I was starting to like you. Please, for my sanity, no UK football talk.
Making a Murderer
- Thread starter etowncatfan
- Start date
I was starting to like you. Please, for my sanity, no UK football talk.
I think there is a 50/50 chance Avery did it. When you burn cats alive, jerk off on cars, etc. you have a few strikes against you. I just know they framed his ***. They didn't prove without a reasonable doubt he was guilty. Most apparent is Brendan didn't do ****.
I agree, totally not trying to say he's 100% innocent...just saying there is a reasonable doubt.
I imagine his release and huge lawsuit definitely provided some motivation. Would have been interesting to have been a fly on the wall at the post conviction celebration the cops probably had.
I imagine his release and huge lawsuit definitely provided some motivation. Would have been interesting to have been a fly on the wall at the post conviction celebration the cops probably had.
But there aren't many ways into a junkyard, they don't just have random entrances unlocked. It's their livelihood, the junkyard is their income. The RAV 4 was found fairly close to the residences, so the police would've had to snuck it in right under their noses.
They would've had to known the girl was on Averys property, and apprehended her as soon as she left. I don't buy the police doing it with where everything was found. Why not dump her anywhere? You've planted his blood in the car, why run the risk of getting caught by burning the body onsite and sneaking the car back onsite?
They screwed that up, but why in the hell did the jury find him guilty when he had 16 eyewitnesses to where he was? The jury has some blame here as well.
Maybe the sheriff's office was surveilling the Avery compound in hopes of finding some dirt on them or trying to figure out a way to get them to drop the lawsuit. Sherriff saw Halbach leaving the compound and pulled her over, and the rest is history.
Valid point. But if the police/sheriff hadn't screwed up to begin with, the jury never would have been put in the position to screw up.
I guess that's possible, but not very plausible. A cop would've had to pulled her over and killed her with the hopes that Steven was the one she'd seen even though a large family lived there. She could've just as easily been there to see someone up front since his brother was tending the business during that time.
I would buy the cop argument if her body had been found somewhere else with the vehicle, or her phone had activity on it after she supposedly left the junkyard, the phone records are what really make me think she never left.
I think if anyone other than Steven it was his brother in law and nephew, his brother in law seemed a little over the top in wanting him in jail.
Well that's all fine and good but they also made note that ONLY Avery's dna was on the key and no prints whatsoever.
That's what made it appear planted to me.
That's what made it appear planted to me.
I'll be honest, the whole key thing seemed very odd. And why it wasn't excluded when the tester introduced her DNA is beyond me, especially when that's standard operating procedure. If I'm a juror that sends up red flags, that's one reason why I said he had enough reasonable doubt for a not guilty or at least a retrial.
I think the key, bullet and slug were all planted. More than likely the blood in the car as well. He didn't clean up his finger prints and leave a few small streaks of blood in obvious places.
What sucks for Dassey is they think he raped and stabbed her in the bedroom then had 5 days to clean up the scene BUT they left the key there? I mean that and the fact he was screwed over by his attorney. I guess that sucks the most.
What sucks for Dassey is they think he raped and stabbed her in the bedroom then had 5 days to clean up the scene BUT they left the key there? I mean that and the fact he was screwed over by his attorney. I guess that sucks the most.
Bill I totally agree and didn't find Bobby Dassey to be too believable. Also they were each other's alibi and in a weird way. Scott said he was at the hospital for his mom, yet his wife came home at 5pm from visiting her and I think that is around the time he said he and Booby crossed in traffic.
I felt more like those two could have easily been suspects which would take away the police planting evidence because they could be there. Never heard them say the family had to move while they searched the area.
I felt more like those two could have easily been suspects which would take away the police planting evidence because they could be there. Never heard them say the family had to move while they searched the area.
It's absolutely not very plausible, but neither is slitting a person's throat and stomach and it not leaving a trace of blood. I think that's part of what makes this story so compelling. There are so many things that don't add up that it makes you think damn near anything could've happened.
Her DNA was introduced with the bullet not the key.
The odd thing about the key is ONLY Avery's DNA was present, not the victims. Which is very unlikely. Really impossible if you ask me. That with the fact it was found in an obvious place after several days can reasonably lead you to think the car was moved by someone other than Avery, then scrubbed and planted.
There was a video of a sherif all but telling them the key was planted. He didn't say his partner planted it, but he said a key appeared after his buddy said "hey look a key" and pointed to a spot where there previously was not a key. Why didn't that make it to trial?
Good point. Only way the photographer's DNA isn't on that key is if it was scrubbed off, so clearly the evidence was tampered with.
The key, blood and slug were planted without a doubt in my mind.
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I would like to see a vote from the folks who have watched the documentary.
Brendan - not guilty
Steve- not guilty
Brendan - not guilty
Steve- not guilty
The key and slug possibly, I don't think the blood was. I'd also like to know when the photo of Stevens cut hand was taken.
