OT: Electric vehicles
- Thread starter BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap
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I had an old neighbor with a Harley and a Corvette. These guys - and the guys with boats will love owning these things.
I just bought a used Model 3
You could. I bought my Bolt in February 2021 and sold it at a profit. With new EVs so scarce, I had to buy a used Model 3 until new vehicle supplies come back to near normal.
I didn't know, but that's useful. Still have the noise and wind problem.
I just think of the airflow and noise generated from a little 1-3 lb drone. Probably a hard sell for residential areas.
Nothing earth shattering, but good side by side overview of Lightning vs R1T
I see and appreciate all kinds of envelope-pushing styles in newer cars, but the Rivian's front-end isn't one that works for me.
Ev's to save the day...
Tesla Is Hiking Supercharger Prices "Significantly" Across Europe
Prices are going up at the pump...err, we mean the Tesla Superchargers.
According to a new report from electrek, Tesla is increasing prices at its Supercharger stations "significantly" across Europe as the continent continues to deal with a sprawling energy crisis that shows no signs of slowing.
The additional price hikes come after Tesla has already increased prices throughout 2022.
"Due to an increase in energy prices, we are adjusting Supercharging pricing across Europe," Tesla wrote in a letter to its owners in Europe this week. The rising prices not only are a burden for EV owners, but they are starting to challenge the narrative that EVs are cheaper to own and operate on a day to day basis.
"One of the biggest advantages of electric vehicles remains that their cost of operations is much lower than vehicles with internal combustion engines," electrek wrote. But with rising prices at Supercharging stations, who knows how much longer that perceived "benefit" will continue to help buoy demand for electric vehicles.
As we noted earlier this month, energy bills in Europe are expected to rise by €2 Trillion. The trigger for this exponential surge in costs: since January 2020, 1-year forward gas and power prices – usually the reference when signing new energy supply contracts for families or industrial customers – have each increased by more than 13x. The following exhibit shows this evolution, rebased to 100.
The blog lamented that it used to cost no more than $5 or $10 for a full charge at a Supercharger. Now, prices are approaching $30.
One Zero Hedge contributor in Europe experienced the rise in prices firsthand this week when an Uber driver, sporting an EV other than a Tesla, remarked that electricity prices had soared over the past week, and that it now costs about $30 to charge fully at a Supercharging station.
A couple dollars more and it'll almost cost the same as filling up with a tank of gas. Oh, the irony...
https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/tesla-hiking-supercharger-prices-significantly-across-europe
Hey, just want to thank you for that in-depth follow-up you promised and came through on vis-a-vis your BS coworker story.
Very informative ... in one way or another.
And a Zerohedge post? Keep that solid informational foundation rolling! Why not post the original Electrek story where ZH pulled the actual info from? (Rhetorical, of course)
Here's the non-propaganda version.
Zerohedge conveniently leaves out the fact most EV owners DO NOT rely on the Supercharger Network for their primary charging needs. Nor do they mention that Tesla's newest V4 superchargers will have solar covered charging stalls and Megapack (battery storage) on site.
https://electrek.co/2022/09/19/tesla-increases-supercharger-prices-europe/
Have said it before. Rivian front end looks like Rosie from the Jetsons. Glad I bought the F150 Lightning. Scheduled to be out of production this Thursday.
I don't particularly love the front end but the rest of it looks sexy IMO. Especially as the first large SUVHave said it before. Rivian front end looks like Rosie from the Jetsons. Glad I bought the F150 Lightning. Scheduled to be out of production this Thursday.
This would require a paradigm shift in battery technology..
Currently, the batteries are so heavy that they're integrated into the body structure of the car. To make them modular would mean making them considerably lighter, so that the chassis could support them on its own.
I may go and review this in more detail, but I believe there is at least one Chinese manufacturer that uses modular batteries. The batteries are leased or rented, IIRC.
However, the concept is for shorter distance urban travel - not for longer-distance trips. The videos I’ve seen seem to show a fair amount of time taken to switch out the battery pack - long enough where I think that recharging with a V3 or V4 charger would be about as fast.
Like this cool, little sucker: https://acm.city/home/
Certainly a limited city car, but a cool foundation, imo.
