OFFICIAL NET Thread - 2022/23

[PSAL_Hoops]

Unless WVU goes and beats TCU another Quad 1 win which makes it 3 and now they are 11-7. Still work to do and like Oklahoma plenty of opportunities. I think WVU and Oklahoma are the 7 and 8 teams out of the BIG 12 . We will see but being in the BiG 12 with all those Quad 1 chances give them the best chance compared to all other teams on the bubble.

We’ll see. It’s a home win over a 4 loss TCU team. That’s good but - TCU has a loss to Northwestern St and is now 3-3 in B12 play. Nice wins over KState, Prov and Iowa certainly offset so TCU is a solid field team but WVU will need a lot more than this and also being perfect against the bottom of the BIG.

The at large competition coild be teams like SHU and Wake who might end up with a lot fewer overall losses. A win is still a win - beating Butler or FSU regardless of the margin is going to be viewed more favorably than piles of losses - even close ones. That is, so long as the quality wins are also there. @ RU and UConn wins stack up just fine with @ Pitt and TCU. Add wins over Kansas and company and maybe things change for WVU.

 

[ScarletDave]

As predicted, we jump Xavier to move to #17. Xavier falls to 22.

Inexplicably, OSU only falls 4 spots from 24 to 28 with their 5th straight loss. Indiana is 32. These are 2 of the bottom 4 teams in the B1G standings

 

[RUJMM78]

As predicted, we jump Xavier to move to #17. Xavier falls to 22.

Inexplicably, OSU only falls 4 spots from 24 to 28 with their 5th straight loss. Indiana is 32. These are 2 of the bottom 4 teams in the B1G standings

Perception matters more than fans would like.it to happen.Ohio State and Indiana have high favorable recognition regardless of their league record.

 

[fluoxetine]

Perception matters more than fans would like.it to happen.Ohio State and Indiana have high favorable recognition regardless of their league record.

It’s a computer algorithm. Perception has nothing to do with it.

 

[RUChoppin]

SHU jumps from 65 to 61, and UConn falls from 7 to.... nope, they're still 7. Not sure how that works. I'm guessing there was a big gap between 7 and 8 before, but it's much narrower now.

 

[RUChoppin]

Comparison between major conferences right now:

B12 has 7 teams in the Top 30, 9 in the Top 60, and all 10 in the Top 90. 0 lower than 90.
B1G has 4 teams in the Top 30, 10 in the Top 60, and 13 in the Top 90. 1 lower than 90.
SEC has 4 teams in the Top 30, 9 in the Top 60, and 9 in the Top 90. 5 lower than 90.
BE has 4 teams in the Top 30, 4 in the Top 60, and 7 in the Top 90. 3 lower than 90.
ACC has 3 teams in the Top 30, 8 in the Top 60, and 9 in the Top 90. 6 lower than 90.
P12 has 2 teams in the Top 30, 3 in the Top 60, and 8 in the Top 90. 4 lower than 90.

 

[bac2therac]

SHU jumps from 65 to 61, and UConn falls from 7 to.... nope, they're still 7. Not sure how that works. I'm guessing there was a big gap between 7 and 8 before, but it's much narrower now.

It seems Non conference play plays a big role in NET rankings

 

[Zak57]

Perception matters more than fans would like.it to happen.Ohio State and Indiana have high favorable recognition regardless of their league record.

The NET doesn't take perception into account.

 

[LeapinLou]

SHU jumps from 65 to 61, and UConn falls from 7 to.... nope, they're still 7. Not sure how that works. I'm guessing there was a big gap between 7 and 8 before, but it's much narrower now.

Among the top 15 teams in the NET, 13 teams have 3 losses or fewer, and only one has as many as 5 losses. UConn is that team and yet they are ranked 7th by the NET? I'm starting to wonder if the NET formula is purposely nebulous so some shenanigans can go on.

 

[fluoxetine]

It seems Non conference play plays a big role in NET rankings

I think every game is weighted equally. Most of the surprising NET results are mirrored in Bart/Kenpom. UConn is still #6 and Ohio St #21 in kenpom

 

[RUtrumpet92_rivals498139]

Nebraska winning last night really didn't hurt our status much at all for the moment, because OSU is still a Q1 win. It also helps to keep them buried in the standings, not a bad thing either as I see Nebraska as being less likely to make a run at us in the standings

WVU net jumps back to 24. They are going to be an odd case at the end of the year if they cannot put together a lot of wins. Great net with a middling winning % could mean the committee splits the difference and sends them to Dayton. Good Q1 win for them last night.

Oklahoma State and Oklahoma basically switched places after their game last night. OSU from 56 to 46, and OU from 45 to 54. But again, OSU at only 10-8 means they have a lot of work to do.

