OT: Who I'm voting for in this years presidential election.

[DukeDenver]

I don't think refusing to participate contributes to fixing it at all. Not voting is essentially a vote for whomever you like least. If they're truly indecipherable in your mind, fine.

I know that's the adage, and I don't disagree with you. My point is that voting doesn't contribute to fixing it at all either. So if neither action helps, I choose the easier path.

Picking a president is just one part of the problem. Congress sucks too. It's hard to imagine a world where we can actually trust politicians to serve the people. You'd have to take away all financial incentive for holding the office. Not sure how that would work.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

I find it odd that some people believe one politician is more crooked than the other. The majority of them have special interest. I also laugh when you have rich people acting like they are representing the masses (both parties). These VP nods better be great!

Yes. It's silly to believe that one is better than the other.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

I find it odd that some people believe one politician is more crooked than the other. The majority of them have special interest. I also laugh when you have rich people acting like they are representing the masses (both parties). These VP nods better be great!

Yes. It's silly to believe that one is better than the other.

 

[Dattier]

I know that's the adage, and I don't disagree with you. My point is that voting doesn't contribute to fixing it at all either. So if neither action helps, I choose the easier path.

The adage I know of is that if you don't vote, you can't complain. I think that's ridiculous, though. You can complain all you want about whatever you want.

If you're a cynic or just wanting to justify the least effort possible, you can argue that no individual makes any difference. I would submit that where you make a difference is probably in between opportunities to vote. Educate yourself and others on an issue, decide on a plan, call your representatives, start a movement. That can ultimately lead to an improved slate of candidates to vote for or not to vote for.

 

[crazyduke3]

Teddy is typically the one I always mean. Last one I enjoyed.

 

[Showenuff]

I would like a stronger military. I would like tougher handling of illegal immigrants. I would like to see stronger border patrol. I strongly support the 2nd Amendment. I would love to see our Vets treated better and get the care they deserve. I'd like a President who supports our Police officers and respects the Flag. I'd like a President who stands up for America not one who makes apologies and excuses. I'd like to have a President who can help the economy and bring jobs back to America. So, yea, I'm voting for Donald Trump. Does he say stupid ****? Yep. Is he downright obnoxious at times? Yep. Do I think he'd be 1000 times better for America than Clinton? Hell yes.

 

[Kingbluedevil]

I would like a stronger military. I would like tougher handling of illegal immigrants. I would like to see stronger border patrol. I strongly support the 2nd Amendment. I would love to see our Vets treated better and get the care they deserve. I'd like a President who supports our Police officers and respects the Flag. I'd like a President who stands up for America not one who makes apologies and excuses. I'd like to have a President who can help the economy and bring jobs back to America. So, yea, I'm voting for Donald Trump. Does he say stupid ****? Yep. Is he downright obnoxious at times? Yep. Do I think he'd be 1000 times better for America than Clinton? Hell yes.

Agree with all of this.

 

[Jake1985]

What about the Candidate who wins is Preident and the one who doesn't win is the VP. Always will have a bipartisan White House then they will be forced to lead together

 

[hallside]

If it's down to Clinton and Trump, I'm afraid I won't vote. I'm 24 and staring a world of corruption in the face. The only person that actually cares about the human beings in this country is about to lose his fight (Bernie). Any informed, intelligent person understands we need a change to our ancient political structure. I am truly disappointed in our country for not seeing through the mainstream media and all the lies from Clinton, and the selfish tycoon Trump is. Yet Congress will be happy with yet another president that will change nothing and let their friends with the money make all the decisions, and not Americans ourselves.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

If it's down to Clinton and Trump, I'm afraid I won't vote. I'm 24 and staring a world of corruption in the face. The only person that actually cares about the human beings in this country is about to lose his fight (Bernie). Any informed, intelligent person understands we need a change to our ancient political structure. I am truly disappointed in our country for not seeing through the mainstream media and all the lies from Clinton, and the selfish tycoon Trump is. Yet Congress will be happy with yet another president that will change nothing and let their friends with the money make all the decisions, and not Americans ourselves.

You can always vote for Sanders as a write in. That way you can talk all the **** you want about whoever does get the office.

 

[Maxwel]

Come November Trump will be screwed, blued and tattooed.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

Come November Trump will be screwed, blued and tattooed.

I don't think Trump or Hilldog will be the ones screwed come November. That will be you, me and the next guy you see.

 

[Dukesince90]

If it's down to Clinton and Trump, I'm afraid I won't vote. I'm 24 and staring a world of corruption in the face. The only person that actually cares about the human beings in this country is about to lose his fight (Bernie). Any informed, intelligent person understands we need a change to our ancient political structure. I am truly disappointed in our country for not seeing through the mainstream media and all the lies from Clinton, and the selfish tycoon Trump is. Yet Congress will be happy with yet another president that will change nothing and let their friends with the money make all the decisions, and not Americans ourselves.

