OT: COVID-19 news. Out of over 3000 positive tests in prison

[NorthwoodHusker]

Open to it, spell out what liberties you’ve been denied specifically.

Religion? Press? Speech? Assembly? Petition?

I could maybe get behind assembly, but in times of public health crisis the Supreme Court has been pretty consistent in allowing some restrictions or requiring specific actions in the name of public health. If you’re so worried about your liberties lawyer up and bring a case.

Do you know the difference between rights and liberties?
I want to go sit at my favorite bar, ordera burger and enjoy the atmosphere.
I dont care if its surrounded by plastic, I even dont mind waiting my turn to get in.

I want to tip the waitress, I want to put some of my money into the bar owners pocket, not let him fail, support him.
There's many businesses I'm not at liberty to go to.

As far as lawyering up, I will if another extension is granted.
At that pount, my grace wears out.

If you think it's me I'm worried about, and another delay is given

 

[MOHUSKER]

Do you know the difference between rights and liberties?
I want to go sit at my favorite bar, ordera burger and enjoy the atmosphere.
I dont care if its surrounded by plastic, I even dont mind waiting my turn to get in.

I want to tip the waitress, I want to put some of my money into the bar owners pocket, not let him fail, support him.
There's many businesses I'm not at liberty to go to.

As far as lawyering up, I will if another extension is granted.
At that pount, my grace wears out.

Yes, I also know what impeachment means. You have shown you don’t know either.

You do America a disservice, crying because you can’t go sit at a restaurant. And then saying your liberties are under attack for it?

Anyone can order takeout and tip just fine, I’ve done exactly that at least once a week for the past 2 months. Got a haircut last week and tipped my barber for the 2 appointments I had to miss.

 

[dinglefritz]

Most the nurses I know are overworked. Pounding hours at them. We have shortages of Drs and nurses.

In our area, nurses have had hours cut drastically or have been laid off completely due to the fear people have of going to the Dr. now.

 

[slwags_rivals53212]

This virus will go down as the biggest scam ever pulled on the people. To think we destroyed our economy and put millions out of work for a virus that in the end will have a fatality rate close to the flu.

 

[MOHUSKER]

In our area, nurses have had hours cut drastically or have been laid off completely due to the fear people have of going to the Dr. now.

Two large hospitals in our area, one local system and one part of a larger catholic system. Catholic system had large layoffs system wide and froze 401k matches, local hospital committed to no layoffs and reassigned staff to do temperature checks and other tasks to keep them on the payroll.

I worked for one for 12 years, wife has worked at the other for 16. Very happy I am out of healthcare during this.

 

[dinglefritz]

Two large hospitals in our area, one local system and one part of a larger catholic system. Catholic system had large layoffs system wide and froze 401k matches, local hospital committed to no layoffs and reassigned staff to do temperature checks and other tasks to keep them on the payroll.

I worked for one for 12 years, wife has worked at the other for 16. Very happy I am out of healthcare during this.

We have a friend with 3 kids and one of them in college. She's a radiology tech and she's been standing at the entrance of the hospital taking temps.....Yeah that's a good use of her skills. She's just trying to get enough hours to pay the bills.

 

[MOHUSKER]

This virus will go down as the biggest scam ever pulled on the people. To think we destroyed our economy and put millions out of work for a virus that in the end will have a fatality rate close to the flu.

Stop it with this stupidity. Despite the most drastic measures in modern history to stop the spread of the virus in the US we have over 80K over 60 days. No flu season in the past 50 years has done anything of the sort.

Countries that didn’t react as strongly (Sweden) have tanked just like the US. Do stay at home orders have a negative impact? Yes. But the economy would be rocked even without those orders.

 

[MOHUSKER]

We have a friend with 3 kids and one of them in college. She's a radiology tech and she's been standing at the entrance of the hospital taking temps.....Yeah that's a good use of her skills. She's just trying to get enough hours to pay the bills.

