OT: Question for Madison/Ridgeland Dawgs......

[coach66]

It is nice, my best friend has built many homes

Homes There and he says people are surprised when they find out it is in MC zone. He says right now more people looking to get to Germantown for whatever reason.

Belle terre land was MSU Dudley Bozeman's family's land.

 

[ShrubDog]

I was not, but that should always be a concern nowadays. I was implying supply may be vastly outpacing demand. Following the crowd is rarely a path to financial success.

You are so right about all of this. I was part of the housing boom in Florida in 2008 and we all know where that went. I worked with many developers and boy did we clear out some acres and fill in some swamps. And all signs are pointing to another burst in the near future. And this one will make 2008 look like a walk in candy land. I am looking to move as well but am holding off until the market re-adjusts.

 

[Rog.sixpack]

You could also move to Fondren or Leftover and not live in suburbia forever

You couldn't pay me to live in Providence subdivision.

I'm possibly moving (back) to the Madison/Ridgeland area, and I'm curious about good neighborhoods for young families. My wife and I are 33, and we have an 18 month old daughter. We'd like to find a neighborhood with other young families and with neighborhood activities going on.

What say the DakPack?

Thanks.

 

[Hammer Down]

You are so right about all of this. I was part of the housing boom in Florida in 2008 and we all know where that went. I worked with many developers and boy did we clear out some acres and fill in some swamps. And all signs are pointing to another burst in the near future. And this one will make 2008 look like a walk in candy land. I am looking to move as well but am holding off until the market re-adjusts.

I saw some of the figures that the Counties were throwing out down there, specifically Okaloosa and Walton Counties, and wow.....it's hard to see how people didn't see the boom coming. But I'm not acting high and mighty, no one should, I think we all got wrapped up in the get rich quick stuff. And bottom line, no one saw that bust coming, so I'm sort of of the opinion that these highs and lows are very unpredictable, even for the smartest of folks. Simply a roll of the dice.

 

[Hammer Down]

Buy in Gluckstadt on the west side of 55.

The Rankin County School Distrct is a dumpster fire, but no one seems to care. The Rez pays the freight for the entire district, but NWRMS and HS are chronically overcrowded with sorely outdated facilities and resources. The disctict has no plan and doesn't feel enough pressure to formulate one

With the changing demographics of Flowood, it wil become Ridgeland/Clinton in 15-20

My Gluckstadt coworkers constantly complain about neighborhoods with smaller houses being built and whine about Canton kids (with faked residency) going to Germantown Middle and High.

Check out www.schooldigger.com. Be warned, there is much chicanery involved in school rankings, but one thing that can't be manipulated is students eligible for free or reduced lunch.

I always thought Rankin County schools were considered OK. I almost moved to Jackson metro a few years ago and I would have lived in Rankin County had I decided to do that, over Madison County. My personal preference would have been Brandon or Northwest, and I had always heard those were good places/schools. I liked the area to the east of the reservoir, or the Bay Pointe area.

I also never thought the Flowood/Pearl area would change demographically. Riff-raff doesn't seem to want to cross the river. I will say this, I absolutely could not believe the state of NE Jackson. Sad.

Madison County, while very nice, always seemed sort of volatile to me. The way the congressional districts are drawn up, to the proximity to Canton.....I got the feeling that I would always be worrying about ever-changing zoning/districts/etc. if I moved out there. Definitely a lot of things going on out that way though. I hope they build them a business jet capable airport too, would really help economic development.

 

[mstateglfr]

I was not, but that should always be a concern nowadays. I was implying supply may be vastly outpacing demand. Following the crowd is rarely a path to financial success.

Couple things-

- If supply is outpacing demand, I agree there could(will) be an issue down the line of suppressed values.

-but-

- Looking at a home as a financial investment is completely twisted at this point. Sure owning a home was the safest path to consistent value growth, but looking at your family home as an investment is just backwards now. The value of a home needs to be in the eye of the beholder. Sentimental value needs to be taken into account- the value of stability, value of memories, value of safety, etc all go into whether a home is 'worth' the costs to a family.
The reality is that land prices and home values will continue to fluctuate.
You don't want to be dumb and buy a cookie cutter townhome in the middle of a new development of unbought townhomes that is located within a ring of already build unoccupied townhomes- that is a stupid financial decision, but short of that, buying a home should be about most everything BUT projected financial success.


