My thoughts on the baseball season

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
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I thought we had a very good year considering we couldn't hit and the injuries we had.

I think a lot of fans thought last year was a fluke, and I think this team proved it wasn't. We won 21 SEC games total including the Tournament, and we won the SEC Tournament a year after going to a SR. Honestly, if we have even half the injuries we did, we probably win at least three more SEC games. But, we didn't, and we controlled what we could.

Certainly, those are not my ultimate goals for our program, but considering where we were two years ago, I'll take it.

I also think this team earned some national respect for MSU baseball for the the first time in years. I think the experts saw us as a program with a good history that is an above average team- depending on the year. We pissed off some people in the SEC and I think in this situation, it's a good thing. I think we also made some fans- I heard a lot of people talk about how they liked the way we played. That to me, is almost as good as any trophy we could win.

The pitching was awesome. I don't know if we will be as good next year, but I really like Woodruff and Lindgren. I also like Trevor Fitts and Will Cox. Holder was lights out this year, and Ross Mitchell was also very good. That's a solid core for the next two years at least. I expect them to improve. Oh yeah- we also have Pollorena and Graveman coming back. Butch deserves a raise.

Defensively, I thought we were average. Especially the infield. I thought the outfield was outstanding defensively with Renfroe, CT, and Brownlee. And then Henderson came on strong. We probably led the SEC in outfield assists. I thought we improved as the year went along, though. Next year, we should be no worse than above average, and I am hoping for better than that. Slauter needs to improve some on blocking balls in the dirt. Rea is really good defensively and Frazier makes plays he should make. I think Alex Detz will be our second baseman and I think Nick Flair will take over at third base. I think Detz will be as good as Frost and Britton at second base and I think Flair will be an improvement over Norris. More importantly, I think they will be upgrades with the bat. I think the outfield will be Hunter Renfroe, CT, and Demarcus.

Now what everyone wants to talk about- hitting. No doubt we need to get better. Some people on here are saying we need to "change our philiosophy". I disagree- we need to add to and improve our philosophy. After all- we used to have a totally different philosophy under a different coach- and it didn't work very well for us either. Why should we go back to something that DIDN'T WORK? And having an offense that doesn't take advantage of what your players can do- that sounds an awful lot like a MSU football coach who occasionally peeps around here. Putting pressure on the defense is a good offensive philiosophy- but what we need to do is IMPROVE it. How? By adding power and more speed. If we have the threat of creating runs and putting pressure on the defense- that in and of itself can cause a team problems. See Vanderbilt vs. Florida in the SEC Tournament. But a team that can create AND has the threat of hitting home runs- scary. Because what pressure does is force mistakes by the other teams- and thus putting your hitters in better situations. Better hitting situations for power hitters and mistakes by the opponent = more home runs. It also makes you more versatile because it would allow us to adapt better to ballparks like FSU's and win slugfests and at the same time we can also adjust to hitter's ballparks better as well.

We also need to be able to run the bases in terms of stealing better. Again, like power- it's another tool that we can use to put pressure on the other team and wreak havoc. Put it all together- again, a team that no one wants to face. That's what we need to get to. And now that we have experience and some talent and hopefully good health- we should be much, much better next year.

Right now- I am excited about the future of MSU baseball. We had a good season. BUT there are some goals and things to work towards. No doubt the coaches will stress all of the close SEC losses in the offseason. That ultimately cost us a regional host bid. Also- no doubt the team will not forget this regional, and I think they will be hungry to achieve their goals next year.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
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I thought we had a very good year considering we couldn't hit and the injuries we had.

I think a lot of fans thought last year was a fluke, and I think this team proved it wasn't. We won 21 SEC games total including the Tournament, and we won the SEC Tournament a year after going to a SR. Honestly, if we have even half the injuries we did, we probably win at least three more SEC games. But, we didn't, and we controlled what we could.

Certainly, those are not my ultimate goals for our program, but considering where we were two years ago, I'll take it.

I also think this team earned some national respect for MSU baseball for the the first time in years. I think the experts saw us as a program with a good history that is an above average team- depending on the year. We pissed off some people in the SEC and I think in this situation, it's a good thing. I think we also made some fans- I heard a lot of people talk about how they liked the way we played. That to me, is almost as good as any trophy we could win.

The pitching was awesome. I don't know if we will be as good next year, but I really like Woodruff and Lindgren. I also like Trevor Fitts and Will Cox. Holder was lights out this year, and Ross Mitchell was also very good. That's a solid core for the next two years at least. I expect them to improve. Oh yeah- we also have Pollorena and Graveman coming back. Butch deserves a raise.

