Ofc that helps, but overall the UC system is so well regarded you just don't see that many CA kids outside of CA, unless they can't get in or it's that top notch a school like an Ivy or something similar. I did know a few CA students at RU and they were mostly athletes.
OT: College enrollment and financial issues?
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Ofc that helps, but overall the UC system is so well regarded you just don't see that many CA kids outside of CA, unless they can't get in or it's that top notch a school like an Ivy or something similar. I did know a few CA students at RU and they were mostly athletes.
It strains credulity that all the NJ students going to these places are in the business school or studying golf. Sounds like a pretty specific set of circumstances.
Maybe my memory is failing, but didn't RU beat Clemson in the tournament, and then again the following year?
Once we're onto campus beauty I know we're in the Shop Rite line.
BU has always been in the top list of NJ OOS schools. BC not as much but it's smaller and much harder to get into. Northeastern has been gaming the rankings. Brandeis for some reason has apparently been struggling to attract students and now we're ahead of them.
VT I would put in the bucket of WVU- likely not getting the same kids, probably getting more the kids who don't want to go to Montclair or Willy P which I have more sympathy towards. I knew a lot of kids from my HS who went there for that reason.
Or maybe it was the beautiful campus! Vermont is actually pretty I'll give them that. Too isolated for my taste...but while I think for us Millennials New England had/has allure (a lot of people still want to work in Boston) Gen Z is being told by their parents and social media to move to the South.
When I was in school and Facebook required a .edu address you could see the top HS for RU students and Cherry Hill was there.
I think especially with the cost of college now for the most part, any NJ public HS worth its salt you're going to see RU on Niche as a top, and in most cases, the top school. The larger the contingent of parents from NY/rest of the US and the world, the larger the RU contingent as well because they haven't been poisoned the same way as people living here longest have to hate everything about NJ.
It's to ours as well, but historically our ability to do so has been legally constrained. And because the economy has been on a yo yo since the great recession, it is more likely to stay that way as now many wealthier NJ parents are interested in RU.
For those interested, room, board, and tuition for out of state students is $42,000 at The University of Louisville.Students from all New Jersey counties can get $12,000 —$16,000 off through their Regional Scholars Program.
I really don't think Louisville is our academic competition.
To me getting into RU-NB is pretty prestigious and holds more weight in South Jersey publics like Kingsway or Lenape. The de facto safety school down here is Rowan. I feel like people in places like Cherry Hill East or Eastern or Haddon Township would be more than happy to send their kids to RU-NB.
Many people still believe that there's a free ride somewhere in the US. You look at any major city that is desirable anywhere in the US, it costs A LOT to live there. It goes for Miami and Austin just as much as it goes for NYC and LA. You trade in income tax for sales tax. There's no free ride anywhere.
OTOH, if someone is interested in place few want to live- Cumberland County NJ? Buffalo? Cleveland? Rural South? Yes, cheap property abounds. But most people don't want that, and the law of supply and demand is in play.
From what I gather a lot of students who want to go to the South indulge in the anti-Yankee sentiment just like the parents who go. The ones who don't run back. This has been a phenomenon for a long time and again some insist on pretending it isn't. Again, it's big mystery why these people aren't the ones getting into UNC and Vandy...I can't square it!
And I was specific from the beginning. You generalized. As per my nieces and nephews the largest contingent of out of state majoring in hospitality and Business at South Carolina is NJ. And largest contingent at Clemson in PGA program is NJ. So more than you think.
Rutgers doesn’t need to offer a PGA golf course business degree. But don’t understand why there isn’t a turf grass degree. What hurt RU with golf specifically turf grass management is that it’s a certificate program and graduate program only. We have one of the best turf programs (research and respected programs)in the country and we don’t have an undergrad program.
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It's likely true that this pipeline will exist forever, but will be interesting as a lot more Catholic HS close.
This is part of a larger phenomenon and thus requires generalization.
It's nice that you have a family member that wants to study golf. This isn't some kind of a widespread thing.
It's like saying that the Cult became popular for its turf management program among NJ parents. It's actually a real well known program there!
