The IHSA needs to act very quickly on this. And by quickly I mean the end of the night or Tomorrow morning
OFFICIALS!
- Thread starter JFelice
- Start date
The IHSA needs to act very quickly on this. And by quickly I mean the end of the night or Tomorrow morning
Why not just add another game for next week....
I'd like to see Fenwick vs Palatine. We just call it the suburban version city private/public league game. Why not??
Wassup
I'd like to see Fenwick vs Palatine. We just call it the suburban version city private/public league game. Why not??
Wassup
That there's no precedent for dealing with this kind of thing doesn't mean that the IHSA can't create a precedent now. I don't think that it would open Pandora's box. It would just state a precedent saying that for all games, if time has expired and there's an intentional grounding call, and that call wrongly awards the other team with an additional play such that that additional play changes the outcome of the game, then that additional play shouldn't be counted and the result that would have held otherwise DOES in fact hold. So Fenwick wins and plays next week.
I'm sure there is an appeal process but it would have to be done very quickly.
The IHSA has no problem reviewing other aspects of completed games (i.e. Doling out suspensions to players that were not suspended during the actual game) but that is a far cry from reversing the results of a game. Apparently they are willing to do it if a player is ruled ineligible to play - basketball example provided by a poster. So it is theoretically possible....
Definitely. Would it require a tremendous amount of resources or something for the IHSA to reverse this? I don't see why on earth the IHSA would allow PN and not Fenwick to play next week.
Said this in the other thread, but
heres what happened in basketball. Though this would be huge considerings it for the 7a football state title.
http://www.mywebtimes.com/sports/br...cle_fb406a45-cc11-5236-867f-22ec777ae52a.html
With social media and live streaming, the pressure is on the IHSA here to make a ruling.
Shows a precident of changing the outcome of a contest. Question is - they seem willing to do it for rules violations... are they willing to do it for rule implementeion error?
1972 Munich Olympics. I was stationed in Germany at the time, so I followed the Games pretty close. Mark Spitz's performance was the high point ; this basketball game - the low point - as far as the U.S. Olympic team was concerned. Doug Collins (ISU) was on that U.S. team by the way. The silver medals are still sitting in a bank vault in Munich the last I heard. The U.S. team refused to accept the result of the game. A detailed Wikipedia article on this game (1972 Olympic Men's Basketball Final) gives a very detailed discussion of the reason for the controversy.
IHSA has admitted they were wrong, they "feel terrible" but by-laws does not allow them to overturn an officials call. So Fenwick is done. Sickening lack of responsibility.
They are following their stated by laws.
Are they supposed to break their by laws? What's the point of having them then?
Why on earth would you have a law stating that “the decisions of game officials shall be final; protests against the decision of a game official shall not be reviewed by the Board of Directors"????
That law by its very nature rules out the possibility of correcting horrible situations such as this one. Apparently the IHSA doesn't value justice so much.
That law by its very nature rules out the possibility of correcting horrible situations such as this one. Apparently the IHSA doesn't value justice so much.
Well, yes. If laws weren't subject to be changed then **** I'd still be able to beat my wife in public if she spoke out against me so that I could uphold the reputation of myself and family (I'm referring to a string of legal precedent that dates back to 1832ish made by the courts in North Carolina). Edit: just because laws can be revised or eliminated all together doesn't mean that there is or was no point in having them.
Last edited:
Yes, this is the original PN-Fenwick aftermath thread.
This is my One HUGE regret as an IHSA Official for 4 years doing football: I truly wish I went to this game. The only reason why I wanted to see this game is neither team had been to the state final before. Heck, I don't think Plainfield North HAD WON a playoff game before 2016, more less been in a state semifinal.
I was thinking about it, but it was too cold AND I had officiated basketball games in the morning that day (I don't remember where it was: MY memory thinks St. Charles East but irrelevant). I seem to remember a few inches of snow as well.
IF I went to this game, I would have tried to get to the field and tell those officials the rule myself. And LORD KNOWS I would have tried. This would have been my chance to do what's right. The story I have heard (unsubstantiated) is the White Hat was hell bound on untimed down and was trying to be overruled by 2 or 3 of his crew. White Hat won. The rest is obviously history.
