SS Funding Solution

[fatpiggy]

F#ck ‘em.


Yes.


The f#ck would you know about it, sh*t-for-brains?

I see Fagnarshortcock needs some attention today?

Off to a bad start?

Lake America really got to you, huh?

 

[fatpiggy]

HATE this idea. You contribute, you get the benefit. More contributions = more benefits. Period.

Penalizing people for saving responsibly outside of SS is a HORRIBLE message to send.

Not to mention, $1M isn't **** in retirement. That's $40K per year using the 4% drawdown rule.

 

[scotchtiger]

You did not read my post correctly,.. I said raise or eliminate the cap, period.

Right, you mean the contribution cap right? So in theory I could pay 4X what I pay today in SS tax with no additional benefit?

NO THANKS

 

[Rifler]

Right, you mean the contribution cap right? So in theory I could pay 4X what I pay today in SS tax with no additional benefit?

NO THANKS

Correct,.. and your thanks is not required.

 

[scotchtiger]

Had dinner with my CEO in Europe last night. I’m leaving to take a new CCO role and he flew me over for a farewell dinner. He asked me my number to stop working full time and this is basically what I told him. I’ll still consult or do some fractional work though depending on the age I hit it.

 

[fatpiggy]

Had dinner with my CEO in Europe last night. I’m leaving to take a new CCO role and he flew me over for a farewell dinner. He asked me my number to stop working full time and this is basically what I told him. I’ll still consult or do some fractional work though depending on the age I hit it.

congrats!

 

[GesterHawk]

That guy qualifies for additional financial assistance.

Yep. Social Security Disability payments.

How does that factor into your forced single payer plan?

 

[WDDT]

Yep. Social Security Disability payments.

How does that factor into your forced single payer plan?

You can have disability payments without pretending the tent needs to hold up social security.


You cannot provide a reasonable example of why someone would be on minimum wage for their entire life without that person qualifying for additional benefits or acknowledging that person made some terrible ******* decisions.

 

[RockyMtNole]

Right, you mean the contribution cap right? So in theory I could pay 4X what I pay today in SS tax with no additional benefit?

NO THANKS

You are talking about a $30M net worth and you’re worried about an extra ~$30k in SS taxes?

 

[GesterHawk]

You can have disability payments without pretending the tent needs to hold up social security.


You cannot provide a reasonable example of why someone would be on minimum wage for their entire life without that person qualifying for additional benefits or acknowledging that person made some terrible ******* decisions.

So we are going to have Social Security for some, but not for all. Or are you going to rename the Social Security disability payments?

Fine. $15 dollars an hour - the going rate for fast food places. Do you think that changes anything?

Do you think the 54 year old woman is working the drive-thru at Arby's because she chose that over a six figure desk job? Don't lie, you've seen her at one fast joint or another.

Do you think that all the people that Wal-Mart hired and then helps apply for SNAP are going to be able to save up for retirement? Do you think they are there even though they have better options?

Just because someone decides not to go to college or gets pregnant in high school and has to drop out, doesn't mean that they should be forced to scan your groceries when they are 82.
A functional society doesn't operate that way.

 

[GesterHawk]

You are talking about a $30M net worth and you’re worried about an extra ~$30k in SS taxes?

Yes. That is exactly it.

 

[scotchtiger]

You are talking about a $30M net worth and you’re worried about an extra ~$30k in SS taxes?

That’s probably a long time down the road, if ever. But yea, I’m worried about that. And honestly an individual’s financial aspirations shouldn’t matter. Everyone needs to pitch in. And we shouldn’t be targeting hardworking families just because they’ve found a bit more success than others.

 

[baltimorened]

I pay more into SS than Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk do, because they both take salaries that are less than mine.

they won't get a payout as large as yours. Think they'll complain about how unfair the system is that your benefits are higher

 

[baltimorened]

Aware of all that,... Anyone currently earning beyond the cap with less than a very substantial 401K balance is an idiot,... A max payout of $62K is more than adequate for what is supposed to be a safety net program.

that would be great, but less than 1% receive the max benefit

 

[baltimorened]

It's a safety net so the maximum benefit level needs to be capped,.. Nobody is being penalized for responsibly saving for their retirement outside of Social Security,... There is a reason why I used the term "threshold balance" in relation to the 401K account I was using as an example,.. and the 4% draw down rule is a fallacy given that an average return of 7% is almost automatic for a market invested account.

can't wait until you get to retirement, have only $1million in an IRA/401K, social security capped and no defined benefit pension, plan to live to 90 or whatever, it will be interesting to see how you sleep at night.

 

[RockyMtNole]

That’s probably a long time down the road, if ever. But yea, I’m worried about that. And honestly an individual’s financial aspirations shouldn’t matter. Everyone needs to pitch in. And we shouldn’t be targeting hardworking families just because they’ve found a bit more success than others.

Most everyone does pitch in to Social Security.

 

[WDDT]

So we are going to have Social Security for some, but not for all. Or are you going to rename the Social Security disability payments?

Fine. $15 dollars an hour - the going rate for fast food places. Do you think that changes anything?

Do you think the 54 year old woman is working the drive-thru at Arby's because she chose that over a six figure desk job? Don't lie, you've seen her at one fast joint or another.

Do you think that all the people that Wal-Mart hired and then helps apply for SNAP are going to be able to save up for retirement? Do you think they are there even though they have better options?

Just because someone decides not to go to college or gets pregnant in high school and has to drop out, doesn't mean that they should be forced to scan your groceries when they are 82.
A functional society doesn't operate that way.