There are definitely many places in Central NJ and North NJ where it holds weight. When I was at RU, West Windsor was a big sender. Fair Lawn was another. It's a large percentage among the top NJ publics. Among the privates and a small handful of NJ publics it gets dicier.
Not a free ride, but the Research Triangle in North Carolina offers a cost of living, especially housing, well below NJ/Rutgers. My niece and husband were working in the Boston area (where they grew up, both children of NJ ex-pats) and got transferred down when they were around 30. What they bought well exceeded what they could have had in either Mass. or NJ. And there is little to no anti-Yankee sentiment, probably because there are so many with a Northeast background.
My brother's experience in Dallas is interesting. Rutgers the school gets a lot of respect. Of course, it's not as good as UT and A&M, Texas takes immense pride in their state schools. But more respect than many NJ residents show Rutgers.
I responded to heaven regarding a very specific thing. You chose to respond to me and made it general. Say what you may. But good students have choices where to matriculate and it doesn’t always come at a considerable price tag above in state nj rates. Many times it’s cheaper to go out of state both private and public. And it doesn’t come at an educational disadvantage.
Neither do I. I just put the info it out there for people who have kids who want to go to a four year school at what is considered a very low price by 2025 standards.
We experienced that on a low level in the early 1990s, and it was enough for us to say we don't want to live here. Thinking it has probably improved some 30 plus years later. One thing about Jersey people, they seem more "real" than those in other regions, if that makes any sense.
Where, specifically, are you talking about? From experience with family I can definitely say it's not everywhere.
it's not and not nearly as pervasive or in your face as suggested by some here. Hell, southerners have a far harder time with bigotry moving north (if they are dumb enough to do so) due to speech and perceived ignorance than anything. I've lived in TN, GA, and FL and not once heard anyone say 'yankee go home'. Now I have heard 'don't bring your politics here' but that is only to the loud mouth northerners who think they can change things they don't like culturally
there is more stupidity, naivety and ******** in this thread to make even Elizabeth Warren blush.
sorry Kapuna, but spending money on a Clemson or Carl's Jr degree is literally throwing money away. If those kids plan on living in SC then fine, I'm sure it has some value otherwise, you're setting them up for 'welcome to Enterprise, how can I help'. Notinrhouse is the only one being realistic in that conversation except he relies too much on rankings as his gold source and we know how wrong and subjective they can be. UF for instance has 12 top 50 programs and RU has over 40 in top 25 (at graduate levels) so hard to imagine UF is that much better. ( I was debating on the national board so had to throw out some facts at the anti RU bias created by AL)
Out of state schools are absolutely viable options provided the education and cost is balanced. RU is overpriced for state students imho. RU does an absolutely terrible job of alumni outreach, no benefits to alumni children despite the numerous studies on this that are demonstrative of it's merits, and just isn't 'user friendly' as many other places.
The reason kids in Cali don't leave is because the schools for state residents are beyond ridiculously cheap. They are very good schools as well so it's a double win
Of note and made me feel pretty good, was at Purdue this weekend and a master student studying quantum genetic engineering said, upon learning I went to Rutgers, 'wow, that is a GREAT school'. Rutgers has a great rep outside of NJ. NJ's main problem is that we have too much money and can afford to send kids out of state in addition to the quality of overall HS education being highly regarded that universities target the area.
regardless, there is a lot of stupidity and naivety in this thread as I stated earlier. Not sure where some of you come up with some of the comments. Still blown away anyone would argue that Clemson and Carl's Jr are good schools. I don't think I ever came across a single graduate of either during my time on the street. Neither are target schools by any wall street, not even RU is for the most part (I know of 2)
So you think a Clemson PGA degree is worthless. Kid is second in command at a very prestigious Northeastern country Club. But don’t let facts get in the way. He knew what he wanted and went for it.
And the ones hat went to U SC I’m not worried about at all. The one had an internship at Disney and took a position at corporate at Marriott (hospitality top 10 in nation). The other one (international business program #1)had 2 NYC internships and offers at bulge bracket firms but delayed acceptance to get his MBA at U Chicago.
