Of course: Lloyd Tubman might be playing for UL this fall
- Thread starter JHB4UK
- Start date
Heres my issue. How do they define a sexual assault, or whatever term they want to use. If you remember, the Colorado State case would be one of your statistics, but it never happened. I don't trust stats from someone with an agenda of any sort, particularly when the stats are not easily and universally defined. The same situation occurs with "mass shootings". An anti gun group claims an exponentially higher number than the FBI because of their definition. I want girls protected but I don't want boys demonized either. How about a modicum of evidence and let our real legal system adjudicate the matter.
He would be best to go to a school other than UL. Many UL fans slammed him when he committed to UK and then again when he was accused of rape. At least Utah State fans have no ugly history with him.
so far as I can determine the case studies I have cited in this and other threads on this topic were done by professionals that had no agenda. I have provided my references so you can interpret it any way you wish.
Yes it was bogus . But so was your 17k...but look the difference...IF UK wins 8 this year along with a bowl next YR we have 40-50 k
back to the West End ..Derby Cruising starts soon Jaybird..:chairshot:
uavel gives away thousands of FREE tickets to try and fill the Pit UK gives away no freebies hat I know of..
I hope, when Louisville kicks our asses (again) that he has 5 sacks. What a complete joke to do this to a kid and his livelihood. Then, when all that transpires, the UK Student Council can undergo an overhaul of all the liberal rape hoaxing idiots that, sadly, our current education culture in this country breeds.
Yea, you're the expert. We should believe your emotional bias over factual data any day. LMAO. Of all the problems in the country, on campus sexual abuse is way the hell down the list.
Since it's so huge, what isn't bigger?
This should be good. Can't wait.
I do. You blow the issue way out of proportion to suit your agenda. Relative to all the world's & country's problems, it's minor. If you want to call the issue huge, then you might as well blow the whole country up as there are way huger issues. Sure it's a big deal to the 4K/yr abused & their families & friends. But what about all the other crimes? Is it right up there with ISIS? North Korea?
This is from your article.
"For instance, a student might report forcible fondling if unwanted groping occurs on a dance floor."
What that means is pretty much any touching can be reported. It is a bit much to associate that with rape and that is where the vast majority of your reports are coming from. Guys are in a pretty tough spot in this environment.
My friend I have no "agenda" other than to look at the facts of an issue and judge it therein. You are continuing to miss the point. This isn't about ranking the severity of this issue against other issues, rather it's about the manner in which universities are handling these cases which in many instances such as UNC, is very detrimental to the victims and for balance there have been other cases like the CSU that jeopardized the rights of the accused. A system driven by money, especially money in sports, reputation and image rather than fairness and proper dealing with criminal activity towards both the victim and the accused.
Petty larceny, bad check writing and speeding are not as significant as felonies, or nuclear war either but that doesn't mean we ignore them and let the perpetrators do as they please. This issue does not "compete" with other issues, it's an issue that has to be judged on it's own merit and corrected accordingly at the administrative level of these institutions.
If you don't see this as an issue that merits any attention, then that's your prerogative.
I understand your concern, but in reality the majority of the case are of rape. For instance if you look at this study (cursor down to page 67 and look at the graph) that was done by 5 independent researchers, they found that 72% of all reports involved rape, not sexual assault which includes groping etc.
Right? Talk about a drive by post with no substance. If 2 players on last years team was accused of rape it would have been a big deal nationally. We are College Basketball. Would have been like the Winston situation at FSU.
I'll never understand why people can't support both programs instead of trying to demonize the other.
Tubman is a sacrificial lamb in today's feminist dominated universities where being accused of rape is almost identical to being convicted of rape
As someone with a close family member going to college who was raped, you sir are another idiot that tries to explain actual problems away by applying political rhetoric.
Defense thank you for finding that study. I think the part of the study that responsible adults can and should contemplate is this:
Overall, 19% of undergraduate women reported experiencing attempted or completed sexual assault since entering college. However, half (52.7%) of our sample had experienced less than 2 years of college. This makes it difficult to predict a woman’s risk of sexual assault during her overall college career. Therefore, another way of looking at these data is to focus on seniors, who are theoretically in their last year of college. When subsetting to seniors, the data show that 368 women (26.3% of seniors) reported experiencing attempted or completed sexual assault since entering college, 6.9% of seniors were victims of physically forced sexual assault since entering college, and 16% of seniors were victims of incapacitated sexual assault since entering college.
I'm aware that some males are falsely accused by females with motives that are akin to extortion but that is a very small percentage. However the statistics in this study point to a real problem that exists and wishing it away will not work. I do tend to believe Tubman got a raw deal in this case but there are far far more women that get a raw deal and none of the attention Tubman gets. The only reason most posters are upset about Tubman is he was a football player, if he wasn't posters here wouldn't care what happens to him or her.
Overall, 19% of undergraduate women reported experiencing attempted or completed sexual assault since entering college. However, half (52.7%) of our sample had experienced less than 2 years of college. This makes it difficult to predict a woman’s risk of sexual assault during her overall college career. Therefore, another way of looking at these data is to focus on seniors, who are theoretically in their last year of college. When subsetting to seniors, the data show that 368 women (26.3% of seniors) reported experiencing attempted or completed sexual assault since entering college, 6.9% of seniors were victims of physically forced sexual assault since entering college, and 16% of seniors were victims of incapacitated sexual assault since entering college.
I'm aware that some males are falsely accused by females with motives that are akin to extortion but that is a very small percentage. However the statistics in this study point to a real problem that exists and wishing it away will not work. I do tend to believe Tubman got a raw deal in this case but there are far far more women that get a raw deal and none of the attention Tubman gets. The only reason most posters are upset about Tubman is he was a football player, if he wasn't posters here wouldn't care what happens to him or her.
