I don’t think Salem would agree with you!
I know they wouldn't and rightfully so but I don't see Salem beating Phoebus, KG, Varina, or Dinwiddie. My honest opinion is that no one in Class 4 is beating Phoebus this year but the next three best teams in Class 4 are the three mentioned above.
It will be interesting to see how this post ages as the playoffs run their course.
You may be right, and I would say I'm keeping receipts, but that didn't work out well for Deion, so I'll just say I guess we getting ready to find out.
. That seeding, none of that matters.I am not being sarcastic at all and I know Salem will be a formidable opponent. I have said since the end of last season that the Class 4 championship in 2023 would be Salem vs Phoebus. I just believe Phoebus will hold any of the remaining Class 4 teams to 2 TDs or less and they will find a way to create points outside of their offense. By no means am I saying Phoebus or the Region B champion would dominate Salem. I am just saying they would have at least one more point than Salem at the end of the game.
LOL you are right, it didn't work out for Deion.You may be right, and I would say I'm keeping receipts, but that didn't work out well for Deion, so I'll just say I guess we getting ready to find out.
You're going to do that based on one year? Also, dont know if Salem will make finals, but if they do the Spartans have heard this all before.
I personally wouldn't make the change based on one year but VHSL seems to have done that with Class 6 this year. They just made the Class 6 tournament to cross -bracket 3-4 weeks ago so that Freedom and Highland Springs wouldn't have to play each other until the state championship. Personally I would like to see a true state tournament like the state of Georgia does where there are no region playoffs. The region champion is determined during the regular season.
I am either going to look like I knew what I was talking about or an idiot if anyone from Region C or D wins. LOL
This is interesting and thanks for sharing! You are right though, the game is played on the field. It's the best time of year for a reason! I just wish my team was still playing!@VolNation85, thanks for providing a justification for your take. Very well thought out. I honestly thought you were taking a page out of @southbottomU playbook and reminding us that Salem has been overlooked in the past. Not sure who would do that at this point, but some still do.
I wanted to evaluate the teams with something a little more than the eye test so I did a little research using Maxpreps, VHSL, and other ranking/computer models. Some support your opinion some don't. You have to play the games on the field, so all this means doodly squat. Fun for me though.
Top 5 ranked teams in Class 4:
VAPreps
1. Phoebus
2. Salem
3. King George
4. Varina
5. Warhill
Max Preps
1. Phoebus
2. Varina
3. King George
4. Salem
5. Dinwiddie
VHSL Power Points Top
1. Phoebus
2. King George
3. Warhill
4. Tuscarora
4. Varina
Top 5 SOS (Teams left)
1. Dinwiddie
2. Varina
3. Glass
4. Churchland
5. Salem
Worst 5 SOS (Teams left)
1. Warhill
2. Loudoun County
3. Tuscarora
4. Huguenot
5. John Champe
Edit: I typed this before @southbottomU replied. He's right too.
Watching over all these years has made me hesitant to anoint teams or regions because as the old saying goes that is why they play the games. I was skeptical when they realigned classes by strict ADM that the more plodding style of the West could compete with the East. I even made the statement they would eventually compete but, it might take 5 or so years to adjust. Salem made me eat those words beating Lake Taylor 3 years in. I think the East still has more teams and overall speed today but, people should never count out the Spartans and a few others. Finally, with Lewis and Cole as the headliners and several other lesser known although no less athletic teammates the Spartans should be able to lineup with anyone from the East. Most times much is made of the athletes but, when it comes to winning championships more often than not it is about what gets done in the trenches on BOTH sides of the ball, in my opinion. A fun time of year in these next 4 weeks for HS football fans.
You are absolutely right about the trenches! That's why I have thought all along that Phoebus would win the Class 4 championship this year. They have the most dominant DL and defense that I have seen in person in a long time. As the saying goes, defense wins championships. But, you definitely can't count out the Spartans.
In past years I would always take Salem to win it if they made it to the championship because they are a premier program and I was biased to Region 4D in previous years because I coached at a 4D school until this season.
