You know had you articulated what you posted in that second paragraph in the beginning stages, this thread would not have turned ugly. I’m no expert on things but I can respect a man for saying hey young brother, you’re wrong, let me educate you... Instead of “ You have absolutely no clue about the relative admissions requirements”... So rethink your first paragraph.
UVA and Tech not getting it done on the home front
- Thread starter CountyBoyGeneral
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I will take your suggestion under consideration. However, it is hard to educate somebody until you determine where you need to start from. Moreover, it is my opinion, that when I make a statement I should be reasonably prepared to support it with facts, observations and clarifications if challenged. This observation, along with never post anything you would not tell someone to their face, were two basic rules I shared with my kids and that they tell me they will share with theirs when the time comes.
Might be easier if you two just exchanged numbers lol
Lol only 7 people have my cell phone number including my employer. If anyone wants a response better @ me or send me a PM on here lol!!!
I remember sitting in the airport with an FSU assistant coach and we were talking about handlers. He said in Florida the Pop Warner and rec coaches have more pull over the athletes than the high school coaches, so a lot of the time they just bypass the HS coach. I was in amazement at this statement. I guess a lot of these guys must have friends in Florida because they've been trying to make that a reality here in the 757. Just my honest opinion
An ho? LOL I'm sure it got cut off!!! Appreciate the support...I try to peek back in every once and awhile
Both 247 Sports and Rivals released updated rankings for the 2021 recruiting classes, providing their latest updates for the class. And with those updates, a few Tar Heels’ saw a ratings increase and it pushed UNC’s class back up to No. 4 in the 247 Sports Composite rankings.
And that's what is wrong with the NCAA. There are kids that have far more talent in sports that absolutely have no business being in college. But because the NFL says you have to be out of HS for 3 years before you can apply to play in the NFL, those kids that don't go to college get screwed. You look at how it used to be, where primo athletes went to college just so they could play football. Those kids took basket weaving 101 type courses and never graduated, or they graduated but they could only read or write at an elementary school level, but they eventually got to the NFL where they flourished as players. Not everybody is a good student academically. Otherwise, we'd all be doctors and lawyers and engineers. There should be another route for kids that are not academically inclined but have the talent to play at the higher levels. I get that football is a collision sport, I agree with the NFL rule that you need to be out of HS 3 years so the body has a chance to physically mature. But going to college so they can continue to play football should not be the only route. In college basketball, you have a lot of kids that are 1 and done and go right into the NBA. In baseball, kids can go into the minors right out of HS. There's not much of a minor league for football. I dunno if any of the other football leagues has a 3 years out of HS rule or not. If they do, I suspect that the NCAA has something to do with it so the colleges can make money off of the kids. I don't know. But something should change for those kids that have the talent that just plain shouldn't be wasted.
Academic Requirement Argument: each school uses Clearinghouse as the baseline but the admissions boards at each school looks at he curriculum of th STUDENT-Athlete and decides if they will be a fit at said university. The admissions board can make exceptions in many circumstances but those concessions are made for coaches and programs with a positive track record of success with the fringe acceptees. If a student athlete can’t stay eligible then it’s futile to bring them onboard, which in many of the higher academia schools (UVA, Stanford, Vandy) and others they look at the rigor of courseload (HS vs the university) and see if the athlete will Be a fit. Sometimes those fringe kids are worth the hassle other times they transfer out. Each school is unique in its own way, UVa didn’t take jucos for a long time, and was selective about the post grads.
London could recruit but his on field management, player development and player retention was attrocious. Negligent in a lot of aspects, he had the right staff to bring in talent he just couldn’t win with it. Best season was 2011-2012 when he went to the chic fil a bowl, but many of those veterans were Groh Guys. London isn’t a power 5 HC, maybe a coordinator but definitely not a HC.