My Anger to all this was 2-fold:
1. Varsity refs need to get penalty enforcement right EVERY TIME.
2. Central-Michigan-OK State was 3 months prior to this game (which is and still is the same rule by the way)
My heart still breaks for everyone involved and I just wish the whole aftermath was dealt with correctly and not by dumb by-laws even corporations think are dumb. Don't ask me why this hit me tonight and not any other day, but that's another day in the life of my brain, which as most of the old-timers know work a lot different than the rest. I feel like crying and I hadn't even cried then. I was mostly angry. As time heals (some) wounds, The voice of reason got to me and realized that humans are always prone to mistake, and life sucks sometimes. But this incident STILL irks the HELL out of me. And I wish I was there to stop it.
This is my One HUGE regret as an IHSA Official for 4 years doing football: I truly wish I went to this game. The only reason why I wanted to see this game is neither team had been to the state final before. Heck, I don't think Plainfield North HAD WON a playoff game before 2016, more less been in a state semifinal.
I was thinking about it, but it was too cold AND I had officiated basketball games in the morning that day (I don't remember where it was: MY memory thinks St. Charles East but irrelevant). I seem to remember a few inches of snow as well.
IF I went to this game, I would have tried to get to the field and tell those officials the rule myself. And LORD KNOWS I would have tried. This would have been my chance to do what's right. The story I have heard (unsubstantiated) is the White Hat was hell bound on untimed down and was trying to be overruled by 2 or 3 of his crew. White Hat won. The rest is obviously history.
My Anger to all this was 2-fold:
1. Varsity refs need to get penalty enforcement right EVERY TIME.
2. Central-Michigan-OK State was 3 months prior to this game (which is and still is the same rule by the way)
My heart still breaks for everyone involved and I just wish the whole aftermath was dealt with correctly and not by dumb by-laws even corporations think are dumb. Don't ask me why this hit me tonight and not any other day, but that's another day in the life of my brain, which as most of the old-timers know work a lot different than the rest. I feel like crying and I hadn't even cried then. I was mostly angry. As time heals (some) wounds, The voice of reason got to me and realized that humans are always prone to mistake, and life sucks sometimes. But this incident STILL irks the HELL out of me. And I wish I was there to stop it.
I don't think fortnight was even a thing back then
Seek professional help, not the 'Edgy's Lost His Mind Free Football Board', and stop wasting peoples' time.
I would invite you to become an official. If nothing else, learn the mechanics, penalty enforcement. Etc I’ve seen a lot of bad lately because basic penalty enforcement etc.
But sitting blindly tossing stones and not helping the situation doesn’t help.
Imagine thinking you could just run onto the field, and not have been tackled by PN security. Imagine further the crew would have even bothered listening to you. Imagine finally that the IHSA wouldn't have taken away your license.
Officiating is killing sports but football specifically! Too many NON-Calls, obvious pass interference not being called, blatant holding in the backfield during pass plays that have TWO officials eyes with no calls... Im glad Im not coaching any longer because I would be banned from coaching after lighting up an Official for incompetence!!!
Officiating is exactly the SAME as it has been since sports were invented. Vast majority of the calls are absolutely correct. Some will be missed.
What's different is the ability for people who think they know the rules, but usually don't, to get out their phone, record a play, and then retroactively look at it slowed down to frame-by frame 20 times before deciding what the "obvious" call should have been. Which, at the levels where money isn't in play, isn't available to the officials.
What's different is the ability for people who think they know the rules, but usually don't, to get out their phone, record a play, and then retroactively look at it slowed down to frame-by frame 20 times before deciding what the "obvious" call should have been. Which, at the levels where money isn't in play, isn't available to the officials.
In high school there are 5 officials. There are not two sets of eyes on any player and maybe one on a given lineman on a play. There is one set on the QB the most important player out there at any level. Go watch the Lions and Packers game and those folks are getting paid a whole lot more than an IHSA official.
Have you filled out an application to become an Official lately?
Bingo....especially for those that dont realize that NFHS rules are MUCH different than College and NFL....
Are you on prescription meds
Ummmm I live in Alabama! I just explained why I wouldn't officiate... Entitled kid that run their mouth and can't grasp basic rules.... Nope... Not for me!~
I watched a game on NFHS and the O crew was like in their 70s... It was painful to watch them attempt to run.
Not all states use 5-man crews. For the playoffs there is no excuse for not using 7-man crews. The kids deserve it and it’s not that difficult of a transition
In theory, but if you're used to a 5 man crew all year and then add 2 more it messes with the cohesiveness and mechanics of the original crew.
