Relf vs. Russell stats in 7 on 7 and scrimage

[catvet]

7 on 7 drills: Thursday Relf 6 for 11 with 1 int
Russell 6 for 11 with 1 int

Friday Relf 6 for 8 with 1 int
Russell 7 for 9 with 0 int

Saturday Relf 6 for 10 with 1 dropped int
Russell 6 for 10 with 0 ints and 2 dropped passes

Totals for 7 on 7 drills Relf 18/29 2 ints
Russell 19/30 1 int

Scrimage: Thursday Relf 4 for 9 0 int
Russell 6 for 9 2 int was being hit on one pic

Friday Relf 6/12 0 int
Russell 12/17 1 int

Saturday Relf 1/5 0 int
Russell 3/4 0 int 1 dropped pass

Totals for scrimage Relf 11/26 0 int
Russell 21/30 3 ints

I personally believe that both QBs will play and you will see Russell alot more than alot of people on here believe. I must say that I want both to do well, but Russell needs to develop, because if Relf has scrimage numbers like this in real games, people will crowd the line and force him to throw, which still seems to be lacking in simulated situations. Tyler has got to learn to play without all of the turnovers. I was able to watch Tyler in high school, and his arm is very impressive, he is just going to have to catch up on the mental part of the game and that has to come by playing.

These stats are why there is a QB battle and it is close.

Stats were from reports posted by Paul on BJD.

 

[catvet]

7 on 7 drills: Thursday Relf 6 for 11 with 1 int
Russell 6 for 11 with 1 int

Friday Relf 6 for 8 with 1 int
Russell 7 for 9 with 0 int

Saturday Relf 6 for 10 with 1 dropped int
Russell 6 for 10 with 0 ints and 2 dropped passes

Totals for 7 on 7 drills Relf 18/29 2 ints
Russell 19/30 1 int

Scrimage: Thursday Relf 4 for 9 0 int
Russell 6 for 9 2 int was being hit on one pic

Friday Relf 6/12 0 int
Russell 12/17 1 int

Saturday Relf 1/5 0 int
Russell 3/4 0 int 1 dropped pass

Totals for scrimage Relf 11/26 0 int
Russell 21/30 3 ints

I personally believe that both QBs will play and you will see Russell alot more than alot of people on here believe. I must say that I want both to do well, but Russell needs to develop, because if Relf has scrimage numbers like this in real games, people will crowd the line and force him to throw, which still seems to be lacking in simulated situations. Tyler has got to learn to play without all of the turnovers. I was able to watch Tyler in high school, and his arm is very impressive, he is just going to have to catch up on the mental part of the game and that has to come by playing.

These stats are why there is a QB battle and it is close.

Stats were from reports posted by Paul on BJD.

 

[catvet]

7 on 7 drills: Thursday Relf 6 for 11 with 1 int
Russell 6 for 11 with 1 int

Friday Relf 6 for 8 with 1 int
Russell 7 for 9 with 0 int

Saturday Relf 6 for 10 with 1 dropped int
Russell 6 for 10 with 0 ints and 2 dropped passes

Totals for 7 on 7 drills Relf 18/29 2 ints
Russell 19/30 1 int

Scrimage: Thursday Relf 4 for 9 0 int
Russell 6 for 9 2 int was being hit on one pic

Friday Relf 6/12 0 int
Russell 12/17 1 int

Saturday Relf 1/5 0 int
Russell 3/4 0 int 1 dropped pass

Totals for scrimage Relf 11/26 0 int
Russell 21/30 3 ints

I personally believe that both QBs will play and you will see Russell alot more than alot of people on here believe. I must say that I want both to do well, but Russell needs to develop, because if Relf has scrimage numbers like this in real games, people will crowd the line and force him to throw, which still seems to be lacking in simulated situations. Tyler has got to learn to play without all of the turnovers. I was able to watch Tyler in high school, and his arm is very impressive, he is just going to have to catch up on the mental part of the game and that has to come by playing.

These stats are why there is a QB battle and it is close.

Stats were from reports posted by Paul on BJD.

 

[57stratdawg]

and didn't think Relf looked very good. Chris White got his hands on a ball and a DB dropped an pick as well.

Lets be honest though, I'd rather see our offense struggling right now than lighting up our D. They still have to work on timing and executing more than the D, plus Relf's strength is still going to be running the ball.