Family homes should not viewed as a vehicle for financial success. They should be viewed as a path towards stability, safety, and memories.

 

[mstateglfr]

I saw some of the figures that the Counties were throwing out down there, specifically Okaloosa and Walton Counties, and wow.....it's hard to see how people didn't see the boom coming. But I'm not acting high and mighty, no one should, I think we all got wrapped up in the get rich quick stuff. And bottom line, no one saw that bust coming, so I'm sort of of the opinion that these highs and lows are very unpredictable, even for the smartest of folks. Simply a roll of the dice.

We bought our first house a year after college in the spring of '05 at the height of prices in Iowa. We sold it 7 years later for the exact same price we bought it for- so at a loss after taking into account realtor fees and the updating we did. But the upgrades made life easier and made it ours. It killed me to sell at what was effectively a loss, but I cant imagine being underwater by 20% or more like other areas of the country.

With that said, a college buddy bought a townhome in Pompano Beach back in '05 for over $450K. I remember specifically telling him that was insane and that there was just no justification for the prices. I have been there- its nice weather as long as you aren't being blown away by a hurricane, but its hardly paradise. I never imagined the floor falling out from under him and everyone else, but on a micro level it was actually quite easy to see how the purchase couldn't justify the price.

A new mass construction townhome just cant justify that price. Take the land value(which is an incredibly small amount of acreage), add construction costs, and you end up with what?- a number not even close to what the mortgage was for.




Farm land, at least up where I am, very well could be the next thing to drop. If/when it does, itll be the farm debacle of the 70s/80s all over again with farms collapsing left and right. land prices since 1993 have increased exponentially to the point of scary levels.

 

[J-Dawg]

Couple things-

- If supply is outpacing demand, I agree there could(will) be an issue down the line of suppressed values.

-but-

- Looking at a home as a financial investment is completely twisted at this point. Sure owning a home was the safest path to consistent value growth, but looking at your family home as an investment is just backwards now. The value of a home needs to be in the eye of the beholder. Sentimental value needs to be taken into account- the value of stability, value of memories, value of safety, etc all go into whether a home is 'worth' the costs to a family.
The reality is that land prices and home values will continue to fluctuate.
You don't want to be dumb and buy a cookie cutter townhome in the middle of a new development of unbought townhomes that is located within a ring of already build unoccupied townhomes- that is a stupid financial decision, but short of that, buying a home should be about most everything BUT projected financial success.


Family homes should not viewed as a vehicle for financial success. They should be viewed as a path towards stability, safety, and memories.

Considering the area in question, they can hardly even finish building these homes before they sell. It's very rare to see any of these new builds stay on the market for long in this area, and many have a sold sign before the sheetrock gets hung. So, unless I'm just completely oblivious to something, I'd say that supply = demand at this point, to be conservative.

As far as your financial investment vs. sentimental investment... I agree to an extent. I don't view a home as a completely financial decision, but I also don't view it as completely "sentimental". Convenience is probably the main value falling in the sentimental category, for me, along with quality of life. Schools is another value that falls into the financial and non-financial investment categories, if you will.

 

[Hammer Down]

We bought our first house a year after college in the spring of '05 at the height of prices in Iowa. We sold it 7 years later for the exact same price we bought it for- so at a loss after taking into account realtor fees and the updating we did. But the upgrades made life easier and made it ours. It killed me to sell at what was effectively a loss, but I cant imagine being underwater by 20% or more like other areas of the country.

With that said, a college buddy bought a townhome in Pompano Beach back in '05 for over $450K. I remember specifically telling him that was insane and that there was just no justification for the prices. I have been there- its nice weather as long as you aren't being blown away by a hurricane, but its hardly paradise. I never imagined the floor falling out from under him and everyone else, but on a micro level it was actually quite easy to see how the purchase couldn't justify the price.