I've been fascinated with all the young voters Sanders has. From what I've seen he's promising free college tuition for everyone. Who's going to pay for that? I'm tired of all the free handouts that the working man has to help fund through their taxes. Everyone needs to get off their a$$ and make something for themselves and not be dependent on the government. As for me, I'm voting Trump.

 

[QC Dukie]

I've been fascinated with all the young voters Sanders has. From what I've seen he's promising free college tuition for everyone. Who's going to pay for that? I'm tired of all the free handouts that the working man has to help fund through their taxes. Everyone needs to get off their a$$ and make something for themselves and not be dependent on the government. As for me, I'm voting Trump.

I agree. Sick and tired of all these freeloaders sitting at home chilling while I'm out busting my ***. What really gets me is being in the grocery store and see them use their snap card then walk outside and they're driving a nicer vehicle than me. And who do you think is paying for all these "free" cell phones??

OFC

 

[Dukesince90]

I agree. Sick and tired of all these freeloaders sitting at home chilling while I'm out busting my ***. What really gets me is being in the grocery store and see them use their snap card then walk outside and they're driving a nicer vehicle than me. And who do you think is paying for all these "free" cell phones??

OFC

You got that right! I get to work around 6:45 am and get home around 6 or 7 pm Monday through Friday and also work most Saturday mornings. I go to the grocery store as well and see the grocery buggies piling over and they get to the register and whip out the ABT card, makes me sick. The government has turned our society into these freeloaders you mentioned. It's time to quit enabling everyone to expect something for nothing.

 

[hallside]

First off, I know for a fact Bernie wouldn't be able to actually accomplish everything on his agenda. Second, I don't want him to. But in order for an economy our size to succeed, we need to do something about the distribution of money. We need to give people like us a better chance to succeed. At this rate college tuition will be over 20k/yr by 2030 at state schools? Where is that money going? Our middle class is being decimated by this, and also by coporate banking everywhere. All of my friends and I are in deep debt for trying to further our education. And once you graduate, every entry level job needs 3-5 yrs experience. I understand you think these are "handouts" but you have to invest in your youth to have a bright future. And we have been set up for failure, while being called the laziest generation ever.

PS- for everyone thinking the 2nd amendment is in trouble, don't worry. It will never be removed. Yet the gun business and politicians involved will try to make you believe that, so you can go spend money on guns before they "take them away". Not gonna happen. Ask Obama.

For people who might think I'm a "loser" wanting "free money", I work as a roofer 40 hrs/week after 4 years of college. All this said, GO DUKE NONETHELESS

 

[Dukesince90]

First off, I know for a fact Bernie wouldn't be able to actually accomplish everything on his agenda. Second, I don't want him to. But in order for an economy our size to succeed, we need to do something about the distribution of money. We need to give people like us a better chance to succeed. At this rate college tuition will be over 20k/yr by 2030 at state schools? Where is that money going? Our middle class is being decimated by this, and also by coporate banking everywhere. All of my friends and I are in deep debt for trying to further our education. And once you graduate, every entry level job needs 3-5 yrs experience. I understand you think these are "handouts" but you have to invest in your youth to have a bright future. And we have been set up for failure, while being called the laziest generation ever.

PS- for everyone thinking the 2nd amendment is in trouble, don't worry. It will never be removed. Yet the gun business and politicians involved will try to make you believe that, so you can go spend money on guns before they "take them away". Not gonna happen. Ask Obama.

For people who might think I'm a "loser" wanting "free money", I work as a roofer 40 hrs/week after 4 years of college. All this said, GO DUKE NONETHELESS

I never thought you were a "loser", I just want to know where you think the money is going to come from to fund these low college tuitions?

 

[hallside]

I never thought you were a "loser", I just want to know where you think the money is going to come from to fund these low college tuitions?

I think taxing proportionally would be a great start. Also, military spending is out of this world. I know people are sick of hearing it but when the top 1% has more money than the other 99% combined in a country of over 300 million people... That is a recipe for an economical disaster. There will be no money to go around if it stays the way it is.

 

[gottagonow]

Why do we even need congress? Have a pure democracy where we can each vote on policy. We're past the days where we need to send a representative on horseback to go vote for us.

They would only be needed for a few select committees, where information discussed shouldn't be released to the public (for other countries' viewing).

Congress will never go away. Why? Because it would require congress to do away with themselves and thats not going to happen even if it was the difference in saving America verses destroying America. A US Congressman lives a life of royalty and entitlement, thus why they want to be Congressman. They are all after one thing, power.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

I think taxing proportionally would be a great start. Also, military spending is out of this world. I know people are sick of hearing it but when the top 1% has more money than the other 99% combined in a country of over 300 million people... That is a recipe for an economical disaster. There will be no money to go around if it stays the way it is.

