The fix for this starts at the top, the people that run the state of NJ. To many people in this state don't recognize the opportunity that we have been presented with. They look at college football as a hobby. They either can't or refuse distinguish between RU and Montclair State. Power 5 college football is huge business. The tri state area magnifies everything good and bad. So why not do what takes to be great. If we could get some real leadership with a plan and a vision to grow the college football market in one the most densely populated regions in the county, the sky is the limit for what this program can be. Look no further than 2006. Many people in the State took pride in routing for RU, because they viewed it as a positive representation of the State they love. The economy surrounding RU got decidedly better, the donations increased, applications increased and overall school/state pride was at an all time high. Like it or not, the football team gave people with little or no connection to the university a way to relate to the school. This is what happens in Michigan, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Alabama, Notre Dame etc... I know there are plenty of smart people here that understand the economics involved. This idea has never been properly communicated to all parties involved. We need someone who can bring the different groups together (politicians, faculty, students, local business, RECRUITS). We need to stop fighting each other at every turn. A consistently good RU athletic department (with football and basketball driving the bus) helps everyone.
This is more than a football problem
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The odd part of all of this is that what you say here is so insanely obvious to anyone with a working brain, that it is simply mind-boggling that enough people with the power to do something about it do not. How the leaders in this state and at RU do not understand this and/or act on it makes me want to pull my hair out.
What kills me is the moment we get inclusion into the Big Ten, we have scum like Sweeney already trying to skim off some of that money.
I'm one of those people whose connection to RU started with FB and BB Mike. I saw the same thing in Missouri today's events not withstanding) that you saw in Tennessee, a state where people from all walks of life support and have pride in the university.
Rutgers is fighting an uphill battle because it doesn't have generations of support. Unlike other states U's, there aren't a lot of families where going to football games started with Grandpa or great grandpa becoming a family tradition whether or not you attended the school. Compared to it's peers, RU is a newcomer to all this stuff. It also has the problem of trying to build a brand in a professional sports area unlike any other with 13 major Pro franchises within an hours drive of campus.
Add in the what's in it for me attitude we have in Trenton, the hatred of large institutions, slanted media pounding the negative, and RU's never ending ability to find a way to shoot itself in the foot PR wise and you have where we are.
Rutgers is fighting an uphill battle because it doesn't have generations of support. Unlike other states U's, there aren't a lot of families where going to football games started with Grandpa or great grandpa becoming a family tradition whether or not you attended the school. Compared to it's peers, RU is a newcomer to all this stuff. It also has the problem of trying to build a brand in a professional sports area unlike any other with 13 major Pro franchises within an hours drive of campus.
Add in the what's in it for me attitude we have in Trenton, the hatred of large institutions, slanted media pounding the negative, and RU's never ending ability to find a way to shoot itself in the foot PR wise and you have where we are.
the attitude in Trenton is indicative of the general attitude of people in NJ and quite honestly the attitude of many RU fans--it's been said before--we eat our own
I refuse to call or allow other people to call the subsidy an athletic subsidy. It is a State of NJ subsidy because they to not properly fund the flagship university of their state. They need to be held accountable.
If you complain about government being too big you are hypocritical blaming NJ for this.
Let's pay for increasing the athletic budget by raising property taxes or sales tax or NJ income tax.
That goes over real well with most of the population who couldn't care less about Rutgers.
Alumni and fans need to foot the bill. They aren't willing so why should the tax payers of NJ?
Let's pay for increasing the athletic budget by raising property taxes or sales tax or NJ income tax.
That goes over real well with most of the population who couldn't care less about Rutgers.
Alumni and fans need to foot the bill. They aren't willing so why should the tax payers of NJ?
I never said anything about taxing anyone. The political system in NJ has a long history of pissing away tax dollars on much worse investments though. What I am suggesting is having politicians that have some vision and understand the importance of a strong state university.
Hey Greene, You forgot to add raising tuition because it would be unfair to all those out of state and foreign students who could care less about football. Well ya know what - f'k them all. I pay for a ton of **** in this state I consider a waste of money and it is about time Trenton realizes it needs to step up and help produce a product this State can be proud of. I'm not just talking football but the entire University in general. They are fast to try and grab but do not assist at all. What are we like bottom 5 in funding from our elected officials? It's time to **** or get off the pot. It has nothing to do with big government just some - JERSEY PRIDE!