The local one is paying the higher of the wage from their normal job, or the new job. And has kept hours the same, hell of a response and a great example of a local institution serving their community.

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

Yes, I also know what impeachment means. You have shown you don’t know either.

You do America a disservice, crying because you can’t go sit at a restaurant. And then saying your liberties are under attack for it?

Anyone can order takeout and tip just fine, I’ve done exactly that at least once a week for the past 2 months. Got a haircut last week and tipped my barber for the 2 appointments I had to miss.

I wont go where I need to go on the impeachment thing. No more politics, so I can't.

You do freedom a disservice, by giving away your liberties then demanding the same of others.
Does demand sound free?

The difference is, rights are stated as such, and cannot be breached. Cities will be sued for those breaches, and rightly so.
Liberties are not rights, but are precious just the same.

 

[MOHUSKER]

I wont go where I need to go on the impeachment thing. No more politics, so I can't.

You do freedom a disservice, by giving away your liberties then demanding the same of others.
Does demand sound free?

I haven’t given away any of my liberties, I took the time to actually learn what they were. And I sure as hell won’t insult the people who died to protect them by whining about not being able to go order a cheeseburger at a bar.

 

[dinglefritz]

Stop it with this stupidity. Despite the most drastic measures in modern history to stop the spread of the virus in the US we have over 80K over 60 days. No flu season in the past 50 years has done anything of the sort.

Countries that didn’t react as strongly (Sweden) have tanked just like the US. Do stay at home orders have a negative impact? Yes. But the economy would be rocked even without those orders.

There's no question this virus was going to hammer some businesses no matter what we did. That said, in some states the primary businesses severely affected have been restaurants, bars and salons. All you have to do though is look at the decrease in traffic at medical clinics to understand how fear has gripped people. A medical clinic is probably the safest building you could go in right now with the precautions they're taking and they actually know what they're doing.

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

I haven’t given away any of my liberties, I took the time to actually learn what they were. And I sure as hell won’t insult the people who died to protect them by whining about not being able to go order a cheeseburger at a bar.

Again you missed it.
If you think this is about me

 

[MOHUSKER]

Again you missed it.
If you think this is about me

You said...”I want to go sit at my favorite bar, ordera burger and enjoy the atmosphere.” and then equated that to your “liberties” that have been taken away.

What did I miss?

 

[dinglefritz]

Governor Polis is scheduled to meet with President Trump this week. Maybe he can explain how difficult it is to follow White House guidelines for reopening restaurants and other venues while getting screamed at by people who conveniently pretend that these guidelines don't exist.

Again, they're guidelines. They aren't laws. They are guidelines set forth by scientists who don't need to take in to account economics or the real world. Personally, I don't agree with a business owner who would let people pack in to their place but let's keep laws versus guidelines or directives straight. Polis is doing a relatively good job considering the mess he had on his hands from the spring break ski traffic. People are just fed up watching their livelihood slip away. The old "I'm mad as hell and not going to take it anymore" line comes to mind.

 

[dinglefritz]

You said...”I want to go sit at my favorite bar, ordera burger and enjoy the atmosphere.” and then equated that to your “liberties” that have been taken away.

What did I miss?

Hey I actually can do that but haven't just yet. Bar stools are 6 feet away from each other. It kind of ruins the fun of sitting there with your friends watching golf of baseball or TV.....er well there is that too.

 

[dinglefritz]

It’s not a redefinition at all. It’s how you keep the health systems from being overwhelmed.
By locking down until you have a good system of controlling it in place. If you reopen before you are ready, the numbers can go back up again. So healthcare systems could still be at risk.

the numbers are going to go back up no matter when you open up unless you lock things down until everybody has had a vaccination. We can't do that. It would be suicide for our nation and likely tens of thousands of people who feel hopeless. People with anxiety disorders have to be losing their minds right now.....by the way where's SoFlHusker?