I will start by saying that I don't have an answer to the rich get richer and poor stay poor riddle. (which qualifies me for president) But allowing the middle class to keep more of their money they earn would be a good start. Everyone talks a big game when it comes to the middle class while campaigning. But once they are elected, it's back to status quo. I don't know everything about a flat tax or a fair tax, but it would even the playing field IMO. At least as far as keeping more of the money we earn anyways.

 

[DukeDenver]

Hallside, you sound like me 10 years ago. That idealism fades into pragmatism and pessimism after you have children and become more of a working professional. Wealth redistribution doesn't work in practice because the Federal government wastes it or misappropriates it. Socialized medicine, limits on corporations and some form of basic income are clearly needed to protect our weakest, but smaller entities, perhaps states or even counties, should be doing this locally. We've gotten too big to effectively centralize these institutions.

 

[gottagonow]

I would like a stronger military. I would like tougher handling of illegal immigrants. I would like to see stronger border patrol. I strongly support the 2nd Amendment. I would love to see our Vets treated better and get the care they deserve. I'd like a President who supports our Police officers and respects the Flag. I'd like a President who stands up for America not one who makes apologies and excuses. I'd like to have a President who can help the economy and bring jobs back to America. So, yea, I'm voting for Donald Trump. Does he say stupid ****? Yep. Is he downright obnoxious at times? Yep. Do I think he'd be 1000 times better for America than Clinton? Hell yes.

Show this is actually one of the better analogies of why I am a Republican and not a Democrat. I do not like much of what comes out of his mouth but I feel most of it is from his heart and his actual beliefs, its just the opposite with Hillary. Trump and Hillary are great at telling their followers what they want to hear but hopefully Trump believes it, but how can anyone believe anything she says. I cannot trust her to tell the truth, not even 1 out of 100 times.

 

[skysdad]

I'm not a Trump supporter by any means and I will not vote for Hillary which really leaves me in a tough position but let me say this. Donald Trump has the tight to campaign in peace without violence and his supporters have the right to have rally's in his support. I would say the same thing if these things were happening in the Hillary and Bernie campaigns. Why aren't either of these candidates stepping up and asking for this to stop. It is their supporters who are doing this. Do they really want these kind of people supporting them. Before it's over there is going to be real situation where someone gets hurt or loses their life. It wouldn't surprise me if some fool doesn't try to assassinate Trump.OFC

 

[Dattier]

I agree. Sick and tired of all these freeloaders sitting at home chilling while I'm out busting my ***. What really gets me is being in the grocery store and see them use their snap card then walk outside and they're driving a nicer vehicle than me. And who do you think is paying for all these "free" cell phones??

OFC

Wow, you even ate the bowl that crap came in. That's some sick, twisted hate directed at strangers right there. You pay more to support people like Trump and their corporate welfare than you do all the people at the grocery store you don't know but judge anyway.

 

[Dattier]

Show this is actually one of the better analogies of why I am a Republican and not a Democrat. I do not like much of what comes out of his mouth but I feel most of it is from his heart and his actual beliefs, its just the opposite with Hillary. Trump and Hillary are great at telling their followers what they want to hear but hopefully Trump believes it, but how can anyone believe anything she says. I cannot trust her to tell the truth, not even 1 out of 100 times.

"Trump might be racist, but..."?
What Trump believes is that America isn't great. That's not what we need in a President. I'm not hearing much enthusiasm among those here saying they'll be voting for Trump. The GOP is stuck with him as their candidate b/c they spent 8 years trying to undermine and obstruct President Obama by criticizing every last thing they could and painting a picture of near apocalyptic doom for the country. When Trump grabbed the reins on that bandwagon of fear, they were powerless to stop him in the primary because they created that narrative.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

I'm not hearing much enthusiasm from those here that are saying they are voting for Hilldog either. Hmmmm

 

[DukeDenver]

Just want to congratulate DI for keeping this civil. It's OK to disagree. It seems like we all are accepting that. Can you imagine a similar thread on RR or THR?

 

[gottagonow]

Just want to congratulate DI for keeping this civil. It's OK to disagree. It seems like we all are accepting that. Can you imagine a similar thread on RR or THR?

I was hoping it would remain civil but hope lost out to reality as I read from the bottom up.

 

[DukeDenver]

I was hoping it would remain civil but hope lost out to reality as I read from the bottom up.

This is tame. I'm not seeing any personal attacks, just old fashioned discussion.

 

[Dukesince90]

The U.S. is not respected like it once was from other countries, so I think we need to make America great again. The President can't do it alone. Society has to wake up and realize we're all in this together. I do however resent those that are healthy and live off of the tax payers. Also, it made me sick when Obama's wife made the comment years ago when he became President- "For the first time, I'm proud to be an American."

