There's a need for realism today (long)....

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DowntownDawg

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May 28, 2007
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  • Mullen is good enough to take classes ranked in the high 30's and 40's and beat top 25 classes on the field. He's not good enough to take the 40th ranked class and go and beat top 10 classes. What is frustrating is that he could probably take a run of top 25 classes and win the division.
  • The recruiting environment in Mississippi is as dirtier than it has ever been with the Rebels. Other message boards are discussing it (see the right rabbi's Ga Tech post). This is due to #1) Mullen beating Nutt's *** two years in a row #2) Mullen rubbing it in his face every chance he gets (including the billboards), and #3) Nutt's in hot water as a coach. He can look at his roster and see that it is going to be hard to put a good team on the field next year. Turn in a bad to average class, and go 6-6 or worse and he knows he's gone. He's getting 2.5/year and wants to hang onto that.
  • The best thing that can happen is for them to have a crappy year and Mullen finish the job with no knees in November. They obviously have an active and established system in place and it has gotten worse for us every year that Nutt has been there.
  • State and Ole Miss have roughly split the Dandy Dozen since I can remember. None of these guys have any allegiance to either program. When South Panola has a bunch of top guys, Ole Miss would normally have a slight advantage. Likewise, when State's normal recruiting areas put out good players, we usually have gotten those. This year is the indicator that something is out of kilter. 8-2. I can't remember a year like that, even when Johanningmeyer was sniffing around and Croom was fulfiling his contract with Green Bay.
  • CJ Johnson is the bellcow in all this. He's been discussed ad nauseum, but it bears repeating one more time. He had no other reason to go to Ole Miss. Committed for 15 months (not to Diaz). Signed pictures "Go Dawgs." Had his lanyard ripped off in Oxford. Was recruiting for us at camps. Has a teammate on the team. We historically do well in Philadelphia (close to campus). And could come in and State on a good team as a true freshman. I understand that they are going to get some and we are going to get some, regardless of how the teams do on the field. But that is just ridiculous and totally obvious. 8-2 including Johnson. Now, they are getting players in areas that have historically been good for State. Noxubee. Philadelphia. The Delta. This is a further indicator that things are happening that haven't happened in the past. There's no doubt that they dominated us, but ****, just own up to it as to why.
  • Mullen is not willing to "play the game" at a certain level. I do not think we are totally clean. I do not think we don't cheat. I think that the very rampant and flagrant cheating started back in the SEC around the time Saban came back in the league and is more or less sanctioned by Slive's "under the rug" policy. Auburn was not going to let Alabama get away with it and we saw that last year, they went all out. Any fan of any school in the conference can see this. And now we are seeing the trickle down effect. I heard from a very good source that Mullen stayed away from Pat Patterson his first year because it was "an obvious bidding war." The same stories are circulating this year. He appears to shy away when the action on a recruit gets to a certain level. I think, above all, that he understands that he is a young coach with a huge upside and he is not willing to associate his name to a program that has been on probation. Also, he has pissed the OM alumni off royally, and now we can add Auburn and Slive to our list of people who would love to see us struggle. In addition.....
  • At some point, the SEC is going to get hammered. The SEC does not control the NCAA, the Cam Newton situation became a national story, and other schools/conferences have to be sick of our league winning the title every year. When that happens, the bottom 6 are the prime candidates. Slive is not going to want his national championships revoked and Heismans given up. As much as it sucks today, it is probably smart to stay out of this as much as possible. If/when we step it up to keep up with the Joneses, we are the easiest target to be made an example out of.
  • All that said, we've got recruiting problems. You don't lose players to Vandy and Tech without admitting that. Mullen has got to rethink his approach.
  • When you buy a player, he owns you.
 