Defensively, I thought we were average. Especially the infield. I thought the outfield was outstanding defensively with Renfroe, CT, and Brownlee. And then Henderson came on strong. We probably led the SEC in outfield assists. I thought we improved as the year went along, though. Next year, we should be no worse than above average, and I am hoping for better than that. Slauter needs to improve some on blocking balls in the dirt. Rea is really good defensively and Frazier makes plays he should make. I think Alex Detz will be our second baseman and I think Nick Flair will take over at third base. I think Detz will be as good as Frost and Britton at second base and I think Flair will be an improvement over Norris. More importantly, I think they will be upgrades with the bat. I think the outfield will be Hunter Renfroe, CT, and Demarcus.

Now what everyone wants to talk about- hitting. No doubt we need to get better. Some people on here are saying we need to "change our philiosophy". I disagree- we need to add to and improve our philosophy. After all- we used to have a totally different philosophy under a different coach- and it didn't work very well for us either. Why should we go back to something that DIDN'T WORK? And having an offense that doesn't take advantage of what your players can do- that sounds an awful lot like a MSU football coach who occasionally peeps around here. Putting pressure on the defense is a good offensive philiosophy- but what we need to do is IMPROVE it. How? By adding power and more speed. If we have the threat of creating runs and putting pressure on the defense- that in and of itself can cause a team problems. See Vanderbilt vs. Florida in the SEC Tournament. But a team that can create AND has the threat of hitting home runs- scary. Because what pressure does is force mistakes by the other teams- and thus putting your hitters in better situations. Better hitting situations for power hitters and mistakes by the opponent = more home runs. It also makes you more versatile because it would allow us to adapt better to ballparks like FSU's and win slugfests and at the same time we can also adjust to hitter's ballparks better as well.

We also need to be able to run the bases in terms of stealing better. Again, like power- it's another tool that we can use to put pressure on the other team and wreak havoc. Put it all together- again, a team that no one wants to face. That's what we need to get to. And now that we have experience and some talent and hopefully good health- we should be much, much better next year.

Right now- I am excited about the future of MSU baseball. We had a good season. BUT there are some goals and things to work towards. No doubt the coaches will stress all of the close SEC losses in the offseason. That ultimately cost us a regional host bid. Also- no doubt the team will not forget this regional, and I think they will be hungry to achieve their goals next year.
 

FlabLoser

Redshirt
Aug 20, 2006
10,709
0
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Pitching was great and defensively the infield was average.

But we led the nation and set a school record in double plays. Was this due to the pitching?
 

DirtyLopez

Redshirt
Feb 26, 2008
1,417
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on Norris? He was doing really well before he got hurt. Do you think the injuries had anything to do with his struggles after he came back? And what if Rae doesn't learn to hit the curve ball? Is Detz the juco from california?
 

drt7891

Redshirt
Dec 6, 2010
6,727
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Butch Thompson has said many times before games that are anticipated to be pitchers duels, "the team with the pitchers that will keep the ball under the opponents bat the best will win the game." Good pitchers (ground ball pitchers, especially) rely on a lot of sinking action with their pitches and that results in the opponent hitting on top of the ball. Double plays will generally result from a pitch that looks good to the batter, but still has sinking action and the batter will lose control on placement and power.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
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the pitchers and the middle infielders.

Pitching because they executed the pitch.

And in the middle infielders for turning it. And Wes for getting the return throw at times. Lot of things that can go wrong and prevent a double play, and usually it doesn't take much.
 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,062
25,095
113
The only injury that really hurt us was Bradford, and he's just an average player to begin with. He wouldn't have made any difference in the regional losses. We had a great season with the complete lack of talent we have offensively. But the key for next year isn't getting injured players back healthy, the key is getting some of the recruits to come in and contribute immediately.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
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I think he will pitch for us next year. I think him scrapping third base and focusing on pitching only might allow him to be a more productive player for us. That's kind of what happened with Holder. I don't expect him to come out and be Jonathan Holder- but I think he can be pretty good for us.

I think it will allow Nick Flair to step in and I'm not so sure that wouldn't have happened had he been healthy this year. I think Flair can have a year a lot like Hunter Renfroe this year- about 5 home runs and a .250 ish batting average. I think he will improve our defense as well. To me, that would be an upgrade over Norris especially when you consider that everyone else should improve.

