it wasn't illegal - you could buy it in the store. when mcgwire had it in his locker, it wasn't against MLB rules, because it wasn't on the list of banned substances. if it later goes on the list, can you punish the player who was taking it? the rules at the time didn't say that you could not take it.
Palmeiro and Tejada Question...
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and I heard what Hatfield said. Remember Canseco played with Palmeiro in Texas and Tejada for a brief time in Oakland. Canseco appears to be the steroid lord behind all of this. Tejada would have to have quite some foresight to go around sticking people with HGH to get back at them for messing around with his wife. I doubt it happened like that.
As far as Tejada lying about his age- that's pretty much commonplace in the Dominican as far as baseball players go. you have to be 16 to sign a pro contract, and some players that get passed over that mature a little bit later sign when they are really 18, but they can get more money if they claim that they are 16. Basically, they are making themselves more projectable than they really are.
I know I've given my view on the HOF and players from the steroids several times, and I still stand by the opinion that they should get in relative to the other players during their era. Baseball is a game that has evolved and is evolving. You wouldn't compare Ty Cobb to Willie Mays. I don't think anyone would argue that they are HOF's. On the other hand, you would compare Mays to guys like Hank Aaron and Mickey Mantle. I think the fact that Dale Murphy isn't in is not really relevant. He should be in, but that's oversight by the election committee. I feel the same way about Ron Santo. Players from the 90's should be judged against each other.
As far as baseball and the law- a better example than running a stop sign- although I guess some base runners do that from time to time, but of course that's baseball slang- is fighting. Baseball players get into fights on the field from time to time in pubilc view. Normally, they would go to jail, but to my knowledge, the only baseball player I can recall ever having assault charges brought forth were Billy Martin in the 60's when he broke someones jaw, and Jose Offerman when he attacked a player by throwing or hitting him with his bat. (I can't remember which). Other than that, as long as the altercation is player vs. player (as opposed to player vs fan), there are no charges brought forth. And I've seen some pretty violent stuff happen- like Juan Marichal taking a bat to Johnny Roseboro's head. (OK, I saw that on video, and by the way Marical is in the HOF). And just because a player broke the law, it doesn't mean that they shouldn't be in the HOF. Where would it stop? Well, Mr. Jeter, you had too many speeding tickets, we can't let you in.
As far as Tejada lying about his age- that's pretty much commonplace in the Dominican as far as baseball players go. you have to be 16 to sign a pro contract, and some players that get passed over that mature a little bit later sign when they are really 18, but they can get more money if they claim that they are 16. Basically, they are making themselves more projectable than they really are.
I know I've given my view on the HOF and players from the steroids several times, and I still stand by the opinion that they should get in relative to the other players during their era. Baseball is a game that has evolved and is evolving. You wouldn't compare Ty Cobb to Willie Mays. I don't think anyone would argue that they are HOF's. On the other hand, you would compare Mays to guys like Hank Aaron and Mickey Mantle. I think the fact that Dale Murphy isn't in is not really relevant. He should be in, but that's oversight by the election committee. I feel the same way about Ron Santo. Players from the 90's should be judged against each other.
As far as baseball and the law- a better example than running a stop sign- although I guess some base runners do that from time to time, but of course that's baseball slang- is fighting. Baseball players get into fights on the field from time to time in pubilc view. Normally, they would go to jail, but to my knowledge, the only baseball player I can recall ever having assault charges brought forth were Billy Martin in the 60's when he broke someones jaw, and Jose Offerman when he attacked a player by throwing or hitting him with his bat. (I can't remember which). Other than that, as long as the altercation is player vs. player (as opposed to player vs fan), there are no charges brought forth. And I've seen some pretty violent stuff happen- like Juan Marichal taking a bat to Johnny Roseboro's head. (OK, I saw that on video, and by the way Marical is in the HOF). And just because a player broke the law, it doesn't mean that they shouldn't be in the HOF. Where would it stop? Well, Mr. Jeter, you had too many speeding tickets, we can't let you in.
from a former MSU baseball player who is close to Palmeiro. I think there may be something to it. Palmeiro certainly never acquired the physique or "look" of a steroid user like McGwire, Sosa or Bonds.
assault/battery is illegal (to the extent charges are pressed and/or the gov't wants to push it), just like steroids. There aren't a lot of baseball players getting arrested for steroids either.