I agree with you about the DL that Phoebus has. Of the teams left in A and B, who do you think matches up the best against them? I have felt and still feel Dinwiddie fits the bill. When Dalton is unscripted, he can turn what would be sure sacks for most qb’s into big gains. He’s also fast enough to get by some of the quicker DE’s. In addition, Dinwiddie has enough balance offensively to keep defenses from loading the box. King George has a potent offense, but when plays break down due to that stellar defensive front from Phoebus, I don’t see them finding as much success as Dinwiddie would.
Starting early with your Michael Jordan impersonation to conjure up a perceived slight for motivation I see. Salem has received proper deference on these boards this year, your protests otherwise notwithstanding.
Like I said, starting your Michael Jordan impersonation early. However, you're right, no one views the West anywhere near as deep as the East. The West so far has been akin to the Big Ten where Salem is Ohio State and after that not really much in terms of scaring anybody come championship time.
I don’t argue against your idea, because I like a rotating cross-bracket format. But please remember, the individual Regions, not the VHSL, decide the format. The membership owns the VHSL, not the other way around.
Least valuable methods@VolNation85, thanks for providing a justification for your take. Very well thought out. I honestly thought you were taking a page out of @southbottomU playbook and reminding us that Salem has been overlooked in the past. Not sure who would do that at this point, but some still do.
I wanted to evaluate the teams with something a little more than the eye test so I did a little research using Maxpreps, VHSL, and other ranking/computer models. Some support your opinion some don't. You have to play the games on the field, so all this means doodly squat. Fun for me though.
Top 5 ranked teams in Class 4:
VAPreps
1. Phoebus
2. Salem
3. King George
4. Varina
5. Warhill
Max Preps
1. Phoebus
2. Varina
3. King George
4. Salem
5. Dinwiddie
VHSL Power Points Top
1. Phoebus
2. King George
3. Warhill
4. Tuscarora
4. Varina
Top 5 SOS (Teams left)
1. Dinwiddie
2. Varina
3. Glass
4. Churchland
5. Salem
Worst 5 SOS (Teams left)
1. Warhill
2. Loudoun County
3. Tuscarora
4. Huguenot
5. John Champe
Edit: I typed this before @southbottomU replied. He's right too.
Don't think Salem has an inferiority complex per say. I think this feeling that Salem folks have is part of a much larger feeling that incompasses much much more. There seems to be a dividing line in Virginia that starts just outside Loudoun County and goes thru Virginia at a SW angle just west of Richmond all the way to North Carolina. Everything west of that line (political views included) is valued to a lesser degree. This feeling of disrespect intensifies the further west you go. Hell, folks in far west Virginia feel much closer culturally and politically to Tennessee and West Virginia than Virginia. So when someone comes on here and makes a statement pertaining to the western part of the state (admittedly it doesnt happen as much as it used to) it doesn't take much to set off the alarm that another slight is being delivered.
No team in the 757 can put anything on the clock until they beat the 804. We love the disrespect. We own those guys.I heard Phoebus was putting Salem on the clock
@mike salem, this says everything you need to know about the Salem program. The proof is in the pudding and only a fool would attempt to discount the Spartans run. I understand @southbottomU latest point especially as it relates to politics, but does it really relate to Salem Football. I think not.
I get what are you saying but I think there is a big difference between this year's Salem team and last year's. I also think they are much better team than they were week 1.
@Touchdown-tony I'm no Nostradamus. Just a guy sharing his opinion on a public message board.
No doubt! I wasn't discrediting Salem for losing to Glass or LCA because both were really good teams. I was just highlighting that Salem lost those two games because they had the inferior OL/DL in those two games even though they had better team speed/athletes top to bottom than those two teams. It's no shade towards any team in Class 4 but it's my professional opinion that Phoebus is just that much better on defense. I don't think people understand how dominant their defense has been for the last 3 years. I have coached HS football in Virginia for 16 years and I don't remember a defense being as dominant as Phoebus has been for the past 3 years. They have given up 4.4 PPG over the previous 41 games!
All good points and similar to what I was thinking as I thought about each team. I give the edge to Dinwiddie because they have the best running game with Dalton and Tucker of the teams left. It’s also just so tough to defend Dalton when he gets creative. Even so, I still wouldn’t expect it to be a high scoring affair regardless of who came away with the win.