VT’s old guard (Beamer and co) made the 75 a priority and had successfully used those players to win and build a profile to reach out to that area. Stiney would rule the 75 in recruitment but it slowly faded as the national powers made the hotbed a priority and took some of those game changers out of state. Vick, Adibi, Kam Chancellor, Tyrod and more made VT a brand/band of brothers for the 75. Tech also controlled the 804 pipeline as well and had great talent filling their rosters with home grown talent. as the recruiting world became more advanced the whole state was now a national hotbed for top recruits and the big boys wanted parts.
757 was loaded and the “handlers” have had a hand in where some guys decide to go, which has darkened and dampened the impact some of the players could’ve had if they would’ve went with where they were wanted and not steered. IMO.
Overall Bronco has a different approach to recruiting and UVA wasn’t an attractive to a lot of instate guys but he’s working to change it, maybe not by visits to HS but by winning and the onfield product. Time will see where he stands it’s year 4 or 5 and now is the time to make inroads because ACC schools are coming for VAs best. Bly and Beatty will make it hard to pull recruits they come from the area, biscuit/Hagans doesn’t have the same pull there right now but he’s a 75 native and success story.
All this to say TECH and UVA are lacking instate prowess on the recruiting trails and it’s showing on the field. Many of the bigtime contributors for them in the spotlight aren’t native of the commonwealth and that creates an issue fr the relationship building. If I can’t trust you with my player why would I send them to you to build/mold into a man or achieve their dreams.
London could recruit but his on field management, player development and player retention was attrocious. Negligent in a lot of aspects, he had the right staff to bring in talent he just couldn’t win with it. Best season was 2011-2012 when he went to the chic fil a bowl, but many of those veterans were Groh Guys. London isn’t a power 5 HC, maybe a coordinator but definitely not a HC.
VT’s old guard (Beamer and co) made the 75 a priority and had successfully used those players to win and build a profile to reach out to that area. Stiney would rule the 75 in recruitment but it slowly faded as the national powers made the hotbed a priority and took some of those game changers out of state. Vick, Adibi, Kam Chancellor, Tyrod and more made VT a brand/band of brothers for the 75. Tech also controlled the 804 pipeline as well and had great talent filling their rosters with home grown talent. as the recruiting world became more advanced the whole state was now a national hotbed for top recruits and the big boys wanted parts.
757 was loaded and the “handlers” have had a hand in where some guys decide to go, which has darkened and dampened the impact some of the players could’ve had if they would’ve went with where they were wanted and not steered. IMO.
Overall Bronco has a different approach to recruiting and UVA wasn’t an attractive to a lot of instate guys but he’s working to change it, maybe not by visits to HS but by winning and the onfield product. Time will see where he stands it’s year 4 or 5 and now is the time to make inroads because ACC schools are coming for VAs best. Bly and Beatty will make it hard to pull recruits they come from the area, biscuit/Hagans doesn’t have the same pull there right now but he’s a 75 native and success story.
All this to say TECH and UVA are lacking instate prowess on the recruiting trails and it’s showing on the field. Many of the bigtime contributors for them in the spotlight aren’t native of the commonwealth and that creates an issue fr the relationship building. If I can’t trust you with my player why would I send them to you to build/mold into a man or achieve their dreams.
I understand where you're coming from but Clemson is in discussion for National title every year now. When was last time UNC won their division?
If Mack Brown can find some assistants to do the play calling, game planning, and scheming for him, it could definitely happen. I would not bet on it now though because he is a terrible in game coach.
He's also almost 70. This is his retirement gig, he took it because it was going to be an easy job. This is a transitional hire for UNC, they have to make an equally good hire in a couple years in order to get a coach who can use what Mack is setting up there, otherwise it's Carl Torbush all over again.
Very true. I thought VT was doing the same Frank Beamer’s last couple of years. I’m not as familiar with the staff as you but I’m sure there was an in house hire that they could’ve made to keep the train rolling. I don’t think anybody seen the Fuente hire coming. I personally think he stinks up the place but I’m a huge Mike Young fan. Tech hit the jackpot with the NRV hire!
