OT: Most Reliable Cars

[Ole Cabbagehead]

If you're a seasoned WRX-owner, focused on manual performance for under $50K, why wouldn't you just get an STi for less than $40K (and, if you have the full $50K, use the extra ~$10K on tuning upgrades that will blow any stock car, twice its value, off the road?) Plus, the STi handles great in winter. In this regard, good luck, with any peoples' car in the snow (presuming it even starts (a related problem), regardless of gearbox.

I gave-up on VW/Audi's two decades ago given their almost inexplicable inability to adequately perform in even, rudimentary, upstate-NY winter conditions (when my father's classic '63 Corvette split-window coupe was able to make it out of the garage and up the driveway, and my brand-new GTI couldn't, it was obvious to me that even ancient American engineering was superior to that of the modern German when it came to practical reliability--God Bless America!).

There's a reason why everyone living north of NYC has long abandoned VW/Audi as viable means of winter transportation, first, in favor of Saabs and Volvos and more recently, in preference of Subarus and their knock-offs. In addition to other failings, VW products suck in the snow. If you don't have to drive in snow, don't worry. If you do, take-out something else during a bad weather test-drive. You'll switch, immediately.

So you are basing your information, and recommendation, on personal data from 2 decades ago? Things have changed...a lot. The new (last 10 years) Audi AWD vehicles are absolute beasts in the snow. My A6 can go through anything...I barely even slow down in the snow anymore. If anything, they have made me a huge danger on the road when I drive any other vehicle.

Obviously Subaru's are everywhere in upstate NY, and are extremely good in the snow. I would argue at least part of the equation is economics though.

 

[miketd1]

If you want to know what cars last long, just look at the other vehicles on the road. 10-15 year old Hondas & Toyotas dominate that age group (along with Ford & Chevy vans & pick-up trucks).

 

[RU4Real]

That's your answer? Not really a good one. I expected real reasons from you. Don't forget the economical factor in keeping a vehicle a long time.But thanks anyway for responding.

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but if you were looking for 8x10 color glossy pictures with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one explaining what each one is about, well... I don't have time for that. Certain inferences have to be drawn. But consider that a car with 200,000 miles on it is going to be, ballpark, 10 years old. A 10 year old car is going to be missing a lot of the inherent safety systems, both active and passive, that are found in newer cars.

Simple example - my new Audi refuses to allow me to run into the back of another car. Now there may be times where I'd actually want to do that, but regardless.... it won't happen.

 

[RU4Real]

So you are basing your information, and recommendation, on personal data from 2 decades ago? Things have changed...a lot. The new (last 10 years) Audi AWD vehicles are absolute beasts in the snow. My A6 can go through anything...I barely even slow down in the snow anymore. If anything, they have made me a huge danger on the road when I drive any other vehicle.

Obviously Subaru's are everywhere in upstate NY, and are extremely good in the snow. I would argue at least part of the equation is economics though.

It's worse than that. He's basing his statement about AWD Audis on his experience with a FWD GTI. That's absurd.

Plus, I used to own a GTI. It was great in the snow. The suggestion that it's less capable than an old Corvette is what we call a "lie".

 

[mildone_rivals]

Audi is a funny brand. As they've mainstreamed, they've gotten more reliable - my "first of breed" B7 A4, circa 2005, was a frequent flier to the service department. My wife's B8 A4 hasn't so seen the shop in 3 years, except for when Audi told us after a scheduled maintenance check that it had failed their oil consumption test and that they would be replacing the engine. I have a 3 week-old A3 that is the most buttoned-down piece of automotive hardware I've ever seen.

I was just teasing about the VW/Audi thing. But in all seriousness, I will be interested to see how things go w/your A3 reliability-wise. I need to pick up a new 4WD SUV first, but when it comes time to consider my next fun car, for which the Cayman is currently in the lead, the only other two cars that have come to mind to consider are the Corvette and the Audi S5 (or RS-5 if offered at that time).

I haven't really found any other cars all that interesting. Well, except maybe another Speed3 if the rumors of the next gen model having AWD prove to be true. If Mazda does that, there's no way I don't test drive that car because the one I have still gets me out driving just for the sheer joy and excitement of it. And it's dirt cheap. I'm way more comfortable messing around with aftermarket upgrades to an MS3 than I ever would be to any of the more expensive cars I'm considering.

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

It's worse than that. He's basing his statement about AWD Audis on his experience with a FWD GTI. That's absurd.

Plus, I used to own a GTI. It was great in the snow. The suggestion that it's less capable than an old Corvette is what we call a "lie".

Maybe he is thinking of an old 3 series BMW. At least that's what it made me think of. Those things were absolutely useless in snow.

The post is interesting in that it is indicative of one of the biggest problems that all car companies, but particularly, Ford and GM, have to deal with, which is that the perception of reliability, once formed, is really difficult to shake. Once people have what they believe is an unreliable car, they will never buy that brand again. There were people who were becoming adults in the 1990's for whom Honda will always make the most reliable car.

 

[Upstream]

If you want to know what cars last long, just look at the other vehicles on the road. 10-15 year old Hondas & Toyotas dominate that age group (along with Ford & Chevy vans & pick-up trucks).

That doesn't tell you which cars last long. That only tells you which cars people keep a long time. First, the number of old cars is based on the cars being sold. In 2005, there were about 1.5 times as many new Honda Accords sold as Chevy Malibus. So all things being equal, today I would expect to see 1.5 times as many 2005 Accords on the road as Malibus. But beyond that, Accord owners may be the type of people who keep their cars until they fall apart, while Malibu owners may be more inclined to get new cars every few years (meaning they are selling their used cars, which may end up being sold off-shore, used for part, or sold as scrap -- the same fates that would happen to Accords if they were sold).

 

[Ole Cabbagehead]

If you want to know what cars last long, just look at the other vehicles on the road. 10-15 year old Hondas & Toyotas dominate that age group (along with Ford & Chevy vans & pick-up trucks).

I think your point is valid, but I think economics factor into this as well. The Hondas and Toyotas are cheap to buy and cheap to fix. So they are frequently bought by people who need cheap cars, and those people are more likely to fix their old car when it breaks as opposed to buying something new. Because they can fix it for a low price, they are likely to do that instead of buying something new.

German cars are expensive to fix. So once they need major repairs, the economics don't make sense. So you won't see a lot of 15 year old German cars on American highways.

 

[FRA10Thunderbolt]

Surprised those other makes ahead of Honda. Am hard to please but Id buy another Honda before another Toyota.

Have a 2004 Toyota RAV4 with 270,000 miles; has never had to go into the shop for any unscheduled service. everything still works like the day I drove it off the lot brand new.