DowntownDawg

Redshirt
May 28, 2007
3,494
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....
  • Mullen is good enough to take classes ranked in the high 30's and 40's and beat top 25 classes on the field. He's not good enough to take the 40th ranked class and go and beat top 10 classes. What is frustrating is that he could probably take a run of top 25 classes and win the division.
  • The recruiting environment in Mississippi is as dirtier than it has ever been with the Rebels. Other message boards are discussing it (see the right rabbi's Ga Tech post). This is due to #1) Mullen beating Nutt's *** two years in a row #2) Mullen rubbing it in his face every chance he gets (including the billboards), and #3) Nutt's in hot water as a coach. He can look at his roster and see that it is going to be hard to put a good team on the field next year. Turn in a bad to average class, and go 6-6 or worse and he knows he's gone. He's getting 2.5/year and wants to hang onto that.
  • The best thing that can happen is for them to have a crappy year and Mullen finish the job with no knees in November. They obviously have an active and established system in place and it has gotten worse for us every year that Nutt has been there.
  • State and Ole Miss have roughly split the Dandy Dozen since I can remember. None of these guys have any allegiance to either program. When South Panola has a bunch of top guys, Ole Miss would normally have a slight advantage. Likewise, when State's normal recruiting areas put out good players, we usually have gotten those. This year is the indicator that something is out of kilter. 8-2. I can't remember a year like that, even when Johanningmeyer was sniffing around and Croom was fulfiling his contract with Green Bay.
  • CJ Johnson is the bellcow in all this. He's been discussed ad nauseum, but it bears repeating one more time. He had no other reason to go to Ole Miss. Committed for 15 months (not to Diaz). Signed pictures "Go Dawgs." Had his lanyard ripped off in Oxford. Was recruiting for us at camps. Has a teammate on the team. We historically do well in Philadelphia (close to campus). And could come in and State on a good team as a true freshman. I understand that they are going to get some and we are going to get some, regardless of how the teams do on the field. But that is just ridiculous and totally obvious. 8-2 including Johnson. Now, they are getting players in areas that have historically been good for State. Noxubee. Philadelphia. The Delta. This is a further indicator that things are happening that haven't happened in the past. There's no doubt that they dominated us, but ****, just own up to it as to why.
  • Mullen is not willing to "play the game" at a certain level. I do not think we are totally clean. I do not think we don't cheat. I think that the very rampant and flagrant cheating started back in the SEC around the time Saban came back in the league and is more or less sanctioned by Slive's "under the rug" policy. Auburn was not going to let Alabama get away with it and we saw that last year, they went all out. Any fan of any school in the conference can see this. And now we are seeing the trickle down effect. I heard from a very good source that Mullen stayed away from Pat Patterson his first year because it was "an obvious bidding war." The same stories are circulating this year. He appears to shy away when the action on a recruit gets to a certain level. I think, above all, that he understands that he is a young coach with a huge upside and he is not willing to associate his name to a program that has been on probation. Also, he has pissed the OM alumni off royally, and now we can add Auburn and Slive to our list of people who would love to see us struggle. In addition.....
  • At some point, the SEC is going to get hammered. The SEC does not control the NCAA, the Cam Newton situation became a national story, and other schools/conferences have to be sick of our league winning the title every year. When that happens, the bottom 6 are the prime candidates. Slive is not going to want his national championships revoked and Heismans given up. As much as it sucks today, it is probably smart to stay out of this as much as possible. If/when we step it up to keep up with the Joneses, we are the easiest target to be made an example out of.
  • All that said, we've got recruiting problems. You don't lose players to Vandy and Tech without admitting that. Mullen has got to rethink his approach.
  • When you buy a player, he owns you.
 

alabamadog

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Oct 7, 2008
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The guy who ripped it off is obviously an idiot, but Johnson knows that guy will have nothing to do with his college career. Other than that, I'm not going to disagree with anything you wrote.
 

DowntownDawg

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May 28, 2007
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....just pointing out that Johnson is an obvious, obvious case. And everybody knows it, no matter which school you root for.
 

Todd4State

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Mar 3, 2008
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that it's the boosters that step up and pay players and not the coaches. Using the term "step up" very loosely.


That's not to say that the coaches don't totally know what's going with that either.

