NCAA/Recruiting Investigation proposal

shotgunDawg

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Nov 13, 2011
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I light of the OM news this morning, and how they "possibly", but unlikely could land the #1 recruiting class in the country, I got to thinking about how the NCAA could/should create an objective measure for calling in the troops for doing a full scale investigation if a schools recruiting class ranking jumps to much in one year.

There is actually precedence for this sort of action when it comes to the NCAA. When a high school student's SAT score jumps 400 points or more, from the last time they took the test, their score is flagged and the student must retake the test. I also think the same rule applies to an ACT score that jumps 4 to 6 points. In any event, for college entrance exams, there are objective, black and white rules that flag tests that are suspicious.

What this system, ultimately, does is it discourages cheating on the tests because people don't want to face the humiliation of having to take the test again and doing poorly.

In the case of NCAA football recruiting, I believe a similar system could exist, and in the process discourage schools from wide spread cheating. Here is my proposal:

Currently, we have 4 major recruiting networks: Scout, 247, Rivals, and ESPN. Each network ranks players, and while they do differ in many ways, for the most part they are more similar than they are different. As much as we complain about these sites ranking, they do come pretty close to representing the industry's opinion on who the best players are and which teams have recruited the best.

1. NCAA uses these 4 networks to follow football recruiting

2. Once the rankings are final, after signing day, the NCAA throws out each school's LOWEST ranking and averages the other 3.

3. The NCAA would then "Flag" schools who finished in the top 15 of the composite recruiting ranking, and who jumped 10 or more spots in the composite recruiting ranking from the year before.

4. Once schools are "Flagged", the NCAA would have the power to do a full scale investigation without having overwhelming evidence to do so.

This is just an idea, but just trying to find a way for the NCAA to have to objective teeth, and to discourage schools from cheating rampantly. Basically, in order for a team to jump in the recruiting rankings, without getting investigated, they would have to gradually get better over a a few year. The NCAA should just have a rule that flags massive jumps, and allows them to do an investigation without having to have overwhelming evidence.

I think it would discourage teams from cheating rampantly in one year.

This sort of things would have not been plausible 10 or 5 years ago, but the better these recruiting sites get, the more info the NCAA has. They would be dumb not to use it.

Al Capone was caught for tax evasion.
 
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Aug 18, 2009
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So basically, if you are rich, you can continue to be rich. But if you are poor, how dare you try to become rich? That's your "objective" standard for investigations?

/facepalm
 

shotgunDawg

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Nov 13, 2011
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So basically, if you are rich, you can continue to be rich. But if you are poor, how dare you try to become rich? That's your "objective" standard for investigations?

/facepalm

Not at all, but you don't find it suspicious, when a school jumps 10 or more spots in one year. There is nothing saying that you can't get better every year, and eventually end up with the #1 class. Thats how it should naturally happen. There is also nothing that says the NCAA would find anything if they did an investigation.

There is absolutely nothing that says the the rich get richer and the poor can't get rich. It just simply "flags" recruiting classes that are out of the norm. Nothing wrong with a school over a 4 year period going from 25, 16, 8, 4, 1 or so. That isn't suspicious to me.
 

Mr. Chen

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Aug 22, 2012
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I'm not really a smart guy

I light of the OM news this morning, and how they "possibly", but unlikely could land the #1 recruiting class in the country, I got to thinking about how the NCAA could/should create an objective measure for calling in the troops for doing a full scale investigation if a schools recruiting class ranking jumps to much in one year.

There is actually precedence for this sort of action when it comes to the NCAA. When a high school student's SAT score jumps 400 points or more, from the last time they took the test, their score is flagged and the student must retake the test. I also think the same rule applies to an ACT score that jumps 4 to 6 points. In any event, for college entrance exams, there are objective, black and white rules that flag tests that are suspicious.

What this system, ultimately, does is it discourages cheating on the tests because people don't want to face the humiliation of having to take the test again and doing poorly.

In the case of NCAA football recruiting, I believe a similar system could exist, and in the process discourage schools from wide spread cheating. Here is my proposal:

Currently, we have 4 major recruiting networks: Scout, 247, Rivals, and ESPN. Each network ranks players, and while they do differ in many ways, for the most part they are more similar than they are different. As much as we complain about these sites ranking, they do come pretty close to representing the industry's opinion on who the best players are and which teams have recruited the best.

1. NCAA uses these 4 networks to follow football recruiting

2. Once the rankings are final, after signing day, the NCAA throws out each school's LOWEST ranking and averages the other 3.

3. The NCAA would then "Flag" schools who finished in the top 15 of the composite recruiting ranking, and who jumped 10 or more spots in the composite recruiting ranking from the year before.

4. Once schools are "Flagged", the NCAA would have the power to do a full scale investigation without having overwhelming evidence to do so.

This is just an idea, but just trying to find a way for the NCAA to have to objective teeth, and to discourage schools from cheating rampantly. Basically, in order for a team to jump in the recruiting allows them to do


Al Capone was caught for tax evasion.

But I would just start at investigating recruits who flash cash on their twitter...
 

shotgunDawg

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Nov 13, 2011
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this is a terrible idea. that is all.


"That is all", is code for I am not smart enough to think of how to improve the idea or have a better idea.


What's wrong with the proposal, and how would you change it?


Heaven forbid we try to create ideas that help regulate cheating in college recruiting.
 
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Aug 18, 2009
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It's a horrible idea because you want the NCAA to "objectively" investigate schools for recruiting well based upon entirely subjective rankings. Let's say a school signs 10 three star guys one year. Just so happens, all 10 of those guys have top 20 rated younger brothers and all come to that school to play with their older brother. If said school was subjectively ranked #20 one year and #7 the next, your proposal means there should automatically be an investigation. (which will turn up something, because let's face it, no school is completely clean)

That's just a completely assinnine and short-sighted way of thinking through the issue of cheating in the recruiting world. It does nothing but allow the "big boys" to continue to cheat with impunity, while punishing anyone who threatens them. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.
 