A new mass construction townhome just cant justify that price. Take the land value(which is an incredibly small amount of acreage), add construction costs, and you end up with what?- a number not even close to what the mortgage was for.




Farm land, at least up where I am, very well could be the next thing to drop. If/when it does, itll be the farm debacle of the 70s/80s all over again with farms collapsing left and right. land prices since 1993 have increased exponentially to the point of scary levels.

Yeah, about the only way anyone should really consider buying real estate is if they want to be in it for the long haul. I agree with your other post too regarding why to buy a home. My current home is a good example - it's in a good location (or at least I think it is) coupled with the fact that we bought it to live in, not to flip after 6 months. I've found you typically come out pretty good if you take into account location, timing, and commit to a minimum of 3 years.

 

[coach66]

The biggest problem with Madison County is the board of supervisors. They

operate like the damn mafia, with their give and take alliances to get a majority. The tail wags the dog quite often.

 

[patdog]

Best advice is to buy a little less than you can afford and be prepared to stay in that house for the long term if necessary. There will be another recession, it's just a question of when and how bad it will be. The less debt you have, the better you will be prepared to weather it.

 

[Nugdawg]

Financing....as always, if you or anyone else needs financing on one of these fine homes, reach out to me and do business with the official mortgage lender of the Pack! Unless DS removed it, it still says that by my name! Seriously though, we have financed countless homes in all of the above mentioned neighborhoods so we are very familiar with them. PM me if I can be of any help to answer any questions about them or financing options.

Edited to say that after posting I see that back during some of the changeover, I was clearly stripped of my title by Dawgstudent!

 

[johnson86-1]

Farm land, at least up where I am, very well could be the next thing to drop. If/when it does, itll be the farm debacle of the 70s/80s all over again with farms collapsing left and right. land prices since 1993 have increased exponentially to the point of scary levels.

The ag industry has actually been too successful at lobbying for that industry to avoid a bust. The U.S. ethanol policy is atrocious and screws pretty much everybody not in the ag or ethanol business, so you'd think eventually it will have to end (although I would have thought it would be impossible to openly screw people this long, so what do I know). That alone is going to put the hurt on a lot of people if they actually bought land or did long term leases based on prices elevated by the U.S. burning basically half its corn supply each year.

 

[fishwater99]

Belhaven and Northeast jackson are great too...

If your children are young you should enjoy living in the city for a while, especially if you work in Jackson.
You can always move later on if you can't afford private schools, but FPDS is affordable and goes through 6th grade.
The price hike comes from 7th-12th when you have to go to Prep or JA.

 

[NCDawg.sixpack]

If your children are young you should enjoy living in the city for a while, especially if you work in Jackson.
You can always move later on if you can't afford private schools, but FPDS is affordable and goes through 6th grade.
The price hike comes from 7th-12th when you have to go to Prep or JA.

What is FPDS?

 

[Hammer Down]

If your children are young you should enjoy living in the city for a while, especially if you work in Jackson.
You can always move later on if you can't afford private schools, but FPDS is affordable and goes through 6th grade.
The price hike comes from 7th-12th when you have to go to Prep or JA.

Question for you fishwater99 - you seem to be a Jackson advocate, so where does the good part of Fondren end, on the north side. When I was looking at the area, I came down Hwy. 51/State Street, and as soon as I crossed under 55 to the west (going south), I thought I was in a 3rd world country. So, at what point between there and Fondren, does it turn from ghetto to livable area? Northside Drive?

Then, cross 55 to the east, I am still stunned at how run-down the area around JA was. I did not go into Eastover (I really don't even know where that is), but it really seemed like that whole area, all the way out to Ridgeland (including Northpark Mall), has really gone downhill. Thugs abounded. Obviously some wealthy people still live around there, as Whole Foods conducted a study that said that was the wealthiest area of the state.

Either way, I'm just trying to match up facts with my own findings/opinions. My intent is not to run Jackson down, on the contrary, I only wish good things for the capital city of the state.

 

[fishwater99]

First Presbyterian Day School

What is FPDS?

http://www.fpds.org/

It's off State Street in Belhaven...