I think NIO had that proposal, would love to see an easy swappable module though in some sort of automated station. I get that there are unique challenges on each side of it
Yes it's Nio. We've discussed this months ago if you want to do a thread search. In summary, it's not a scalable solution due to battery supply and could compromise safety of the battery
Not sure about that. In 1993 1% of US households were connected to the internet. That number was 43% (7 years later) in 2000. Change happens fast.
I‘d be somewhat surprised if EVs dont represent 25% of the automobile market by 2030. I could certainly be wrong.
Quite possibly, but by that time, there'll be enough styles and improved performance that it'll be feasible for many drivers for whom it is not feasible now.
The idea that the current state of EV range works for everyone and range anxiety is a myth is what we were arguing at that point.
Change happening fast is why I wouldn't argue the 25 percent figure - or even something higher. But change, in terms of better range performance across driving conditions, more vehicle styles and more naturally competitive pricing, is what's going to make that happen.
Can’t wait until this EV nonsense comes crashing back to earth. More expensive than ICE cars w/o subsidies. We may be going electric but it will be several decades before a majority of people can afford EV’s.
Do you get paid to be wrong? Just curious.
I absolutely hated having to go to a flat-screen. Fortunately my acadia still has knows for the fans and many other controls. My wife's Outback is almost completely operated through the screen and it's freaking awful. Having to find the tiny fan speed control buttons on the fly is extremely distracting.
Isn't that hard to get used to?
My S60 has a full control vocabulary. It's also got a massive touch screen.
Way more often than not, I just use the screen.
I've only had it 2 weeks and it's rare I can't figure out the correct command by the 2nd try. I only have a 7 minute commute so I haven't had a lot of practice, yet.
great comparison. Would be helpful to know price and performance. I like the Rivian SUV but think it’s a mistake to compete in the pickup market.
I definitely prefer mechanical controls for frequently used actions. For stuff I can do at a traffic light or stop sign, touchscreens are fine. I suppose the quality of the screen and UI design are a big factor. But it seems like a solution in search of a problem.
Hahaha! Well we will have the next few decades to watch won’t we. Meanwhile to make an EV tens of thousands of acres of earth will be strip mined and millions of pounds of carbon will be released to make EV’s. More environmentally friendly my ***. LOL!
Cost will come down eventually - they always do. We're going through wild times right now with supply and demand. I feel like my dad shelled out big money for a projection tv back in 1990...today you get 70" led tvs for less than I paid for a 42" lcd back in 2008.
Hopefully, material prices may stay elevated given demand though its possible we stop building pipelines and refiners which will be an offset. Not for copper, nickel etc. hoopedully tech advances can solve the problem but nothing imminent. The smarter solution would have been plug in hybrids.
Few years ago continental created an infotainment screen concept with tactile ridges so you could feel for different options ...just like ...buttons!
Would be much better than a flat screen but did make you wonder why not just bring the damn buttons back.
This is his full time job. Paid troll. Unlikely he's in the US or a US citizen. Such a fulfilling existence .
I tell this story frequently. In 1992 my first company was an early adopter of computer technology in the printing industry. We saw Adobe's beta version of its Photoshop software product in San Francisco that year. Our first Macintosh computer we purchased had a 200 megabyte hard drive with 20 megs of RAM. Cost $4200. Seems silly today. Costs will come down. (Relatively) Quickly. Of that I am certain.
I don’t think the analogy of PCs and certain other digital devices to cars works. There is no Moore’s law for cars. Cars have only ever gotten more expensive with time.
When supply chain problems ease, and when enough time has passed for manufacturers to produce enough cars to exceed demand, then all cars, including EVs, will get less expensive.
More EV manufacturers will eventually be able to produce EVs less expensively and still make a profit, so that will mean new and less expensive models. But it won’t be like computers where the performance is improving exponentially while costs keep going down.
Inflation might drive the cost of cars down eventually. But low supply is driving costs way up. I think it might be several years, at least, before things normalize.
I agree re: "Moore's law". I do not believe the "technological leap" will be in battery capacity, but rather the ability to charge EV batteries quickly and often. Varying the amperage and charging time is not constrained by Moore's law (I don't believe, I'm not a scientist to be fair). If an EV can go +/- 300 miles and "fast charging" becomes available (relatively) everywhere (parking lots, roadsides, outside coffee houses and snack shops, etc.) that to me is what will produce significant adoption over the next 5-7 years. Not necessarily increased range due to increased battery capacity.