OT: Duke is suing their QB for contract violations

yesrutgers01

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I am a person that usually sides with players. But here is the new thing that has to be addressed. If these kids,handlers, family want contracts holding schools and NIL deals responsible…then they need to do the same. If the language ties them to the school and the kid signs it…then, they need to buy their asses out of it or stay where they are. The same way coaches have to do it
 

RUTGERS95

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Sep 28, 2005
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As @rutgersguy2 says above, Duke and Menash have settled, and Menash has transferred to Miami. We don't know the terms, but it seems clear that Duke thought it was more trouble than it was worth to be involved in litigation against a student-athlete.

https://sports.yahoo.com/college-fo...ahead-of-his-transfer-to-miami-140948149.html
not a good outcome for college football
not sure how contracts can be so easily broken unless monetary and rights were bought/paid for

will be interesting to hear about the particulars later
 

Knight Shift

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Retired711

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Nov 20, 2001
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not a good outcome for college football
not sure how contracts can be so easily broken unless monetary and rights were bought/paid for

will be interesting to hear about the particulars later
My guess (and it's just that) is that Menash paid some money back to Duke and they let him go. Duke probably figured it couldn't get a court to prohibit Menash from playing for a competitor, or that it wasn't worthwhle to do it -- judging from the story, Duke didn't want to be suing a student. Maybe there was some bad stuff that Duke didn't want disclosed in litigation. I think you're probably right that contracts like this don't do much to keep a kid at a school.
 
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Knight Shift

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My guess (and it's just that) is that Menash paid some money back to Duke and they let him go. Judging from the story, Duke didn't want to be suing a student. Maybe there was some bad stuff that Duke didn't want disclosed in litigation. I think you're probably right that contracts like this don't do much to keep a kid at a school.
Don't see it as bad as what Lane Kiffin did to Ole Miss in the middle of the CFP. Contracts and breaches thereof are negotiable.
 
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Zak57

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They should introduce transfer fees from school to school like soccer clubs have. Contract goes over or gets re-worked and then receiving team gives money to the losing team. Would be interesting as certain schools could take a chance to develop players building up their money chest and then going out to spend and so on. Would introduce some new layers and makes more sense than having these contract disputes all the time.
 
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NickRU714

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Aug 18, 2009
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I am a person that usually sides with players. But here is the new thing that has to be addressed. If these kids,handlers, family want contracts holding schools and NIL deals responsible…then they need to do the same. If the language ties them to the school and the kid signs it…then, they need to buy their asses out of it or stay where they are. The same way coaches have to do it

100% my thoughts.

If you want to be treated and paid like adults (which they should be) then you get treated like adults in all the time.
 

Retired711

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Don't see it as bad as what Lane Kiffin did to Ole Miss in the middle of the CFP. Contracts and breaches thereof are negotiable.
Have you ever heard of the theory of "efficient breach?" The law & economics "scholars" who dominated legal education for years thought it up. The theory holds that it's good for parties to breach contracts when that leads to a more profitable result. It is thought to explain why the law tends to give only damages for a breach of contract instead of forcing a party to perform. Menash and Kiffin are examples of what those "scholars" would call "efficient breaches."

Of course, the theory is nonsense, like most of law and economics. If I know that you will breach a contract with me if you find it profitable to do so, then I am less likely to contract with you in the first place.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efficient_breach
 

Retired711

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They should introduce transfer fees from school to school like soccer clubs have. Contract goes over or gets re-worked and then receiving team gives money to the losing team. Would be interesting as certain schools could take a chance to develop players building up their money chest and then going out to spend and so on. Would introduce some new layers and makes more sense than having these contract disputes all the time.
For better or worse, that would probably be an anti-trust violation under existing law.
 

Retired711

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Just curious how come? The player still has to agree to the move.
If you and I are in business, and we make a deal about our business practices --"we are going to charge a customer for changing from using one of us to using the other" -- that is an agreement "in restraint of trade," to use the anti-trust argot. Such an agreement can be upheld only if a court thinks it's "reasonable." The more businesses are part of our deal, the less "reasonable" it looks. And if the court thinks the agreement isn't reasonable, then any business that became part of it pays triple damages to the plaintiff.
 
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-RUFAN4LIFE-

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For better or worse, that would probably be an anti-trust violation under existing law.
That’s been the whole issue with all of this. The NcAA can’t do much like a real league would because they need an antitrust exemption.
 

Knight Shift

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Have you ever heard of the theory of "efficient breach?" The law & economics "scholars" who dominated legal education for years thought it up. The theory holds that it's good for parties to breach contracts when that leads to a more profitable result. It is thought to explain why the law tends to give only damages for a breach of contract instead of forcing a party to perform. Menash and Kiffin are examples of what those "scholars" would call "efficient breaches."

Of course, the theory is nonsense, like most of law and economics. If I know that you will breach a contract with me if you find it profitable to do so, then I am less likely to contract with you in the first place.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efficient_breach
Many breaches are inherently more efficient than litigation, where the only winners are often the hired attorneys. In some cases, it pays to litigate. In this case, spitballing numbers, let's say that Miami offered Mensah $1-2M more for his services. IIRC, Duke was paying him $4M, but let's use that figure. Miami, Duke and Mensah may have agreed to split the difference, and Duke walked away with an additional 0.5-1M in the deal, and still have the $4M in NIL they were going to pay Mensah. That's a win win, versus spending over $1M or more in legal fees, witness fees, court costs, travel, the uncertainty of who would win, etc. In my practice, I tell clients I'm a make love not war counsel. I don't litigate. I did litigation for a while, but I enjoy more building versus fighting and/or destroying. But litigation can be a terrific rush and rewarding if you don't mind giving up more of your personal life compared to doing transactional work.

As for your last paragraph, there is a sucker born every minute willing to sign a contract for $$$.
 

Retired711

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Many breaches are inherently more efficient than litigation, where the only winners are often the hired attorneys. In some cases, it pays to litigate. In this case, spitballing numbers, let's say that Miami offered Mensah $1-2M more for his services. IIRC, Duke was paying him $4M, but let's use that figure. Miami, Duke and Mensah may have agreed to split the difference, and Duke walked away with an additional 0.5-1M in the deal, and still have the $4M in NIL they were going to pay Mensah. That's a win win, versus spending over $1M or more in legal fees, witness fees, court costs, travel, the uncertainty of who would win, etc. In my practice, I tell clients I'm a make love not war counsel. I don't litigate. I did litigation for a while, but I enjoy more building versus fighting and/or destroying. But litigation can be a terrific rush and rewarding if you don't mind giving up more of your personal life compared to doing transactional work.

As for your last paragraph, there is a sucker born every minute willing to sign a contract for $$$.
Let me quote Judge Learned Hand, who served as a federal judge for a half century: "I should dread a law suit beyond almost anything else short of sickness and death." Let me also quote Abraham Lincoln in a lecture he gave to new lawyers: "Discourage litigation. Persuade your neighbors to compromise whenever you can. Point out to them how the nominal winner is often a real loser — in fees, expenses, and waste of time. As a peacemaker the lawyer has a superior opportunity of being a good man. There will still be business enough."
 
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Retired711

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That’s been the whole issue with all of this. The NcAA can’t do much like a real league would because they need an antitrust exemption.
Exactly. Either Congress has to be persuaded to grant an anti-trust exemption (and the NCAA would have to compromise in order to get it) or players have to be allowed to organize into unions (as in, say the NFL) and collectively bargain with the NCAA. The latter works because the provisions of a collective bargaining agreement are exempt from antitrust law.