 

[NCDawg.sixpack]

http://www.fpds.org/

It's off State Street in Belhaven...

I don't know, still seems pretty high to me. $13,800 per year for 2 kids. One thing I can say for the Raleigh NC area, since I moved up here, they have great public schools.

 

[fishwater99]

Question for you fishwater99 - you seem to be a Jackson advocate, so where does the good part of Fondren end, on the north side. When I was looking at the area, I came down Hwy. 51/State Street, and as soon as I crossed under 55 to the west (going south), I thought I was in a 3rd world country. So, at what point between there and Fondren, does it turn from ghetto to livable area? Northside Drive? (It's Northside Drive, but I would say Meadowbrook is the North Boundary and State Street is the West Boundary) http://www.finditinfondren.com/

Then, cross 55 to the east, I am still stunned at how run-down the area around JA was. I did not go into Eastover (I really don't even know where that is), but it really seemed like that whole area, all the way out to Ridgeland (including Northpark Mall), has really gone downhill. Thugs abounded. Obviously some wealthy people still live around there, as Whole Foods conducted a study that said that was the wealthiest area of the state. (North of Old Canton on Ridgewood is down, you have to go south on Ridgewood towards Lakeland.
Take Northside Drive to the East and this is Leftover, then Eastover is the area just South of Meadowbook and East of Ridgewood down to Eastover Drive).

Either way, I'm just trying to match up facts with my own findings/opinions. My intent is not to run Jackson down, on the contrary, I only wish good things for the capital city of the state.

I live in Belhaven and love it. We have two of the best restaurants in town in my neighborhood in the Manship and Provisions 1908.
We are close to everything, we have a great park down the street and plenty of activities, music and art are close by.
I am not saying I won't move when my children are older for public High Schools, it's a possibility and I can understand why anyone else does. What I don't understand is why people with no children choose to live in the burbs if they work in Jackson.
I also don't understand why people live in Madison and still send their children to private schools.
I have lived in New Orleans and Jackson is much safer imo, and we never had a problem in NOLA either.

 

[Mafiadawg]

While there may be a house or two that doesn't look great on ridgewood, the area around JA isn't run down at all. Not sure what you are even referring too. Maybe you were lost?

 

[Hammer Down]

While there may be a house or two that doesn't look great on ridgewood, the area around JA isn't run down at all. Not sure what you are even referring too. Maybe you were lost?

No, I went up Ridgewood from Lakeland, all the way up to County Line, and then out to the east and ultimately to the Old Canton/Spillway Rd. intersection. It may not have been run down, but it was much different from what I remember when I was growing up. I didn't grow up in Jackson, but I went there a good bit for doctors, shopping, etc. It honestly didn't get better until I got north of County Line....there were check cashing places, and all sorts of riff raff right there at County Line and Old Canton, a place I remember as being very nice back in the day. Back to Ridgewood.....I thought I was going to get jacked riding through there, from Lakeland all the way up to County Line. And wasn't there an armed robbery right in that area not too long ago? I honestly felt safer in downtown and Fondren than in NE Jackson.

Again, I'm not a local. Just my observations. It was sort of funny, I'd see a bunch of ghetto'ed out houses along Ridgewood, then I'd see a big house on the corner with a bunch of huge SUVs and an Ole Miss flag. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Hammer Down]

I live in Belhaven and love it. We have two of the best restaurants in town in my neighborhood in the Manship and Provisions 1908.
We are close to everything, we have a great park down the street and plenty of activities, music and art are close by.
I am not saying I won't move when my children are older for public High Schools, it's a possibility and I can understand why anyone else does. What I don't understand is why people with no children choose to live in the burbs if they work in Jackson.
I also don't understand why people live in Madison and still send their children to private schools.
I have lived in New Orleans and Jackson is much safer imo, and we never had a problem in NOLA either.

Thanks, I like that area as well, although really the only place I've eaten is Walkers. I've only ridden through there, so I'm a rookie. I am fascinated at how certain areas keep value and stay nice, and then literally right across the tracks is just sh*t. That's the way it seems to be in downtown Jackson, especially there around MDOT and the Capital.

