Ralph will be our QB in 2011...

[Johnson85]

If our D wasn't capable of holding Auburn, UGA, and UF, you would have seen us open up the playbook a lot more and score more points (and commit more turnovers). The coaches made a decision to be conservative on offense to avoid potential turn overs.Can't say I'munhappy with the results and that's an option that Tyler Russel didn't give us, b/c the offense can't grind out 4 and 5 yard runs aagainst SEC caliber D's without Relf's help.

That said, I wish we were getting Tyler Russel more snaps, just for late game/half situations. Had we not gotten that last fumble, I think Tyler Russel would have given us the best chance to score quickly, but it's hard to put him in in that situation when he's not getting regular playing time. With the way the UGA and UF games played out, I'm not sure there was really an opportunity, and Russell didn't take advantage of his opportunity in the UK game, so it's not really a criticism that he's not playing more, I just wish it had worked out to where he had.

 

[Cochise Cowbell]

I agree with Strat Dawg. Relf plays hard, and there's no lack of effort. But we won't win the West or reach Atlanta with him under center. Remember this is only Mullen's second year and we are leaps and bounds above where we were. We have to recruit more talented and smarter QBs to become a top tier team in the SEC and/or the nation. Hopefully one of the three will improve greatly in the spring and summer.

 

[jcdawgman18]

First of all, we've got a floor vs. ceiling situation going on here. On a scale of 1 to 10 let's say Chris Relf's ceiling is a 7 (providing run game threat, managing the passing game by hitting open guys off play action, etc) and Tyler's ceiling right now is about an 8 (making big time throws in crucial situations). However, Chris' floor (based on what he's done so far this year) is a 5 whereas Tyler's floor (if he's forcing balls and throws some INTs, making freshman mistakes) is a 3.

If you're Dan Mullen, you've gotta start the surer thing. No questions asked. But now onto the issue of getting Tyler more PT. That's not easy to do either (and I'm not saying he should). Why, you ask? Because of the type of offense we're currently running and how it's effective. Sure, we run for a lot of yards. But we do that by committing to the run heavily. Sure, we ran for 262 yards last night, but we did that on 70 carries for an average of 3.7 yards per carry. That means that we have to pretty much get that every play in order to keep moving the chains and scoring points. We can't have negative plays at all and really can't afford neutral plays all that often, either. We need to get as many plays as we can in order to produce offense. Chris is also a major part of our running game this year because we don't have a back who can make plays on his own. Vick is a very solid back, but he's not a creator. He's a guy who hit's the seam hard and takes what's there and does a great job of it. So with all that said, it's hard to switch things up because of the style we're playing.

Right now Dan is doing exactly what he should be doing with the quarterbacks. Since we are winning, there's no way you can justify to your team that you need to change your identity, and like I just said above, we're not exactly using a style that lends itself to switching things up. Like I said before last week's game, the only way you change it up is if you're A) losing and B) not moving the ball and scoring on offense. That's not an indictment of Tyler, that's just the spot we're in offensively. Until something forces a change this year, you continue to dance with the one that brought you. And as far as next year goes, you deal with that in spring practice. Right now, it's about winning football games.

 

[Todd4State]

is because of our win at Florida. If we were 2-5 and averaging 15 points a game in SEC games, this board would hate Chirs Relf. That UF win has masked how bad we've been on offense this year. I'm sure our stats are marginally better this year, but we haven't played NEAR the defenses we did in '09.

There is no way MSU will finish higher than 4th in the West next year with Relf as our QB. I'm not advocating TR starting more this year, just saying MSU has a real ceiling with Relf at QB. That ceiling will be there in 2011.

If we want to make a run at Atlanta next year, we better hope Russell (and the WRs) make some strides, because it isn't going to happen with Relf at QB.

between Relf and all of the other crappy QB's that we've had over the years. And that is in general he doesn't turn it over. Last night non-withstanding.

Yes, Relf has a ton of deficiencies, but if those other crappy QB's didn't do that, we would have probably been in position to win games as well.

 

[KennyPowers2]

For the most part. I would have liked to gotten Russell more PT this year but we need these 7-8 wins and decent bowl to keep the momentum of our program. My question to everyone is how are we gonna transition from relf to russell and still win. Or will we skip that step if we get a real Dual Threat qb that is exceptional. I don't know how Russell will pan out but at some point we won't have Relfs legs anymore. We do have a unique problem and I'm not sure how to handle it in the future, that's why we hired Mullen who I trust.

 

[KurtRambis4]

some of y'all are missing is the lack of WR play. Without good WRs it doesn't matter who is throwing the passes. I mean our receiving corps is currently in the bottom half of the league as a unit, I would say. Despite what crooms said, you cant find good WRs on any street corner in Miami. For TR to be good we need good WRs. We just dont have that currently (at least not upper tier). If TR got significant pt right now it just wouldn't be good for our team this year. Not to mention he'd probably get sacked every time he faced a blitz vs first string Ds. However, if we can hold onto Brassell and land Tobias we would receive a major upgrade in this area. Their talent would allow TR to be more successful in the future.