Other than that, not a lot of movement in the top 100 yesterday.

 

[bac2therac]

I think every game is weighted equally. Most of the surprising NET results are mirrored in Bart/Kenpom. UConn is still #6 and Ohio St #21 in kenpom

except non conference play seems to dictating alot about the general area a team will be in

the fact that uconn can lose to seton hall and stay 7 and they have lost 5 of 6 tells as well tells me that the non conference is playing a big role

 

[bac2therac]

I think every game is weighted equally. Most of the surprising NET results are mirrored in Bart/Kenpom. UConn is still #6 and Ohio St #21 in kenpom

any ranking system that has UConn is severely flawed, ditto for 8 loss teams at #21

the white elephant in the room is that win loss percentage is not being weighted enough and its inexplicable that it is not...winning matters

 

[RUChoppin]

UConn's NET record is still pretty sound.... I don't know if it's #7 sound, though.

They have 5 losses, but 4 are road Q1 games. The one true blemish on their record is the home loss to SJU.

 

[Jtg=04131996]

It also can’t be ignored that UConn has blown out both minnows and a bunch of good teams.

24 point win vs. Oregon
15 point win vs. Bama
18 points win vs. Iowa state
21 point win vs. Florida
22 point win vs. Butler

Those are some impressive margins.

 

[Mr_Twister]

It also can’t be ignored that UConn has blown out both minnows and a bunch of good teams.

24 point win vs. Oregon
15 point win vs. Bama
18 points win vs. Iowa state
21 point win vs. Florida
22 point win vs. Butler

Those are some impressive margins.

And we can assume their margins in defeat are narrow.

 

[bac2therac]

And we can assume their margins in defeat are narrow.

3 losses by double digits....10., 11, 12

 

[bac2therac]

Arkansas resume needs work....good win over San Diego State but their only other quality win is Missouri, 1-5 in the SEC says alot

they do have to go to Baylor but I dont think their SEC schedule is all that tough

to be honest I do not think the SEC is all that good, sort of surprised at all the hype they got. I just do not see it.

 

[bac2therac]

just glancing because I have not gone in depth yet (coming in two weeks) but honestly the bubble this year is pretty scarce. Not alot of smaller or mid majors schools contending for bids and I really see a very less interesting bubble then other seasons. Tons of bloated mediocrity from power 6 schools

 

[Eagleton95.99]

any ranking system that has UConn is severely flawed, ditto for 8 loss teams at #21

the white elephant in the room is that win loss percentage is not being weighted enough and its inexplicable that it is not...winning matters

Close losses vs. decent teams don't seem to hurt much. Similarly close wins vs. similar teams don't help as much as it seems it should. Margin of victory really seems to matter a lot.

 

[kcg88]

just glancing because I have not gone in depth yet (coming in two weeks) but honestly the bubble this year is pretty scarce. Not alot of smaller or mid majors schools contending for bids and I really see a very less interesting bubble then other seasons. Tons of bloated mediocrity from power 6 schools

Yup. Atlantic 10 has no one. WCC has no one past Gonzaga and St. Mary's. It's strong in the sense that I think Ohio State and Michigan are pretty talented for instance but resume wise it's weak.

 

[goru7]

except non conference play seems to dictating alot about the general area a team will be in

the fact that uconn can lose to seton hall and stay 7 and they have lost 5 of 6 tells as well tells me that the non conference is playing a big role

Very true . I was suprised to see UConn stayed at 7 but apparently they were leading almost the entire game and their metrics against a good defensive team like Seton Hall was still very good. They led for like 39+ minutes. Only reason I see they stayed at 7

 

[RUChoppin]

just glancing because I have not gone in depth yet (coming in two weeks) but honestly the bubble this year is pretty scarce. Not alot of smaller or mid majors schools contending for bids and I really see a very less interesting bubble then other seasons. Tons of bloated mediocrity from power 6 schools

"Bloated mediocrity" being translated roughly as "parity"

 

[G- RUnit]

This is where I strenuously disagree with BAC and all the weak bubble talk or all the bloated mediocrity talk.

There are a ton of really good teams out there and they are not “ Bloated Mediocrity. Nor is the bubble weak.

How many times have we seen Cuse make a run out of nowhere?

Two years ago an 11 seed bubble team in a Play in game, UCLA, made it to the Final Four. They had to win a helluva play in game against MSU to get there.

Last year an 8 seed, UNC, made it to the Finals and damn near won it all.

Two bubble power 6 teams grossly underseeded, RU and ND, played in a play in game last year that one website labeled as the best NCAA tourney game in the last seven years.

So I am not buying the bloated mediocrity argument. Parity yes.

