@mdeer1, with Manchin caving to…

[MosbysGhost_rivals424287]

I seriously wonder how many of you actually read into what Manchin negotiated before getting pissed off because Fox News told you to be.

He set things up for legislation to be passed that will open the door for a shale oil pipeline in WV... Something that will do our state far more good at this stage than the dying coal industry.

Don't be a sheep... Think for yourself and do the damn research.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

Emperor Joe makes them take turns. Just when you think he's with you...

Ha ha ha. Cry, extremists, at your moderate overlord.

Then next week he'll be back at pissing AOC off.

He just signaled intent to vote for tax increases during a recession, half a trillion in pork amid our highest inflation in 40 years, a curb to energy production through regulatory methods during an energy crisis, and negatively impacting farm output via regulatory initiatives during a global food shortage.

I don’t care what side you’re on, left, right, or middle, pretty sure we’re all gonna be pissed off in the very near future. All to try and bolster the soft headed tit in the WhiteHouse. Congrats, I guess?

 

[Archetype XLIV]

He just signaled intent to vote for tax increases during a recession, half a trillion in pork amid our highest inflation in 40 years, a curb to energy production through regulatory methods during an energy crisis, and negatively impacting farm output via regulatory initiatives during a global food shortage.

I don’t care what side you’re on, left, right, or middle, pretty sure we’re all gonna be pissed off in the very near future. All to try and bolster the soft headed tit in the WhiteHouse. Congrats, I guess?

Agreed, not sure why we're seeing the football-spiking here.

 

[Veldo]

Manchin must want to retire early.

 

[spectat'EER]

Manchin must want to retire early.

Correct. After this big flip he's done he won't get re-elected in WV. To bad he has awhile to go before he;s gone.

 

[rknapp]

I never thought he would cave. This makes be sick.

He’s a snake in the grass. I can’t believe he keeps getting re-elected.

 

[Darrin class of 1989]

I seriously wonder how many of you actually read into what Manchin negotiated before getting pissed off because Fox News told you to be.

He set things up for legislation to be passed that will open the door for a shale oil pipeline in WV... Something that will do our state far more good at this stage than the dying coal industry.

Don't be a sheep... Think for yourself and do the damn research.

Gosh I was hoping this wouldn't devolve into politics and get moved but...

Research the current inflation rate....then research Manchin's comments on it...then this?

His true colors are showing through man.

 

[MosbysGhost_rivals424287]

Gosh I was hoping this wouldn't devolve into politics and get moved but...

Research the current inflation rate....then research Manchin's comments on it...then this?

His true colors are showing through man.

I think he believes this will benefit our state or he wouldn't have agreed to it.

Whether it leads to inflation we will have to see, but my guess would be that he saw data that showed the money being pumped into the economy would be offset by all the other items in there.

I vote for a lot more Republicans than I do Democrats and I truly believe Manchin felt this was the best thing for our state and our country or else he wouldn't have done it... What motivation would he have to risk reelection if it wasn't to try and help his people?

 

[pburg011]

He won with a 60% margin in 2012 and by only 49% in 2018. Only two more years of him. As to why he decided to team up with Schumer et al, he was very upset that he was being shunned by "his own party" and bemoaning how difficult it was on him. The Democratic Whip said she was going to be a "little more accepting" of him since he was modifying his stance on climate change now. Joe keeps thinking the Democratic party today is like it was back in the sixties, and his long-term loyalty to being considered the ultimate Democrat rules his brain today when push comes to shove.

Anyone who thinks this bill is anything other than a New Green Deal with a rebranding is mistaken, and this is not good for WV in any way. He just allowed them to get their foot in the door to ultimately make our country energy dependent on others. Anyone who has learned from the past knows how that turns out.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

What motivation would he have to risk reelection if it wasn't to try and help his people?

Pork which funnels to him personally, his friends, and his families. The same as most politicians in DC. They enrich themselves and those who grease them on our tax dollars.

 

[Archetype XLIV]

 

[WVUPharm2007]

The inflation we are going through is caused by like a dozen different things hitting simultaneously. It's a worldwide problem. Completely blaming or completely exonerating Biden is pretty idiotic. He gave out a lot of "free" money, which didn't help, but Trump did, too. Hell, Trump was flipping out at the Fed because they were thinking about raising rates during his administration. It's not like the Republicans weren't all in on easy money themselves. The stimulus packages spanned both administrations. And the economy was potentially about to collapse if they didn't do it, so I get why it was done by both presidents.

For me, we've had two below average presidents in a row. It is what it is. And it's why I appreciate Manchin. He stops every harebrained scheme either of them come up with in its tracks. We need more Machins and McCains. Fewer members of the Borg.