I think the solution is simple. You turn Ole Miss in. If nothing happens, then we start doing it. And I don't disagree about Slive having us under a microscope, but there are ways to cover your tracks, and whatever booster gets involved with this better figure out how to do that.
 

maroonmania

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Feb 23, 2008
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there is one potential bright side in the "looking for a silver lining" viewpoint out of all of this. I do believe Mullen runs a stellar program and I think he can and will produce winning seasons and lower level bowl trips even without getting a lot of upper level elite talent. Now he is already somewhat of a rising coaching commodity but if you accompany the program he runs with continued Top 25 recruiting classes (the kind you mentioned he could win the division with) he might end up being even that much more of a hot commodity that much faster making it that much harder for us to hang onto him. Now I know that's somewhat the same lame viewpoint where last season some were saying "let's don't beat FL in Gainesville or FL will probably hire away Mullen" but hey there is at least is some grain of truth in it. Gotta find something positive in all of this.
 

maroonmania

Senior
Feb 23, 2008
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on facebook that you don't even know would not be significant either but CJ sure made them out to be.
 

AdamDawgDude

Redshirt
May 28, 2007
335
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Todd4State said:
that it's the boosters that step up and pay players and not the coaches. Using the term "step up" very loosely.


That's not to say that the coaches don't totally know what's going with that either.

I think the solution is simple. You turn Ole Miss in. If nothing happens, then we start doing it. And I don't disagree about Slive having us under a microscope, but there are ways to cover your tracks, and whatever booster gets involved with this better figure out how to do that.
<div>
</div>It would seem that a coach only needs to give the green light and boosters start cutting checks. Beyond that, the coach wouldn't have any involvement in the process. All of the contract negotiation would take place behind the scenes.
 

maroonmania

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Feb 23, 2008
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and yes, he would love to get back at us but it won't be through allowing us to go on probation. It will likely be through cowbell fines or something. He will never be behind allowing any SEC team to go on probation. If that happens it will be something out of his control.
 

Jake.sixpack

Redshirt
Sep 2, 2010
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Mississippi State recruited Cam Newton and when they didn't get him, they ratted him out to the NCAA. No recruit wants anything to do with a program that will report them if they don't sign.
 

DowntownDawg

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May 28, 2007
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...there is some type of oganization going on. I don't think the HC is in direct contact, but I also don't think there are a bunch of rogue bosters out there.

The problem with turning them in is that nothing is apparently going to happen. The problem with stepping up is that the NCAA is just as likely to come down on us as them when that happens.

There's no easy solution in my mind, except to keep beating their asses and hope Slive goes down in flames over this Newton thing.
 

maroonmania

Senior
Feb 23, 2008
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from the coaches because big time boosters don't like to risk being ostracized from a program no matter how much they want to win and get involved. And that's exactly what they would be risking if they were indeed doing this in direct conflict with what the coaching staff really wanted.
 

MSU124

Redshirt
Dec 7, 2008
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That makes no sense.If that is the case, recuits should WANT to come here so we DON'T report them.
 

DowntownDawg

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May 28, 2007
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...the money and go somewhere else."

I think the Auburn situation may be hurting us, but I don't get it from that angle. If we were paying a player and they came to State, then there is no issue there. We obviously wouldn't "snitch." If recruits were worried about us "snitching" it looks like they wouldn't commit to us in the first place, i.e. they'd have nothing to do with us.

Recruits hate State because we turned Newton in. The more I think about it, the dumber that is.
 

AdamDawgDude

Redshirt
May 28, 2007
335
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DowntownDawg said:
...there is some type of oganization going on. I don't think the HC is in direct contact, but I also don't think there are a bunch of rogue bosters out there.

The problem with turning them in is that nothing is apparently going to happen. The problem with stepping up is that the NCAA is just as likely to come down on us as them when that happens.

