Two things for all the "sky is falling" crowd.

MSUCostanza

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Jan 10, 2007
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1. Ole Miss has won the recruiting battle for about 50 years in a row. They always, always claim victory in the recruiting wars. Never forget that.<div>
</div><div>2. Maybe it's just me, but didn't Dan Mullen skull-17 Ole Miss two years in a row with a roster full of Croom recruits? Color me unconcerned about the on-field matchup. Honestly if they (a) don't want to be at State, or (b) were otherwise coerced to go to OM, who the 17 needs them? The train is leaving the station with or without them. </div>
 

MSUCostanza

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Jan 10, 2007
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1. Ole Miss has won the recruiting battle for about 50 years in a row. They always, always claim victory in the recruiting wars. Never forget that.<div>
</div><div>2. Maybe it's just me, but didn't Dan Mullen skull-17 Ole Miss two years in a row with a roster full of Croom recruits? Color me unconcerned about the on-field matchup. Honestly if they (a) don't want to be at State, or (b) were otherwise coerced to go to OM, who the 17 needs them? The train is leaving the station with or without them. </div>
 

ArmyDawg

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Dec 9, 2008
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CJ would have helped a lot but your right we have coaches that will turn our two star into a CJ without all the drama.
 

Croomcream

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Apr 30, 2006
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compared to us...not a good analogy. Don't look now but ol' Croomsey wasn't that bad of a recruiter if this one-egg puddin' collapse holds up! Maybe we need to send Big Dan to southern charm school...the boy ain't gettin' it done.
 

DerHntr

All-Conference
Sep 18, 2007
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or even this guy....

 

AlCoDog

All-Conference
Feb 27, 2008
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everybody that includes croom in their username is an idiot, and your's is the worst one. Croomcream? What does that mean? Also, your post was awful.
 

RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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That's especially true when you factor in attrition and nonqualifiers.

While I still think our 2009 crop was more than adequate even after attrition, your 2009 haul was better overall.

You were good this year in large part because you had good players. We struggled because we didn't have enough good players.

You can't just follow signing day, and on top of that if you want to compete in the West you're going to have to do more than just develop diamonds in the rough.

Based on the recruiting hauls I would expect you to be better in 2011 since you 08/09 hauls were better. I would expect us to be at least as good as you in 2012, and by 2013 I think you'll likely be looking at rebuilding at best. 2014 might really be a struggle. That's unless you happen to have a load of underevaluated talent in you 10/11 classes or unless you really start tearing it up in these next classes.

Gloss over recruiting if you want but if you sign too many Plan B's you won't be winning much in the future no matter your coach.
 

MSUbravesfan

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Jun 20, 2006
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Of the best days of the funniest **** that I have ever seen! First the chick that had a shadow cock and now this. You made me laugh again! Bravo good sir, bravo!
 
G

Goat Holder II

Guest
and again, just because it happened to Ole Miss doesn't mean it will happen to MSU. If Nutt had actually signed somebody in the '09 class who made it, you might not have been 4-8 this year.

Looks to me like we are signing good players. They don't have the ratings of the Ole Miss class, but pound for pound, it's solid. If half our guys are non qualifiers, I could see your point. Plus we have some talented QBs stocked. You don't. That's the most important position in football. I still would not trade our class for yours at this time. C.J. Johnson is the only one that really sucks to lose. And that's probably more timing than anything.

Cut the ****, we all see through you.
 

mcdawg22

Heisman
Sep 18, 2004
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Bruiser what will the Rebs D-line be like in 2013. Nutt is going after Jucos to cover up gaping holes. Unless the freshmen pack on massive weight, the DTs at Ole Miss will be RFresh or Soph with limited playing time.
 

Croomcream

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Apr 30, 2006
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I have explained my handle...basically I'm an engineerand I'mout of the country ALOT, too much, usually in remote places and don't usually have time or access to personal internet. Someone stole my old handle, badtotheboneII and one of my LSU co-workers was braggin about the Stallion "shuting this board's *** up" and over tequilla he gave me the Croomcream handle...he was killed in a freak accident 3 weeks later so I hung onto it.
 
G

Goat Holder II

Guest
10 never made it to campus.
14 quit or transferred
And a couple more were not much more than a waste of a scholarship.
35 players left, out of two classes. Most of the guys that were worth a **** in those classes weren't highly rated, either.

Try again, Bruiser.
 

Columbus Dawg

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Feb 23, 2008
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Except I don't think we are necessarily doomed for a dropoff because we have continued to sign bodies on the O-line and D-line and we redshirted all but 2 of our players from last year's class. So as long as we can add a key Juco here and there and sign a Top 25 class next year, we should be ok. I also like our outlook at QB which is the most important position in college sports.

</p>
 

Rebel1.sixpack

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Dec 14, 2010
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is that it is never "over". It wasn't all "over" for y'all when we won two Cotton Bowls. It wasn't all "over" for us when y'all won the Gator Bowl, and it isn't all "over" now that we have put together a good class.