This bill isn't that bad. It's not very big. A fraction of the gargantuan build back better. Will be paid for (remember when bills were paid for before they passed them?) by an increase in corporate taxes. No taxes on anyone making under $400k. Will be awesome for people on Medicare. $2000 oop max. Feds will negotiate medication prices, finally. This is huge. We've been subsidizing the rest of the world's healthcare systems by paying ridiculous drug prices that other countries pay at a fraction of what we pay.

It seems like a lot of give and take took place. And a true centrist was the gatekeeper. I'd rather have Manchin making the call than Schumer, McConnell, Nancy or McCarthy.

I'm looking forward to unbiased analysis of the bill from nonpartisan sources. Which takes time. The cbo isn't magic.

That said... I'm still hoping for Andrew Yang to take over in 2024. #yanggang.

 

[bgregory74]

I said all along that Manchin would cave.

I give you credit, you called it. I hoped you were wrong but you weren’t

 

[NYC_Eer]

The inflation we are going through is caused by like a dozen different things hitting simultaneously. It's a worldwide problem. Completely blaming or completely exonerating Biden is pretty idiotic. He gave out a lot of "free" money, which didn't help, but Trump did, too. Hell, Trump was flipping out at the Fed because they were thinking about raising rates during his administration. It's not like the Republicans weren't all in on easy money themselves. The stimulus packages spanned both administrations. And the economy was potentially about to collapse if they didn't do it, so I get why it was done by both presidents.

For me, we've had two below average presidents in a row. It is what it is. And it's why I appreciate Manchin. He stops every harebrained scheme either of them come up with in its tracks. We need more Machins and McCains. Fewer members of the Borg.

This bill isn't that bad. It's not very big. A fraction of the gargantuan build back better. Will be paid for (remember when bills were paid for before they passed them?) by an increase in corporate taxes. No taxes on anyone making under $400k. Will be awesome for people on Medicare. $2000 oop max. Feds will negotiate medication prices, finally. This is huge. We've been subsidizing the rest of the world's healthcare systems by paying ridiculous drug prices that other countries pay at a fraction of what we pay.

It seems like a lot of give and take took place. And a true centrist was the gatekeeper. I'd rather have Manchin making the call than Schumer, McConnell, Nancy or McCarthy.

I'm looking forward to unbiased analysis of the bill from nonpartisan sources. Which takes time. The cbo isn't magic.

That said... I'm still hoping for Andrew Yang to take over in 2024. #yanggang.

But Trump. That’s what it always comes down to.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

But Trump. That’s what it always comes down to.

Clearly you didn't read what I wrote. It's not really Trump's fault, either. Neither of their policies particularly helped, but in the grand scheme of things, nothing can really be done, either. I was just saying that if you want to blame Biden...well, he just did exactly what Trump did. Printed money to keep the economy afloat.

But let's be honest. Inflation is mostly being caused by a once in a century pandemic that shut down the worldwide economy and created devastating, worldwide supply chain issues. Did Trump and Biden help things? Not really. But the thought that either one of them singlehandedly caused all of this is ridiculous. It's a perfect storm of multiple variables that are completely outside of the control of the US president. Just like how I don't blame Trump for the 2020 recession, either. I mean, I get why the GOP is hounding the man on it, too. It's a perfect issue for them. Biden really can't do anything about it. It's going to be here until the supply chains catch back up. And by then, the midterms will be well over and it will be onto the next thing. I'd be pounding him on inflation if I were a Republican tribalist, too. Why not?

 

[OLD TIME MOUNTAINEER]

My grandfather was a coal miner in to his 60's, (remember him coming in regularly with coal dust all over him). I had several uncles who worked in the mines, but all that being said, West Virginia can not continue to be reliant on the coal industry. Anything done to continue to prop up the coal industry in this state only delays the inevitable. At some point in time West Virginia needs to figure out other industries that can benefit or work for the state. If not West Virginia will be in the same position 50 years from now as it is today. The truth hurts but sometimes reality sucks. My dad cries every time he hears country roads specifically because of the "miners lady" phrase because he thinks of my mom (who died in 2016). Her dad was a miner and that connection resonates. Coal miners have been very close to me but I'm also a realist and appeasing the mining industry isn't going to help West Virginia in the long run.

I disagree. At this point in time we 100% can not afford to eliminate coal. There is no infrastructure that can replace the need for energy that coal provides to us and the rest of the world. Anybody that tells you any different is lying to you. Oh, and by the way...Anyone that tells you men can have babies is lying to you also.