Aug 18, 2009
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There is nothing "objective" about your desire for new legislation that would

prevent your in-state rival from recruiting the way they are this year. Your entire premise starts with a flaw.
 

shotgunDawg

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Nov 13, 2011
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It's a horrible idea because you want the NCAA to "objectively" investigate schools for recruiting well based upon entirely subjective rankings. Let's say a school signs 10 three star guys one year. Just so happens, all 10 of those guys have top 20 rated younger brothers and all come to that school to play with their older brother. If said school was subjectively ranked #20 one year and #7 the next, your proposal means there should automatically be an investigation. (which will turn up something, because let's face it, no school is completely clean)

That's just a completely assinnine and short-sighted way of thinking through the issue of cheating in the recruiting world. It does nothing but allow the "big boys" to continue to cheat with impunity, while punishing anyone who threatens them. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.

Geez, you mad Bro?

Your right, but this a very very unlikely scenario. Just trying to think of ways to make the system better and more fair. Right now it is not. Plus, the NCAA may not find anything.

The individual rankings are subjective, but when you include all 4 of them, it does represent the industries' opinion. It is a great way to determine magnitude of suspicion.
 
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patdog

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May 28, 2007
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That's the problem with you and a lot of MSU fans. You'd rather ***** about how the NCAA mostly turns an eye to blatant cheating and ignores it and how they should "do something about it." We'd be a lot better served if MSU and its fans spent half as much energy in trying to use the current situation and work with it to recruit better than we do bitching about something that is not going to change.
 
Aug 18, 2009
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Why does someone have to be "mad" just because they provide a perspective that differs from the person they are responding to? You asked for a reason why people think your idea is bad. I gave you a hypothetical highlighting that reason. Why ask for reasoning if this is the way you are going to respond?
 
Aug 18, 2009
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No, your proposal is aimed solely at what Ole Miss is doing this year. That's fine, but completely ignores and perennial powerhouse that cheats. You also keep saying the term "objective" meanwhile nothing you suggested has anything to do with objectivity. I don't know how to say that any clearer.

Nowhere have I said that the system doesn't need to be fixed. All I said was that your idea was not a good one, and then I gave you examples of why.
 

Arloguthrie

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Nov 3, 2012
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This idea is exactly like baseline blood testing in cycling,

only if they replaced the blood testing with having the cyclists race on Hell Track to determine who's cheating.

 

Jalakin

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Aug 22, 2012
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The other thing this proposal completely ignores is what a down year in recruiting will do. So if a school loses a coach or has a down year with regards to recruiting and as a result finishes around 40-60 whereas they normally recruit top 25 classes the get investigated for going back to normal levels of recruiting?
 

Dawgzilla

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Mar 3, 2008
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What if the school has a new head coach who is in his first full year of recruiting for that school? Maybe he's just a good recruiter?

We all find it highly suspicious that UMiss could attract a recruiting class of this caliber given their recent football results, but the NCAA needs something more than a suspicion. Find some facts -- any actual, evidence -- that shows UMiss cheated for even one recruit. Then we'll talk. In the meantime, what do you even suggest the NCAA should investigate? Do they just start asking recruits if they received cash or other improper benefits? They need an actual incident to investigate, not just some generic claim that "they MUST be cheating...."

I always found it highly suspicious that Stansbury was able to sign so many highly rated recruits. The only ones who got investigated, such as Mario Austin, came up clean. That's all that really matters.
 

shotgunDawg

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The other thing this proposal completely ignores is what a down year in recruiting will do. So if a school loses a coach or has a down year with regards to recruiting and as a result finishes around 40-60 whereas they normally recruit top 25 classes the get investigated for going back to normal levels of recruiting?

Very very good point Jalakin. I agree with you, it ignores that.

Just throwing out ideas guys. I am not the smartest person in the world, but I do like to take initiative in finding solutions to problems. I would love to hear some your ideas on how we can make the current system better. Because, obviously it doesn't work.

Nothing is ever going to be fixed unless people really think about ways to fix it. Most people on this board are die-hard college football fans that want the sport to be better. Most of us follow it so closely that we are just as qualified and have the same ability to find solutions as some AD's and presidents. I love college football so much, and I just want the sport to survive and thrive for many many years.

Unlike the NFL, in college football, the best team gets the first pick and the worst team gets the last pick. That system alone doesn't promote parody. The sport will always have some problem, but I will never stop trying to find ways to make it better. Most of my proposals/ opinions suck donkey balls, but sometimes you have to come up with many bad ones to eventually find a good one.
 
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I hope they do land the #1 recruiting class in the country..

..when they go 4-8 in the year 2016, we can laugh. Obviously, they are accepting academic casualty castoffs who now stand as undesirables to all other serious programs. I don't know why this is so hard to figure this out. If you can't read or write, are you are going to get accepted by Alabama, Ohio State or USC? No. You are going to get accepted by Ole Miss.
 

tenureplan

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Dec 3, 2008
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I didn't read this post for a while because I saw all of the terrible idea replies and figured "Why waste my time?" But then I got bored and read it, and they were right about it being an awful idea. Now I'm pissed for wasting my time.
 

stinkfoot

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Aug 23, 2012
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Do you realize this would have resulted in automatic investigations of State in 2 of the last five years? 2011-2012 you dropped 27 spots and 2008-2009 you dropped 14 spots.
 

codeDawg

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Nov 13, 2007
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How about we institute a fair way to compensate people for the revenue they help generate. How is criminalizing a person for accepting payment for their their services in the best interest of the student athlete?