There's no easy solution in my mind, except to keep beating their asses and hope Slive goes down in flames over this Newton thing.
They solution is to put a great product on the field and send players to the NFL. If high school players feel like they are going to a coach that will give them the necessary tools to get to 'the league', then they won't risk it all for monthly payments of $600. Keep winning and everything will be fine. I can even see Slive making a visit to Oxford (off the record) to tell them to cool it. One excellent recruiting class with a loss to Jacksonville State is not a huge deal. However, if you string a few poor seasons together and keep up your recruiting, then eyebrows will raise.
 

maroonmania

Senior
Feb 23, 2008
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8 to 10 years ago with the whole snitching from them on us and the ensuing investigation and probation I NEVER NEVER thought I would see the day their fans would come to our board and give us hell over following the rules in recruiting. Any recruit that has a Father perform a shakedown of a school like Cecil Newton did us absolutely deserves getting turned in. And as I said, OM has a long history of snitching on somebody else when its in their interest. Of course I am sure they would never self report anything on a recruiting situation involving themselves like we did.
 

Drewbacca

Redshirt
Jun 7, 2009
6
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which fuels and directs the Ole Miss recruiting machine. It goes much deeper than you can possibly know. The various agents in Mississippi are but the surface. If you keep prying, you will uncover secrets that may put your life in danger. The puppet masters at work are individuals who control men and organizations such as Dick Cheney and Halliburton. Think Trilateral Commission.

Do you think it is merely a coincidence that in the last couple of weeks the governments of Tunisia and Egypt have been overthrown AND Ole Miss got commitments and LOIs from C.J. Johnson and Nick Brassell? I think not.

Trust me. For your the safety of yourselves and your families, please stop digging and just accept the seemingly inexplicable events surrounding this recruiting cycle. It is out of your control. When these powerful men make a decision to topple a government or destroy a recruiting class, nothing can be done to stop it.

I have said too much. You have been warned.
 

hullabaloodog

Redshirt
Jul 10, 2008
1,238
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You're on the right track...

The Head Coach hears that the recruit has his hand out...The HC sends his assistant to give him some 'love.' Money is never discussed amongst coaches.

There is one coach on the staff, almost always an assistant (i.e. "The Bagman:" Trooper..Melvin) who talks to the boosters/recruits and work the deals. Those coaches don't talk about the deals with other assistants and only tell the HC in extreme circumstances for the protection of the staff/program.
 

Shmuley

Heisman
Mar 6, 2008
23,737
10,370
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I guess we can expect Quay Evans to sign with the Bears?

Or should I just STFU if I know what's good for me?
 

HammerOfTheDogs

All-Conference
Jun 20, 2001
10,756
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At any one time, you had ratted out Alabama, Auburn, Arkansas, and The Mississippi State University. If you Bear fans had spent all the millions of dollars on building your Athletic Department that you spent on PI's, you might not such a ******** that requires big-money people buying players for you.
 

dawgoneyall

Junior
Nov 11, 2007
3,426
204
63
think reporting illegal activities is wrong.

But didn't you snitch on MSU on a player that you signed (where obviously you paid him more than we offered).

Just stick it up you ***......and you can figure out which end to start with.
 

Drewbacca

Redshirt
Jun 7, 2009
6
0
0
I am not certain if Chicago's drafting of Quay Evans is related to the world events that MSU now finds itself slap in the middle of. And these things usually come in threes. Tunisia, Egypt & 2011 MSU recruiting class. King Abdullah is probably safe for now. But who knows. I mean, C.J. Johnson was COMMITTED for 15 months. If they can get to him, even the Saudi ruling family might not be as untouchable as they think.

Strange days we live in!
 

Drewbacca

Redshirt
Jun 7, 2009
6
0
0
I just didn't get your joke immediately. I now see that you are referring to Ole Miss as the "Bears." I thought you were insinuating that the NFL was somehow involved.

You guys are hilarious and just uber-witty. "Bears." Outstanding. (Slow clap).
 

Hail State

Sophomore
Dec 27, 2009
459
101
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Jake said:
Mississippi State recruited Cam Newton and when they didn't get him, they ratted him out to the NCAA. No recruit wants anything to do with a program that will report them if they don't sign.
Do the names Julie Gibert or Richard Johanningmeier mean anything toyou?
 
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