 

[CAJUNEER_rivals]

Honestly, if Joe wasn’t leveraging his vote as one of a number of contingencies on saving WVU’s football future, he needs dick punched. There are plenty of other more ridiculous things Senators have leveraged for their vote.

His negotiation was with Schumer. I doubt he would be much help in conference affiliation matters.

 

[CAJUNEER_rivals]

The inflation we are going through is caused by like a dozen different things hitting simultaneously. It's a worldwide problem. Completely blaming or completely exonerating Biden is pretty idiotic. He gave out a lot of "free" money, which didn't help, but Trump did, too. Hell, Trump was flipping out at the Fed because they were thinking about raising rates during his administration. It's not like the Republicans weren't all in on easy money themselves. The stimulus packages spanned both administrations. And the economy was potentially about to collapse if they didn't do it, so I get why it was done by both presidents.

For me, we've had two below average presidents in a row. It is what it is. And it's why I appreciate Manchin. He stops every harebrained scheme either of them come up with in its tracks. We need more Machins and McCains. Fewer members of the Borg.

This bill isn't that bad. It's not very big. A fraction of the gargantuan build back better. Will be paid for (remember when bills were paid for before they passed them?) by an increase in corporate taxes. No taxes on anyone making under $400k. Will be awesome for people on Medicare. $2000 oop max. Feds will negotiate medication prices, finally. This is huge. We've been subsidizing the rest of the world's healthcare systems by paying ridiculous drug prices that other countries pay at a fraction of what we pay.

It seems like a lot of give and take took place. And a true centrist was the gatekeeper. I'd rather have Manchin making the call than Schumer, McConnell, Nancy or McCarthy.

I'm looking forward to unbiased analysis of the bill from nonpartisan sources. Which takes time. The cbo isn't magic.

That said... I'm still hoping for Andrew Yang to take over in 2024. #yanggang.

You can draw a fairly direct line from oil production restrictions to economic recession.

 

[The Elf]

Clearly you didn't read what I wrote. It's not really Trump's fault, either. Neither of their policies particularly helped, but in the grand scheme of things, nothing can really be done, either. I was just saying that if you want to blame Biden...well, he just did exactly what Trump did. Printed money to keep the economy afloat.

But let's be honest. Inflation is mostly being caused by a once in a century pandemic that shut down the worldwide economy and created devastating, worldwide supply chain issues. Did Trump and Biden help things? Not really. But the thought that either one of them singlehandedly caused all of this is ridiculous. It's a perfect storm of multiple variables that are completely outside of the control of the US president. Just like how I don't blame Trump for the 2020 recession, either. I mean, I get why the GOP is hounding the man on it, too. It's a perfect issue for them. Biden really can't do anything about it. It's going to be here until the supply chains catch back up. And by then, the midterms will be well over and it will be onto the next thing. I'd be pounding him on inflation if I were a Republican tribalist, too. Why not?

I agree with most of what you said, but we’ve had 3 below average presidents in a row (not two) and Biden kept handing out free money long after it was needed. Hell, his cronies still want to forgive all the student loan debt (which is essentially still handing out trillions of dollars), we’ll see how that one plays out.

 

[DvlDog4WVU]

You can draw a fairly direct line from oil production restrictions to economic recession.

And extended unnecessary lockdowns to the necessity for stimulus packages to inflation. It’s like he completely absolves the upstream actions as the only path to take. We’d have had a much softer landing had blue states not stayed shutdown for political purposes.

 

[cwbullet]

My father and Manchin were neighbors in high school. I know his daughter (don't get me started there). I will never vote for him again. What a turn coat.

 

[gusbob]

I seriously wonder how many of you actually read into what Manchin negotiated before getting pissed off because Fox News told you to be.

He set things up for legislation to be passed that will open the door for a shale oil pipeline in WV... Something that will do our state far more good at this stage than the dying coal industry.

Don't be a sheep... Think for yourself and do the damn research.

Right Ray Charles
It will NEVER happen.

 

[OHEER89]

You can draw a fairly direct line from oil production restrictions to economic recession.

WVUPharm2007 is correct. It comes down to the simple law of economics (supply & demand). The pandemic which caused massive supply chain issues is the primary cause of inflation although the infusion of money at the time supply was limited didn't help which is on both administrations. I hope corporations have learned a lesson from this experience and not just look at the cheapest costs for their supply chains in the future but also look at the risk to their supply chains which should in turn should bring more jobs back to the US.

As for Manchin, if he didn't secure some jobs for WV as part of the Climate package then shame on him. He had all the leverage at that point.

