Hmmmm, the guy that created this post knows more than he is given credit for. Who woulda thunk it....... Thanks for the stats Tarp.....
Our program
- Thread starter WEH8ST8HAWK
- Start date
And now Buchanan misses weight for his RAF match this weekend. It might be a meaningless match but it’s a horrible look.
Nice job. Thanks Tarp. Anyone else still want to argue?
I think the money helps but its impact is exaggerated. The most elite kids are wired to be the best. They want training and development that get them NCAA, world and Olympic championships. If we are recruiting kids that are all about the money, we are recruiting the wrong kids.
On a scale of 1-1,000,000 this ranks -7 things that impact my feelings on the state of the union
Lots of interesting points of view. Pro and con. Some ideas seem valid and others speculative and sound like whiners. Doubt Tom or Terry read anything here, but apparently Bob does, so some information may be passed along about the natives being restless and what can we do to improve. Of course, I would expect they are doing all in their power to improve the best they can.
You can't change anyone else. You can only change yourself and or your reactions to others.
So, when you are done complaining, do something positive for yourselves and Pray for the coaches and the wrestlers.
You can't change anyone else. You can only change yourself and or your reactions to others.
So, when you are done complaining, do something positive for yourselves and Pray for the coaches and the wrestlers.
Tom Brands is a good coach and a great guy. Tom was once a great coach and a great guy. Time comes for everyone and the sport has evolved. Iowa was THE brand in wrestling and is now a big brand but PSU is THE brand. It isn't a question of whether OSU is going to blitz past Iowa if things remain status quo. The Brands legacy and past results are solid, but the future isn't going to be as great as the past if Iowa stays the course. DT was rumored to Iowa (with no truth) just after the NCAA tournament in 2024 and that should have been willed into existence. Guys like MSU point out how Iowa has been the overwhelming 2/nd best program, but I have yet to hear any of them predict holding that line the next 5 years under Brands. The future matters more than the past imo.
As is Cael.
David Carr is going to be a great coach someday. Bring him in at whatever price for the HWC now, and move him into coaching when he is done competing after this next Olympic cycle.
This board is losing it now, wait 7 days and see what this board is like. People saying just wait, it’s fine, well unfortunately psu is coming next week and most likely will pistol whip the entire lineup. It really sucks but you can’t deny it’s gonna happen.
"Tell that to Indiana football right now that has the tenth of the money Alabama or Michigan does."
I am not sure that is as accurate as you think it is. Watching Mark Cuban on the field last night is a fairly solid indicator of a few $$$$'s being spent.
Come on man, you know as well as the rest of us that Iowa hasn’t exceeded or even met expectations at NCAA’s outside of 2020 and 2021. If this is your argument for them, you need to pick a better one.
Last nights performance was bad outside of 165-184. Drake and BK are baffling to me. Idk what’s going on. Watching BK stand around for 7 minutes and then smirk like he’s the man was awful to watch. Drake looking up at the replay board and complaining to Tom was awful to watch. Fugitt is solid but he hasn’t been on Drakes level.
I won’t judge our backups, they’re backups. Heavy, 133, 149, 157 just looked bad and tired content to win one td matches.
Yep, and I would guess they're $$$ purchases have MAYBE a 50% ROI.
Bailey looks like an absolute "swing and miss".
I’ve been following Iowa Wrestling since the 80’s. Enjoyed watching an aggressive offense. Gables wrestlers left everything they had on the mat. If they didn’t pin or tech someone they should they were pissed. If they would have smiled after a close win Gable would have wiped it off their faces. Iowa wrestling has become a boring program. I no longer go to matches and have become somewhat uninterested. The Iowa program needs a reboot.
MSU fact checking Tarphawk and preparing his dissertation.
Even John Smith knew when it was time to step away.
The $$$ tied up with a wrestling coach contract is peanuts for a place like Iowa.
Beth made the call with Brian Ferentz.
The direction of wrestling is worrisome and the decision might need to be made if this team finishes like it looks it could...outside a trophy.
No need for preparation. He will just say “because Penn State…”MSU fact checking Tarphawk and preparing his dissertation.
Waiting for Tom to shake hands with Cael after Friday’s beat down and whisper “thanks for taking the heat off of me!”
Nope I am all good. I have said my piece. I am fine to wait til March and see who is right and who is wrong. The masses are out for blood and there is nothing I can say to change that for now.MSU fact checking Tarphawk and preparing his dissertation.
The vast majority of this board would love if you were right. I think Iowa will finish with about 6 AA and a 4th place trophy. Who is right if that happens? This is a senior laden team with 2 returning senior finalists and another returning senior stud in Kennedy. This should be the peak year of the 4 year period. Next year already doesn't look as promising imo. I love your research and knowledge, but I do think even you deep down suspect things aren't headed in a great direction. It isn't off a cliff but simply trending good rather than great.
I fully expect top 3 and would be upset by anything less.
As Kingstown said, I’m one of those that hope you are right, but I’ve not seen anything remotely that leads me to believe it is possible. The “Iowa Style” is just that and the style it takes to win with today’s rules keeps pushing us further from the top. Our inability to have multiple attacks, reattacks and the absolute lack of scrambling ability across our roster is concerning. Need some fresh ideas in that room and TnT need to be open to new ideas. It is possible for TnT to still exist but for change to happen. Unfortunately, I think it will take Beth Goetz making that change for them. I don’t know they will have the ability to handle that as well as KF did when told change will happen. We will see. I had not missed a dual or nationals for better than 15 years since moving back, but I’ve missed multiple over the past 3 seasons and haven’t been to nationals since Detroit. I will always watch, but nights like last night have led me to better investments of my time over the last few years. It’s very apathetic.