 

[DukeDenver]

America isn't as great as it used to be because we aren't well educated. Where's the pride in working hard in school? If you aren't working hard in school, you best be laboring.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

America isn't as great as it used to be because we aren't well educated. Where's the pride in working hard in school? If you aren't working hard in school, you best be laboring.

I think more and more with each generation, initiative is lacking in this country. We can blame it on education and not be wrong, but I think it also has to do with how entitled the younger generation acts. The thought of not having to work hard and still get what you want has taken over this country and it's sickening. I don't want to say that education is not important, but it is a little overrated when it comes to making the best of yourself.

 

[DukeDenver]

I think more and more with each generation, initiative is lacking in this country. We can blame it on education and not be wrong, but I think it also has to do with how entitled the younger generation acts. The thought of not having to work hard and still get what you want has taken over this country and it's sickening. I don't want to say that education is not important, but it is a little overrated when it comes to making the best of yourself.

Where do we learn work ethic from? It's an interesting question. For me, it was encouraged in my school and community. Nowadays cities and rural areas are pretty weak communties in terms of work ethic. If schools were able to push kids, some of that entitlement might drift away. The trouble is, you can make good money in this country as a complete moron. College degrees grow on trees and corporate structure makes it about "who you know" and "what you own", rather than what your abilities are. Then on top of that, folks are trapped in terrible districts with no guidance.

 

[denniden]

Where do we learn work ethic from?

I think it starts at home.

 

[Showenuff]

Well, Dattier wants to go there, so I'll bite. I AM enthusiastic over Trump and I think it's downright stupid for half the **** he gets called out for. Just like the Mexican Judge issue. Sure it's all proper and sweet to gasp and says"oh my! That's so racial!" BS. It's the truth. He's being judged by a man who supports Hillary, even with donations, and is of Mexican Heritage and Trump has caused a lot of dissension amoung many Mexicans. If you think that Judge doesn't take those issues into his thought process, you are an absolute idiot. Trump just essentially calls it like he sees it and people, he doesn't get it wrong much. Now in today's TIME, oh yea it's wrong, because you can't tell the truth anymore . I'm sick and damn tired of people using their so called rights to do the wrong thing. I'd like to see people respecting this great country and its military. I'd like to see people respecting our flag. I'd like to see people coming into this country the right way, not skinning their back on some barbed wire while dragging in a sack of cocaine. I want to know our military can respond to any enemy with greater force than any other. Most of all, I just want Trump in to see how much of that dirt in congress he can sweep out. There's wayyyyy to much. I know Trump isn't President Material yet, but I think he can get there and he's famous for surrounding himself with the right people. He will. The Clintons are as underhanded and dirty as any duo on this planet, how anyone could support Hillary simply blows my mind. We are down to Trump and Hillary. Write ins and non votes are a vote for Hillary. So the bottom line is, you're still voting for one or the other. I'm voting Trump, at least there will BE change that way.

 

[Liftee]

I haven't posted for over a year but I think I'm still a member of the OFC.

I have to say I think our country is possibly greater than it's ever been. I see more women and minorities in important roles in hospitals, schools and government and nobody thinks anything of it. Our health care system is too bureaucratic but from what I hear from people from other countries we get the best health care possible (trying getting elective surgery in another country). And we can have a serious but friendly discourse on the most divisive issue (politics) and still remain friends. My kids are very motivated and so are their friends. We have great people in our armed forces willing to defend our country. It's not a perfect country but it's the best there is out there.

OFC

 

[DukeDenver]

It's not a perfect country but it's the best there is out there.

OFC

This is the truth.

 

[DukeDenver]

I think it starts at home.

It did for me too, but I was taught poorly. My community, teachers and peers saved me from mediocracy.

 

[LetsGoDuke301]

Where do we learn work ethic from? It's an interesting question. For me, it was encouraged in my school and community. Nowadays cities and rural areas are pretty weak communties in terms of work ethic. If schools were able to push kids, some of that entitlement might drift away. The trouble is, you can make good money in this country as a complete moron. College degrees grow on trees and corporate structure makes it about "who you know" and "what you own", rather than what your abilities are. Then on top of that, folks are trapped in terrible districts with no guidance.

I feel like if the parent(s) teach their kids to work hard in school they are more likely to learn. IMO to a certain extent, good work ethic is taught at an earlier age than school. Not that it won't come at a later age for some. But like denniden said, it definitely starts at home.

 

[DukeDenver]

I feel like if the parent(s) teach their kids to work hard in school they are more likely to learn. IMO to a certain extent, good work ethic is taught at an earlier age than school. Not that it won't come at a later age for some. But like denniden said, it definitely starts at home.

We aren't going to fix bad or absent parenting anytime soon, but maybe we could provide a public forum for success for young people. Throwing money at it doesn't work. We need to reinvent the inner city and rural America.