We both have our "sky is falling" groups, but in a rivalry like ours in a state like ours the ebb and flow will always exist. "We have them now, they will never bounce back" is just stupid. The better your players are the easier it is for the other team to point out the all important factor of "early playing time." Each of us has landed strong classes after a good year by the other. When we had P Jerry and Powe on the DL it was hard to recruit there. When we had Eli, no QB would look at us. That is why neither team can ever really pull away and why we will each have to rebuild every few years. Two really good classes back to back makes the third one really tough for both of us.

Getting all carried away and declaring permenant dominance is dreamland. Neither of us will ever be permenantly "on the rise" and neither of us will ever be in a perpetual decline into oblivion. I just wish there was enough talent in this state for both of us to sustain something.
 

GloryDawg

Heisman
Mar 3, 2005
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And all these guys have to get qualified. Some might have to get out of jail as well.</p>
 

GloryDawg

Heisman
Mar 3, 2005
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They never do but those Son of Bitches win year in and year out and in years they were in good conference. Hell even this year they are only 33.I'm calling bull **** on your plan B statement. We just kicked your *** two years in a roll with a bunch of plan b guys and about to make it three leaving Ole Miss coachless.
 

JxnReb.sixpack

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Jan 17, 2010
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Eddie O. He weighs us down alot.<div>
</div><div>Also, MSU, by technicalities, won the 2009 recruiting battle.</div>
 

RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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See most of you are still talking about ratings.

That's not what I'm talking about.

Was our 2009 class "overrated" because of who we lost from it? I guess if you follow the rankings, but I still feel like that class gave us as much more more SEC ready talent as we normally sign in a decent class.

Your 2007 and 08 classes did have some attrition, but they still gave you more SEC ready talent than our 07/08 classes did. We had a total of 7 scholarship players left from our 07 class, and the 08 group was a transition class.

You're going to have some natural attrition, probably about 5 per class in most cases, but you should have around 15-20 players from each class 3 and 4 years later, and ideally at least 25 of those will be SEC level contributors with 5-10 of them being definitely above average SEC players. If I look back at Goat's numbers, it looks like that's probably what you had.

As far as my comments about your 10/11 classes, I'm looking mainly at how many players you signed that you beat USM to sign. Maybe that's a good strategy, and we'll find out soon enough, but on paper it looks like you signed a lot of guys that were either not heavily recruited, or were Plan Bs. Maybe it works out, and we'll find out soon enough, but I have my doubts.
 

RebelBruiser

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Aug 21, 2007
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and if we do give him a chance in 2012, or if he does well enough this year to get himself through to 2012, I think he will be able to get things turned around well enough to stick around for a while.

Regardless, I care a lot less about who is coaching us and more about whether we win. If we did end up firing him after next season, and we go out and make a decent hire, we'll be able to win fairly quickly with a new coach. That's what matters to me.

The worst situation is if you have to fire a coach AND rebuild. I don't think we're that far away when you add this class to the previous two. We still have some areas that need added depth in next year's class, namely RB and a few more D-linemen depending on how our young DL do this fall, but overall the cupboard won't be "bare" as they say if we did make a coaching change.

And yes I still count our 2009 class as a solid class, because I don't get caught up in the rankings. We still have 23 players (21 non specialists) left on our roster from that class, and that's not counting Tim Simon who may or may not return from his 2009 knee injury. I'd say at least 8 of those players have already proven they are good enough to be regular contributors at the SEC level (with a handful of them clearly above average SEC talents), and I would say another 5-6 of them have potential and haven't had the chance to show it yet due to the depth chart at their positions.

I think the ideal recruiting class ends up giving you 4-5 players that you could say are clearly above average SEC players, and another 8-10 that are average SEC caliber talent. The rest will either quit/get kicked off or just toil on the bench for 4 years. That's going to happen in every class. I'm talking strictly about the high school signees, not the Jucos by the way. I think our 2009 class will end up close to those numbers in terms of high school signee contributors.

Our 2006 class was so good because it gave us 7-8 players that you would probably say were above average SEC talent and another 7-8 that I would say were at least average SEC caliber. The rest either didn't make it, quit, were Jucos, or just weren't that good. Our 2007 class, on the other hand, was so bad because as far as high school talent goes, we only got 6 high school players that I would say were at least average SEC players, and that's being generous. Our 2008 class was poor because it only gave us 7 or 8 players that I would say are average SEC talent, with only maybe 1 of those I would say as above average at this point. Those 2007 and 2008 classes were the downfall of our 2010 season, and they're the reason why most of us knew it was going to be a rebuilding year. The hope was that our schedule and Masoli would give us a chance to mask the rebuilding year a little bit, but it didn't work out that way.

Anyway, that's how I follow recruiting and why I follow it. If you understand what level of players you need and how many of them you need from each class, usually you can figure out how strong a class was within 2 years of it signing. If you follow the recruiting process, you can get a good idea how many of your signees have SEC potential (you hope it's over 20), and after a few years, you can have a good idea if enough of those players were as good as you needed them to be. Go back and do the same for your 2007, 08, and 09 classes. It's not hard to see, even when you look at it on an individual player level, if you recruited well in a particular class.