 

[MaroonOldCrow]

Any place with a frequently seen pineapple motif on the houses should be fine.**

NM

 

[johnson86-1]

What I don't understand is why people with no children choose to live in the burbs if they work in Jackson.

I'd be pretty hesitant to buy in Jackson out of concern for property values, so I can understand why people without children would buy in the suburbs if they want to buy rather than rent.

 

[BoomBoom.sixpack]

Considering the area in question, they can hardly even finish building these homes before they sell. It's very rare to see any of these new builds stay on the market for long in this area, and many have a sold sign before the sheetrock gets hung. So, unless I'm just completely oblivious to something, I'd say that supply = demand at this point, to be conservative.

As far as your financial investment vs. sentimental investment... I agree to an extent. I don't view a home as a completely financial decision, but I also don't view it as completely "sentimental". Convenience is probably the main value falling in the sentimental category, for me, along with quality of life. Schools is another value that falls into the financial and non-financial investment categories, if you will.

sure, as long as the builders stop building at the same exact time as demand falls off. but that's not how things work. i don't see underlying fundamentals to explain the demand, Jackson isn't growing and job opportunities in the area aren't growing, there's no influx of population to the greater Jax area. maybe school zones and white flight explains it, but i don't see it. add that to the rapid building pace, and it doesn't look good long term. the people selling now probably know what they are doing.

 

[ronpolk]

I live in Belhaven and love it. We have two of the best restaurants in town in my neighborhood in the Manship and Provisions 1908.
We are close to everything, we have a great park down the street and plenty of activities, music and art are close by.
I am not saying I won't move when my children are older for public High Schools, it's a possibility and I can understand why anyone else does. What I don't understand is why people with no children choose to live in the burbs if they work in Jackson.
I also don't understand why people live in Madison and still send their children to private schools.
I have lived in New Orleans and Jackson is much safer imo, and we never had a problem in NOLA either.

I found and wanted a nice older home in Fondren when my wife and I were looking. I was ready to pull the trigger and live there for about 5 years (until our daughter started school). However, my wife did not feel comfortable staying by herself there. A large part of me thinks she being dramatic but I do travel a lot for work and her peace of mind is nice to have. We ended up buying in ashbrooke. I actually like the neighborhood a lot but it takes getting used to being so far away from a grocery store or at least a gas station.

 

[J-Dawg]

sure, as long as the builders stop building at the same exact time as demand falls off. but that's not how things work. i don't see underlying fundamentals to explain the demand, Jackson isn't growing and job opportunities in the area aren't growing, there's no influx of population to the greater Jax area. maybe school zones and white flight explains it, but i don't see it. add that to the rapid building pace, and it doesn't look good long term. the people selling now probably know what they are doing.

Well, I guess I'm just doomed then. **



On a serious note though, I do think flight has alot to do with it. I can't exactly explain the demand either, but I do know that an extremely large percentage of folks that graduated State around the same time as me have ended up in the metro area... so I'm guessing there's something drawing a decent number of mainly young professionals and young families to the area.

 

[coach66]

Good farmland doesn't go out if style,

Especially when it's getting welfare payments that have become lucrative.

 

[J-Dawg]

I found and wanted a nice older home in Fondren when my wife and I were looking. I was ready to pull the trigger and live there for about 5 years (until our daughter started school). However, my wife did not feel comfortable staying by herself there. A large part of me thinks she being dramatic but I do travel a lot for work and her peace of mind is nice to have. We ended up buying in ashbrooke. I actually like the neighborhood a lot but it takes getting used to being so far away from a grocery store or at least a gas station.

I'd be willing to bet a grocery store or two ends up off the Gluckstadt exit once they finish re-doing it.

 

[ronpolk]

I'd be willing to bet a grocery store or two ends up off the Gluckstadt exit once they finish re-doing it.

I think so too. Once I found out the plans for the new exit I was willing to make the move. I think gluckstadt, west of 55, is getting ready to boom with commercial development. Too many people living out there now for stuff not to pop up.