As far as Rea- I think some of his problems had to do with his shoulder. After he got that shot in the arm, he hit a lot better. As far as him hitting curve balls- you have to trust the coaches and Rea to work on that. If he doesn't- we play someone else.

Detz is the JUCO from California.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
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That would be my guess. If Renfroe wants to catch- I could see him and Slauter splitting time with Hunter learning from Mitch on how to handle pitchers and then playing some in the outfield when he doesn't catch.

If you are correct, our outfield would then be:

RF- Renfroe/Henderson
CF- CT
LF- Henderson/Robson
 

weblow

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
2,860
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patdog said:
The only injury that really hurt us was Bradford, and he's just an average player to begin with. He wouldn't have made any difference in the regional losses.

You have spent the entire season sounding like a complete and total dipshit. If you cannot see that injuries had a massive impact on our season, then you should give up following sports on any level and pursue something that requires less intelligence, like painting the stripes in parking lots or refilling the glasses of water at your local Denny's.

Your post this season achieved a legendary level of ignorance.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
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and see how you do. Or even with a hurt leg like Norris- you can't drive the ball. That's what many on our team did all year.

CT hit .303 as a freshman and is defensively one of the best I have seen at MSU. His arm is incredibly accurate for an outfielder. For reference- Adam Frazier hit .274 as a freshman and was benched. And CT made the Cape Cod League as a freshman. I hope he is an average player for us- because that means we are one of the most talented teams in the country.

Not having him healthy hurt us really, really bad.

Again- see Wes Rea. He gets his arm patched up and he almost immediately gets out of his slump. It would have been nice to have had Demarcus Henderson for the couple of weeks that he had a broken hand, too.
 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,062
25,095
113
Who was hurt besides Bradford that's worth a ****? The simple fact is we suck offensively, and injuries isn't the reason.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
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Most teams want two catchers anyway. Putting Slauter out there everyday isn't really the most idea thing.

I could see something like Slauter start on Friday and Sunday and then Renfroe start Sat. and midweek to rest Mitch.

No doubt both will see plenty of playing time.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
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we are hosting a regional and we don't have to go to Tallahassee. Because we would have won at least 19 SEC games and the SEC Tournament.

The majority of our losses were either one run losses or extra inning losses. You don't think that having a healthy CT, Norris, Rea, Henderson, Brent Brownlee or Nick Flair would have made a difference during the season? Seriously?

I think the worst part about the injuries was it slowed down the development of some of our players too.
 

weblow

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
2,860
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38
First off Bradford was hurt. That puts us with our best outfielder on the bench. Maybe if CT is in, Pollo, who I love by the way, does not have to play in the outfield and bat. Maybe CT, if he was able to take all of his at bats this year, get that much more experience seeing pitches, could have been a better option at the plate than Pollo.

Maybe Norris, who's knee is ten kinds of !@#+%% up, is playing at 3rd instead of a guy that has proven over and over again that he is not capable of making the throw from 3rd to first and basically cost us the game.

Maybe Hendersen, who had his trips to the plate cut in half this year due to a broken bone in his hand could have seen pitching all year long and had that much more experience at the plate. Maybe with all those at bats under his belt he settles in and quits chasing pitches out of the zone.

Maybe Bracewell has pitched in 5 more games and improved each game. Extended the number of innings he could pitch instead of missing a ton of the season with a sore arm.

Then again, maybe if you just had the understanding of the game that my 9 year old kid has, I wouldn't be having to explain this to you and you would not have made yourself look like a total dipshit repeatedly since the season started. It appears that you are the only fool who thinks "The only injury that really hurt us was Bradford, and he's just an average player to begin with."

Seriously, greeter at Walmart, grocery bagger/cart guy......understanding sports is not for you, that you have proven beyond the shadow of a doubt.
 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,062
25,095
113
That's not a terribly heavy load for any catcher. How many SEC teams this year split the catching duties this year? I'mbeing seriousbecause I haven't researched it. But I haven't really seen it that much.
 

MSDawg34

Redshirt
Aug 30, 2011
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1. Why would we take his healthy bat out of the lineup. Before the injury he was mashing and besides Frazier our only hitter with a clue. I would hope he could compete to be our everyday DH.

2. Has he even worked on pitching? How much effectiveness has he lost by not getting experience this season? How will his bum knee take the toll of pitching, which seems to be more wear/tear on a knee (I know he hurt it hitting, that was a fluke though).

3. I don't see him as a SP and we return a DEEP set of pitchers as well as adding some like Shelly who you are so high on. Will it be worth taking his bat away for a limited roll out of the pen?