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

You said...”I want to go sit at my favorite bar, ordera burger and enjoy the atmosphere.” and then equated that to your “liberties” that have been taken away.

What did I miss?

The obvious. To make a person feel better about themself. To help them stay afloat. To share what their dream brings.
Me the customer, them the happy business owners.

I've owned my own business, I get it.

 

[ZaneHickey]

Again, they're guidelines. They aren't laws. They are guidelines set forth by scientists who don't need to take in to account economics or the real world. Personally, I don't agree with a business owner who would let people pack in to their place but let's keep laws versus guidelines or directives straight. Polis is doing a relatively good job considering the mess he had on his hands from the spring break ski traffic. People are just fed up watching their livelihood slip away. The old "I'm mad as hell and not going to take it anymore" line comes to mind.

At some point...soon...the "at your own risk" policy needs to implemented. Good grief - afraid of the salon? Don't go. 70+ and unsure about going to Husker game with 80k in attendance? Stay home. We are still employing strategies to save our hospitals from being overrun and they are at greater threat from going under, from lack of business. Our local Menards is now requiring masks. They have been cranking up the Covid policies when we should be loosening. By the time an all-clear is given (I am an optimist), Menards will be requiring your choice of a full chemical bath, or hazmat suit prior to entering. Most of those I talk to are running out of patience for the current, continued mandates. I hope the governor has the fortitude to give the "as you were" order before long.

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

At some point...soon...the "at your own risk" policy needs to implemented. Good grief - afraid of the salon? Don't go. 70+ and unsure about going to Husker game with 80k in attendance? Stay home. We are still employing strategies to save our hospitals from being overrun and they are at greater threat from going under, from lack of business. Our local Menards is now requiring masks. They have been cranking up the Covid policies when we should be loosening. By the time an all-clear is given (I am an optimist), Menards will be requiring your choice of a full chemical bath, or hazmat suit prior to entering. Most of those I talk to are running out of patience for the current, continued mandates. I hope the governor has the fortitude to give the "as you were" order before long.

Meanwhile, they'll allow you near a forklift unloading overhead.

 

[dinglefritz]

At some point...soon...the "at your own risk" policy needs to implemented. Good grief - afraid of the salon? Don't go. 70+ and unsure about going to Husker game with 80k in attendance? Stay home. We are still employing strategies to save our hospitals from being overrun and they are at greater threat from going under, from lack of business. Our local Menards is now requiring masks. They have been cranking up the Covid policies when we should be loosening. By the time an all-clear is given (I am an optimist), Menards will be requiring your choice of a full chemical bath, or hazmat suit prior to entering. Most of those I talk to are running out of patience for the current, continued mandates. I hope the governor has the fortitude to give the "as you were" order before long.

I don't think requiring masks is really cranking things up. It's probably a really good idea. I would be fine if the state government actually passed a law requiring people to wear them in public buildings but since they just re-opened restaurants that makes it a little bit tough. I made a trip to the local farm store today and I was one of few wearing a 90% ineffective mask. None of the cashiers wore masks. Then again we've only got about 5 known active cases in the county right now. No doubt there's at least a couple of hundred asymptomatic ones walking around so I try to mask up with my crappy ill fitting mask when I go in a store.

 

[schuele]

I don't think requiring masks is really cranking things up. It's probably a really good idea.

I agree. I have no idea how much good a mask does, but I look at it this way:

I get to work from home, and there's been zero impact on my income or the future of my job. When I go to the grocery store or the hardware store or a restaurant pickup window, I'm dealing with people who have to be on the job every day, dealing with cranky people and a whole lot of confusing information about mask-vs.-no-mask, clean-this, clean-that, stand-there-but-not-there. If wearing a mask makes their day even a little bit easier, it's not a big deal. Just put the damn thing on.

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

Those darn pesky billionaires.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/11/cars/elon-musk-tesla-factory-tweet/index.html

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

Problems wearing masks are, if we touch them, we could get the virus on our hands.
Like anything, it needs to be washed and so too your hands.