You and Lloyd's mother should have a talk because it sure seems to me that you are of the belief that ALL men on college campuses who are accused of rape should be treated as if they are guilty regardless of the circumstances... and I'm sorry if your family member went thru this ordeal and hope she is well.
Let me know where I said it's not an issue that deserves attention.
What I object to the yours & others' objective to blow this out of proportion to the exclusion of more important issues. And that's what goes on here.
BTW, you've toned down your position from a "huge problem" to "merits attention". Net, you recognize you were over the top.
You nailed it. Extremists here could care less that the accused's civil rights are trampled.
Being related to a rape victim gives you no leeway to name calling.
But go ahead all someone an idiot all you like since apparently you are so superior that you lack self-awareness.
that's the message that your posts convey to me, maybe I'm misinterpreting them.
I haven't "blown anything out of proportion", I have cited stats from case studies that I have linked - you can be your own judge of them. The issue, in part, is one that effects college athletes. Accordingly members of our board have found the topic of interest to discuss and a variety of opinions are being expressed herein, including yours. It's not being discussed to the exclusion of anything else. If you deem this issue as not important why are you vigorously participating in the discussion? Most people read past threads that are not important to them. You are welcome to start a thread(s) on any other football related topic you wish.
It's a huge problem, that merits attention IMO. The two are not mutually exclusive.
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That simply isn't true. I don't care if he is a UK basketball player or an average kid. That is not the issue, at all. My issue is, and has been, due process for the accused. The current system does not provide appropriate due process, particularly where such serious accusations as rape are concerned. Accusations which would result in felonies in our legal system should be adjudicated there, not in front of a student review board.
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Did you actually read that study? It had nothing to do with groping. It was very clear on what was counted although some of their determinations and charts were contradictory.
Guys I have deleted the last couple of posts because other members were being attacked. I know this topic raises emotions, and many people have very different opinions, but everyone has a right to express their opinion on here without being attacked personally so let's keep it civil.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Thanks, saved me a post, a very good job of expressing what I was thinking.
Sure, a real tragedy and ruins many a life, both victim AND criminal (and many that might not be criminal, just the accusation is very serious, see Tubman) but not as serious as the HUGE number of minorities that spend most of their life in prison for MOSTLY other crimes when our biggest money is spent not on keeping them out of that vicious cycle but in trying to lock all of them up------
And part of that problem is that "crime" is a HUGE money maker for all the lawyers (that try their best to defend a criminal they know is guilty, see Hilary's first Public Defender case, OR send someone to prison that the DA KNOWS is innocent, click https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randall_Dale_Adams) and the corporations that make a fortune by keeping them there.
By the way, the book "Adams vs Texas" is not only enlightening but also a very good and gripping story, (found it in Readers Digest Condensed Books, probably on the internet also) but most people that read it to the end probably miss the most important thing in the book-----in the prologue it says that Mulder was brought before the Texas Bar Assn to see if he merited any censure (should have gone to jail, not just disbarred) and they found he had done nothing wrong------LOL. Deliberately and falsely sent a man to death row that he KNEW was innocent (to maintain hie PERFECT prosecution record) AND caused the murderer to go free to murder another man.
But what would you expect from the tight knit clique of lawyers that run our country, they stick together like thieves because in most cases the are thieves.
But what would you expect from the tight knit clique of lawyers that run our country, they stick together like thieves because in most cases the are thieves.
If you've read johnnygentles posts, I was being very reserved in my statement. With what he has posted I have no idea why you mods haven't banned him. BTW, my emotions are not running high at all.
Johnny is a fanatic, a true believer, and probably a SJW. There is no point in even trying to engage his type in conversation.
I'm not going to touch the situation that got Tubman dismissed from UK. IIRC, he did not play (or played minimally) at UK his FR year and, per reports here, subsequently red-shirted at Trinity Valley. That would mean he has basically not played since HS.
FWIW, in a new article today by UofL's recruiting counterpart to JRowland, it was reported that IF Tubman plays at UofL this fall it will almost certainly be as a walk on.
Peace
FWIW, in a new article today by UofL's recruiting counterpart to JRowland, it was reported that IF Tubman plays at UofL this fall it will almost certainly be as a walk on.
Peace
No you are very wrong about this and that is understandable. I learned a lot about young women on campus who are raped and because of the legal system have very little protection from their rapists on campus after their rape. For young women it requires a very understanding support system mainly being family that a lot of young women do not have.
It is very similar to the military where women have to deal with their rapists also being their superior officer and very little recourse after their violation because the "good ole boy network" works to protects the male criminal to the point of public campaigns to drum up sympathy. I'm not berating you but I am saying most decent men in this country have very little knowledge about what a young woman deals with after they are raped.
For women.... due process often means being treated like a low life slut and criminal more so than her rapist. Have you ever heard a man being question about his suggestive attire? How about his being questioned on how many sex partners he has had in his life? It is a very one sided disclosure procedure most times designed to intimidate the victim into a settlement. See FSU and UF about their specific lawyers who handle their cases. That unfortunately has a side-effect, the end result being unscrupulous women working the system to get to a settlement. It is a pretty screwed up system that has little to do with justice or truth.
It seems pretty obvious from reading stories of both sides in these situations that the system is very broke and needs fixing in the worse way. This is not rocket science and it could be handled very differently for both sides if authorities really cared.
I understand your position, I really do. However, I hope you can agree that the young man at Colorado State has been abused himself. He is the poster child for what is wrong with the system. I hope whoever attacked your family member rots under the jail.