I don’t understand why people think everyone’s college experience needs to be just like theirs. And look down their nose at someone that does it differently. Bizarre behavior.
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When I have visited my brother in Dallas the reaction is almost always "Good school. Mediocre football team though Schiano seems to be trying."
BTW, UT Austin is less expensive in state than Rutgers and has more financial aid.
Lots of great schools are far cheaper than Rutgers for their state students (all Cal schools, GA, NC,UF, UT, Texas A&M, off top of my head from his acceptance and application process). My son's tuition out of state is cheaper/equivalent to Rutgers. Lots of states have those head start programs as well which would be nice or even the state price tag agreement with neighboring states (most SEC schools have reciprocal agreements on student tuition for in state rates. To the best of my knowledge, only MA, NJ and NY do not have these.
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I'm just being practical and realistic, that's not looking down any nose. It's your horse your rodeo, ride it how you want
the reality is that kids can be successful coming from anywhere but the road doesn't need to be as difficult by sending them to schools that have less than stellar reputations and/or lack the alumni support that more prestigious schools do. I only called you out because you make it seem like Clemson and Carls Jr are on par with schools way above their weight. I fully appreciate the connection and bias once you have family attending. If you said FSU, U Tampa etc, then I'd be no different
good luck
I never made any such claim. I was skeptical when they chose those schools. But after doing the research and seeing the packages they received they would have been negligent not to do their due diligence. I’m not the one painting with broad strokes. I was very specific with whom and what I responded. Clemson academics are not up to par but he chose a very specific professional degree and is successful. The 2 that went to U SC also had very specific goals. One went to the top international business school in the country is now in his 2nd year at a top 5 MBA program. Kid could have gone to Wharton but wanted a more well rounded college experience. He was raised a Rutgers fan they didn’t do a great job of putting a very good package together. The other went to one of the top hospitality programs in the country.
Now if you want to throw money away you just mentioned 2 schools in your last sentence that degrees from those institutions have no value.
What’s funny is one of the top performing desks I have ever seen was DBK’s derivative desk late 90’s early 2000’s those guys printed money. They were mostly SEC (LSU,Ole miss) guys. They murdered the IVY guys at other shops. Thats when I realized it’s not where youre from it’s where you’re at.
I agree no need to make things difficult but ultimately it’s their decision. Not my kids not my problem. Even though there isn’t one.
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I personally know two people that went to schools that some of you would snub their nose at, Florida State and Drake. They became Vice-Presidents at two of the largest companies in America. They made millions of dollars, donate to charities, and retired in their late 40s. Beautiful house, country club memberships, endless travel, etc. I asked the one who went to Drake once. Did people who had Ivy League degrees get promoted over you? He said if all qualities were equal, the Ivy grad might be hired first. He then said if they weren’t doing well after six months, they would have someone have a “talk” with them. Six more months of the same, they would be gone.
Yep hired numerous people over my career. Outside of an initial hire never looked at where they went to school. At that point it’s what have you achieved professionally. I know many people that looked great on paper educationally that were professional train wrecks.
Yeah the only leg up an Ivy grad has is in the entry level field. Anything after that is all about experience and what a person does in his current and past roles.
Just because university A is rated higher than B it doesn’t mean it’s a better school for students A, B and C.
Even if B costs more than A.
Even if grads of A get “better” jobs, on average, than B. “Better” in one man’s eyes doesn’t have to be better in another’s.
Even if B costs more than A.
Even if grads of A get “better” jobs, on average, than B. “Better” in one man’s eyes doesn’t have to be better in another’s.
All three of my nephews were admitted to Rutgers. At least two would have been miserable. Not everyone likes blueberry ice cream. That is why GOD created Baskin Robbin’s.
That's not entirely accurate. Many times the Ivy grad is also getting a leg up to get in the door when moving to new jobs outside of their current employer. Also, don't underestimate the power of their alumni networks. But, that goes for a lot of schools with strong alumni networks, not just Ivy, and that's what many of those Southern schools are building. People have pride in their school and want to help others that went there succeed.