Not sure everybody gets that part.

 

[ZaneHickey]

Meanwhile, they'll allow you near a forklift unloading overhead.

That's hilarious!

 

[ZaneHickey]

I don't think requiring masks is really cranking things up. It's probably a really good idea. I would be fine if the state government actually passed a law requiring people to wear them in public buildings but since they just re-opened restaurants that makes it a little bit tough. I made a trip to the local farm store today and I was one of few wearing a 90% ineffective mask. None of the cashiers wore masks. Then again we've only got about 5 known active cases in the county right now. No doubt there's at least a couple of hundred asymptomatic ones walking around so I try to mask up with my crappy ill fitting mask when I go in a store.

I think masks are a great idea for those who are at risk or think they are. The mandate, when we hardly have anything going on, hospital-wise...??? Nope. Heaven help us if a real plague hits. This one shouldn't have had us wobbly-kneed for this long. We can be trusted to behave, like big kids. Help the at risk (if they can't help themselves) and let the rest of us assess risk like grown-ups.

 

[Dean Pope]

Decisions, decisions, decisions. The bride and me must go grocery shopping and the dilemma being mask up and face the world & risk our well being. We just don’t know what to do what with the media reporting the dangers of being alive in these frightening times...and then I remember this...

Amen. And to hear of the hairstylists who are getting screamed at by wacko customer's who do not want to wear a mask in order to protect others. What selfish ignorant jerk would yell at a hair stylist for trying to follow the law? The least you can do is wear a mask and protect your fellow tax payers and yet they "*****, *****, *****." Shameful.

 

[NorthwoodHusker]

Will this take monies away for PPE,hospitals etc?
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/pe...rus-aid-to-counties-that-defy-lockdown-orders
Tests? Remdisvir? Masks? Shields?

 

[dinglefritz]

I agree. I have no idea how much good a mask does, but I look at it this way:

I get to work from home, and there's been zero impact on my income or the future of my job. When I go to the grocery store or the hardware store or a restaurant pickup window, I'm dealing with people who have to be on the job every day, dealing with cranky people and a whole lot of confusing information about mask-vs.-no-mask, clean-this, clean-that, stand-there-but-not-there. If wearing a mask makes their day even a little bit easier, it's not a big deal. Just put the damn thing on.

At least it stops myself or others from spewing out projectile vapor right in to somebody's face. Hopefully I can scab on to an N95 when I go in to the clinic tomorrow. It will last me a long time. My wife has a few for her and our other family members but for some reason she hasn't gotten me one. I think maybe I should ask the same question I asked this board when she requested a .38 for Christmas a few years back. "Should I be concerned?"

 

[Charlie Marlow_rivals363743]

the numbers are going to go back up no matter when you open up unless you lock things down until everybody has had a vaccination. We can't do that. It would be suicide for our nation and likely tens of thousands of people who feel hopeless. People with anxiety disorders have to be losing their minds right now.....by the way where's SoFlHusker?

That wasn't what I was saying though.

 

[litespeedhuskerfan_rivals19671]

This virus will go down as the biggest scam ever pulled on the people. To think we destroyed our economy and put millions out of work for a virus that in the end will have a fatality rate close to the flu.

But we gave it a cool name, so it was worth it.

 

[dinglefritz]

Problems wearing masks are, if we touch them, we could get the virus on our hands.
Like anything, it needs to be washed and so too your hands.

Not sure everybody gets that part.

You just put the mask on the dash of your car out in the sun and you'll be fine. The whole getting the virus from touching things is proving to be way overstated. The don't touch your face rules should have really been, "don't pick your nose and don't eat with dirty hands....oh and really don't eat your boogers." You would have to be a VERY unlucky person to catch corona virus from touching your mask when you put it on and take it off. By all means though, now is a good time to practice being a germophobe.

 

[dinglefritz]

That wasn't what I was saying though.