Chicken or the egg? It's my understanding from the people here that RU get's less financial support percentage wise than peer institutions. If it received the same support as a PSU or OSU would there be a need for subsidies?
Of course you're right that the people don't care about RU and increasing taxes to benefit the school would never fly.
Oh is that all. All we need is to change the entire governmance and population of the state, the governance, faculty, alumni, and students at the university, the leadership in the athletic department, and the coaching staff. Seems like a good plan to ensure that RU FB wins a couple of games more a year. Will be well worth it.
Another great post by DJ. You are correct sir. But I want you to admit that some with political ties on this board warned us years ago that the additional B10 money would be offset by cuts in appropriations while redirecting revenue to other universities. Thank you.
Mike, I am sure that you are still friends with many of your former teammates. Assuming that most are in agreement with you, is there any pressure being applied by "members of the family" to administration? U of Miami alumni players were very vocal and a powerful lobby, which is what got me thinking.
Let's say in most years we will be #5 thru #7 in our division...maybe once or twice decade we will seriously compete for the conf. title game....but the usual finish will be closer to bottom than top.
Spending tens of millions more per year on a top coach, staff, facilities, etc won't change that so why do it ?
Seems to me the head start the three powerhouse teams plus MSU have too much of a head start to overcome.
Same reason Indiana hasn't won the league since 1968. Spending money isn't likely to change fortunes over time. The divide is too great for money to bridge it.
Spending tens of millions more per year on a top coach, staff, facilities, etc won't change that so why do it ?
Seems to me the head start the three powerhouse teams plus MSU have too much of a head start to overcome.
Same reason Indiana hasn't won the league since 1968. Spending money isn't likely to change fortunes over time. The divide is too great for money to bridge it.
You're partially correct. If the state of New Jersey and the institution supports a major push towards big-time football we will beat Ohio State in time. But that would take a herculean effort. If you're asking hypothetically if we're able to compete for a B10 title and a NC game in ten short years? The answer is yes. Will this ever happen probably not.
Vote Lesniak in 2017 and convince everyone you know to do the same.
Then you'll see **** get done at Rutgers.
31...my point is, competitiveness is not a money issue. No amount of money can reverse our destiny, which is to be a bottom-tier team much more often than not simply because the top of the division is too strong. The rich will always get richer. We just can't aim as high.
Spending more is a waste of money.
What we should try to do is find the right stepping stone coach and hope to catch lightning in a bottle, not to sustain a higher level of winning but to just get there every blue moon. Anything else is unrealistic in the big 10 east. Just ask Indiana.
Spending more is a waste of money.
What we should try to do is find the right stepping stone coach and hope to catch lightning in a bottle, not to sustain a higher level of winning but to just get there every blue moon. Anything else is unrealistic in the big 10 east. Just ask Indiana.
Yup no doubt, the ****** product on the field, thanks to three years of ****** recruiting, is the fault of everyone else in New Jersey other than Kyle Flood. Thanks for the reminder guys!
LOL. This couldnt be more wrong.
Indiana doesnt compete because they dont spend alot of money on FB, and also because they are in an area with few recruits nad bigger names.
Our history has held us back, but it need not be our future.
Or to put it another way - Michigan State is currently a top team in this conference, but a decade ago most people would have said the same thing about them (ahd the current divisions existed) - they are destined to be in the 2nd tier (with MD and RU - all ahead of Indiana) - because there is no way they can keep up with the behemoths in the 100,000 seat stadiums.
But thats not reality for them, and its not for us. Put money into the program (and really I just mean spend $3 million a year on an HC, and an analogous amount for a staff) and we will be competetive at the top of this conference. We might not win it. But we wont be any worse than MSU has been and would be ahead of MD.
I am talking about changing how all those people/ groups view college athletics as a whole. It's not about winning a few more football games. This is bigger than just feeling better on sunday mornings. It attracts more people to games, to the school, to the state. Donors and corporate money etc...This idea of being more competitive and having a better AD across the board, means more $$$ for all in the long term. This is not a very difficult concept to grasp or execute. It takes people with the right mind set and understanding at all levels.
yeah--but we can only raise an average of $50 on the fire flood fiasco site---if ALL our fans who say they really care gave meaningful dollars to the program maybe along with the 7 figure givers we could afford that kind of money--cause I agree with you
Lousy logic Derlieder...usually you do better but you're 0-1 on this. You don't seem to get WHY Indiana doesn't spend the money. is for the same reasons i applied to RU. Diminishing returns. Dollars don't translate to wins.