 

[J-Dawg]

I think so too. Once I found out the plans for the new exit I was willing to make the move. I think gluckstadt, west of 55, is getting ready to boom with commercial development. Too many people living out there now for stuff not to pop up.

Can't be. There's nothing to justify the growth in the area**

 

[JDuck17]

Did anyone else go to the Mansdale Open house tonight....I'd say there are a few extra students as compared to last year.....and 5 new trailer class rooms. Prob 1/3 again more.

 

[BoomBoom.sixpack]

Well, I guess I'm just doomed then. **



On a serious note though, I do think flight has alot to do with it. I can't exactly explain the demand either, but I do know that an extremely large percentage of folks that graduated State around the same time as me have ended up in the metro area... so I'm guessing there's something drawing a decent number of mainly young professionals and young families to the area.

that happened for me too, but I and most people i knew ended up elsewhere. i think it has to do with the relative size of the city offering more entry opportunities, and geographic location and other factors making it appealing to most State grads. but the lack of general job opportunities (for advancement) leads the younguns elsewhere usually.

as to housing, the key is to just not justify a purchase by "everyone else is doing it so it must be smart". if it's better than the alternatives in the short term, then go for it, you have to live somewhere. but if it's significantly more expensive than the alternatives, then don't justify it based on expected resale, because the market doesn't look good IMO.

 

[Faustdog]

I always thought Rankin County schools were considered OK. I almost moved to Jackson metro a few years ago and I would have lived in Rankin County had I decided to do that, over Madison County. My personal preference would have been Brandon or Northwest, and I had always heard those were good places/schools. I liked the area to the east of the reservoir, or the Bay Pointe area.

I also never thought the Flowood/Pearl area would change demographically. Riff-raff doesn't seem to want to cross the river. I will say this, I absolutely could not believe the state of NE Jackson. Sad.

Madison County, while very nice, always seemed sort of volatile to me. The way the congressional districts are drawn up, to the proximity to Canton.....I got the feeling that I would always be worrying about ever-changing zoning/districts/etc. if I moved out there. Definitely a lot of things going on out that way though. I hope they build them a business jet capable airport too, would really help economic development.

Don't let anyone tell you there is anything wrong with Ranking County schools. They are consistently highly ranked.

 

[patdog]

They are good schools. Only problem with them is the facilities in the Northwest zone are terribly inadequate for the number of students and they won't do a damn thing about it.

 

[J-Dawg]

Thanks for the advice?

 

[Lawdawg.sixpack]

I heard that Kroger is looking on the parkway by Germantown HS, and a smaller local chain (McDades, Rameys, etc) is looking at Gluckstadt Rd, west of 55.

There's also a new gas station/food place going in also on the west side.

 

[ronpolk]

I heard that Kroger is looking on the parkway by Germantown HS, and a smaller local chain (McDades, Rameys, etc) is looking at Gluckstadt Rd, west of 55.

There's also a new gas station/food place going in also on the west side.

Hope you're right about that. There are a few lots available on gluckstadt rd that would be a good fit for a kroger or any grocery store really.

 

[mstateglfr]

The ag industry has actually been too successful at lobbying for that industry to avoid a bust. The U.S. ethanol policy is atrocious and screws pretty much everybody not in the ag or ethanol business, so you'd think eventually it will have to end (although I would have thought it would be impossible to openly screw people this long, so what do I know). That alone is going to put the hurt on a lot of people if they actually bought land or did long term leases based on prices elevated by the U.S. burning basically half its corn supply each year.

agreed.
I work in logistics/transportation and my office works with 4 of the 6 largest seed companies in the world, as well as dozens of seed and ag companies that are all based around ethanol and seed production. Its gonna be a brutal day if/when all this stuff is no longer inflated by government funding and tax breaks.

 

[J-Dawg]

I heard that Kroger is looking on the parkway by Germantown HS, and a smaller local chain (McDades, Rameys, etc) is looking at Gluckstadt Rd, west of 55.

There's also a new gas station/food place going in also on the west side.

A McDade's would be nice. That stretch of Calhoun Parkway from G'stadt Rd to Stribling Ext. seems prime for development.