 

[Todd4State]

For the most part. I would have liked to gotten Russell more PT this year but we need these 7-8 wins and decent bowl to keep the momentum of our program. My question to everyone is how are we gonna transition from relf to russell and still win. Or will we skip that step if we get a real Dual Threat qb that is exceptional. I don't know how Russell will pan out but at some point we won't have Relfs legs anymore. We do have a unique problem and I'm not sure how to handle it in the future, that's why we hired Mullen who I trust.

That's my biggest beef with Relf, and I have been rightfully concerned since he went 4/10 in a scrimmage. I think if Relf had passed the ball all year like he did last night, I think you would see a lot fewer people even throw around the idea of Tyler starting. I hope Relf has turned a corner with his passing and he continues as he did last night- we all saw how much more efficient the offense is with the threat of a pass. We more than doubled our SEC per game average last night because we could throw and run the ball.

Now as far as Tyler- I think he has gotten enough playing time this year. He saw a lot of playing time in our first three games, played a good bit agaisnt Alcorn and Houston, and got in on a series or two against UK and Bama, and he also took one snap vs Florida. Our goal for him should have been for him to get his feet wet and get some playing time against live compeition against SEC opponents. We'll see what happens as far as the Egg Bowl and whatever other bowl game we play in as far as playing time. The extra bowl practices will really benefit him- and MSU- a lot as well.

As far as the future- I have no idea what will happen with the QB position next year because no one knows how much progress Relf and Tyler are going to make between now and next year, but I expect Relf to start so let's fast forward to Tyler's junior year when Relf is gone. By that time, Tyler will have had three years of experience on our offense and two years of game experience in some capacity. Our o-line should be better at that point in time. We are going to be bigger and more athletic than we are now- o-linemen have to be developed just like QB's. We are going to have Chad Bumphis and Chris Smith as seniors, Carr as a junior, and then Brassell, Morrow and whoever else as freshmen or sophomores along with Arceto as a senior. That's going to be a much deeper, bigger, experienced and more athletic group of WR's than what we have now. So, what about the running game? I think it will be fine. We're going to throw more because that will be a strength for us in a couple of years, but we're going to compliment it with good running from our slot WR's, LaDarius Perkins who will be a junior, and I think we're going to get Xavier Grindle from East Marion who is someone that I think could come in right away and play for us and make an impact as a freshman. Will Tyler run as much as Relf? No. But he will make up for Relf's running in terms of production from his passing. Russell is no Micheal Vick for sure, but he does run it effectively enough where he can make a play for us every now and then with his legs. He has proven that this year. I'm sure coach will disagree, but the proof is in the pudding- our longest run by a QB has come from Tyler Russell, and he also has a higher average per carry than Relf. Also, we will have backs that will help make up for the loss of Relf's running as well. Just think about how Relf played in the Egg Bowl two years ago and think about how much progress he has made between two years ago and now. Tyler, similarly should also improve as a QB in general. If you look at his stats, they are comparable to a lot of very good QB's during their freshman year. After we got beat 45-0 by Ole Miss, I think most State fans probably would have said that Relf would be another Tray Rutland or would be switched to another position. Now, he is an effective QB.

 

[AssEndDawg]

1) What in the hell is this 17er, 17's, etc language mean?
2) Why are y'all consistently bitching at each other. Aren't we all on the same side here?
3) Apparently when one posts, there is a spell check option. Why is this never used?</p>

1) Due to some advertising restrictions DS had to stop allowing the F-word. So rule 17 of the board became no F-bombs and thus people use <17> instead. You can read the rules here.

2) This board was basically built out of protest over another board not allowing discussion and differing opinions. Pretty much the entire legacy of SixPack is about bitching at each other. Get used to it. If you want to go someplace where all the State fans get along in a nice big circle jerk about how great everything MSU is you can head on over to Swan Lake.

3) Because we have people here who dedicate a good portion of their life to grammar and spell checking. We would hate to deprive them. Ya dubmass!

 

[Cochise Cowbell]

Now that I've been informed by AssEnd I am much the wiser. Thanks for bestowing your wisdom.

Howdo I get a strange Asian girltotranslate my posts into sign language for the ...hearing impaired?

 

[karlchilders.sixpack]

To use Russell, we will have to totally revamp our offense. Not that he is a bad player, but it is very obvious that he does not fit what we are now doing.

Also, we do not seem to have the supporting cast to do what is best for Tyler.

 

[Coach34]

is because of our win at Florida. If we were 2-5 and averaging 15 points a game in SEC games, this board would hate Chirs Relf. That UF win has masked how bad we've been on offense this year. I'm sure our stats are marginally better this year, but we haven't played NEAR the defenses we did in '09.

There is no way MSU will finish higher than 4th in the West next year with Relf as our QB. I'm not advocating TR starting more this year, just saying MSU has a real ceiling with Relf at QB. That ceiling will be there in 2011.