Mike Houston is just praying ECU turns the corner in time to get a sniff at that job.
If Weaver hadn't come down with Parkinson's, I'm almost certain the plan was Bud and then likely Shane. When Weaver got sick and Babcock was hired, he did what any sensible AD would do and moved on and made arguably the best available hire, just sometimes even a good hire doesn't work out.
Definitely! I don’t see Fuente there after this year. Tech is a big time program and I’m sure you alums are tired of mediocre seasons. I attended my first ever game at Lane Stadium back in 2018. Hokies played GT. GT beat the snot out of VT. Fans were gone by halftime and some Hokie fans even boo’ed Fuente in the second half. I see where even ODU got a 5 star RB the other day (Ricky Slade).. Doesn’t mean much but Tech could use a home run hitter in the backfield with Hooker. I hope the Hokies get it right soon. The state of Virginia is much better when the Hokies are contenders for the big game.
IF Fuente were to be gone after this year it will be his choice. The buyout and the performance to date do not warrant a termination. The GT game was 28-21 at half and your contention that VT fans were gone at halftime is inaccurate and there are a few fans everywhere that boo in a loss as the score gets lopsided. Slade was a five star on his "name" offers and his actual talent finally was evaluated. He didn't play much at PSU and I doubt he is better than what is already at ODU.
He'll survive this year unless the wheels fall completely off just because VT returns a ton of players and with the lack of practice that experience will be even bigger than normal and with a relatively easy schedule they should churn out a good 9+ win season. If he goes 6-6 or something then yea he's gone but I think 2021 is probably the end for him, maybe 2022 depending.
I'm not really sure many coaches will be fired for how this season goes given the circumstances. It's basically just going to go in the history books as an exhibition season for most sports. There won't be many conclusions to draw from this season imo.
I'm not really sure many coaches will be fired for how this season goes given the circumstances. It's basically just going to go in the history books as an exhibition season for most sports. There won't be many conclusions to draw from this season imo.
Just FYI, the buyout could have theoretically happened last year, boosters got awfully pissed by the end. Each year cuts off such a big chunk that it becomes more appealing and easier to stomach. The issue is more in if you decide to shuttle him out then that leaves less to lure in the next guy and cheaping out on coaches is very hard to do successfully.
Just as an fyi, the buyout could "theoretically" happen any year but, practically speaking it was not really close to reality. Some rumblings after Duke and some after UVA but, largely just rumblings because nobody was willing to write that check on their own and the budget/coupled with performance would not have sustained it from the perspective of current operations or hiring a new staff. 2020 is more manageable but, with the new staff, budget challenges surrounding the virus and a few other non public considerations it is extremely unlikely barring some unforeseen trainwreck.
You’re correct about the halftime score and I am wrong. It was a Thursday night game, Tech couldn’t stop them on offense. GT played their second string QB that night & GT went up 42-21 after 3 and the fans emptied, not half. Fans did boo Fuente. I will say that it was not so much Fuente that the Hokie faithful didn’t like, it was Ryan Willis. Hooker looks to be a good QB moving forward but Patterson could be special. Saw Hooker play at Dudley in Greensboro, very underrated.
Coach Paul Johnson and GT were in Fuentes head when came to VT. The GT offense put pressure on opposing defenses to get off the field and opposing offenses to maximize fewer possessions and Fuente, to his and VT's detriment, was impatient and chased points(not so much in 2018 as earlier years). Hooker, Patterson, and Burmeister along with Kadum should make for a good QB room that will get better if 2021 verbal Bullock gets to campus. Fuente's biggest issue is being the guy that follows the guy and some VT fans lack patience and perspective.
Fuente's biggest issue is his recruiting is garbage and he's completely stumped on what to do to fix it. Beamer didn't even recruit well at all and Fuente is like eight steps behind Frank. you can either hire a staff of recruiters who can do the job for you if you as the HC are incapable or you can be Bobby Bowden and just require your staff to get the kid close before you seal the deal in a home visit but you can't be neither of these things.