You said, "if you reopen before you're ready your numbers are going to go back up". I would say that my reply is pretty logical given that statement. I don't know of any place that will be any more ready a month from now than they are already anyway. The governors of Pennsylvania and New Jersey are out of their gourds. The fact that 2/3 of the new cases in New York City were people who stayed at home should maybe give them a clue that their plan isn't working and they might as well get back to work.

 

[Charlie Marlow_rivals363743]

Do you know the difference between rights and liberties?
I want to go sit at my favorite bar, ordera burger and enjoy the atmosphere.
I dont care if its surrounded by plastic, I even dont mind waiting my turn to get in.

I want to tip the waitress, I want to put some of my money into the bar owners pocket, not let him fail, support him.
There's many businesses I'm not at liberty to go to.

As far as lawyering up, I will if another extension is granted.
At that pount, my grace wears out.

If you think it's me I'm worried about, and another delay is given

We ain't seen nothing yet? Whatcha gonna do? RollingLaugh

By the way, why do you get to be the one to decide which liberties are okay to be compromised and which aren't? The courts have backed the government's right to do this for close to 200 years now. If you don't like it, leave and find another country that doesn't take away anyone's liberties even a little bit. Good luck with that.

 

[Charlie Marlow_rivals363743]

Since this thread is supposed to be about COVID19 and not armed revolution, here's an article reviewing more numbers.

 

[Iroh2]

I think masks are a great idea for those who are at risk or think they are. The mandate, when we hardly have anything going on, hospital-wise...??? Nope. Heaven help us if a real plague hits. This one shouldn't have had us wobbly-kneed for this long. We can be trusted to behave, like big kids. Help the at risk (if they can't help themselves) and let the rest of us assess risk like grown-ups.

Americans are not smart enough to handle this epidemic, let alone one with a higher death rate. Went by Menards and Lowes this weekend and it was standing room only, nobody had a mask on so I stepped out. I’m going to let the dumb ones get killed off first. We need to thin the herd a bit, too many lazy and stupid idiots.... I do have empathy for senior living residents as it is nasty. I agree this shouldn’t have hit this hard, but the average intelligence in the US is low and people can’t be trusted to help themselves.. as this will rage for another 12-18 months this “flu” will take 200,000+ but it’s all good...

 

[Charlie Marlow_rivals363743]

You said, "if you reopen before you're ready your numbers are going to go back up". I would say that my reply is pretty logical given that statement. I don't know of any place that will be any more ready a month from now than they are already anyway. The governors of Pennsylvania and New Jersey are out of their gourds. The fact that 2/3 of the new cases in New York City were people who stayed at home should maybe give them a clue that their plan isn't working and they might as well get back to work.

It was part of a larger discussion. NW was pretty much saying the original intent of the stay home orders were to prevent the health care systems from being overwhelmed. Then he said we had reached that goal so we didn't have to worry about it anymore. My point was that that was only good for now, but reckless return to normal could overwhelm the healthcare systems again. I don't believe I am wrong. Obviously the country will open up again whether it's ready or not, but we can minimize the damage if we are smart about how we do it.

 

[dinglefritz]

Americans are not smart enough to handle this epidemic, let alone one with a higher death rate. Went by Menards and Lowes this weekend and it was standing room only, nobody had a mask on so I stepped out. I’m going to let the dumb ones get killed off first. We need to thin the herd a bit, too many lazy and stupid idiots.... I do have empathy for senior living residents as it is nasty. I agree this shouldn’t have hit this hard, but the average intelligence in the US is low and people can’t be trusted to help themselves.. as this will rage for another 12-18 months this “flu” will take 200,000+ but it’s all good...

Well there's more than a few studies that show that wearing cloth masks or bandanas over your nose actually do very little to limit spread. You can't buy an N95 mask in any stores that I'm aware of so I think some people just say "WTH, if it's only 10 to 20% effective why bother." Ironically I think the cloth ones may be giving people a false sense of security causing them to forget about the 6 foot rule.