If we want to make a run at Atlanta next year, we better hope Russell (and the WRs) make some strides, because it isn't going to happen with Relf at QB.

and probably everyone else in the Relf vs Russell/Farvuh QB debate:

I dont think those 2 guys have a higher ceiling <span style="text-decoration:underline">in 2011</span> than Ralph does. What we may gain in the passing game, we will more than lose in the run game and turnovers...and that is why I am a proponent of staying the course for next season and hoping we get more games from Ralph in 2011 like we did last night...

Then in 2012, we will have some better WR threats on the field hopefully to make the transition. Brassell or Singleton or whomever our true Freshman are will not make enough of an impact in 2011 to necessitate a QB change.

 

[klerushund]

is because of our win at Florida. If we were 2-5 and averaging 15 points a game in SEC games, this board would hate Chirs Relf. That UF win has masked how bad we've been on offense this year. I'm sure our stats are marginally better this year, but we haven't played NEAR the defenses we did in '09.

There is no way MSU will finish higher than 4th in the West next year with Relf as our QB. I'm not advocating TR starting more this year, just saying MSU has a real ceiling with Relf at QB. That ceiling will be there in 2011.

If we want to make a run at Atlanta next year, we better hope Russell (and the WRs) make some strides, because it isn't going to happen with Relf at QB.

Don't look now but we lose in Oxford (a distinct possibility) and we'll finish 5th in the West this year and have lost to the 6th place team.<div>
</div><div><div>I totally agree with Strat. The Florida game is deceiving people. That's the worst Florida team in 20 years. If we played them at a neutral site we'd be favored. Not a big win.</div><div>
</div><div>State hasn't won a single division game. We've beaten 3 CUSA teams and Alcorn St., two SEC teams with losing records in conference (UGA & UK), and a dumpster-fire in Florida's uniforms. Yet people on here are happy because we've improved to 7-4. Considering our schedule last year, I'm not sure we've improved at all. The game atmosphere has improved. The buzz around the program has improved. But the on field product? That's up for debate at the least.</div></div><div>
</div><div>Relf played the game of his life last night. I was very impressed given his previous performances. He wasn't perfect, but he played his best game all year.</div><div>
</div><div>That said, our quarterback played his best game of the season and we lost. That says a lot. Some of that is on the defense for sure, but our offense has ZERO explosiveness.</div><div>
</div><div>We were down 10 with 10 minutes to go and if Arkansas had any sort of defense or hadn't fumbled the ball back to us, it was over. On the other hand, if we'd been up 10 with 10 to go I certainly wouldn't have felt secure that we would win. That's what explosiveness does, it gives you the potential to make up deficits. We don't have that with the Relf-bone offense. Could we have it with Russell? I don't know. Would we turn it over more with Russell? Well we turned it over 3 times last night without him. So who knows?</div><div>
</div><div>The formations have changed, but the offense is, dare I say it, Croom-esque. That's why people are clamoring for a QB change. They are tired of not feeling like we can comeback when we get down. They'd like to have an offense that scares defenses, instead of one that lulls them to sleep (see: the entirety of Mississippi State football in my lifetime).</div><div>
</div><div>Arkansas showed last night what a good offense will do for you. They took our best shot, got off the mat and knocked us on our backs. That's what I'd like to see from State's offense. Until I do, I won't be satisfied.

</div>

 

[thatsbaseball]

not slamming Relf , just an observation.

 

[KurtRambis4]

all I know is that, for some weird and outrageous reason, Mullen has decided that Relf gives us the best chance to win this year. I feel safe in saying he knows a great deal more about our team (and football, in general) than anyone on sps.

 

[Johnson85]

Lots of games were won despite Madkin, not b/c he was effective.He had some good games, but he usually contributedlittle to nothing. As limited as our offense may be b/c of Relf's accuracy issues, he makes a big contribution to our offense every game just because of what he brings to the running game. Granted it's not a completely fair comparison since Madkin didn't have the coaching and system Relf has, but on the other hand Madkin had a hell of a lot more talent. Asgood as Bumphis may be, I'm not sure he could hold Kevin Prentiss's jock strap.

 

[thatsbaseball]

have been hard pressed to start for another SEC team.

 

[MaroonedNdaRock]

.....especially 3.

I will not saymuch about Relf's accuracy. Yeah, he is no Peyton Manning but he is as good asmost QBs we have had over the years. Anyway, the only thing I will say. He has got to keep moving forward when he has committed to running the ball. I understand he is trying to set up blocks from time to time. But most of the time, he just needs to pick a hole and go. You can not stand there and wait on a hole to develop. The players are to fast at this level.

As for Russell, the future at QB......I will preface by saying the Russell story is great. I want the home grown guy to become Johnny all american and lead the Bulldogs to greatness. However, with the offense we are running.We need to find another Pat White. Someone with some speed and quickness (physics of football). Relfbreaks into that second layer a good bit but has not broke anylongs runs. We need aQB who can break a long run with this offense and can out run people on the edge.