Please read my wiki American/Iran History link.
We only do things out of fear or oil. Obviously this is about oil and fear of what Israel has on leadership. It’s not a good idea!! It doesn’t work…… except for the people making money.
Over the next few weeks, keep your eyes on the Middle East
- Thread starter HunterPKP
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We only do things out of fear or oil. Obviously this is about oil and fear of what Israel has on leadership. It’s not a good idea!! It doesn’t work…… except for the people making money.
Here's the problem, Iran doesn't care, it will only be another rallying cry. They are zealots that believe in martyrdom. This is worse than the search for WMD because we allowed Israel to bait us into this mess. Now Iran is just parroting our old rhetoric right back to us. Should never have had two real estate developers as the key negotiators for such combustible situation. As much as I support certain actions taken by this administration, they have now completely lost me moving forward. I now have zero trust and faith in their ability to read the room.
The most critical skill in any fight you’re in is to remove yourself and become the life of your enemy.
The convenient history of US / Iran usually only hits two and maybe three major moments:
the coup in 1953,
the Islamic revolution of 1979
the 1985 Iran contra affair
now it’s way more adventurous and eventful since the 1920s, but even if you just focused on these three events from an Iranian point of view, you can quickly remind yourself why are we dealing with this as Iranians?
The 1953 coup was a British and American MI6 and CIA operation to install the shah. How would you like to know the leader of your country is being imposed upon you from the west?
Between the oil crisis in 1973 and the dire economic situation created for Iran drove the buildup for the Iranian Islamic revolution. It was created because of the economic strife that was being imposed onto Iran.
then, we are so pissed about what happened to our American people in 1979 and 80 yet we’re more concerned about Saadam Hussein so we start selling weapons to Iran through Israel so they can fight each other.
I don’t say this stuff as a form of anti-anything. I say these things as a form of education in history as it serves a purpose to think about what happened before and what you’re getting into. Go read further about all the interventions we’ve had with Iran in this region over the past 100 years, we’ve built up a lot of distrust from their point of view. Thinking we can do this or do that or take over an island and it’s gonna magically set the conditions forever it’s just bollocks. It always has been. People need to ask themselves. What exactly do you think we can actually achieve, honestly?
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Largely agree with you, but Trump is hardly the first president to go to war with a country on Israel’s behalf. Let’s not forget about the intelligence Israel provided the US concerning Iraq’s WMD’s and how that was used in the justification to invade.
I get a nice chuckle when people say this all started in 1979.Every American needs …... HISTORY in their life!!
If we live in a country where events from 2000-3000 years mean so much to a large number of them, surely what’s been happening in the last couple of hundred years should to. And if not, please explain.
Iran–United States relations - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
If you know me by now, I like Clemson relatable stories. Why? In theory, it’s what binds us the most together.
Summer of 1990 college tour - destination Southeast >> Richmond to Gainesville. I want to get out of New York.
My dad and I are big Geography and history geeks. We crack the giant Rand McNally road atlas to map our journey……
Richmond, William n Mary, UNC/NC State, GT, EmoryFSU, UF.
“Hey Dad, what about that school that started football 10 years ago, Clemson?”
“Yeah”
Tracing our fingers all over the state…. Columbia, Myrtle, Charleston. Literally cannot find it for 5 minutes……. What is Greenville Spartanburg?
This is also embarrassing for both of us as we are insulting our own intelligence and can’t find the place,
.WHAT???? It’s literally in the middle of nowhere but perfectly right along i85. Got to see this oddity, makes no sense. 80,000 seat stadium and you can barely see the town dot and name. Weird.
____________________
All the prior campus visits were good but after 15 minutes on Clemson campus, I knew this is camp on steroids. And it just kept getting better every moment. The best!!
But wait, like Iran starting in 1979, did Clemson start in 1981?
For many people outside the Palmetto State or Southeast, I’m sure it’s exactly what some of them think. I know as much as I possibly can about Clemson history, seems to predate 1981,
. Clemson was an all male military college? WHAT? That made what I saw in 1990 even more appealing in its transformation. I love all the great and not so great moments in our incredible history. It’s who we are.
As you mention, when American people think Iran and 1979 or Clemson 1981, how can you take them seriously? You don’t. We bless their hearts,
.Selective history or willing to take the history given to you is such a lack of curiosity and disingenuousness. I bleed orange and
all day. But I’ll never stand for ignorance in leadership positions. That’ll cost you money and lives.Not having a clear objective and several exit strategies based on resource utilization is FASCINATING to me.
There are people in positions of power within our government who legitimately believe that conflict with Iran on Israel’s behalf is good and necessary in order to bring about the second coming of Christ.
They probably also think Jesus was white and spoke latin or better yet, Shakespeare.
lol Trump has identified his official fall guy
The Achaemenids must not be allowed to obtain wicker shields. I fully support Alexander the Great's special military operation. We simply cannot allow such a regime to have that much purple dye and threaten regional hegemony.
The clearest sign of history repeating itself!
IF ZEUS IS ON OUR SIDE WHO THE F*CK IS ON THEIRS
If you really want to go down a rabbit hole, do some googling on Shakespeare and how many are now thinking that he didn’t actually write all those plays.