 

[dinglefritz]

It was part of a larger discussion. NW was pretty much saying the original intent of the stay home orders were to prevent the health care systems from being overwhelmed. Then he said we had reached that goal so we didn't have to worry about it anymore. My point was that that was only good for now, but reckless return to normal could overwhelm the healthcare systems again. I don't believe I am wrong. Obviously the country will open up again whether it's ready or not, but we can minimize the damage if we are smart about how we do it.

You should have said "reckless return to normal" instead of "re-open too soon" then. Even then I don't think there's many people who are going to recklessly return to anything but I get your point. I don't see a bunch of people in my community lining up to stand shoulder to shoulder with anybody in a bar. IF they do well that is natural selection I guess. We were told this past week we could start having inside church services again but we're continuing with our parking lot/FM broadcast and Facebook live services for at least 3 more weeks. I suspect we'll continue beyond that because so many of our attendees are elderly. The majority of people are scared shitless. For the rest of them, good luck.

 

[ZaneHickey]

Americans are not smart enough to handle this epidemic, let alone one with a higher death rate. Went by Menards and Lowes this weekend and it was standing room only, nobody had a mask on so I stepped out. I’m going to let the dumb ones get killed off first. We need to thin the herd a bit, too many lazy and stupid idiots.... I do have empathy for senior living residents as it is nasty. I agree this shouldn’t have hit this hard, but the average intelligence in the US is low and people can’t be trusted to help themselves.. as this will rage for another 12-18 months this “flu” will take 200,000+ but it’s all good...

Please don't run for public office any time soon. Not in America, anyway. I wouldn't be bright enough to understand your message, anyway, I suppose. Glad you lived to tell about your shopping experience.

 

[Hoosker Du]

The 1% mortality rate you are using is causing your problem. In actuality the number is at 1/2 of one percent now for recent infections and it continues to trend lower as more and more asymptomatic positive cases are discovered. At .5% even your number falls to 1 million. Again, it's the asymptomatic positives that ARE driving mortality rates in places that aren't called New York City to a number much lower even than that . When it's all said and done, I believe that the mortality rate will end up being near (gasp) .25%. Worldometer statisticians at this point seem to agree. The same Worldometer's worst case scenario for us is to reach 3000/day and we still end up with less than 300k fatalities according to them. I'm not talking about even reaching population immunity to get to my number. I'm talking about every single American being infected with this virus which we both know won't happen.

This is good news. My initial thoughts based on China's mortality rates (sic) were that we would have nearly 3% of our population die from this if we didn't take drastic measures. Well we took those measures (sort of) and it bought us some time to get our ducks in a row. It's become very obvious that this is not nearly as deadly as we first thought. Yeah it's bad especially for us old fogies with other problems and you never know which one in ten thousand younger healthy person is going to have some predilection for this virus which causes them to die from it. But, that can happen from influenza as well. Keep watching the cases where they go in and test a large cohort of people all on the same day. The number of asymptomatic positive cases is amazing. In some ways SoFLHusker was right when he was proclaiming that this is nothing more than the flu (without a vaccine). We haven't heard from that character lately. I hope he's okay.

FWIW even the LA Times ran a story a few days ago questioning if this was worth killing the economy over.

As I've said before, I'm not as concerned with the mortality rate as I am the numbers that are dying each day. Although I still think the mortality rate will end up being higher than .5%, simply because no one has prior immunity to this virus.

We lost over 50,000 people in April alone, which is more than we lose during an entire average year of seasonal flu in the U.S. 80,000+ is app. 2 - 2 1/2 times the deaths each year for seasonal flu. And that is in just what, 10 weeks?

And of course our Social Distancing is finally paying off, and we're seeing the Total Cases and deaths in the U.S. starting to decline. Only to open all the states back up, which will kill more than the previous 2,000/day in April.