Our administration is not surprised about the basketball situation

[Coach34]

We always allow our coaches to stay a year or two too long so they can completely kill a program.

The President and AD interviewed former players about previous coach's recruiting tactics. After they got the feedback, they decided they wanted to move in a totally different direction. They also couldnt stand how the program was viewed as well as it's reputation. They decided on a complete overhaul and a 180 from where we were. This is why Ray was chosen to be the new HC.

We are starting over- and its going to be ugly in the short term. But Ray is going to be given time to rebuild- you can pretty much count on 4 years. It's up to us to get behind it and support it or not. This season is going to suck from a wins/losses standpoint, but we wont have to watch players walk up the court, yell at the coach, and other things that permeated the program over the years.

We are where we are right now because of Stansbury. That's 100% fact and cant be disputed. Is Ray the guy to overhaul it correctly and build us back up into a contending bubble team? We'll see- but we wont know for a couple of years.

 

[GloryDawg]

Are we playing Auburn in football this week?

bd

 

[DawgatAuburn]

The first two paragraphs are somewhat opinion-esque.

The last two paragraphs - other than the speculation about player behavior - is absolute fact and a harsh reality of what we are facing.

 

[msu4ever]

We always allow our coaches to stay a year or two too long so they can completely kill a program.

The President and AD interviewed former players about previous coach's recruiting tactics. After they got the feedback, they decided they wanted to move in a totally different direction. They also couldnt stand how the program was viewed as well as it's reputation. They decided on a complete overhaul and a 180 from where we were. This is why Ray was chosen to be the new HC.

We are starting over- and its going to be ugly in the short term. But Ray is going to be given time to rebuild- you can pretty much count on 4 years. It's up to us to get behind it and support it or not. This season is going to suck from a wins/losses standpoint, but we wont have to watch players walk up the court, yell at the coach, and other things that permeated the program over the years.

We are where we are right now because of Stansbury. That's 100% fact and cant be disputed. Is Ray the guy to overhaul it correctly and build us back up into a contending bubble team? We'll see- but we wont know for a couple of years.

IF this is true, and I firmly believe it to be so, why was Stans given his current position?

 

[Dawghouse]

IF this is true, and I firmly believe it to be so, why was Stans given his current position?

My guess is because he isn't a POS, he's been loyal to MSU for a long time, and he can still help us in some capacity. He just isn't able to coach our BB team. That and we owed him a lot of money. Might as well find something for him to do.

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

Hope you guys like your hope and change.

 

[Coach34]

The first two paragraphs are somewhat opinion-esque.

The last two paragraphs - other than the speculation about player behavior - is absolute fact and a harsh reality of what we are facing.

No, the first 2 paragraphs are what happened. There is no opinion about whether they talked to former players or not

 

[1msucub]

IF this is true, and I firmly believe it to be so, why was Stans given his current position?

My opinion is that it happened for two reasons.

Number one, Stansbury won a lot of games for us. We got more attention nationally (MOST of it positive until the end) and you can't argue with the results that he produced. I'll be the first to admit that I was frustrated with the lack of ability to take the next step, but an SEC title is hard to complain about.

Secondly, it looks like a good gesture to reward a coach that has given essentially his entire coaching career to your school.

 

[Shmuley]

4 years? Somebody get Doc on the f'n phone.

 

[dawgstudent]

I know we have talked about this before - but you would have kept Stansbury even after last season?

 

[maroonmania]

We always allow our coaches to stay a year or two too long so they can completely kill a program.

The President and AD interviewed former players about previous coach's recruiting tactics. After they got the feedback, they decided they wanted to move in a totally different direction. They also couldnt stand how the program was viewed as well as it's reputation. They decided on a complete overhaul and a 180 from where we were. This is why Ray was chosen to be the new HC.

This paragraph scares the heck out of me. I don't know all about Stans' "recruiting tactics" and really don't want to know but all I can say is that until Rick Stansbury showed up on our staff we NEVER were able to consistently recruit high caliber basketball talent to MSU in the modern basketball environment. I had a lot of issues with Stans on the way the program was run discipline wise, how players were developed and how we played strategy wise in certain games but the one area I didn't have a problem with him was recruiting. The fact that we are now going in a "totally different direction" recruiting wise gives me even less confidence in getting this program back into the upper tier of the SEC than I even had before.

 

[Coach34]

My opinion is that it happened for two reasons.

Number one, Stansbury won a lot of games for us. We got more attention nationally (MOST of it positive until the end) and you can't argue with the results that he produced. I'll be the first to admit that I was frustrated with the lack of ability to take the next step, but an SEC title is hard to complain about.

Secondly, it looks like a good gesture to reward a coach that has given essentially his entire coaching career to your school.

that's it

 

[shsdawg]

I know we have talked about this before - but you would have kept Stansbury even after last season?

I would have, for one more year. For the same reason the Rebs should have given Cutcliff one more year.

 

[FlabLoser]

4 years? I thought basketball was the easiest sport to build quickly.