I think in every example you gave the undertone is that person wasnt able to progress at 15 dollars an hour from the time they turned 16 until they are "54" and if you are being honest with yourself the reason they got there involves a ton of lack of accountability on their part. Yes, disability should be disability, not social security. And what you dont seem to want to acknowledge is that lady could take the exact same money she sends to social security and put it in any number of safe vehicles and be far ahead of anything social security has to offer. The people that supposedly needed to run people's money in order to make sure they save have bankrupt the system.

 

[scotchtiger]

Most everyone does pitch in to Social Security.

Yep. And my solution here has everyone pitching in to close the funding gap. It’s how it should be. Not this BS about gouging people above the contribution cap and giving them nothing in return.

 

[RockyMtNole]

Yep. And my solution here has everyone pitching in to close the funding gap. It’s how it should be. Not this BS about gouging people above the contribution cap and giving them nothing in return.

I consider it helping my kids, and my fellow man.

 

[scotchtiger]

I consider it helping my kids, and my fellow man.

I already do that. By paying hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal income tax. I don’t need to pay 10s of thousands more to subsidize everyone else’s social security. Everyone should chip in to solve that issue like my proposal suggests.

 

[RockyMtNole]

I already do that. By paying hundreds of thousands of dollars in federal income tax. I don’t need to pay 10s of thousands more to subsidize everyone else’s social security. Everyone should chip in to solve that issue like my proposal suggests.

That’s fine.
I don’t mind paying a bit more.

 

[scotchtiger]

That’s fine.
I don’t mind paying a bit more.

Kind of the point of my proposal. Everyone pays a bit more. My family pays $3k more. Dude making $50k pays $400 more. Very, very fair and logical.

 

[Monzon]

I am really good with a capital gains tax for SS that kicks in for people whose capital gains vastly exceed their wages.

I think there needs to be more discussion on a capital gains SS tax (say, 2 or 3% - doesn't need to be the full 6.2 / 12.4). Another alternative to that would be to apply a SS tax on RSU / stock options as they are granted to execs as 'deferred compensation'. Again, doesn't need to be the full amount. Taxing RSU's wouldn't stop Joe Main Street from investing. It wouldn't stop execs from still obtaining them as part of their compensation, because it would remain more tax advantageous than ordinary income in a W-2.

 

[Tom Paris]

they won't get a payout as large as yours. Think they'll complain about how unfair the system is that your benefits are higher

You can’t be this obtuse.

 

[baltimorened]

You can’t be this obtuse.

you mean they will get as high a benefit payout?? You seem to have a real thing about people who make/have more than you. Didn't you realize the salary scale when you went in to teaching?

EDIT: There will always be people who make /have more than you and people who make/have less than you. Those in the less category look at you, steady job, healthcare, pension s\and say "tax Tom Paris" he can afford to pay more.

 

[LafayetteBear]

It must be amazing going through life so uninformed.

View attachment 1409006

He's a MAGAt. What can you reasonably expect out of someone like that? Rhetorical question, Farley.

 

[Rastafarian]

I just turned 43, but I better damn well get something from SS. My wife and I have both contributed the maximum since our 20s. There better be some ROI there.

Don’t hold your breath.

 

[baltimorened]

Don’t hold your breath.

based on your post, is it safe to assume then that you'd be on the side of cancelling SS and let every individual save/invest on their own?

 

[scotchtiger]

based on your post, is it safe to assume then that you'd be on the side of cancelling SS and let every individual save/invest on their own?

We should have done that from the beginning. Imagine if everyone had a personal investment account with those same required 12.4% contributions for 45-50 years. Every retiree would be a millionaire and most multi-millionaires. But instead we have a government boondoggle that no one seems to want to fix.

 

[Rifler]

we shouldn’t be targeting hardworking families just because they’ve found a bit more success than others.

Its called our progressive tax system,... welcome to adulthood.

 

[Rifler]

can't wait until you get to retirement, have only $1million in an IRA/401K, social security capped and no defined benefit pension, plan to live to 90 or whatever, it will be interesting to see how you sleep at night.

That isn't my financial condition,.. I sleep very well at night.

 

[scotchtiger]

It’s called our progressive tax system,... welcome to adulthood.

Yes yes, our progressive income tax system. The one I’m very familiar with as I pay the top marginal rate. The one that steps up significantly right around the threshold SS contributions stop. The one where I pay 30% effective rate and most people pay single digits.

That’s doesn’t change my position on SS, but reinforces it. High earners already pay a disproportionate share due to our progressive tax system. We shouldn’t compound that with even more burden passed to the small group of people paying 60% of all income taxes.

Question: Would you pay materially more if the SS cap was lifted? Trying to figure out if you are willing to be part of the solution or are passing the buck to others.

 

[Rifler]

Question: Would you pay materially more if the SS cap was lifted? Trying to figure out if you are willing to be part of the solution or are passing the buck to others.

I'd say that on average I'd be paying 30-40% more annually towards Social Security if the income cap were eliminated,.. So yes, I think that would be a material change.

 

[baltimorened]

That isn't my financial condition,.. I sleep very well at night.

my mistake..I thought you were using this as your condition. I guess you were using it as an example. But, I'll say this, and I guess a lot of folks on here will go insane, but retiring with social security average benefit of 25,000, and 1 million in a 401k,, I personally would not sleep well at night with the market ups and downs.

 

[Rifler]

my mistake..I thought you were using this as your condition. I guess you were using it as an example. But, I'll say this, and I guess a lot of folks on here will go insane, but retiring with social security average benefit of 25,000, and 1 million in a 401k,, I personally would not sleep well at night with the market ups and downs.

No problem,.. I think it depends on the lifestyle a person wants in retirement.