Well maybe you guys missed it, but Steven lived in a.......well a junkyard so just about anything could have cut him.
I honestly do not think Steven did anything. I think to be honest him being the last to see her is too obvious.
What's in doubt: deleted messages after her death, key, blood, slugs, essentially putting the scene on lockdown except for sheriff's that weren't "involved", the prosecutor's story the day dassey statement came out and wasn't close to the truth, slugs on the ground months later that somehow weren't at least a point of interest(if they were there at all) in the disappearance of a person, Colburn's license plate call, logging out of the scene but never logging in, and the case not being made until a halfwit kid was basically tricked into a statement with no supervision at all.
All of that within the investigation yet somehow someway without a shred of doubt a man was convicted......IN REAL LIFE. It's like the exact opposite of OJ.
I honestly do not think Steven did anything. I think to be honest him being the last to see her is too obvious.
What's in doubt: deleted messages after her death, key, blood, slugs, essentially putting the scene on lockdown except for sheriff's that weren't "involved", the prosecutor's story the day dassey statement came out and wasn't close to the truth, slugs on the ground months later that somehow weren't at least a point of interest(if they were there at all) in the disappearance of a person, Colburn's license plate call, logging out of the scene but never logging in, and the case not being made until a halfwit kid was basically tricked into a statement with no supervision at all.
All of that within the investigation yet somehow someway without a shred of doubt a man was convicted......IN REAL LIFE. It's like the exact opposite of OJ.
Incestuous salvage yard employees always have all kinds of cuts and ****... they just do.
That's good news, the saddest part of the show to me was when he wanted to go back to school in time for a test.
I know the cops are trying to get a confession, but damn he's a kid that has no idea what's going on, and he just wanted out of that situation. At least let his parents in there with him.
I know the cops are trying to get a confession, but damn he's a kid that has no idea what's going on, and he just wanted out of that situation. At least let his parents in there with him.
Another thing I have wondered is. Where is her camera?? Where was her purse?? Were these things ever found??
Right, but they did publicize it and basically used a shell of his story as a means to direct a murder scene that didn't happen.
Also, based on the fact that they created a different murder scene in his case, basically the prosecution is using evidence that almost depicts 2 different murder scenes and he should be consistent with that.
Just doesn't seem right.
Also, based on the fact that they created a different murder scene in his case, basically the prosecution is using evidence that almost depicts 2 different murder scenes and he should be consistent with that.
Just doesn't seem right.
http://truecrimecases.blogspot.com/2012/08/steven-avery.html?m=1
I just read an article and they were found or parts of them in the burn barrel or pit.
Also Brendan told the police they cleaned the garage with Bleach, kerosene and gasoline. His mother asked him that night why he had bleach stains on his clothes. The clothes were also tested and had a heavy presence of bleach.
I just read an article and they were found or parts of them in the burn barrel or pit.
Also Brendan told the police they cleaned the garage with Bleach, kerosene and gasoline. His mother asked him that night why he had bleach stains on his clothes. The clothes were also tested and had a heavy presence of bleach.
I feel like maybe you've never been in a bad case. Weird **** stirs the pot sometimes and creates a change in situation that can open up a case.
An overruling in the same murder could be that for Avery despite dassey's confession not being used directly.
If his confession never happens how is any evidence after the fact admissable?
An overruling in the same murder could be that for Avery despite dassey's confession not being used directly.
If his confession never happens how is any evidence after the fact admissable?
A few points here:
We know that Avery had prior felonies other than the wrongful conviction for sexual assault. No matter what, the prosecutor could have impeached him with those prior convictions and made a big production out of them during cross. Jurors don't like felons, and they certainly don't trust them.
Which brings me to this: It's one thing to have defense attorneys suggesting that the police are corrupt, have planted evidence, etc., but it's an entirely different matter to ask a jury to believe whatever stream of consciousness BS that inevitably would have come out of Avery's mouth had he taken the stand. Even if he was entirely innocent, it wouldn't have come across in a believable manner. He would've ranted and raved about conspiracies, Bigfoot, whatever, especially with the prosecutor going after him for a day or two.
Also, how would it have helped? What could he have said that would've convinced everyone that he didn't do it?
"Nope, I was just sitting in my trailer alone all night. Built a bonfire later. That's it." Even if it's true, it wouldn't have added anything to the narrative. Instead, the government gets to attack the defendant on cross, and the defendant gets very little, if anything helpful out of it.
Last and most important, why should he? I know it's tough, but you have to remember that this man is on trial for his life and he has a constitutional right not to testify. You're not allowed to hold it against him, and you're can't speculate about why he made that decision. I know that it's an almost impossible task, but it's extremely important if our system is going to work. The burden is entirely on the government. If they can't prove it beyond a reasonable doubt, you have to acquit. The court of public opinion might be different, but in a court of law Steve Avery doesn't and shouldn't have to explain anything.