And you are also wrong about recruiting. ND is in the same region as Indy and remote Wisconsin has no trouble attracting players, heck, even NJ players.
MSU wasn't the low-tier team you suggest either. It's been a solid program for decades. We have never been at that level, even with two wins over them since the late eighties.
And you are also wrong about recruiting. ND is in the same region as Indy and remote Wisconsin has no trouble attracting players, heck, even NJ players.
MSU wasn't the low-tier team you suggest either. It's been a solid program for decades. We have never been at that level, even with two wins over them since the late eighties.
Nuts, I am not saying the staff isn't to blame. They are a piece of a tough puzzle to solve no doubt. But it becomes hard to attract talented coaches when the leadership looks like the keystone cops.
66-because there are coaches out there who are light years ahead of him in competence and potential. Urban Meyer was a little known assistant once, so was Saban, Shula, Parcells, Lombardi, etc.
The elite programs can cherry pick the stars after their rise. Lesser programs need to try to find them earlier. We need to take a swing and maybe hit the home run. If not, then we try again in 4-5 years.
There are future hall of fame coaches out there who no one knows about yet.
The elite programs can cherry pick the stars after their rise. Lesser programs need to try to find them earlier. We need to take a swing and maybe hit the home run. If not, then we try again in 4-5 years.
There are future hall of fame coaches out there who no one knows about yet.
Good luck with that. Politicians with vision in NJ are like unicorns. The only purpose that a strong state university serves for NJ politicians is as a vehicle for corrupt patronage and graft.
It really doesnt is the issue, not for a large state schools . Just logically - lets say you could use $20 million extra on FB to turn around the fortunes of a $3 billion a year school.
Well any school would be dumb not to. So everyone would spend that money - and the price of doing so would increase (since not everyone can win.) In the end the benefits of sports accrue almost entirely to sports. Now that RU is in the Big Ten, its even more so.
The thing is - there is no real proof out there that any of this works like you say it does. Schools that have money to spend on sports usually also have money to spend on the school - which is why the school gets better - not because a few extra million spilled over from sports fans. Michigan was a great school before they ever had FB. OSU, despite being great in FB and BB isnt as good of a school as Michigan, or even PSU - who is worse in FB and MUCH worse in BB or Illinois who SUCKS at FB and so on and so on. Wisconin was AWFUL at FB and BB for several decades, yet is the 2nd best school in the state.
Athletic success mostly accrues to athletics, and given the unpredictable nature of sports, its basically apt to simply leave sports to its own - invest enough that it doesnt cost the school money to run the programs, but not much more.
And who put the Sweeny's of the world into a political power position in New Jersey ?...sadly people in New Jersey don't look at dear old Rutgers as their State University...not like the citizens of Wisconsin , Nebraska , Michigan , Penn State etc. of the conference do...the reason is we have never promoted this entire charade properly.... we all donate , root and angst over this program but we are not the saviors of this fiasco and for Rutgers to succeed in all areas ( athletics and academics )the university must be on board ... that ain't happening anytime soon...the ONLY thing the leaders in our state understand is the almighty $$$$$...take that away and see what happens...this is going to get much worse than better and we all know it...
66-Brady Hoke and Al Golden were proven winners too.
Am just saying that the future stars are out there somewhere and dont need to cost more than we're paying now. What we are paying Flood is plenty. It's not about the money. It's about hiring the right person.
Am just saying that the future stars are out there somewhere and dont need to cost more than we're paying now. What we are paying Flood is plenty. It's not about the money. It's about hiring the right person.
Sorry, but we could hire people at HC, AD, President, who would take less money than the current "leadership."
Maybe we will never be Ohio State or Michigan.
But we could easily be Wisconsin or Iowa if we hired COMPETENT people, and plenty of them would work for the salaries currently on offer.
More money is nice but stubborn idiocy, not money, not Christie, not Sweeney, not NJ self loathe, is what created this mess, and that began with Pernetti and his wonderful hires.
Maybe we will never be Ohio State or Michigan.
But we could easily be Wisconsin or Iowa if we hired COMPETENT people, and plenty of them would work for the salaries currently on offer.
More money is nice but stubborn idiocy, not money, not Christie, not Sweeney, not NJ self loathe, is what created this mess, and that began with Pernetti and his wonderful hires.
Sorry Mike was just having some fun...all good....let's hope things change for the better!