 

[gusbob]

Clearly you didn't read what I wrote. It's not really Trump's fault, either. Neither of their policies particularly helped, but in the grand scheme of things, nothing can really be done, either. I was just saying that if you want to blame Biden...well, he just did exactly what Trump did. Printed money to keep the economy afloat.

But let's be honest. Inflation is mostly being caused by a once in a century pandemic that shut down the worldwide economy and created devastating, worldwide supply chain issues. Did Trump and Biden help things? Not really. But the thought that either one of them singlehandedly caused all of this is ridiculous. It's a perfect storm of multiple variables that are completely outside of the control of the US president. Just like how I don't blame Trump for the 2020 recession, either. I mean, I get why the GOP is hounding the man on it, too. It's a perfect issue for them. Biden really can't do anything about it. It's going to be here until the supply chains catch back up. And by then, the midterms will be well over and it will be onto the next thing. I'd be pounding him on inflation if I were a Republican tribalist, too. Why not?

Nope.
People are building dirt bike parks with covid relief money.
That is wants caused inflation.
That and the war on carbon
That doesnt actually reduce carbon.

 

[Mdeer]

The inflation we are going through is caused by like a dozen different things hitting simultaneously. It's a worldwide problem. Completely blaming or completely exonerating Biden is pretty idiotic. He gave out a lot of "free" money, which didn't help, but Trump did, too. Hell, Trump was flipping out at the Fed because they were thinking about raising rates during his administration. It's not like the Republicans weren't all in on easy money themselves. The stimulus packages spanned both administrations. And the economy was potentially about to collapse if they didn't do it, so I get why it was done by both presidents.

For me, we've had two below average presidents in a row. It is what it is. And it's why I appreciate Manchin. He stops every harebrained scheme either of them come up with in its tracks. We need more Machins and McCains. Fewer members of the Borg.

This bill isn't that bad. It's not very big. A fraction of the gargantuan build back better. Will be paid for (remember when bills were paid for before they passed them?) by an increase in corporate taxes. No taxes on anyone making under $400k. Will be awesome for people on Medicare. $2000 oop max. Feds will negotiate medication prices, finally. This is huge. We've been subsidizing the rest of the world's healthcare systems by paying ridiculous drug prices that other countries pay at a fraction of what we pay.

It seems like a lot of give and take took place. And a true centrist was the gatekeeper. I'd rather have Manchin making the call than Schumer, McConnell, Nancy or McCarthy.

I'm looking forward to unbiased analysis of the bill from nonpartisan sources. Which takes time. The cbo isn't magic.

That said... I'm still hoping for Andrew Yang to take over in 2024. #yanggang.

You say you are against free money yet you want the guy who proposes Universal Basic income to be president ?

 

[CAJUNEER_rivals]

WVUPharm2007 is correct. It comes down to the simple law of economics (supply & demand). The pandemic which caused massive supply chain issues is the primary cause of inflation although the infusion of money at the time supply was limited didn't help which is on both administrations. I hope corporations have learned a lesson from this experience and not just look at the cheapest costs for their supply chains in the future but also look at the risk to their supply chains which should in turn should bring more jobs back to the US.

As for Manchin, if he didn't secure some jobs for WV as part of the Climate package then shame on him. He had all the leverage at that point.

He right in saying multiple factors caused inflation and recession. Covid was a factor outside our leadership’s control. Restrictions on oil production was an intentional action by our leadership. The pandemic caused many stresses to the economy. Restriction on oil production and $5.00/gallon fuel removed any opportunity for recovery.

 

[gusbob]

He right in saying multiple factors caused inflation and recession. Covid was a factor outside our leadership’s control. Restrictions on oil production was an intentional action by our leadership. The pandemic caused many stresses to the economy. Restriction on oil production and $5.00/gallon fuel removed any opportunity for recovery.

How many refineries have closed under Biden? These are not hard questions if anyone bothers to pay attention.

 

[moe]

shale oil pipeline

shale gas

 

[moe]

How many refineries have closed under Biden? These are not hard questions if anyone bothers to pay attention.

5. It was happening under Trump as well. The world is changing, more electric cars/trucks coming. Less gasoline will be needed.

The last major refinery to come online in the United States, in 1977, is the one owned by Marathon Oil in Garyville, La. It is capable of pumping out 578,000 barrels per day. Since it opened, more than half the refineries in the United States have closed.

The case of the shuttered Philadelphia Energy Solutions refinery illustrates how little influence the White House has over such operations.

The Trump administration had worked aggressively to keep the plant that was churning out 335,000 barrels of fuel per day from closing, warning it played an important role in U.S. energy security and independence. The White House had dispatched Peter Navarro, a top Trump economic adviser, to try to help advance the bid of a group of energy executives who planned to rehabilitate the bankrupt facility. The bid, which had the backing of organized labor, fizzled.