 

[Seinfeld]

If you were to take Stansbury's most excruciating, underachieving season

I feel safe in projecting that you'll find that it was a good deal better than what we're about to witness for the next couple seasons. I'm not saying that Stans didn't have his faults and I'm not saying that a change wasn't a fair move, but I will say that you've gotten exactly what you've asked for. We'll see how a so called "good guy" and "disciplinarian" fares in the SEC. As much as I hope he's nothing like this, I can't help but see visions of Sly Croom floating through my head.

 

[Tds & Beer]

He's not just talking about recruiting when he says we're doing a 180. He's also talking about coaching. They wanted someone who could actually teach the game. Not someone who recruits well and sucks on the coaching end. There will never be a doubt in my mind that Rick was absolutely horrid at the preparation part. People bash his in-game coaching. I don't think that was the problem. The problem was practice. Just because we are doing things differently doesn't mean that we are gonna recruit ****** players. It just means we will recruit coachable players. That's why we will look outside the state more. Ray has those connections. But that doesn't mean we aren't gonna recruit Mississippi. I have seen a lot of people make assumptions that we are gonna go after unathletic kids from out of state and ignore MS. That's not the case. We will just be more specific in the player we want. And you gotta address things in recruiting early, the way Mullen does. Stans promised anything to get a player to campus. He was like Chizik. They have to know what is expected of them when they arrive, and they have to be ready to work their asses off. The previous ones didn't know what hard work was. I'm not looking at wins and losses this year. I am looking at effort, structure, basketball IQ. Something I haven't seen at State in a looooooooooong time. And if Ray doesn't have a good recruiting year, then I will start to wonder about him. Until then, we have to be behind him the way we were behind Mullen when he went an entire year last season without a big win.

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

I don't even know if that was an option, DS. But if it was, yes. Why? Because we would be better this year, and the year after that and the year after that. Isn't that supposed to be the goal? When will the Ray trajectory bring us to that level? Who the hell knows. As of right now, my bet would be never.

 

[IWantReaganomics]

Hope you guys like your hope and change.

Not another four years. I want our basketball team back. You would think that croomjokerandobama....

“We have the ability to take him out, and I think the time has come that we exercise that ability.” Pat Robertson

 

[BiscuitEater]

Based on ..

It's up to us to get behind it and support it or not. This season is going to suck from a wins/losses standpoint, but we wont have to watch players walk up the court, yell at the coach, and other things that permeated the program over the years.

your BB posting history, this is just another 'hope and prayer.' Two weeks ago Ray insisted that Shawn Smith was "doing the right things." And, now he is history.

To me, it's not about coaches, it's about the team. I supported Stans until the day he was fired/retired and I will support Ray until the day he is fired/retired.

Just explain the difference between 'yelling at a coach' and two players dismissed for 'repeated rules violations.' Stans kicked several players and now Ray has kicked two more. What is the difference?

 

[VegasDawg13]

I feel safe in projecting that you'll find that it was a good deal better than what we're about to witness for the next couple seasons.

We could not score a point this year, and it would be less excruciating than last year. And the year before that might have been even worse.

 

[VegasDawg13]

That's not at all the same.

For the same reason the Rebs should have given Cutcliff one more year.

Cutcliffe was one year removed from a Cotton Bowl victory. Stansbury had just overseen the most disappointing season in any MSU sport in my lifetime and was one year removed from the most embarrassing season in any MSU sport in my lifetime.

I defended Stansbury longer than most, but it's absolutely mind-boggling to think there are people who didn't think we needed to make a change.

 

[Coach34]

I feel safe in projecting that you'll find that it was a good deal better than what we're about to witness for the next couple seasons. I'm not saying that Stans didn't have his faults and I'm not saying that a change wasn't a fair move, but I will say that you've gotten exactly what you've asked for. We'll see how a so called "good guy" and "disciplinarian" fares in the SEC. As much as I hope he's nothing like this, I can't help but see visions of Sly Croom floating through my head.

we are where we are right now because of Stansbury- not Rick Ray.

I didnt ask for Rick Ray- I asked for a better basketball coach. Our AD and President decided to do a total overhaul of the program.

 

[Coach34]

as TD's said- by 180 I dont just mean recruiting. I am talking discipline, S&C, coaching, and dealing with drug issues.

 

[idog]

I don't even know if that was an option, DS. But if it was, yes. Why? Because we would be better this year, and the year after that and the year after that. Isn't that supposed to be the goal? When will the Ray trajectory bring us to that level? Who the hell knows. As of right now, my bet would be never.

what he said x 2.

did we move this thread over from YUKU? 34, it's sad you feel the need to bring this up over here. 40 seconds ago.

 

[engie]

I feel safe in projecting that you'll find that it was a good deal better than what we're about to witness for the next couple seasons.

And just where do you think we would have been going into next season if Stans was still our coach?

 

[00Dawg]

We are starting over- and its going to be ugly in the short term. But Ray is going to be given time to rebuild- you can pretty much count on 4 years. It's up to us to get behind it and support it or not. This season is going to suck from a wins/losses standpoint, but we wont have to watch players walk up the court, yell at the coach, and other things that permeated the program over the years.
We are where we are right now because of Stansbury. That's 100% fact and cant be disputed. Is Ray the guy to overhaul it correctly and build us back up into a contending bubble team? We'll see- but we wont know for a couple of years.