Interesting stats from Tarp. But let's not overlook that Z overtook a Gable ran program that was a well oiled machine with a roster full of his recruits. This definitely skews the numbers in Z favor.
This is not saying that I am not in the party that feels some drastic changes are needed in the immediate future.
This is not saying that I am not in the party that feels some drastic changes are needed in the immediate future.
WEH8, I liked your post, then re-read it and realize that you've considered me an idiot all these years. "Who woulda thunk" (that Tarp could type numbers into an Excel sheet and calculate an average for a column of cells)? No respect, WeH8, no respect.
Brands had a double recruiting class and rode it to 3 titles in 6 years...since 2010 that he has 2 titles (Covid *) and it appears we are regressing. Future recruiting classes are nice but tomorrow isn't promised to anyone. We don't know if those guys are going to be the next Spencer Lee or the next Moores.
I love landing big recruits, but it's a fickle business and it's frightening to think we're banking on a class that may not contribute for 2-4 years.
Indiana has some very well off alumni that have been putting a lot of money into their program.
The biggest part of all this, that every naysayer here has failed to remotely acknowledge is whether or not the oft-rumored limitations are true involving compliance and Beth herself. Everyone just laughs it off, but, if true, they are real issues that go way beyond the Brands. If true, they are actually doing an incredible job. Integrity has its place. Even above winning. An incredible amount of money is being spent on college athletics right now and a vast portion of it I am absolutely certain does NOT fully comply.
I am nowhere near close enough to know how much of it is true. But, there has been enough smoke for me to believe that fire may be real…
Just the data. Brands vs. Zalesky:
Avg NCAA points:
TB = 90.0
JZ = 91.3
Avg NCAA placement:
TB = 3.2
JZ = 3.3
Avg NCAA champs per season:
TB = 0.8
JZ = 1.1
NCAA Points & placement last 3 seasons (i.e., JZ was fired for this performance):
TB = 82.5-67-81 (2nd, 5th, 4th)
JZ = 82-66-70 (2nd, 7th, 4th)
Total NCAA titles:
TB = 4 in 18 seasons
JZ = 3 in 9 seasons
# of seasons with 100+ points:
TB = 4 in 18 seasons
JZ = 4 in 9 seasons
Just the data. Brands vs. Zalesky:
Avg NCAA points:
TB = 90.0
JZ = 91.3
Avg NCAA placement:
TB = 3.2
JZ = 3.3
Avg NCAA champs per season:
TB = 0.8
JZ = 1.1
NCAA Points & placement last 3 seasons (i.e., JZ was fired for this performance):
TB = 82.5-67-81 (2nd, 5th, 4th)
JZ = 82-66-70 (2nd, 7th, 4th)
Total NCAA titles:
TB = 4 in 18 seasons
JZ = 3 in 9 seasons
# of seasons with 100+ points:
TB = 4 in 18 seasons
JZ = 4 in 9 seasons
Just the data. Brands vs. Zalesky:
Avg NCAA points:
TB = 90.0
JZ = 91.3
Avg NCAA placement:
TB = 3.2
JZ = 3.3
Avg NCAA champs per season:
TB = 0.8
JZ = 1.1
NCAA Points & placement last 3 seasons (i.e., JZ was fired for this performance):
TB = 82.5-67-81 (2nd, 5th, 4th)
JZ = 82-66-70 (2nd, 7th, 4th)
Total NCAA titles:
TB = 4 in 18 seasons
JZ = 3 in 9 seasons
# of seasons with 100+ points:
TB = 4 in 18 seasons
JZ = 4 in 9 seasons
I thought TnT had figured out the injury issues, but last year and this year has proven otherwise. I am afraid will limp into another NCAA's. If I could have one realistic thing to mirror frim PSU is their training / medical. Brands bros haunting legacy is the amount of injuries that hindered some outstanding teams.
Also, Brands has gone up against Carl for most of his coaching career. What juggernaut was Z matched up against? That absolutely effects the average finish and the number of champs for Brands. That's just the breaks, but it matters in the scope of things. This year is all that matters right now anyway. I'll wait until March's outcome before I go dig out my pitchfork.
Nick's senior season was a gut punch of heartache. One of the most mystified seasons.
Oh I don’t know. Minnesota and Oklahoma State. As I recall that 2005 cowboy team was decent.
I’m just saying people seem to forget ok state and Minnesota run during that period of time. Oklahoma state 05 is still in the argument for the greatest team ever. Minnesota first team to have 10 all Americans at that time they still would have been recruiting against gable in the mid to late 90s before that title in 01 wasn’t it?
This is one of those cases where not all stats are created equal.
3 of Zakesky's 4 titles came in the years immediately after Gable retired. The cupboard was full, great assistants were involved and we were THE dominant program in the sport. In the years that followed we saw a team digress to unrecognizable levels while there also wasn't a generationally great team (like current PSU).
Brands rebuilt the program and started winning immediately, and while we took a step back, he did so again in the 2019-2021 stretch.
Unfortunately what we're seeing now is another downward trend while 2-3 other programs are really improving...
Not trying to argue as I agree with you but tom had double recruiting classes when he came back to Iowa. That should definitely be noted. Also, no it is not Penn state level at all but those Minnesota and OsU teams deserve a lot of credit.
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Zalesky didn't have ped state to deal with and I never said I'm for or against coaching change. Waiting until the season is over is the time to do that. Right now us fans should be backing the team or refusing to watch until desired change is made. Whining 24 7 isn't helping your health or the team.