Think about how this is a form of mental illness but it’s not cool to say it. If only someone would say it.
Like COVID came from a wet market.
glad we have some shvthole countries trying to talk sense into our brilliant leaders.
I’ve defended Trump and Co on a lot of things, even thought they’ve done atleast some things along the way that I’d agree with so I say this as not some avid Trump hater: this conflict exposes and brings to light all of the absurd messiness we’ve heard about the Trump regime.
Wars and extended conflicts can only be successful when you have smooth, well-oiled machines from a personnel and process standpoint. That’s different from a single action or strike like the bunker buster mission or Venezuela where you could plan out for weeks / months and then execute.
Extended conflicts require constant coordination, communication, and clear direction, which seems to be the opposite of what we have.
This has the makings for an epic disaster and a true revealer for all the chaos that has been rumored and reported within the administration.
The demands Trump and Iran leadership are each making for the other side makes me think of the dodgeball quote “it’s like watching two ret*rds trying to hump a doorknob”
Sounds like the Iranians have communicated that they rejected our "peace proposal" and declared it illogical.
Also...a full year might be very generous.
Also...a full year might be very generous.
One of the worst aspects of this is how its potentially possible to discern what’s going to happen based on prop betting markets:
I can't believe this isn't getting more coverage . so damn corrupt
It is but we don’t seem to realize that they want this prolonged. I think it’s a clear part of their strategy.The demands Trump and Iran leadership are each making for the other side makes me think of the dodgeball quote “it’s like watching two ret*rds trying to hump a doorknob”
I’m not saying it’s right, and I’m not saying it makes sense. I guess they’re thinking it will galvanize internal support. Maybe they think it will turn the entire region into chaos and make them rife for extremism. I don’t know.
It sure feels, though, like we had a number of Middle Eastern countries in UAE, Qatar, Oman, and Saudi who, to some-ish degree, were starting to normalize and really become stable entities in the region. This feels like Iran saw that, was desperate to not be left behind, is gonna rope all of them into why they hope is a larger, more prolonged conflict with the belief that the will have pulled all those countries back down into the mud with them.
And we played right into it.
Yeah this is a finger trap situation. The longer it goes, the more leverage Iran has.
Honestly the only way I think you can fix this is finding out who hath done it and shooting them for treason.
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I'm not typically one of the grammar police but this is straining my limit ha.
I don't understand how we didn't see this coming. Did we not think they would actually close the SOH? That and attacking energy assets around the region is their only real leverage. Whodathunkit but they did exactly what they have been saying they would do all along if the US or Israel attacked them again. What does the IRGC really have to lose at this point anyway? Israel has shown they can't be trusted in any ceasefire agreement and we've all seen what happens to an under-armed country Israel doesn't like. We/Israel are already killing every leader they name within a few days.
Short of committing war crimes or a mass land invasion what screws do we have left to turn? Honest question.
TBF it seems like many people in the pentagon saw this all coming but the warnings fell on deaf ears.
speaking of overly confident timeframe assertions...oof
The demands Trump and Iran leadership are each making for the other side makes me think of the dodgeball quote “it’s like watching two ret*rds trying to hump a doorknob”
If you know who is over there now and who is arriving over the next couple days, it’s fairly obvious what is going on and how we viewed negotiations.
Your not wrong, I fixed it because I made a pretty egregious mistake there.
I have been very hesitant to wade into this thread. But, the best option now as I see it is to:
1. Stop offensive operations on the lands of Iran. Only shoot back. Announce this as a strategy dependent on Iran’s actions. Sink any Iranian watercraft operating in the Gulf.
2. Demand Israel do the same in Iran.
3. Do not put troops on the ground unless something catastrophic happens. That would make Iraq look like a cake walk.
4. See if a week of no attacks by us result in some calming. Ignore their rhetoric. Watch their actions.
5. Escort ships through the Strait after a little time for minesweeping. Strongly retaliate for any ships hit.
6. See if this leads to a new status quo.
Avoid making this a bigger quagmire.
1. Stop offensive operations on the lands of Iran. Only shoot back. Announce this as a strategy dependent on Iran’s actions. Sink any Iranian watercraft operating in the Gulf.
2. Demand Israel do the same in Iran.
3. Do not put troops on the ground unless something catastrophic happens. That would make Iraq look like a cake walk.
4. See if a week of no attacks by us result in some calming. Ignore their rhetoric. Watch their actions.
5. Escort ships through the Strait after a little time for minesweeping. Strongly retaliate for any ships hit.
6. See if this leads to a new status quo.
Avoid making this a bigger quagmire.
This thread has
This thread has basically become useless for inside thoughts or updates on the war. We've got people posting about God, Shakespeare and then the same person that doesn't do anything but retweet everything from his X feed.
Any chance you can provide more details?
This thread has basically become useless for inside thoughts or updates on the war. We've got people posting about God, Shakespeare and then the same person that doesn't do anything but retweet everything from his X feed.
I’m mainly just giving you a hard time ha, I was able to interpret eventually
This plus some form of saving face with "we accomplished 100% of our goals" is probably the best path forward if deescalation is the goal, which it should be because what would we even be escalating to achieve at this point. Hopefully the right voices will prevail.