I think it would be foolish to lose his bat
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
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starts around 40-42 games or so. There are exception like Florida who has a guy that is really good.

It's not four days a week- it's doing it over 56 games.

It's not an ideal situation to have a guy catch everyday. I would say most teams have a starter that catches 3 and then has one day off or they DH on their day off.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
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1. Norris wants to pitch. Pitching is what he thinks is his best shot in pro baseball. The coaches think very highly of Flair, and as I said- he probably would have been starting had he not been hurt. Flair was the player of the year in New Orleans after his senior year and was drafted by the Pirates in the 25th round.

2. Yes- Norris pitched some last year, pitched in the summer and the fall. I think he would have pitched some this year had he not hurt his knee. His knee should be healthy by the fall. Daryl was actually drafted out of high school by the Rangers as a pitcher.

3. I don't see him as a starting pitcher either, but we lose Caleb Reed and Nick Routt. We can't have enough good pitching. We will see what his role is next year.
 

lawdawg02

Redshirt
Jan 23, 2007
4,120
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But I could see him playing midweek or some early weekend games. We did the same thing with Easley and Diggs a few years ago, I think. Didn't Easley play a little 3B at times?
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
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There are a lot of ways we could have a platoon set-up. A lot of actually would depend on who the pitchers are comfortable with.
 

MSDawg34

Redshirt
Aug 30, 2011
1,080
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How are those rabbits?

 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,062
25,095
113
This year, he didn't do anything before his first injury and didn't do anything between the 2 injuries. Last year, he didn't do anything the second half of the season. He just looks to me like a player who had a lot of success early and then people figured out how to pitch him after a couple of months and he's been about a .260 hitter ever since. As for me being right about baseball, I was right about our offense this year. People said for months that all our "young" guys needed was some experience and they'd be fine. And how they'd turned the corner in the SEC tournament (despite scoring less in the SECT than we did during the regular season). Well, a full season of experience gave us 2 runs in 18 innings against Samford. And we didn't even see their ace. He got shelled by Florida St. Now the disussion on this board is how many of these guys will be able to keep their jobs next year.
 

patdog

Heisman
May 28, 2007
56,062
25,095
113
I'm not sure, but his average dropped from .400 to.300 so it couldn't have been too good. What did he hit in the SEC tournament and in the super? What did he hitthis season before his first injury? What about for the whole season this year? He feasted on a lot of bad pitching early last season (and in the regional), but he hasn't been able to hit good pitching his whole career.
 
Dec 27, 2009
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to give Slauter some relief, and leave Renfroe in RF. He's too good to take out of RF, and we don't have anyone else with his kind of arm out there. Let Garner catch midweek games and get him ready for his Soph. year, he's supposed to be our best recruit this year.
 

KurtRambis4

Redshirt
Aug 30, 2006
15,926
0
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great, my SPS stalker...the kid who turned down a volunteer baseball coaching position at Jim Hill and who has a subscription to Baseball America and full access to Microsoft Excelt (thanks to McCool)...how's that breakdown on the team's swings coming?

/still waiting
/excel cannot compute
 

BiscuitEater

Redshirt
Aug 29, 2009
4,178
0
36
Todd4State said:
I thought we had a very good year considering we couldn't hit and the injuries we had.

We also need to be able to run the bases in terms of stealing better. Again, like power- it's another tool that we can use to put pressure on the other team and wreak havoc.


Add the 3+ games we 'gave away' with atrocious base running. I totally understand the need to be aggressive and to put additional pressure on the ‘other’ team BUT too many times, we simply gave away scoring opportunities with mistakes on the paths.
 

Seinfeld

All-American
Nov 30, 2006
11,015
6,746
113
The reason I ask specifically about him is that I feel like he has a chance to be one of our most improved players if the right things fall into place. He's gotten a lot of grief on this board in the past due to the occasional boneheaded play or staring at strikes, but I felt like he really started hitting the ball well in the SEC tourney. Unfortunately, though, a lot of his hard hits seemed to go right towards the fielders. Anyway, it just seems like with a little maturity and continued hard work, he could really end up being a solid player for us before it's all said and done.
 

Todd4State

Redshirt
Mar 3, 2008
17,411
1
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I think he can hit somewhere between 5-10 home runs (closer to 5) by the time he is a junior and hit about .300-.320. I'd like to see him steal some more bases- he stole 6 this year and that should increase with more playing time.

I'd like to see him continue to get better defensively now that it seems like we have found a spot for him to play. He's already pretty good in that arena. Just improve the little things.