You're entitled to your opinion. The question is whether you can actually support it with anything more than one bad year to date and your own emotional dislike of Fuente? While you are pondering your response you might also want to consider the following. With the exception of the one small class year Fuente's recruiting classes have ranked comparably to Beamer's. Also, besides VT and using the 247 composite rankings, do you know how many other programs have had recruiting classes ranked in the Top 30 in 3 or more of the last 4 years while operating with a budget under $100 million?
You can't just ignore last year's class because of small numbers, that's just cherry picking. Smaller classes should be of an incredibly high quality since you don't need to fill out a class for the sake of numbers. With 15 recruits they should have been going after exclusively blue chip kids except gee, they landed a whole one of them. Notre Dame had a 17 man class in 2020, they finished with a five star and eight four stars for a top 20 finish. VT finished 75th.
I don't care that Fuente's classes compare favorably to Frank's, Justin Fuente is no Frank Beamer. Frank got a pass for never recruiting well, even personally, because he's a legendary HC who picked up his recruiting slack in other areas; Foster got a similar pass for the same reasons. I don't see what value Fuente has brought to the table that would give him such a pass. Those comparable recruiting classes are what has VT mired in mediocrity right now and, I'd remind you, those are Fuente's best classes. Where was the bump, by the way? You know, the bump literally every other school in the country sees when new blood comes in at HC and tons of recruits flock to be there and start a new era. Fuente's bump was bringing in literally the same 25-30 classes Beamer did and losing kids to Iowa freaking State after personally driving them to and from the airport.
The biggest issue, the one you're choosing to ignore, is why one bad class has led to another in 2021 and why Fuente's "Beamer-esque" years in recruiting look like they happened a decade ago. Why is a program that readily averaged 5-8 four stars a year stuck with a grand total of one between two classes?
A couple of bad classes is all it takes to sink a program in football. If they can't force a massive turnaround in recruiting and start bringing in classes approaching the level you'd expect from VT i.e. top 25-30 at least then VT will simply cease to be anything more than mediocre. Sitting here and praying for a dozen diamonds in the rough to coach up every class will never happen, even Beamer was only good for one or two of those a class tops and his staff was elite at spotting those types. Stars matter at the end of the day, like it or lump it, and if Fuente can't start landing blue chips (and not having them decommit in embarrassing fashion like he did this class about five times over) then he will end up on his rear with a box of his things.
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I get it. You don't like Fuente and think he was not the right guy. Over the long haul you might be proven correct but, so far you do not really have much to support your opinion in objective and quantifiable facts, at least that you have chosen to put on the table so far.. Notre Dame is a different recruiting animal than VT and always has been. That 5-8 four stars on average is probably overstating a bit and that is before we get in to the discussion of the actual specifics and weaknesses of star ratings for most anything outside the 5-star category. This year is not complete yet and even when it is all the NLI's tell you is who is probably showing up. Some schools/coaches recruit on name and some recruit on evaluation. I do not believe there is near enough evidence for your garbage assertion.
- Literally said he was the best available hire in this very thread, not sure how you think I "think he was not the right guy".
- ND recruiting better doesn't give VT an excuse to recruit poorly.
- Stars 100% matter and you're sticking your head in the sand to believe they don't. Even recruits care about them. There's a reason the class fell apart when DD de-committed. Kids flock to talent, it's not something unheard of in the business.
- Not really sure what you're trying to say with "That 5-8 four stars on average is probably overstating a bit". Feel free to enlighten me or just word it better.
You seem content to state that kids don't matter until they contribute on the field which is fine but Fuente's kids from classes "comparable to Beamer" were all over the past two years, including that lovely 6-7 season. So does Fuente's eval suck or was 247 wrong on their rankings and the class was overrated?