Agreed IVY networks are extremely strong. Southern schools have extensive networks and they are extending out of their historical reach. I mentioned earlier there was a small niche desk on wall st that was almost entirely SEC alums. And they were an anomaly 25-30 years ago. Now half of the intern list is southern state schools. It’s crazy.mentioned in an earlier thread when kids from prep schools and elite day schools start choosing southern schools not named vandy or Emory start popping up rather than Ivy and junior Ivy names it’s time to take notice.
UNC and UVA grads have had inroads to Wall St. and the banks for a while, though not to the extent of the Ivies.
Yea think further south. I Dont really consider them Southern from an academic perspective.
LSU, ole miss, bama South Carolina. Schools that had no real presence.
Agreed on UVA/UNC. They are a part of what is known as the "Southern Ivies" or proposed Magnolia League which was a Southern answer to the Ivy League. It would've been UVA, UNC, Duke, Tulane, Vandy, Emory, Wake, GT, Rice, and SMU if my memory is accurate. Would've been curious to see how that would've played out had that Magnolia Conference been established.
NC K-12 is not well regarded, so many people pay for private. A TX school district that is well regarded will have NJ level property taxes. There's no free rides.
Closest someone will get is taking a NYC/SF salary and working remote from certain developing countries. And even there, there will be different kinds of tradeoffs. For someone childless it's probably the best of both worlds especially for someone adept in the language of the destination.
I did in fact mention UF as being in a different echelon (along with UGA, GT, UNC, UVA, Vandy, Duke, WF, Emory) than the others. You can throw in TX and TXAM in that bunch, but I think they take precious few OOS students.
Also I think Florida has a program for students to get in state tuition if their grandparents live there.
This isn't USCe or Clemson. That is the NJ phenomenon.
Again, what I find so bizarre about what happens in NJ is that it's very rare for OOS school beloved by NJ parents to be nationally regarded as more prestigious. NYU is the only one I can think of, and I think among NJ parents that has faded.
The new NJ hot trend is to spend profligate sums on second rate schools south of the Mason Dixon line. Among the ones I have seen- JMU, Florida Gulf Coast, Coastal Carolina, Univ of Tampa...just an oddball phenomenon IMO. It's never about the actual academics but rather about the "statement" being made. Very similar to what it was my generation when it was like "look at me, I spend extra to get my kid an at best equivalent education at Cult or UDel!"
At least people have heard of those schools up here. No NYC/NJ employer is going to be impressed.
And maybe the phenomenon is to get the kids down there so the parents move too, which is also odd. We hear constantly, oh NB is too close to home...so let's get the kid OOS and then get the parents down the street there? You wonder why Gen Z has issues, they're never launching and they're not understanding the value of education. They're thinking it's something to show on TikTok versus a key to success down the road.
Also I think Florida has a program for students to get in state tuition if their grandparents live there.
This isn't USCe or Clemson. That is the NJ phenomenon.
Again, what I find so bizarre about what happens in NJ is that it's very rare for OOS school beloved by NJ parents to be nationally regarded as more prestigious. NYU is the only one I can think of, and I think among NJ parents that has faded.
The new NJ hot trend is to spend profligate sums on second rate schools south of the Mason Dixon line. Among the ones I have seen- JMU, Florida Gulf Coast, Coastal Carolina, Univ of Tampa...just an oddball phenomenon IMO. It's never about the actual academics but rather about the "statement" being made. Very similar to what it was my generation when it was like "look at me, I spend extra to get my kid an at best equivalent education at Cult or UDel!"
At least people have heard of those schools up here. No NYC/NJ employer is going to be impressed.
And maybe the phenomenon is to get the kids down there so the parents move too, which is also odd. We hear constantly, oh NB is too close to home...so let's get the kid OOS and then get the parents down the street there? You wonder why Gen Z has issues, they're never launching and they're not understanding the value of education. They're thinking it's something to show on TikTok versus a key to success down the road.
The taxpayers in that Texas school district also pay zero state income taxes.
Kupuna, I wonder if your nephew and mine ever crossed paths. He is from Howell. Not the only kid from Howell at Clemson. Of course, Howell is a very large high school.