The question is, is assault/battery cheating in baseball if its not addressed in the rules? Is running a stop sign cheating if its not addressed in the rules? The answer is of course not--the foundation of cheating is that it gives you a competitive advantage. And I think that answers the question of "where does it stop?"
The question is, is assault/battery cheating in baseball if its not addressed in the rules? Is running a stop sign cheating if its not addressed in the rules? The answer is of course not--the foundation of cheating is that it gives you a competitive advantage. And I think that answers the question of "where does it stop?"
is that not all of them are intended to be used to body building, or gaining mass.
Some are used for endurance purposes.
So, just because a guy doesn't look the part, it doesn't mean that are or aren't using.
Some are used for endurance purposes.
So, just because a guy doesn't look the part, it doesn't mean that are or aren't using.
and say that you could get into a fight with the other teams stars and get them kicked out and that would give you a competitive advantage. ( I know that's grasping at straws, and I'm not really being serious)
The steroid is issue rather complex, though.
The thing about it is this- I don't think players are going to stop using them. It's all a matter of whether you take your masking agent or not. I wouldn't be shocked if steroids are just as rampant now as they ever were. The difference now is that there is a policy in place, and it's only there to make the game "look good".
So, as far as the HOF goes, they can either start letting guys in that used them, or make it exclusive to players that played before 1990. The sooner the HOF voters admit that it's still going on and that it's part of the game, the better off they will be. Fact of the matter is, from now on, whenever an incredible player comes along, there's always going to be suspicion, whether it's proved or not. There may actually even be one or two guys hurt by this that never took them.
And as far as the competitive advantage, it's still unknown just how much of an advantage they give you. Does it add 1-2 home runs a year? Does it add 20? We'll never know the answers to that. I don't doubt that they do give you an advantage though. One thing no one mentions though, is that it doesn't improve your hand eye coordination. Taking steroids doesn't improve your knowledge of the game, how to pitch, or improve your defense. I think that's the worst thing about all of this- those other things go unnoticed or seem to be getting swept under the rug.
The steroid is issue rather complex, though.
The thing about it is this- I don't think players are going to stop using them. It's all a matter of whether you take your masking agent or not. I wouldn't be shocked if steroids are just as rampant now as they ever were. The difference now is that there is a policy in place, and it's only there to make the game "look good".
So, as far as the HOF goes, they can either start letting guys in that used them, or make it exclusive to players that played before 1990. The sooner the HOF voters admit that it's still going on and that it's part of the game, the better off they will be. Fact of the matter is, from now on, whenever an incredible player comes along, there's always going to be suspicion, whether it's proved or not. There may actually even be one or two guys hurt by this that never took them.
And as far as the competitive advantage, it's still unknown just how much of an advantage they give you. Does it add 1-2 home runs a year? Does it add 20? We'll never know the answers to that. I don't doubt that they do give you an advantage though. One thing no one mentions though, is that it doesn't improve your hand eye coordination. Taking steroids doesn't improve your knowledge of the game, how to pitch, or improve your defense. I think that's the worst thing about all of this- those other things go unnoticed or seem to be getting swept under the rug.
the stats worthy of HOF enshrinement should be voted in? I think we are of the same opinion as far as this is concerned.....
is that I really believe that all of these players knew they were doing something wrong relative to baseball (not the law).
You don't see anyone that has been proven to use it come out and say "Yeah, I used it b/c it was perfectly within the rules". They are all ashamed.
You don't see anyone that has been proven to use it come out and say "Yeah, I used it b/c it was perfectly within the rules". They are all ashamed.
but I think at least some of that is because these players have agents and PR people telling them to go write of apology and apologize and act like you regret it and everything will be OK. Or, actually the PR people are writing it for them. Plus, I think some of the embarassment is because they are being raked across the coals by the media. A lot of the players are probably more upset at distracting their team than anything else.
Stanozolol a/k/a Winstrol which has not been demonstrated to increase endurance. It is used for strength gains. Ben Johnson was also busted for it but 100 meters is not an endurance event - hence the difference in physiques between sprinters (large muscle mass / power / strength) and distance runners where large muscle mass is a detriment. Endurance athletes are much more likely to use EPO or maybe Clenbuterol which would still yield a positive drug screen for banned substances.
