebody that I'm a huge fan of. He was a good player in last years lineup, but we have more talent and more depth this year, so I don't orgasm over him like you do. He's decent, but I would like for a DH to be more of a feared guy for opposing pitchers. Porter is a big guy, but has become more of a singles hitter. Not that there's anything wrong with that, he's just nothing overly special in my eyes.

 

[Will James]

I see what you're saying now...but I still don't agree. If they are both hitting at about the same exact average in non conference play right now, what makes you say Henderson has a higher upside THIS SEASON? You just said Robson has higher ceiling over his career, so if he's at the same place that Henderson is right now, wouldn't that also make his ceiling higher for this season? In other words, if Henderson isn't out hitting him in pre conference play, what makes anyone think he will suddenly hit SEC pitching? I guess that's my point.

If you have option A and option B....Everyone agrees option B has a higher upside...and A and B are even right now...Doesn't it make more sense to go with the better upside guy?

They have had 19 and 22 at bats respectively. If one goes 4-4 and the other 1-4 they are far apart. Meaning: You can't judge **** off 20 at bats against ****** pitching. Looking at an entire offseason and scrimmages the competition shouldn't be close, especially since Henderson is playing well so far. That's why its his job

 

[CadaverDawg]

They have had 19 and 22 at bats respectively. If one goes 4-4 and the other 1-4 they are far apart. Meaning: You can't judge **** off 20 at bats against ****** pitching. Looking at an entire offseason and scrimmages the competition shouldn't be close, especially since Henderson is playing well so far. That's why its his job

I am not basing anything off of 20 at bats. Did you read what all I said? I said that Robson looks like the type of player that could be a stud one day. He has more upside than Henderson due to a better swing, better wheels, and so far as good of a glove. That being said, Henderson is not separating himself from Robson so far. And if there is any doubt as to who the best left fielder is, Im saying I would go with the guy with the most potential.

By the way, you just said Alex Detz is "by far our best option" at 2B....are you basing this on a limited number of at-bats against ****** pitching?? Are you saying this because I said it?? Doesn't Frost have more SEC experience at 2B?? No, you just see what Detz brings to the table, and like me, you know that he needs to be in the lineup. At some point a person that knows baseball can look at a player and see potential, form, and the "it" factor....and everything in baseball isn't a stat.

You could get lucky 3 times in a row and bloop 3 hits while getting jammed by the pitcher....meanwhile I could have excellent form and line out 3 times....does that make you a better hitter than me? No. You just have a better average for the time being. It doesn't take a genious to watch Robson and Henderson, and know who the better long term player is most likely going to be.

Once again, my opinion and what I think Cohen will actually do, are 2 different things. I fully expect Henderson to start in LF...but I can still have a different opinion.

 

[Will James]

My opinion has zero to do with Todd or anyone else.

I said I was not a big fan of Porters. It's nothing personal...I just feel like he has a bad swing and a tendency to be a dead pull hitter. You will bring up the oppo hit he had earlier this year but we both know that is rare. I also think good SEC pitchers can take advantage of his wide stance and pitch him outside and down and get him to pull grounders to the right side all day. He is also a double play threat, and is pretty slow overall. And considering he doesn't add a ton of power, I think we have other younger players that can hit as well or better, as well as giving us more speed on the bases.

Once again, I'm not saying he's a bad player, just not somebody that I'm a huge fan of. He was a good player in last years lineup, but we have more talent and more depth this year, so I don't orgasm over him like you do. He's decent, but I would like for a DH to be more of a feared guy for opposing pitchers. Porter is a big guy, but has become more of a singles hitter. Not that there's anything wrong with that, he's just nothing overly special in my eyes.

Are any of your opinions based in fact? He hit those SEC pitchers for nearly .300 last year. He also led the team in HBP last year. He also walks a lot. He also doesn't strike out.

Quick: only two players on the team last year to have more walks than K's.. Adam Frazier aaaaaaaaand..... Trey Porter.