 

[bac2therac]

I think it still bloated mediocrity

 

[G- RUnit]

Is #11 UCLA making if to the Final Four bloated mediocrity? Beating MSU in a great play in game to get there?
Is UNC in the dreaded 8-9 game and then almost winning the entire tourney bloated mediocrity
I think those results undercut that argument IMHO.

 

[Degaz-RU]

I'm just going to chime in here to say that I think that the NET's focus on out of conference games being equivalent to conference games is kind of ridiculous. Most OOC games are played in November and December, before teams have really gelled.

Games played in early part of the season should have less weight in the algorithm than more recent games. There should be at least SOME "incremental" higher weight given to games played in January, February and early March.

 

[G- RUnit]

I'm just going to chime in here to say that I think that the NET's focus on out of conference games being equivalent to conference games is kind of ridiculous. Most OOC games are played in November and December, before teams have really gelled.

Games played in early part of the season should have less weight in the algorithm than more recent games. There should be at least SOME "incremental" higher weight given to games played in January, February and early March.

Agree 100%.

I think the other issue was weighing bad loses higher than good wins right?

Lafayette lost hurt us more than a good win at Purdue helped us.

Weren’t rewarding excellence but were ironically penalizing a mediocre loss. Lol

 

[RUChoppin]

More teams are better, and fewer teams are elite. That creates a glut of teams that would warrant 5-12 seeds, and fewer that clearly warrant 1-4 seeds. But that is a result of greater parity, which will make for a more exciting tournament instead of being able to lock in a bunch of one and two seeds deep into the tournament.

 

[bac2therac]

I dont find school like Oklahoma, West Virginia, Michigan who will finish with 14-15 losses better

 

[krzymick]

The NET ranking system seems to have quite a few flaws. Makes no sense how Saint Mary's is at 8 with a 1-1 Q1 and 5-1 Q2 record and Kansas State is 15 with a 5-1 Q1 and a 1-1 Q2 record. Saint Mary's even has 2 Q3 losses while Kansas St. has none.
or how about we compare Boise St to Iowa. Boise St. is at #19 with a 0-1 Q1 and 7-2 Q2 record with a Q4 loss while Iowa is at #35 with a 3-3 Q1 record and 4-2 Q2 record also with a Q4 loss.

 

[bac2therac]

Because non conference and sos is given much too weight yet win/loss percentage is an afterthought

 

[krzymick]

Because non conference and sos is given much too weight yet win/loss percentage is an afterthought

Yeah, Creighton at #20 with a 11-8 record is crazy.

 

[bac2therac]

Yeah, Creighton at #20 with a 11-8 record is crazy.

And Osu at 10-8 in the top 30

 

[RUChoppin]

I dont find school like Oklahoma, West Virginia, Michigan who will finish with 14-15 losses better

But they are comparatively.

Oklahoma is the 9th ranked school in the B12 in NET at #54 (11-7). Last year that was KState at #69 (16-17), and the year before was KState at #176 (9-19).

Michigan is the 12th ranked school in the B1G in NET at #75 (10-7). Last year that was Penn State at #88 (14-17), and the year before was Northwestern at #95 (8-15).

It's not Oklahoma or Michigan themselves.... it's the bottoms of the conferences that are getting better. But when your worst teams are competitive, they're going to jump up and bite better teams more regularly than if they are bottom feeders. But that means you don't get runaway favorites that are 4 or 5 games ahead of 2nd or 3rd place in their conference, destined for easy 1 or 2 seed placement.

 

[bac2therac]

Are they really more competitive

Oklahoma had 15 losses last year
Michigan was another skin of their teeth in NCAA with 14 losses

Dont get caught up in net rankings

Florida Atlantic is in top 15

Uconn is 7 despite 5 losses in last 6

 

[ScarletDave]

It should be W/L over everything. That’s the point of the game of basketball. Win it by 1 not 15. Teams dribble the ball out at the end, hurts their rankings.

 

[RUChoppin]

Are they really more competitive

Oklahoma had 15 losses last year
Michigan was another skin of their teeth in NCAA with 14 losses

Dont get caught up in net rankings

Florida Atlantic is in top 15

Uconn is 7 despite 5 losses in last 6

Depends on your definition, as all things are relative. If there are fewer elite schools, and those at the top pick up more losses to teams at the bottom of the conference..... is it that the top schools are worse, or that the bottom schools are more competitive?

If parity becomes a trend, you're going to see more teams in the field with more losses - because the 20-win threshold will become harder and harder to achieve.

 

[Zak57]

21 after the L last night.

 

[bac2therac]

Indiana at 23 now moved up to Q1 win for RU. Ohio State at 30 barely staying as a Q1 and Michigan St now up to 37