 

[Coach34]

Totals for scrimage:

Relf 11/26 0 int
Russell 21/30 3 ints


I dont think he will play as much as you think. We will run the football almost 2 of every 3 plays. The running game and not turning the ball over is what we want the most. Without a doubt Relf has got to complete more passes and be an effective thrower, but our offense is not about to start slinging it all over the field.

Russell is completing more passes, but he is also turning it over alot. I use the Jarret Lee example because he, also as a RS Freshman, had to step in and play QB before he was ready at LSU. And he played well at times and threw alot of TD passes, but his turnovers were killers for them. There is also almost no threat for the QB to run when he is in the game and changes the way teams will defense us.

Plain and simple- it's in our best interest for Relf to get better and complete a few more passes for us to be the best offense we can be. Teams walking up and playing us man coverage alot should help him make some easy throws on pick routes across the middle of the field- resulting in some long pass plays in 2010

 

[catvet]

if we run the ball 70% of the time, we will never get the WRs here that is necessary to go to the next level. He is at 40% completion in game like situations and if he does not improve, we better hope Russell can get up to speed.

 

[Coach34]

if we run the ball 70% of the time, we will never get the WRs here that is necessary to go to the next level. He is at 40% completion in game like situations and if he does not improve, we better hope Russell can get up to speed.

63% of the time with Louis Murphy, Percy Harvin, Riley Cooper, and the best TE in the nation Aaron Hernandez....if he isnt going to sling it when he has those guys, he isnt going to period

 

[War Machine Dawg]

Mullen likes to run the ball as much as JWS did. There are only 2 real differences: 1) Mullen prefers to run out of spread sets instead of the I and 2) he insists on having a very effective passing game, even if he doesn't need it. Jackie's only goal in the passing game was to keep the D honest.

 

[Coach34]

also...and Saban always has been- he seems to be able to recruit WR's still

Good players go to winning teams...hell, we have a 4-star WR committed already and we ran the ball 67% of the time last year

 

[MSUArrowCS]

if we run the ball 70% of the time, we will never get the WRs here that is necessary to go to the next level.

You're basing this on what, exactly? Not to equate our recruiting prowess to UF, but they didn't seem to have this problem.

Mullen's spread is a run-first spread. Anyone who doesn't see this based on his body of work is just kidding themselves.

Also, on point, he coached a 2-QB system to a national title. Unlike McCroomvey, I have 100% confidence in his ability to work Russell's talents into the offense right on time, just like he did with Relf last year. If Mullen can squeeze what he did out of Tyson Lee why wouldn't he get that much more out of Russell simply by having a better head on his shoulders?

 

[rebel law]

that MSU fans make about why would any WR ever want to play for Nutt and think they should all just flock to Mullen and his spread. Mullen loves to run it every bit as much as Nutt does, they just do it in different ways.

 

[Todd4State]

I'm still pissed that Relf hasn't taken over. Not because I favor him, but because a RS junior should be completing more than 40% of his passes in scrimmages.

 

[MississippiKite]

also...and Saban always has been- he seems to be able to recruit WR's still

Good players go to winning teams...hell, we have a 4-star WR committed already and we ran the ball 67% of the time last year

True, but it's hardfor most (read: anyone) to compare Bama to MSU at this point. More to the point, Sabanwins games with stifling defense, ball control, and field position.Tough to do without someserious *** athletes only avaialble to theAlabamas and Floridas of the world.

 

[catvet]

Florida has won several national championships, has been on tv constantly the past 15 years and plays in New Year's day bowls. We have never had a pro type QB which is why we can't recruit them now. We run the ball--fine. We have had one winning season in about ten years--used against us in recruiting. We have been in one bowl in the past ten years-used against us in recruiting. We don't produce good QBs-used against us in recruiting. We don't throw the ball-used against us in recruiting. Florida can get away with the offense they ran since they won tons of games, played for championships, recruit in the best football state in the country, and put tons of players in the NFL. We don't do any of that. This is why some of you can't get it through your heads that no one comes to MSU to sit the bench or get 10 catches a game. If we run the ball 70% of the time, we will not be able to recruit a difference maker at QB, who is not going to come to MSU to hand the ball off. Along with that we will not get WR either. This ain't Florida.

 

[Coach34]

I'm still pissed that Relf hasn't taken over. Not because I favor him, but because a RS junior should be completing more than 40% of his passes in scrimmages.

if you are waiting on Relf to take the job based on passing alone...where Relf will take the reigns completely is when they have all the pads on and they go 7 on 7 in the run game with no WR's...that's when Relf is in control like a RS Junior should be....let's see Russell keep up with him when they do that

 

[thatsbaseball]

and the group that Croom destoyed. I think he would have put a pretty good offense together.