Oil refineries are making a windfall. Why do they keep closing?

 

[CAJUNEER_rivals]

How many refineries have closed under Biden? These are not hard questions if anyone bothers to pay attention.

Since Nov. 2020, 7 refineries have announced permanent cessation of all crude oil refinement operations.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

You say you are against free money yet you want the guy who proposes Universal Basic income to be president ?

I'm not against free money in general. The long term problem is still going to be deflation (similar to Japan) as fewer people will be needed over time to do skilled jobs as AI and automation begin to lessen the amount of skilled laborers needed in the economy. And we need to prepare for this. Yang is the only politician that seems to recognize this.

I was just saying that blaming any one person for inflation is sort of ridiculous, especially given that that particular policy was just a continuation of what the previous administrations did.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

You can draw a fairly direct line from oil production restrictions to economic recession.

A feel like a single pipeline isn't going to affect oil prices on a worldwide scale. Maybe I'm wrong. I'd love to see an academic study that actually calculates what the differences in prices may be if the Keystone were online. That would be interesting.

 

[moe]

You can draw a fairly direct line from oil production restrictions to economic recession.

Trolling hard I see, shew. Oil companies restrict oil production not Joe and obviously it takes many factors to lead to a very shallow recession that may or may not be going on.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

As for Manchin, if he didn't secure some jobs for WV as part of the Climate package then shame on him. He had all the leverage at that point.

I rather enjoyed the theories that he should offer the Big Ten ending the filibuster immediately and passing every bill the Democrats wanted while simultaneously offering the SEC to be wiling to change parties to give the GOP control of the Senate. Whoever acts first, wins. A generation shift in the US legislature for college football conference alignment seems pretty on brand for this country, lol.

 

[TarHeelEer]

Trolling hard I see, shew. Oil companies restrict oil production not Joe and obviously it takes many factors to lead to a very shallow recession that may or may not be going on.

Thank you for your opinion.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Trolling hard I see, shew. Oil companies restrict oil production not Joe and obviously it takes many factors to lead to a very shallow recession that may or may not be going on.

While this is strictly technically true...I do believe the theory that they don't want to invest in more infrastructure knowing that the US wants to reduce its dependence on fossil fuel.

Of course, if we built a bunch of nuclear plants and expanded the installation of solar panels to homes, we would have cheaper energy for cars and heating. I don't understand why this isn't the obvious conclusion people arrive at. Depending on fossil fuels is a choice we've made over the last several decades. And we remain at the mercy of hostile actors (Russia, various OPEC members) and wild swings in the international energy market because of it.

We have the technology to split the atom and generate endless electricity. Or, you know, harness that giant ball of gas in the sky that perpetually showers the entire planet with free energy. If every house had a solar panel array and every city a nuclear plant, you would have reliable, cheap energy and reliable, cheap cars that are easier to maintain and accelerate at incredibly fun speeds.

 

[NYC_Eer]

Clearly you didn't read what I wrote. It's not really Trump's fault, either. Neither of their policies particularly helped, but in the grand scheme of things, nothing can really be done, either. I was just saying that if you want to blame Biden...well, he just did exactly what Trump did. Printed money to keep the economy afloat.

But let's be honest. Inflation is mostly being caused by a once in a century pandemic that shut down the worldwide economy and created devastating, worldwide supply chain issues. Did Trump and Biden help things? Not really. But the thought that either one of them singlehandedly caused all of this is ridiculous. It's a perfect storm of multiple variables that are completely outside of the control of the US president. Just like how I don't blame Trump for the 2020 recession, either. I mean, I get why the GOP is hounding the man on it, too. It's a perfect issue for them. Biden really can't do anything about it. It's going to be here until the supply chains catch back up. And by then, the midterms will be well over and it will be onto the next thing. I'd be pounding him on inflation if I were a Republican tribalist, too. Why not?

I was kidding. I firmly believe no one person, Dem President, Rep President or otherwise, could cause inflation like this. Its a confluence of events affecting the whole world...not just the US.

 

[CAJUNEER_rivals]

A feel like a single pipeline isn't going to affect oil prices on a worldwide scale. Maybe I'm wrong. I'd love to see an academic study that actually calculates what the differences in prices may be if the Keystone were online. That would be interesting.

How about 2,000,000 barrels production less per day?

 

[CAJUNEER_rivals]

Trolling hard I see, shew. Oil companies restrict oil production not Joe and obviously it takes many factors to lead to a very shallow recession that may or may not be going on.

They restricted because of government restriction on production.

 

[moe]

They restricted because of government restriction on production.

LInk?