A contending bubble team? If we fired the winningest coach in program history to spend 4 years getting back to exactly where we were, we're stupid.
We either make the NCAAT more consistently with Ray than we did with Stansbury (after a grace period), or this was a mistake.

 

[NewTweederEndzoneDance]

How exactly do you figure we were going to be better this year?

We added an All-SEC freshman and a first round draft pick to an existing All-SEC, senior point guard, and still managed to piss away a good season. How many teams exist that have had a 1st round player on the roster (not an injured one) and don't make the NCAA tournament? I'm betting its a pretty damn small number.

The problem was not that Stansbury got talented players, its that Stansbury promised more than he could give to get those players, and once they realized he could not follow through they had no respect for him (if they stayed at all).

I really don't understand why so many people can't even let our new coach get through a single game without decreeing that he is a failure and we will suck for the next 4 years. Coach Ray is going to be able to promise a crapload of playing time in the next 2 classes, and should be able to reel in some good players. You can't fault him for not landing us the #1 class in the world during the short time he had to recruit and amidst the BS that was going on over the Stansbury firing.

 

[patdog]

Because he had another year on his contract and we were going to have to pay him the same amount either way and this was a way to try to ease some of the bitching about Stans being moved out. Not sure that completely worked though as much bitching as there's been.

 

[vhdawg]

Our administration is not surprised about the football situation

We always allow our coaches to stay a year or two too long so they can completely kill a program.

The President and AD interviewed former players about previous coach's recruiting tactics. After they got the feedback, they decided they wanted to move in a totally different direction. They also couldnt stand how the program was viewed as well as it's reputation. They decided on a complete overhaul and a 180 from where we were. This is why Croom was chosen to be the new HC.

We are starting over- and its going to be ugly in the short term. But Croom is going to be given time to rebuild- you can pretty much count on 4 years. It's up to us to get behind it and support it or not. This season is going to suck from a wins/losses standpoint, but we wont have to watch players walk up the field, yell at the coach, and other things that permeated the program over the years.

We are where we are right now because of Sherrill. That's 100% fact and cant be disputed. Is Croom the guy to overhaul it correctly and build us back up into a contending bowl team? We'll see- but we wont know for a couple of years.

 

[engie]

what he said x 2.

did we move this thread over from YUKU? 34, it's sad you feel the need to bring this up over here. 40 seconds ago.

So we would have been drastically better under Stans going into next season if he was still our coach? How do you figure?

This situation is identical to Polk apologists about Cohen. IDENTICAL. So, go ahead and get your shots in now and stroke your ego while we are admittedly going to be down for a few years, because we will come back eventually, and when we do, the message boards are not going to be kind to all of you that were, once again, happy in underachievement and mediocrity, and then enjoyed the misery of the team while in transition.

More legit basketball talent coming through MS in 2014 and 2015 than there has been since the Monta Ellis/John Bender days. MANY of these players have direct ties to State(Thank you Richard Williams). We are not under a death sentence here. Just an adjustment period.

Were Tennessee boards this ridiculous about Cuanzo?

 

[Shmuley]

Damn you for posting that. Damn you. ***

nm

 

[patdog]

Stans didn't make the tournament once in his last 4 years. So matching that record should be no problem.

 

[BoomBoom.sixpack]

This ignores two things. 1) That fans were getting tired of the seeing the same crap year after year. Talent that dissapoints, year after year. I'm sure the AD is well aware of attendence and TV viewership. 2) That Stans was getting less results even with his talented players. He was in decline.

 

[DAWG61]

If Rick Ray is in the same class as Cuonzo Martin we'll be ok. I doubt he is though.

 

[Coach34]

what he said x 2.

did we move this thread over from YUKU? 34, it's sad you feel the need to bring this up over here. 40 seconds ago.

did you not see the 10 damn threads on here about Ray and the two guys that got run off yesterday? Wtf dude? Acting like I just brought this up out of thin air makes you the idiot you probably are

 

[engie]

If Rick Ray is in the same class as Cuonzo Martin we'll be ok. I doubt he is though.

Do a little search regarding what they have to say about each other and get back to me....

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

Someone explain to me why going 5-25 when you think you are going to win 5 games is superior to going 20-10 when you think you are going to be 25-5. PLease?

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

If nothing had changed at all, would you be predicting 5 wins this season?

 

[Seinfeld]

And just where do you think we would have been going into next season if Stans was still our coach?

In better shape than we are today

How much better? I don't know... but whether he added some Jucos, a star transfer, or a stellar freshmen class, Stansbury always managed to put a team together that had a chance at winning ballgames. The current roster doesn't have a prayer to win more than 10

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

That's the standard set by those wanting the change. I guess the real question is how many years will Ray get to take us to his first NCAA appearance? 4 years? 5 years? 6? 7? more?