29 walks to 27 K's

Your favorite player Norris had 17 walks and 40 K's.

2nd highest OBP and tied for the team high in HR and Cad Dawg says I don't like you, let's start a freshman. Genius.

 

[Will James]

I am not basing anything off of 20 at bats. Did you read what all I said?

so if he's at the same place that Henderson is right now, wouldn't that also make his ceiling higher for this season? In other words, if Henderson isn't out hitting him in pre conference play, what makes anyone think he will suddenly hit SEC pitching? I guess that's my point?

Um

 

[CadaverDawg]

Are any of your opinions based in fact? He hit those SEC pitchers for nearly .300 last year. He also led the team in HBP last year. He also walks a lot. He also doesn't strike out.

Quick: only two players on the team last year to have more walks than K's.. Adam Frazier aaaaaaaaand..... Trey Porter.

29 walks to 27 K's

Your favorite player Norris had 17 walks and 40 K's.

2nd highest OBP and tied for the team high in HR and Cad Dawg says I don't like you, let's start a freshman. Genius.

Haha, so you take me saying "I'm not a huge fan" and turn it in to "I hate this guy". Typical. By the way, where did you pull the "my favorite player is Norris" stat? I said I thought he could have a big year....not that he was my favorite player.

And just because Porter isn't my favorite player, doesn't mean I don't think he should play.

 

[CadaverDawg]

Um

Uuuuummm are you going to ignore everything else I've said when comparing the two? No. It doesn't fit your spin

 

[CadaverDawg]

Um

It's very obvious why everyone thinks you're terrible...

Where most people have an opinion, and can discuss others' opinions and simply agree to disagree at times...you cannot. You think your opinion is fact, and cannot comprehend how anybody in the world could have a different viewpoint as you.

just like the other day when you pointed out that 4 of the 5 ERA leading teams were in the CWS last year, and then proceeded to tell us why hitting was more important....You are not the baseball God that you think you are. And your personality makes you even more horrible to discuss anything with. Do you enjoy being an argumentative know it all kind of guy? It's a bad look.

 

[Will James]

Do you enjoy being an argumentative know it all kind of guy? It's a bad look.

It gets me laid...

Also I am OCD about facts to back up opinion. I feel my variable/control analogy was my most brilliant posting yet. It perfectly matched up with the Stony Brook and Kent State runs and what matters in this format.

 

[CadaverDawg]

It gets me laid....

Ha! Here's a stat for you to find then...find out how many people are members of SPS. Take that number and multiply it times 1. That's how many people think that you have never been laid. And if you need evidence to back that up...scroll through your ****ing rampages and you will see where people draw that conclusion.

I applaud that response though.

 

[GOOD_DAWG2.0]

It's very obvious why everyone thinks you're terrible...

Where most people have an opinion, and can discuss others' opinions and simply agree to disagree at times...you cannot. You think your opinion is fact, and cannot comprehend how anybody in the world could have a different viewpoint as you.

just like the other day when you pointed out that 4 of the 5 ERA leading teams were in the CWS last year, and then proceeded to tell us why hitting was more important....You are not the baseball God that you think you are. And your personality makes you even more horrible to discuss anything with. Do you enjoy being an argumentative know it all kind of guy? It's a bad look.

If Will James is agreeing with me, I'm defecting to your side. I don't care if I was right or wrong, I just can't stand that 17er. So 17n annoying. Geez man.

 

[KurtRambis4]

Highly unlikely**

It gets me laid...