 

[Todd4State]

I don't think it's that much to expect a QB that is going to be your starter to complete 50% of his passes in a scrimmage. Even if we run it 70% of the time.

I understand that we will run it a lot- but while some of that is because of the style of offense, some of it is also because of the strengths of our QB.

But, my thing is if we can't throw it decently, no one will respect the pass. And that's going to make it more difficult to run on people. That's also going to hurt us in the screen game to. Even if we throw it 30% of the time, if we are effective when we throw it, it will open up the run even more, and it will make our screen passes that much more effective. Unfortunately, we don't play Tyrone Nix every game.

The other thing that is more upseting to me is the apparent lack of progress that Relf has made. Like I said- all I want is 50%.

 

[thatsbaseball]

the less surprised I think I`m gonna be if we burn Farve`s redshirt about half way through the year.

 

[Coach34]

having no threat of the run while they are in shorts and then shorts and shoulder pads helps nobody but a throwing QB...the defense didnt have to respect the run and the LB's could help more easily...

Now that the run-threat is there for the defense to respect- look for Relf's numbers to get better

 

[Coach34]

our 2 QB's should be able to handle it all just fine

 

[patdog]

get injured. And hey, even then there's always a chance Masoli will <17> up at Mississippi and force them to boot him and we could pick him midseason.

 

[Todd4State]

get injured. And hey, even then there's always a chance Masoli will <17> up at Mississippi and force them to boot him and we could pick him midseason.

a better than average chance of Masoli <17> up this year.

 

[MSUArrowCS]

Not to equate our recruiting prowess to UF,

I think you skipped a clause there. Florida is one example, and the SEC is full of examples of run-first programs that have no problem recruiting WRs. We don't need to compete with UF for recruits in order to be competitive, but personally, I think it's a little defeatist to think that we never will. We have receivers on the roster that got interest from UF, and we've got 4-star caliber talent at that position. The whole point of Mullen's offense anyway is to get the ball in the hands of playmakers. He's used QBs, TEs, Percy Harvey types, and RBs, lining them up in each other's spots routinely. It simply needs multiple threats, and we're starting to get some into place as it is.

What reason do you have to believe that MSU needs to throw the ball more often in order to recruit better WRs? We're already recruiting better WRs just by trying. If we start winning, the recruiting will improve all over the field. Not many guys would rank offensive scheme over being competitive, but if you've got some counterexamples, I'd love to hear them.

Also, I'd love to hear your definition of "difference maker at QB" that doesn't involve a 6'4" frame and a 4 star rating.

 

[catvet]

this was rarely done in our history. I'm not saying that we need to run the run and shoot, but we have to keep defenses off balance and to do that we need more of a 60/40 run to pass ratio. I'm glad we got Dylan last year, but everyone is well aware that he was not offered until 5-6 guys commited elsewhere. We ran out of necessity last year--we had Dixon--but we better balance it out more. One more reason for the emphasis on the run at Florida was Tebow which was like having an extra runningback. Yesterday, I saw a stat on Tebow during the 2009 Florida/Arkansas replay: until that game, Florida was 1-5 when trailing in the fourth quarter--they simply could not get the passing game geared up enough to win when they trailed under Tebow. We need to emphasize the run, but better have more balance than 70/30.

By the way, Russell is 6' 5" and was a 4* recruit. He needs to play.

 

[Coach34]

this was rarely done in our history. I'm not saying that we need to run the run and shoot, but we have to keep defenses off balance and to do that we need more of a 60/40 run to pass ratio. I'm glad we got Dylan last year, but everyone is well aware that he was not offered until 5-6 guys commited elsewhere. We ran out of necessity last year--we had Dixon--but we better balance it out more. One more reason for the emphasis on the run at Florida was Tebow which was like having an extra runningback. Yesterday, I saw a stat on Tebow during the 2009 Florida/Arkansas replay: until that game, Florida was 1-5 when trailing in the fourth quarter--they simply could not get the passing game geared up enough to win when they trailed under Tebow. We need to emphasize the run, but better have more balance than 70/30.

By the way, Russell is 6' 5" and was a 4* recruit. He needs to play.

2009 Alabama- 63.5% run- national champs
2008 Florida- 62.8 run- national champs

apparently good teams have figured out running the football 60+% of the time is the key to winning

 

[Mr Meoff]

*

 

[Coach34]

2009 Big Ten champ Ohio State- 64% run
2009 ACC champ Georgia Tech- 82.5% run
2009 Pac-10 champ Oregon- 61.8% run

 

[anon1751035439]

But you have to have a lot more talent than your opponent. Teams like Texas Tech and Houston have shown a way to win without having the best players on the field. Maybe the spread option will be successful at MSU. Who knows? I'm sure if anyone can do it, it will be Mullen. But he needs to realize that his success at Florida was as much based on the Jimmy and Joes as it was the Xs and Os.

 

[catvet]

get closer to a 60/40 offense, not a run heavy 70/30. By the way, those Alabama and Florida teams were talented enough to do whatever they wanted and had dominant defenses that allowed for ball control. They also could sell players on the fact they were going to be on tv alot and be high draft pics. Our best player last year was Dixon, and he was a 6th round pic.

 

[Coach34]

We were just over 67% last season...I've even stated we need to be down around 63% like Bama and Ohio State- but we are only talking about trading in 30 runs for 30 passes when doing that

Our best offense we can put on the field is with Relf at QB running the football and hopefully he is able to make enough throws to keep defenses honest- and when they aren't- burn them in man coverage

With Russell at QB- you are going to see alot of interceptions because teams won't need to bring the extra defender into the box and they will be able to play more Cover 2 with dual safeties. Not having a RB as good as Dixon and having Russell in there who can't even run it as well as Tyson Lee pretty much eliminates the zone read and any option with him in the game.

 

[Coach34]

But you have to have a lot more talent than your opponent. Teams like Texas Tech and Houston have shown a way to win without having the best players on the field. Maybe the spread option will be successful at MSU. Who knows? I'm sure if anyone can do it, it will be Mullen. But he needs to realize that his success at Florida was as much based on the Jimmy and Joes as it was the Xs and Os.

He took Croom's offensive personnel and had them lead the SEC after finishing last the year before. Thats coaching. He will simply use the talent he has and get the best out of it. And the talent we have is in the run game- people wanting Russell to throw all these passes need to ask themselves who they want him to throw it to? Bumphis can't do it by himself. There's one thing that is for sure- our WR's rank near the bottom of the SEC. Thats not where our talent lies.

 

[anon1751035439]

I'm not sure you can count on it this season.

I agree that the talent you have right now is in the running game. But where do you go from here in terms of recruiting? That is what this is about. I think Mullen would be smart to try to balance things out a little bit going forward. But I have to admit, you guys have been successful in attracting very capable running backs in the past. You will need to continue that or get a QB who can open things up a bit.

 

[MSUArrowCS]

as if that'll have a revolutionary impact on our recruiting. That's absurd.

We didn't run out of necessity last year. We ran because Mullen's offense is based on running the football. Period. We'll run this year too, and we'll do it with a lot of different guys. In fact, Mullen seems to prefer that way, making them respect multiple playmakers from the backfield, the slot, out wide.

I don't know what C34's deal is about Tyler Russell, but he'll see the field. I have no idea where he gets that Russell is incapable of running the zone read, but if he is, there will be other ways to make the defense respect the run with him in there, if necessary. Russell will throw "alot of interceptions" just because of facing a Cover 2?

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

Omar is still one of my favorite players. He got a raw deal.

 

[Coach34]

as far as Russell goes, he will have to read defenses more and face alot of different coverages because teams wont respect the run as much with him in there. I've also never said he won't see the field- there is no doubt he is going to play. But in those early SEC games, I just dont see us playing a guy that is turning the ball over alot in practice like he has been. In scrimmages so far, he is 21-30 with 3 INT's- Relf has yet to throw one. Against Auburn, LSU, and Georgia where one turnover can make the difference, i'm just not sure we want a completely inexperienced QB taking alot of snaps in those games.

 

[MSUArrowCS]

but I still don't see how scrimmage stats support the leap from "he'll see more complex coverages" to "he'll throw a lot more interceptions". I guess we'll find out soon enough.

 

[Hidog78]

What facts do you have that Russell can't run better than Lee? Oh, I forgot you talk to coaches and have films.

 

[Coach34]

.

 

[Hidog78]

OK , I'll go ahead an play the 17ing ******** card. Your knowledge of Russell ability to run and pass base on film, coachs, and a few plays in a spring game thatyou did not see in person.

 

[Coach34]

or any other card you want. When a member of the Miss State football coaching staff says that Lee runs the ball better than Russell- I'm going to have to believe them.