*

 

[tdawg22]

LF is def. the big debate no doubt. I cant decide if I like D. Armstrong or Robson out there (not that my opinion makes a damn). I do, however, think for our team to be at it's best it would be Robson over the rest when it's all said and done. As Cadaver said, the reason I like Robson over Henderson is because of upside. In my opinion, Henderson has reached his ceiling. With him what you see is what you're going to get, whether it be today, or come post season play. I just can't see Henderson lashing doubles in the gaps by the end of the season but I can see Robson doing that. With that being said, if Robson and company decide to suck it up (I will get blasted for this) I wouldn't mind seeing Sam Frost getting a shot at LF. I know a lot of y'all bash him on here but that kid is scrappy. He's been hitting the ball hard when he gets in the game and he tore up the summer league. The bottom line is that no matter what line up we put in there come SEC play we are going to rely on pitching. And that category is stout. It's going to be a fun year. At some point we need to stop worrying about the line up let the coaches do their job and just enjoy the hell out of this season.

 

[Will James]

1.) Frazier SS
2.) Bradford CF
3.) Detz 2B
4.) Renfroe RF
5.) Rea 1B
6.) Porter DH
7.) Norris 3B
8.) Slauter C
9.) Henderson LF

The optimal lineup for our Mississippi State Bulldogs

 

[KurtRambis4]

I like

this lineup. Detz has really been smashing it, so far. I like Armstrong, too. He's excelled when presented an opportunity (for the most part). If Henderson's production falls (and Armstrong continues), I wouldn't be surprised to see him take Henderson's spot.

 

[Philly Dawg]

How did Porter's numbers break down against lefties compared with righties? If there was a big difference, then last year's numbers don't support his being included as an everyday DH.

 

[Will James]

How did Porter's numbers break down against lefties compared with righties?

I'd be interested to see that.


I did say this earlier in the thread

If we want to platoon DH for righty lefty matchups with Porter/Flair and Flair produces I say go for it.

The dealbreaker would be Flair's production once we start seeing good pitching. Even then Porter would get a majority of the starts because I'd imagine we see righty starters for the most part.

 

[shoeless joe]

I see what you're saying now...but I still don't agree. If they are both hitting at about the same exact average in non conference play right now, what makes you say Henderson has a higher upside THIS SEASON? You just said Robson has higher ceiling over his career, so if he's at the same place that Henderson is right now, wouldn't that also make his ceiling higher for this season? In other words, if Henderson isn't out hitting him in pre conference play, what makes anyone think he will suddenly hit SEC pitching? I guess that's my point.

If you have option A and option B....Everyone agrees option B has a higher upside...and A and B are even right now...Doesn't it make more sense to go with the better upside guy?

some guys are just .300 hitters; meaning they hit .300 against good, bad, or mediocre pitching. then there are some who tear it up against lower level pitching but cant cut it in league play. therefore, i think henderson has the upper hand since his contributions are known...he doesnt have to seperate himself...the others do.

 

[Will James]

some guys are just .300 hitters; meaning they hit .300 against good, bad, or mediocre pitching. then there are some who tear it up against lower level pitching but cant cut it in league play. therefore, i think henderson has the upper hand since his contributions are known...he doesnt have to seperate himself...the others do.

This. I think if anyone could separate himself it will be Armstrong but Henderson has the experience and has shown improvement over the offseason and throughout the scrimmages and early non-con play. It's his to lose and he has not done anything to warrant losing it. Also, he in no way, shape, or form has hit his ceiling.

 

[tdawg22]

Armstrong hit .391 his freshman yr. and .404 his sophomore yr. during is juco days. That is STRONG. I can't see Henderson doing that. Look at Henderson summer league stats the last 2 yrs. They are not very good.

 

[Will James]

Armstrong hit .391 his freshman yr. and .404 his sophomore yr. during is juco days. That is STRONG. I can't see Henderson doing that. Look at Henderson summer league stats the last 2 yrs. They are not very good.

Which is why I said

I think if anyone could separate himself it will be Armstrong

They will get their chances to show what they got but Armstrong will have to take that spot from Henderson. Much harder to take over somebody. I'm comfortable with either but at this point I like Demarcus starting. Robson will struggle against the better pitching. He has had some AB's already where he looked lost.